hamilton

Thanks for the tip Christian! This process is not intuitive for me, and I appreciate the guidance!

hamilton

Minor update on the deadflat frame. The chocks and cross chock are now cut out and I think my approach to doing this (at least provisionally) works ok. As noted above, I made a few billets of boxwood for the cross chocks and the chocks, since I felt that it would be very hard for me to make these if I was just trying to cut them out of the larger sheets along with the futtocks.

I position the template of the chock/cross chock at the end of the appropriate billets - in this case, they were all cut from 10" stock - with the angled side at 1 edge. I then use the disc sander to shave the angled portions down - not quite fully, so I can finish them off more carefully by hand with a sanding block. I then cut along the straight edge on the scroll saw to release them from the billet - I was worried that this would be really hard to achieve since the pieces are so small, but it actually proved not too difficult. Some light final finishing with sanding block and files and presto! I now only need to refine the futtocks and then get into the joinery....the kind of finnicky work that normally defeats my lazy and distracted nature, but that I'm determined to really get right! The final shot, below, shows the chocks loosely put together with the futtocks, and it shows I've got some ways still to go before I can finalise the assembly and raise the frame....but I'm enjoying this far more than I feared I might! Hopefully that feeling lasts!!

hamilton

A bit more progress on Echo. I took some time over the weekend and studied the framing tables supplied by Admiralty for the cross-section, sorted through wood, made copies of the frame patterns and started work on the deadflat frame. I also made the framing square jig, the pattern for which is also included with the other documentation for this build - it is suggested to use heavy card for this, but having an ample supply of 1/16" basswood strip, I decided to use that. 

For the deadflat frame, I first cut out templates of the individual frame elements, but realised that cutting and refining the chocks and cross chocks might be done more precisely and efficiently if I made billets for this purpose. The chocks and crosschocks are made from different thicknesses of boxwood depending on their location - 10.5", 10" and 8.25". The cross chocks for the forward frames are all 10". So I made 4 billets - 1 10.5" x 5/8" x 3 1/4", 1 10" x 5/8" x 3 1/4", 1 8.25" x 5/8" x 2 1/4" and for the cross chocks 10" x 1 3/4" x 2 1/2". I cut these billets over long for the number of chocks required so I could use the excess as a handle to refine the angled portions of the chocks on my disc sander. The straight edge will be cut using a chisel and refined by hand.

I have yet to refine the futtocks so the images below show them as I rough cut them on the bandsaw.

Enjoy and bye for now!

hamilton

Another (hopefully quick) question for you, @dvm27. I've been studying the document called "Echo Cross Section Frame Components", which provides tables giving info on the sided dimensions of frame components, and the drawing of the disposition of frame, and I think I must be missing something in relation to Frame 2 (Aft).

On the Frame Components document, there is information given for the 3rd futtock (cut from 9" stock), but none given for the chock or second futtock - this is the case both port and starboard. If I read the table correctly, I'm to attach the 8" 3rd futtock of frame 2 to the 10.5" floor of frame 2 directly using a 10.5" chock - is this right? I know this frame is line with the gunport, so perhaps that explains things.

But when I checked this against the disposition of frame drawing, I noticed that a) there are 2 measures given on the 2nd futtock - 8.5" in the lower part and 8" at the upper part - I assume this indicates a taper, rather than two futtocks, since there is no line dividing a 2nd & 3rd futtock as can be seen in the other aft frames.....is that right?

Thanks for any clarification you can provide - I hope my explanation of the problem I'm having is clear.....

hamilton

Over the last several days I constructed the building board for the Echo cross-section - a fairly straightforward process, though aligning the mounting holes in the keel with their positions on the building board tested my eyes and patience....I used 3/4" MDF for the board, painted with 3 coats of matte white acrylic, with two 1 x 2 strips for support.

To trace the centre line, I first extended the centre line markings on the breadth plan drawing supplied by Admiralty models. I then positioned this drawing centred on the building board and extended the centre line from the plan sheet to the top and bottom of the building board. Once the plan sheet was removed, I could then connect these two short lines, scribe them with a #11 blade and retrace for emphasis. In a way this process was unnecessary, since the plan sheet is fixed to the building board, but having the centre line on the board provided the necessary reference for aligning the plan sheet with the centre line once I was ready to adhere the plans to the board.

I ended up threading the holes in the building board as my 6-32" machine screws were not able to fit through the holes as drilled, but fit perfectly once they were properly threaded. I was quite satisfied when the keel assembly fit nice and snug on the mounting screws along the centre line of the board! At this stage, I am considering making some right angle squares since the ones I have are either too large or too small for the scale of the cross-section. I made some right angle squares from 1/8" acrylic sheet a while ago and these might serve - but I have to find them first!! If your workshop is like mine then you know what a challenge this can be!

I also cut out the various parts that make up the framing square that slides over the keel assembly to ensure verticality of the frames - but I've yet to complete this stage....once this is done I'll be moving on to the framing, which is both exciting and a little nerve-wracking...Going to spend some time studying the information provided by Admiralty models, sort out the frame components and boxwood sheets appropriately and set up for constructing the frames....

Enjoy the photos and bye for now

hamilton

So over lunch today I walked up to the local hardware store (located dangerously close to my house) and picked up a tap & die set to resolve the mounting question asked above - thanks again Dave and VTHokiEE! It took about 1 minute to tap the mounting holes I drilled out yesterday and I was very relieved to find that I hadn't drilled the holes out too wide for the 6-32 tap. A small step, but this lightened up a huge area of ignorance for me in terms of this aspect of modelling. Here are some photos, just to liven things up a bit, though they may not be of much intrinsic interest. The second shot is of the tiny puncture made by the awl - hard to get focus on this.....

hamilton

Thanks Davec! Very helpful suggestions all around! I agree that all of a sudden my little hobby shop looks pretty pro with the drill press set-up! In fact, I've already got some ideas about re-organising and renovating the work area to allow for more permanent tool set-up - right now, I store my power tools and bring them out when needed - it's not too bad, but it's getting to the point where the time I spend taking things out, setting them up and putting them back relative to the time I spend at the bench is getting annoyingly skewed....but I have a fence to re-do and a deck to resurface first or it'll be gunplay and gravestones over here.....

hamilton

Thanks VTHokiEE and Greg - thanks for this - I'm a little worried now that the holes I drilled in the keel assembly are too wide - but I will follow up on these suggestions and see! I see now that I'll have to get myself a tap & die set! The Admiral has started to levy what she calls a "practicality tax" on my tool purchases....meaning that I need to start using the things I buy for more than ship modelling.....starting to realise how much my modelling practice depends on the the policy directions of the Central Bank of Canada....

hamilton

Hey OC - no diorama for me - I do not have the patience for painting figures at scale and my eyes are just bad enough for ship modelling! Though I see from your signature that you have both the patience and the skill! Is this project documented somewhere here or elsewhere?

hamilton

Quick question for @dvm27 - or really for anyone who has a knowledge of this....I've now drilled the mounting holes into the keel assembly and I have a supply of 6-32 machine screws at hand for the mounting - but I can't find any info in the instructions about the actual process of mounting the keel assembly on the building board....for some reason, my limited "common sense" is stumbling over this.....

I assume I have to set the nuts for the machine screws into the keel assembly after shaping the holes to admit them and then epoxy them in place, then mark out & drill corresponding holes in to the building board and fasten the machine screws in from below? The issue is how to widen the holes without really damaging the part - carefully, yes...but I can't imagine a 1/4" chisel is going to do the job.....any hints would be greatly appreciated! Thanks and bye for now

hamilton

Thanks Greg! I made a point of downloading those a while back, along with the fitting out instructions - in addition to the boxwood framing package for the cross section, I also bought a supply of un-milled boxwood from Crown Timberyard when were at the end of their operation and a friend generously milled this into three 2" x 3" x 36" lengths - I assume this will be more than enough for the fitting out of the cross-section - I downloaded the wood list and once the framing is done, I'll get to have yet another new experience - putting my bandsaw, Byrnes thickness sander, and mini table saw to work milling boxwood sheets and strips!

In any case, I hope I can do justice to this build - and learn from the experience and the many other excellent Echo builds out there. Bye for now

hamilton

Well this is probably ill-advised, but I've decided to start on the Admiralty Models HMS Echo cross-section (1:48). I actually ordered the framing package for this kit from Crown Timberyard way back in....I can't even remember when....a long enough while ago....and in fact a number of years ago I put together the keel, false keel & rising wood for this build - getting a feel for my then newly purchased mini table saw and disc sander. But since then I haven't done anything, taking some time off modelling and then finishing both the Bluenose and my little Off Center sailing skiff and commencing on Corel's HMS Bellona. 

Bellona is currently at the stage of the second layer of lower planking - a time when I frequently tire of the slow and repetitive work of planking and try to build momentum by breaking it up not with other work, but by starting a totally different model! This is why I say "ill-advised"....but....

I also sometimes use new model builds as excuses to expand the workshop - this is one of those times. Because I absolutely needed a drill press to drill out the mounting holes in the keel/rising wood assembly, right? Plus the numerous other uses that this tool will see in the shop....right? In any case, I feel that with the drill press my tool complement is complete so at least I can close that chapter....for now.

So here are a couple of images of the keel/rising wood assembly - the rabbet still needs a bit of cleaning up on both sides, but otherwise, I'm pretty happy with the results. Next I'll be making a building board, drilling out the mounting holes & then starting on the framing - my first time at this, unless you count a couple of test futtocks I cut out several years ago as a trial....in any case, not sure how quickly this will go, but I'm looking forward to this one as a new type of challenge. Bye for now

hamilton

Thanks Ron!

hamilton

Hello for a final time here - I've now finished the OC "sailing skiff" - which is, of course, a hybrid of the OC rowing skiff and the Monk Truant (for the rig). I'm quite happy with this little one - it's quite cute and I'm very proud of the results. Here are some photos of the finished model - bye for now and enjoy!

hamilton

Hi there:

I just realised that after almost 3 years (has it really been that long!!), I still haven't put an end to this build log and called it done.....this is for a few reasons, most obviously that in getting back into modelling again, I started juggling this build, the Corel Bellona and my scratch-built Bluenose. Now that Bluenose is done, and the Bellona is well underway, I realised that I still have some stuff to do with this little skiff.

I needed to re-do the stem piece, which was damaged for some unknown reason, complete the rudder and do some little details. I had considered earlier adapting her by adding a rig, but put that idea on the back burner until a couple of weeks ago, when I was looking through a book of small boat designs by Edwin Monk and came across the "Truant", whose rig I thought could work (at least aesthetically) with this skiff. It did mean that I would have to file a slot through the bottom of the boat/keel for a dagger board, but this was not too difficult to accomplish. The rigging arrangement and dagger board design were all taken from the Monk "Truant" design.

At this point, I've also made and added a main sail and jib, but I don't have photos of these. I just need to add a few rope coils at this point and she'll be done. Here are some photos prior to the addition of the sails - I should be done this one by the end of the week and will post some completion photos here and in the gallery when that's done. In the meantime, enjoy!

hamilton

I was just thinking about this kit before seeing this update! Great work - she's looking nice!

hamilton

Beautiful work on the sails John! 

hamilton

I didn't use any of the kit-supplied planking except below the wales and I also didn't use those metal gunport frames, but framed out the gunports with scrapwood....sorry, it was so long ago I can't really remember........

Because of the flaws of this kit, I strongly recommend just going with whatever works rather than with the kit's recommendations - that's what I did about 75% of the time on this build. If you already have those gunports installed, then the main thing is that the general arrangement (1 strake above the gunports , 1 below and whatever works to fill the gap between) be maintained, and also that whatever material you use it should be of a consistent width - at 1:100 scale I would go for the 3mm planks myself - 4mm would look a little too wide, I think, for this vessel at this scale - those can be used for the lower hull planking.

hamilton

Thanks Nearshore! I feel like it's going better than it usually does, which isn't saying much, but still - I'm happy with these results so far. As we know, in ship modelling there's always more time for mistakes! Wish I had more time to work on the model, but such is life. I'm going to be heading into another really busy push at work starting mid-week, but in a couple of weeks I'll get a breather and hopefully find an hour here and there at the bench to make some progress.

hamilton

Really impressive metal work Gregg! 

hamilton

So it's been quite some time since my last contribution here. There has been very little time for modelling in the last few months, but since the last update, I've completed the bulwark planking except for the upper bulwarks in line with the f'csl, quarterdeck & poop deck; installed the false wales and main wales, and finished the outboard bulwarks (yellow ochre & black for the wales). I also did some work to correct the square tuck transom, which now that I've started the lower hull planking seems to have worked out ok - though this was a lot of nerve-wracking work with a rotary tool and a variety of sanding blocks.

In any case, the photos below document my start on the lower hull planking. At the deadflat, I measured 102cm. The material supplied in the kit is 4mm wide, which translated into 23 planks of 4mm width and 2 of 5mm (which I'll use for the garboard and the strake above it, which will be coppered over in any case).

There will be 5 bands - 3 of 5 strakes, 1 of 6 strakes at the bilges and a garboard band of 4 strakes. I have not lined off the hull completely, but am doing so band-by-band, starting with band "A" of 5 strakes immediately below the wales.

So far things have gone quite well. Anyone who has seen my previous builds will know that hull planking is not my forte! But so far I'm pleased with the results aesthetically, though in terms of period practice they do not entirely follow convention (or architectural sense). Since I'm under no pressure to keep anyone on the vessel safe or to protect the Admiralty's investment, I'm cool with that! Here are the photos - enjoy!

hamilton

I always start hull planking at deck level - the top edge of the first plank you lay should be flush with the upper surface of the deck planking. Then I usually plank the bulwarks, and then line off and plank the lower hull. 

hamilton

I had no trouble completing all deck planking with the material provided - albeit, by the time I built this model I had a significant pile of leftover material (including dimensions needed for this deck planking) so I can't recall if all of the deck planking came out of the Greyhound box. 

My advice - though maybe it's dumb or at least really cumbersome - is that you take a total measure of all the woodstrips provided by

Corel for deck planking and then get rough width and length measurements of the sub-decks. There tends to be less attrition of wood in deck planking compared with hull planking so if the numbers are close (but not over on the sub-deck side) then you should be ok - even a rough go at this will give you a decent impression. 

I'm envious of your progress - I have not been able to get a day at the bench in over two months due to work and family stuff - and now work is getting to its busiest time for the next few weeks - I have a couple of weeks of quiet at the end of April, so hopefully then I'll finally be able to get some time at the bench! For now, I'll enjoy yours!

hamilton

Tack some planking strips across the bulkheads to see how they want to run - look to see if the strip is either bowing out or leaving a gap to the bulkhead. I usually run a test strip across 4-5 bulkheads and then move fore and aft and from the rails to the keel in this way to identify where things need to be sanded down or built up. Don't worry about the forward most 3 frames for now - you'll be fairing them for planking later so for now you just want to make sure you have a reasonably fair and smooth framework for the planking. The best way to ensure this is by "rack of eye", and it's hard from a photo or two to get a 100% sure assessment of the situation. However, when I look at how the bottoms of the bulkheads line up in the photo above they look ok to me.

The current distance between the bulkhead bottoms and the bearding line is probably ok, because it will get filled up by the roughly 2mm of planking that goes over the bulkheads. Do some testing with a planking strip, take your time and try to get things as fair as possible. This hobby is a matter of fractions of inches and millimetres, so it can be quite exacting - particularly at this stage, where getting all the parts correct relative to one another is of crucial importance. I think your skeleton is shaping up well though, by the looks of it. 

hamilton

Yes - OC has achieved a great result here - if you can get yours looking like this, you'll be ready to move on. You don't have to build them up to the keel. Just to fit along the bearding line - here is an MSW thread that talks about the bearding and rabbet lines - the ships uses as e.g.'s aren't exactly like Greyhound but you will get the principle and general idea from this.

hamilton