iMustBeCrazy

17 minutes ago, bruce d said:

Using the link in post #19 above, this database is the alphabetical list of subjects so look at the vertical menu on the left; RATTLESNAKE will be in the set ‘No.77 – Sea’.  

And you should find the 'card' for Rattle Snake at No 116. On it in the lower left you will see the reference 'F 18'. As there is only one reference there is only one drawing.

To access the drawing open the link Bruce provided in post #17 and search in the left column for F 18. You should find a F14-F31, click on the plus symbol, nothing but numbers, number 1 is F14, 2 is the back of F14 etc etc (most of the time) 9 is F 18.

It's a real pity that they made this wonderful resource so hard to navigate.

Anyway, have fun.

3 hours ago, bruce d said:

Have fun!

Months and months of fun at a guess!

But for some of us your hard work (actually 'Diligence' seems more appropriate ) paid off. Thank you again.

Lapwing (1816)
Kite
Fancy (1817)
Racer
Sprightly

Nightingale (1825)
Speedy (1828)
Snipe (1828)

Vigilant (1821)
Swift (1821)
Basilisk (1822)
Bramble (1822)
Skylark
Diligence

9 hours ago, oakheart said:

Oh Craig, I should have guessed as usual you are one step ahead of me..........

Umm. Earlier was 2018, before I found this forum. First ever 'build' and I wasn't happy with what I was doing and with the family connection I wanted to show more of the interior. The moulds/bulkheads were corrected.

Which lead to something more like Bruce is suggesting:

But I still wasn't happy, so I bought a Bounty Launch kit and found this forum and started learning.

But I still wasn't happy, so I designed and built my small Cutter and learned a lot.

I was quite happy with that so I designed and am building my Bounty Launch (and 'Kitty').

Which brings us up to date.

Here's one I made earlier

14 minutes ago, Jaager said:

Scratch is difficult enough without starting with ambiguous plans.

True, but the plans Tim has will build him a cutter, just not Speedy. For me, my great grandfather sailed out here on Lapwing so I'm more inclined to build her and get her right, unfortunately.

Definitely a nightmare. 2 sets of plans, 2 draftsmen. Sheet 1 and 2 are a pair but the one showing the moulds is different.

The book of building the model gives the answer, despite the name on the box and book It's not Speedy!

Page 31 of the book gives references and says "The original Admiralty draught of the naval cutter that the 'Speedy' model was based on" and shows a drawing.

Except it's not! The drawing shown is ZAZ6373 which is the drawing 'Skylark' was to be built from along with 'Swift', 'Bramble' and 'Diligence'.

I believe these were cancelled and the names 'Skylark', 'Swift', 'Bramble' and 'Diligence' and 'Speedy' were later given to vessels built on the lines of the 'Lapwing', hence the confusion.

So the model is of the proposed 'Skylark' perhaps with some alterations taken from 'Lapwing/Speedy' drawings. Lots of room for confusion.

So I confess I was wrong, it's ZAZ6425 which is Lapwing and therefore Speedy.. Tooooo many drawings.

3 hours ago, oakheart said:

I now have a complete set of drawings scaled and corrected.

Are you sure? I've been asleep but looking this morning there are some discrepancies between drawings. And it doesn't help that there are 10 stations and 9 moulds.

The 1st drawing below has a scale to which I have corrected but the aspect ratio is wrong (only just noticed that) station 6 should be 10'11" ( half of 21'10" ).

I traced the sternpost, keel and stem and copied it to the other drawing which has been scaled to Mould 'E' which should be 21'10" (twice station 6) and the length doesn't match. So there is possibly something wrong with the scaling of individual sections. Maybe?

Or maybe I'm still asleep having a nightmare?

See post #7.

At this stage she's looking better than the original!

But don't forget the new paint scheme:

18 minutes ago, oakheart said:

Lets hope there is a high resolution version on Wiki as well

Sorry Tim, Speedy (1928) is based on Lapwing (1916) and believe me, there are no hires plans.  Edit: I forgot about the Danish drawings found by Bruce_d (post #11 below)

Revisit my Lapwing thread for clues: https://modelshipworld.com/topic/23486-lapwing-1816-revenue-cutter/

Allan, I think the context is 'not reclaimed/recycled" so ground as in the past tense of grind. toes, tocs, I don't know.

16 minutes ago, Louie da fly said:

some kind of oval thing (I dunno what it its)

The Captains (armoured) observatory.

29 minutes ago, Louie da fly said:

funnel with base

It's a little more complicated (just a little I promise). But perhaps I'm being fussy.

And no, I wouldn't be making the boats either. Way over the top.

1 hour ago, CPDDET said:

Going to have to learn alot about shellac, universal tints and how to mix them.

One thing to be aware of is how much shine you want, one coat of shellac can give you a low sheen finish but if you keep adding layers to get a darker colour it's going to get very shiny. So a few different diluted stains and tinted shellacs will give you the best control.

Edit: Bob's got it, listen to him.

I've done a little Dave, using spirit based stains (dyes,tints). I've also used the stain on it's own but diluted with denatured alcohol.

There are only two three types of wood in my Bounty Launch, the knees are basswood, the thwarts footwaleing cap rails and windlass are Tasmanian Oak and the rest (including the quarterdeck) is Paulownia:

Fenders and port cap rail fitted. I need to finish the interior before fitting the starboard.

9 hours ago, Louie da fly said:

I think we are talking about two different things. I mean the one about halfway between the pergola and the funnel.

Possibly the same thing that keeps moving?

The wheelhouse is actually the binnacle-house (9). With the wheel at (19).

The binnacle-house becomes the binnacle-pergola.

A new compensated* waterproof binnacle is installed and the pergola is moved to between the funnel and ventilator.

* probably to allow the fitting of the two Nordenfelt machine guns.

44 minutes ago, Louie da fly said:

Do my beady old eyes deceive me or is the mast coming up through the huge vent?

I would say so.

45 minutes ago, Louie da fly said:

There appears to be a vent just forward of the steersman's pergola in the second picture

I think it's a binnacle. It seems to have 'balls'.

54 minutes ago, Louie da fly said:

but I don't know about doing that mast coming up through the front turret with the weird ball thing on top.

Skip it, it only occurs in that pic. It looks like it belongs on a castle wall with a fire in it.

57 minutes ago, Louie da fly said:

but I'm not prepared to put in too much, as it's not likely to be appreciated

You have to strike a balance, it only has to be good enough to sell and price will most likely be the deciding factor. It can also look a bit rustic. Rails could be bicycle spoke posts with automotive electrical wire with the insulation stripped off soldered to the posts (use one that has tin plated wire not bare copper) as cable. Don't do all the railing, just some.

Pic 4 zoomed out a bit:

1 hour ago, Louie da fly said:

Does she have a wheelhouse at the fore end of the upper deck (as shown on at least one set of plans) or doesn't she?

She did when she arrived, later they moved it down the back yard as a garden shed and built a pergola for the helm. Later again they put a search light on the roof of the garden shed.

1 hour ago, Louie da fly said:

How many vents (I don't know the correct term - those big vertical tubes with a "hockey-stick" bend at the top coming up out of the deck and leading down to the interior) does she have in front of the funnel, and how many aft of it? I think there are two fore and two aft, but it's very hard to work out from the plans and the photos. 

One giant one aft with two small between it and the funnel and one big one forward (I can't see any others but). On the colour plans The giant one aft didn't have the 'hockey-stick' bend.

Update time.

Transom knees fitted, floorboards fitted, windlass chocks fitted, cap rails and thwarts made, windlass made.

To do: Foredeck, there are several valid options but I think I'll go with framed with longitudinal planking.

           Thwart knees, iron or wood? Both the Bountys launch and large cutter had removable knees (and bolts), the cutters knees were stored in a carpenters chest - wooden knees would take up too much space so they were almost certainly iron - but the launch?

           Fender below the sheer strake.

           Cant frame in the bows.

           Mast steps and brackets, round or square lower mast? The drawings usually show round, the models square.

           Masts and sails.

           Oars.

           Rudder.

           Other stuff, probably.

11 minutes ago, Louie da fly said:

But to be honest, this is going to be quick and basic

I figured that. One thing they couldn't stop themselves doing was playing with her, hardly any two photos are the same. The deck had a support in the middle of the turret (it shows in the drawing) and the 'cantilevered' deck stopped just past that.

15 minutes ago, Louie da fly said:

Such a shame that she ended up as a breakwater and is now unsalvageable. 

True but otherwise she would have been scrapped, at least we can still see her.

G'day Steven, Having known her all my life and having walked her decks a few times Cerberus is certainly on my list.

1 hour ago, Louie da fly said:

Fortunately, I was able to find this on-line:

I have an original of this drawing inherited from my Uncle. I intend to redraw it in CAD but as usual it doesn't quite agree with other drawings I have found, unfortunately I can't find any 'official' drawings. Even her length varies.

Anyway, I have a little collection of photos, drawings etc. If you need anything just ask.

29 minutes ago, druxey said:

That is the wing transom!

Oops.

29 minutes ago, druxey said:

Note that conventional numbering of the other transoms is from above to below.

Doh! I blame working in 3D, it's unnatural.

But on the bright side, we're getting closer and I'm learning things.

Did anybody notice Transom 6 hiding in there?

Edit: added Transom 6 and Station 29.5.

11 minutes ago, druxey said:

It's more like an inverted cone:

A section of an inverted cone sounds like a pretty good description, but shouldn't there be some curvature to it? Perhaps a section of an inverted bullet shape?

I'm going to have to call it a 'rounded corner', an eighth of a sphere isn't right (but that's what is shown here). However you can see where the rounded corner cuts into T4 and T5, they will have to be shaped to fit.

The rounded corner will need to follow the curve of station 29 and transom 3 will need to be extended outside the lower deck.

The rounded corner will have to have a tighter radius.

5 hours ago, Matrim said:

it is new station lines I want...

(Note: The drawings below are really rough)

It's both to give an intersecting point in space. The problem is that we know there are complex curves above waterline 5 and aft of station 29 and the plans give us no information about this area.

Below W4 things are pretty straightforward because we have the shapes at the waterlines and adding new station lines aft of S29 is pretty much like nailing a batten on.

We add in what info we have.

And here we run in to my lack of skill, Transom 3 (in blue above) should have another curve on the aft surface curving forwards at the bottom edge.

More importantly there is a shape, roughly an eighth of a sphere (visualise an orange cut vertically into four quarters the once horizontally giving eight "triangular" segments) with one of the points touching one of those top aft corners. (or something like that)

The plans give no information about this shape or how it fairs into the waterlines etc we do have.

Obviously the above drawing has errors, T2 is too wide t4 is too narrow and the curves aren't there.