On 3/4/2021 at 2:02 AM, Heinrich der Seefahrer said:

 

Yes but I told my son:"A highscore isn't something you print out and put into a glass show cabinet..." 

 

So he started to build tanks and planes. And is very good at his Warhammer miniatures. So we have something to communicate about quite technologically but he feels competent to be at the same level as his dad but on an other playground. I get new ideas from him he from me so it does cooperate.

 

I think getting youth interested in the hobby at all is important. Their physical skills are trained and if the do good they start an new kit and do get better and it is an obvious progress pictured in the result and neurological in their brain - you ca not cheat on our hobby just for money payed to win or some pressed caps. 

 

So if the makes progress his brain developes so he will do his way... 

 

All we can do is being authentic to show our intrest in them by praising their work and showing other shorter easier ways to the same or better result:

 

"Education did never work, 

children allways do imitate us." 

unknown

 

 

 

As a high school History teacher, I put together a Model Club for after school.  I received a lot of interest from the students, so the club was a very popular one until I retired. Most teenagers do appreciate interested adults and will participate in these activities if given the chance.

Bill Morrison

Marc,

I have started re-reading your approach and explanations from page 1.  Granted, much of what you have done is beyond my skill level, but it is a great refresher course. If I were to emulate that which you have done, I will have to do so as a full-hull model.  Who knows?  I did buy another Heller model of Le Soliel Royal to attempt your modifications, but I have to receive the book first.

Bill

On 4/8/2022 at 7:56 PM, Nek0 said:

 

Your interpretation is brilliant... !

 

I fully agree!  

The issue of belaying pins is somewhat controversial.  Lees' book on masting and rigging focuses on English square-rigged ships.  There are contemporary paintings showing some Dutch ships with them. However, I believe that Lees is accurate.  Take your choice.

You are doing a marvelous job!  I prefer the normally painted version.

llWould

I tried paper modeling but am having a problem that is causing me fits. I rescaled the German battlecruiser Goeben by JSC down to 1/350 and am trying to fold the secondary armament sponsons. Try as I might, they are fighting my efforts.  Oh well . . .

That said, if you are interested in paper modeling, I recommend www.papermodelers.com.  That site features paper models of all genres.  Many of the models are among the best I have ever seen.

Bill

Great job so far!  I have had my eyes on this model for a while.  My wife tells me that I can sell off my stash and use the proceeds to purchase the kit. Yours is nicely done.

Bill

I'm impressed!  If you can, can we please have a detailed explanation about how you made them?  They look great!

Bill

11 hours ago, CRI-CRI said:

You can find here the announced test using paper prints :

 

 

 

What do you think about ?

 

It's possible to transform it in a wooden version, but neither for the same price, nor the same working time 

I think that it looks great except that I am not looking at the difference in person.  But, the photos look fine.

Bill

I love the hull dimensions and appearance, but I appreciate the different calibers of the guns most.  Few builders seem to appreciate this, but an excellent model can be spoilt by adhering to a single caliber on the gun decks and above. Impressive, Nek0!

Bill

1 hour ago, Roger Pellett said:

Considering the high standard of workmanship that you are maintaining, I would suggest real wooden gratings.

 

I fully agree.  I have seen paper models that look great, but you are building an exceptionally outstanding model. Paper might not look right.

Bill

First, I am most impressed with the advice presented here.  It is so well articulated and justifies building all kits of the ship. To underscore the point, my first POB kit was an Aeropiccola 1/180 model given to me by my wife in 1979.  The kit was basic in the extreme, with the instructions calling for simply drawing all gun ports and lids onto the model, with only the upper decks modeled with printed sheets in lieu of planks, and little detail. I learned the fun of greatly improving the model using my own skills, learning new skills, and researching better techniques to make a "real" model of the ship. Any model can be a fantastic experience.

Second, HMS Victory is over 240 years old.  Which era would you like to build?  As built? Pre-Trafalgar? At Trafalgar? Post-Trafalgar?  This question can have many possible answers. For example, while Caldercraft models the ship with raised forecastle bulwarks, no other model depicts her so.  The Heller 1/100 scale plastic model shows her without the entry ports on either side.  Mantua has three different models of her, each in a different scale.  Some companies provide sheets with the gun ports pre-carved with exact measurements. In others, the builder must carve them out using templates.  I can only describe the available kits as a smorgasbord of choices.  All are good in their own way.  All have weaknesses in their own way.

Good luck with your choice!

Bill

On 4/4/2022 at 7:54 AM, Hubac's Historian said:

A better example of the shipwright’s art, there is not.

I have to second this comment.  Your work is incredible!

Bill

Marc,

There are indeed quite a few exceptional models of SR that have been and are being built.  One of my favorites was by a builder named David_K over on FSM from several years ago.  I am waiting to see both yours and Nek0s models.  By the way, I ordered that book about French Warships in the Age of Sail that you recommended.

Bill

Marc,

Yours is beyond doubt the most impressive model of this ship I have ever seen!  I am a skilled modeler, but I tip my hat to you. Well done!

Bill

I like using www.agesofsail.com as my "go to" for ship models of most manufacturers, tools, paints, references, a "how to" guide and fast service. I used to do business with Model Expo but they have gotten smaller over the years.

Bill

Your HMS Mercury is STUNNING!!!  I am inspired to try building this ship.

Bill

My father got this kit for me back in the 1990s.  It's a fun kit to build but there is one glaring error to me. It has no cannons. It is only an impression to me, but I believe that this type of ship did have some defensive armament.

Bill

There is an interesting thread where the issue of belaying pins is discussed.  I recommend it as an interesting read.

By hamilton,
July 31, 2019 in Masting, rigging and sails

 

Credible representations are what the hobby is about.   Marc is building a fantastic conversion of the Heller kit and painting it in an interesting and beautiful fashion!  His model might or might not be a specific ship, but it certainly appears to be a French ship-of-the line, which he has based on credible plans.  CRI-CRI is doing the same, as is the other Marc in France.  Does this answer the question about belaying pins?

We have conflicting information.  Lees states explicitly that belaying pins first came into use around 1750. Was he talking specifically about English ships?  Does he include French practice?  Marc in NYC has provided some references about French warships of the period and paintings of Dutch ships.  Looking at what appear to be belaying pins on the Dutch ships, I would not want to try to pick them up; their tops appear as large as my head (if not larger!). The Heller 1/100 scale plastic version has molded pins on the sheer rails. Unfortunately. these are sharply pointed, shaped badly, and fragile.  Most wood plank on bulkhead kits don't seem to include them but I could be wrong.  The Artesania Latina kit includes them on fife rails, which seems incorrect. 

I suppose the correct answer is to go with whichever the builder believes is authentic.

Bill

Credible representations are what the hobby is about.   Marc is building a fantastic conversion of the Heller kit and painting it in an interesting and beautiful fashion!  His model might or might not be a specific ship, but it certainly appears to be a French ship-of-the line, which he has based on credible plans.  CRI-CRI is doing the same, as is the other Marc in France.  Does this answer the question about belaying pins?

We have conflicting information.  Lees states explicitly that belaying pins first came into use around 1750. Was he talking specifically about English ships?  Does he include French practice?  Marc in NYC has provided some references about French warships of the period and paintings of Dutch ships.  Looking at what appear to be belaying pins on the Dutch ships, I would not want to try to pick them up; their tops appear as large as my head (if not larger!). The Heller 1/100 scale plastic version has molded pins on the sheer rails. Unfortunately. these are sharply pointed, shaped badly, and fragile.  Most wood plank on bulkhead kits don't seem to include them but I could be wrong.  The Artesania Latina kit includes them on fife rails, which seems incorrect. 

I suppose the correct answer is to go with whichever the builder believes is authentic.

Bill

NekO,

You gave an outstanding explanation of your point that the Tanneron model is "false".   I appreciate your point of view.  I suppose that we can look at all models of this period as being "false" if we cannot back up our models with documentation. At best we can use a medical description that the Tanneron model," . . . morphologically resembles . . ." French warships of the 17th-18th centuries.  Indeed, the same description can apply to many ship models. Without specific evidence the Tanneron model is a facsimile.

Concerning the belaying pin issue, we are all relying on secondary and tertiary sources.  I am using Lees' book that was first published in 1979. Given that we are all using such sources we are all discussing based on very scanty evidence at best.  Given this, I am open to everyone here offering an opinion.  I would love to find primary sources to add to this discussion.

Bill

Marc,

Good morning.  Okay, I see what you are pointing to.  They certainly look like belaying pins at a glance, but they are far too large to be used as such.  Even on the models, pins of that size couldn't be easily handled. They appear to be larger than a man. Maybe we have an answer to the mysterious "turnpins"!  😀

Bill

Marc,

I will certainly look tomorrow. I discovered a similar discussion on MSW in August 2019 that sources Lees.  The participants can point to a reference as early as 1750 in smaller ships but no reference before that date except for a reference to something called a "turnpin" that no one could define.  They tried to pin i t down by using logic and reason, but no one was sure.

Again, it does make an interesting discussion.

Bill

Marc,

Just as respectfully, I am inclined to believe just the opposite.   Perhaps it's my age but I don't clearly see belaying pins in the paintings.  The red arrow is pointing to what seems like carvings, but I could be wrong.  But, I am enjoying this conversation.  Thank you!

Bill

According to my sources, the use of belaying pins did not occur until the 1790s.  Granted, these sources might be talking about English ships, but they do not differentiate between navies.    I have carved off all of the pins from the Heller kit and sanded the sheer rails smooth. But, again, there might be other opinions.

Bill