Kevin

glad to see you back Andy! been out of the loop for a week or so.....now I have to play catch up! with so many different colors in primers these days, it's nice to be able to take your pick. one thing to consider though, is the hue the base coat is going to give the color coat. red sounds like a good choice.....and gray is such a solid color. it is going to deepen the gray, but hopefully, you won't get any sort of a reddish hue. you'll have to do light coats.....with all those angles, there is a threat of gathering in the corners. you might want to wait after the base is done, to give it time to fully cure. there's nothing worse than reanimated paint
 
no jealousy here Augie......only that Andy has a new and exciting model to build. I think he's too shrewd to fall into the same pit as I did play on......after you ply on Andy!

So she sound like she is already pretty demanding. Is this developing into a co-dependent relationship? Is this the right basis to set up your future relationship? Perhaps you three need to go see some counseling ( perhaps a dry "doc") to make sure your relationships are starting on an even keel.  
Okay, I have run out of similes. Enjoy.

My Victory will be back on the workbench by this weekend, intentions are to get her to a masting stage by the end of the year, (well its a plan anyway)
 
My list of things to do in the next few weeks, lol about 100 on it -which will take me to masting
 
1) finish port side gun-port lanyards and then repeat everything starboard
2) stern and bow decoration
3) rudder
4) rework all davits and lower mast booms
5) stern Gun ports (missed)
6) find a way to re-position all top side cannons so they are not taking up deck space
 
yep the BUZZ is back

My Victory will be back on the workbench by this weekend, intentions are to get her to a masting stage by the end of the year, (well its a plan anyway)
 
My list of things to do in the next few weeks, lol about 100 on it -which will take me to masting
 
1) finish port side gun-port lanyards and then repeat everything starboard
2) stern and bow decoration
3) rudder
4) rework all davits and lower mast booms
5) stern Gun ports (missed)
6) find a way to re-position all top side cannons so they are not taking up deck space
 
yep the BUZZ is back

My Victory will be back on the workbench by this weekend, intentions are to get her to a masting stage by the end of the year, (well its a plan anyway)
 
My list of things to do in the next few weeks, lol about 100 on it -which will take me to masting
 
1) finish port side gun-port lanyards and then repeat everything starboard
2) stern and bow decoration
3) rudder
4) rework all davits and lower mast booms
5) stern Gun ports (missed)
6) find a way to re-position all top side cannons so they are not taking up deck space
 
yep the BUZZ is back

OK, here we go with my interpretation of hammocks.  Remco, I'm glad you are so far ahead of me so I don't embarrass myself attempting to duplicate your hammocks!
 
First of all, I had no idea how the hammocks were designed.  I found some pictures and sketches on the web to guide me. The hammocks are a regulation six feet long.  I made mine three feet wide.  Multiple cords (nettles) are sewn to the hammock and end in a ring.  A lanyard then extends from the ring to the batten and then doubles back and is secured proximal to the ring.  The right hand picture actually shows the hammock suspended from battens on the far side of the beam.  The drawing in TFFM suggests they are suspended from the near side of the beam, so I used that interpretation.
 
 
 
The next problem was materials.  After some experimentation, I decided to use 2 ply of Kleenex impregnated with dilute yellow glue.  The look was initially too shiny but after rewetting a few times and rubbing them down the final look is one of used canvas.  I added ten nettles per side and secured them on the underside with an additional single ply strip of Kleenex.  I used an unblackened brass ring to secure the nettles.  I was afraid the blackening would rub off with all of the handling.  I used the finest thread I had available (No. 100 Cordonet) for the nettles, but they are too heavy appearing. The lanyard is No.30 Cordonet.
 

 

 
Now comes the "interesting" part.  I like to think I am a pretty decent surgeon.  Surgery is easy compared to sculpting.  I made my sailor out of Sculpy.  He is 5'6" tall.  When I baked him he got a little burnt.  I guess I won't have to paint any brown shoes on him.    I am not home this week and so he won't be painted until next week.  I moistened one of the hammocks and wrapped it around my sailor so it would look like he was laying in the hammock.  The other two hammocks will be shown trussed.  These were also moistened to that they could be folded.  After the folds had dried, the hammocks were trussed.
 

 

 

 
I tried to hang the hammocks as depicted in the drawing but simply could not get the thread tied proximal to the ring. So I tied the hammocks off to the batten.  I removed two ledges to gain access to the area.  They have been temporarily replaced for the picture.
 

 
 
 
 

My Victory will be back on the workbench by this weekend, intentions are to get her to a masting stage by the end of the year, (well its a plan anyway)
 
My list of things to do in the next few weeks, lol about 100 on it -which will take me to masting
 
1) finish port side gun-port lanyards and then repeat everything starboard
2) stern and bow decoration
3) rudder
4) rework all davits and lower mast booms
5) stern Gun ports (missed)
6) find a way to re-position all top side cannons so they are not taking up deck space
 
yep the BUZZ is back

Because of the server issue I went back and checked all of the photos in the build log.  It was necessary to repost  about a dozen pictures.
 
I have made and installed the hammock battens.  These are pieces of tooth shaped wood that attach to the beams just under the carlings.  Their function is to provide a hook to secure the hammocks.  I first made several strips of wood the correct dimension (2" x 3") and glued them together.  I set the height of the blade on the table saw to the depth of the notch and sawed all of the strips simultaneously.  The distance between the teeth is 12".  The piece was then put into a bottle of isopropanol and the individual pieces separated from each other after several minutes.  The interior and exterior edges were rounded off with files.  The nails attaching the batten to the beam were simulated with an awl highlighted with pencil.  I decided to only place these on the starboard side since I have not yet decided how much decking I will install on the port side.
 

 

 

 

 

 

 
I have also finished the upper row of planks for the aft bulkheads.  They now extend to just below the beams.
 

 
 

Druxey and David, thanks.  The only thing I could think of as I finished the deck was...thank god this isn't a frigate!
 
I deferred making any of the items that attach on to the upper deck (except for the fore and main mast partners) until the entire deck was completed.  Now it is time for some small projects which will vastly improve the monotony of the appearance of beams and scantlings.  The first thing made was the capstan step. The shape of the step varied among the Swan class ships.  In TFFM, David shows a three piece rectangular step.  Atalanta has a tear-drop shaped step.  At this point I was still psyched from finishing the deck, so I forgot to take pictures of the step fabrication.  The step is made of three pieces of wood rabbeted together.  The inner piece was 14" thick and the outer pieces were 10" thick.  The edge of the 14" thick wood was highlighted on both sides with archival ink. The top of the step is flat, stands 7" proud of the beam and is parallel to the waterline, not to the deck.  There is a hole in the middle for the capstan post.  The step is secured to the beams and carlings with bolts.
 
 
 

 
 
 

 
The mizzen partner is a simple plank, in contrast to the complex structures of the fore and main partners.  The most difficult part is placing the hole in the correct location because of the rake of the mizzen mast.  I do not plan on masting and rigging Atalanta so I took the location of the opening off the plan rather than make a dummy mast.
 

 

 

I have finally finished the upper deck framing.  The first three photos show the deck before final fairing.  The last two are after everything has been sanded down.  I started with 100 grit and progressively sanded down to 400 grit.  I finished with a razor blade scraper.  There was a slight hump in beam 20 which was corrected with the sanding.
 

 

 

 

 

Toni,

The original shipwrights had the same problem fitting beams into place - even without the knees. Their end clearances were very close and the frames above the decks "tumbled home."
 
I suggest you do what they did if you can - spring the beam by lifting the center while holding the ends down, then rotate it into place. I installed Naiad's beams with knees attached using this method. Thanks to Blaise Olivier's 1737 commentary on English practice. (The French at the time apparently set the beams then raised the clamps under them.)
 
Here's a picture.
 

 
Ed

My general approach for fabricating and installing the beam sets has been one complete set at a time.  This worked well where there was no curvature of the hull but I had difficulty with the run of the outer carlings at the fore end of the upper deck and decided to change my approach as I neared the stern. I set out all of the beams and tack glued them in place.  I then drew fair lines for the outer carlings.  The deck beams were removed as I worked on them, only mortising the outer carlings.  The carlings were then tack glued without gluing the beam.  This continued until the last two beams.  The transom knee abuts the for end of the transom and extends along the hull just past beam 20.  It is set down on to the deck clamp and "bolted" to the frames and transom.  The last two beams are mortised into the transom knee.
 
The pictures show the run of the lateral carlings.  No finish shaping or sanding has been done yet.  I broke off the port counter timbers (again!) and just stuck it back on so that area looks out of whack.  I will probably have to remake it when it comes time to make the counter.
 

 

 

Well, I finally was able to spend a little time in my workshop.  The net result is that I was able to complete the forward platform on my longboat.  I may have been re-inventing the wheel on this one, but I decided to use a spacer block, so my template would have the proper shape, at the correct height inside the hull.

The block, with a strip of wood glued to it, was made thick enough so that the template would give me the shape of the upper surface of the platform. The wood strip helped keep the block in place as I worked with the template.  This worked out pretty well.



It took me a couple of tries before I was able to get a template I was happy with.

I then blackened the edges of the planks, and glued them to two wood strips that were positioned so they wouldn't interfere with the frames.
Once I had the platform cut to shape, and I was happy with the fit, I used black paint brush bristles to simulate three rows of nails.  For a final touch, I added a small strip of wood across the face of the platform.  This strip was actually "L" shaped, which allowed me to glue it to the underside of the platform.

I've been told by friends who have completed their longboats that the forward platform is the more difficult of the two.  I sure hope they're right.
 
BobF

My Victory will be back on the workbench by this weekend, intentions are to get her to a masting stage by the end of the year, (well its a plan anyway)
 
My list of things to do in the next few weeks, lol about 100 on it -which will take me to masting
 
1) finish port side gun-port lanyards and then repeat everything starboard
2) stern and bow decoration
3) rudder
4) rework all davits and lower mast booms
5) stern Gun ports (missed)
6) find a way to re-position all top side cannons so they are not taking up deck space
 
yep the BUZZ is back

Since the Quarter and Forecastle decks are to be positioned soon, it is necessary to cut out the gunports below them on the main deck. Plan sheet #8 gives locations horizontally, but the height off the deck should be measured from an actual gun assembly. I noticed a note from KeithW. that no mention is made of the different gunport sizes in the plans. This is not correct as they are clearly marked with dimensions on the plans.
 
Vince P.
 
 

I have now painted the area below the facia, though does not yet have a coat of polyyurethane.
 
The decorative wooden strips have been painted and attached.  These were pre-bent using my little bending machine (I don't know what else to call it) a photo of which appears earlier in this log.  The 2x1mm strip was quite splintery, and it is a good idea to coat the strip with a little thin CA first to prevent breakage.
 

Here is the facia dry-fitted

 
The following give some idea of what the facia and the decorative molding look like. I am very tempted to attach the molding to the facia as well as some of the cast decorations before putting the facia on the model.  It would make things far easier.  A potential problem is that the facia will have a slight curve when attached.  Gluing all the bits and pieces onto it without any 'give' in the glue may result in trouble.
 
Comments/suggestions welcome.
 



 
The two bits of ply poking over the top of the facia will have to be filed down flush.This, and the need to lower the facia so that the windows are obscured (others have had the same problem) suggest  the plans need revision.

While waiting for the copper problem to resolve itself, I decided to test fit the rudder.  It's something that has worried me for a while and something I have been postponing as a consequence.
 
As gudgeons,I have used a brass nail inserted into the eye of an eyelet, glued with gel superglue. I let the glue set for a couple of days to make sure it was completely set. It worked a treat.  (Thanks Arthur for the idea.) I also used eyelets for the pintles.  The result seems to be quite sturdy. The gel CA, once really set is really hard and durable.  I'm afraid soldering things would have been beyond me.
 

 
Having placed the rudder to the correct level against the waterline I fixed the pintles/gudgeons at the  top and the bottom.  This gave the spacing for all the intermediate fixtures. Unfortunately the following picture does not show it all that well.
 

 
Here is the rudder with top and bottom gudgeons.  I followed instructions to taper the rudder which made coppering the front and back difficult. This is the front of the rudder with top and bottom gudgeons.  The coppering here is obviously not neat but once the rudder is attached (to my relief), any imperfections are completely hidden (The rear of the rudder is OK thankfully.)  The gap between stern post and rudder is 1.5mm, and when I finally fix the rudder, the gap could be made a fraction smaller.
 
 

 
When drill into the copper plates on the stern post used Tamiya tape to prevent the drill bit slipping.
 

 
Here is the rudder fiitted.  All of the gudgeons/pintles are dry fitted at the moment.  I will attach it finally  once the copper finish is done.
 

 

 
 

The cleaning is complete, however there is still a problem.  While the vast majority of plates are unaffected by the heavy and unsightly (almost black) tarnish there are a few, mainly around their edges that are. It happens very quickly, and from previous, painful experience can occur while 'protected' by polyurethane.
 
I have now decided to leave the plates without a protective coating for the time being and clean off the affected plates as they appear. I am hoping that whatever is causing the problem will gradually dissipate over time. I will be away for a couple of weeks or so from next weekend and will make some sort of decision about what to do when I return.
 
Assuming all goes well, I now have three alternative protective coatings suggested to me:
 
1. the 2X clear matte mentioned above;
2. Tamiya clear metal primer followed by Tamiya acrylic spray paint Flat clear; and
3. GoddardsLong Term Brass and Copper polish followed by Polish Up Glass, Metal ... Surface Protector.
 
Of the last, I was advised that a matt acrylic or pol urathane "should" be OK over it. (?)
 
Advice is welcome.
 
In the meantime I have put on the gun doors for the stern chasers.
 
In drilling the holes for the ropes I have drilled though  Tamiya masking tape - there is less chance of the drill bit slipping.  Unlike Arthur (AEW), I did not provide a recess for the doors as I thought I would probably damage the stern. The doors are simply 5x1mm strip glued on, but I think 5x0.5mm would probably have been better.
 


I followed Len's and Arthur's examples in using plastic tube to finish off the holes, ready to insert the rope-  In my case electrical shrink tubing, which I was able to reduce in size to 0.8mm in diameter.



The following shows the nice finish the tubing provides.

 
 

I have just lost a whole bunch of stuff - which is really annoying.
 
It turns out the 2X clear matte cannot be taken in passenger baggage, so my friend will post it when he gets back to the US .... in 3weeks.  The copper problem seems to have gone away however.  After 3 weeks or so it shows very slight 'normal' weathering.
 
In the meantime I will work on the stern. It seems best to do it while the model is upside down anyway.
 
I found that the stern facia did no quite fit the curve of the platform above it. I fitted a piece of 1x1mm strip to fill the gap and filed it to shape - later another was added to make the facia slightly lower so that the top windows would not be obscured.
 

 
I found the 3mm strip would not easily bend to the degree required. A 5mm strip was shaped to accommodate the bend and allow a lesser bend for the 3mm strip.
 

 
I then planked the stern until it was almost to the facia.  The facia was dry-fitted and the final piece of the planking shaped to fit  the gap between it and the penultimate plank.  I'm afraid the following photos are a bit out of order, but I hope the procedure is clear.
 
Here is the filler used to close the gap.
 

 

 
The extra 1mm strip added and shaped.
 

 

 

 
Here is the stern planked and the facia dry-fitted.  The fit is very snug and I have just put a first coat of black paint on the planking
 

 
In fitting the facia I will use 5 minute epoxy.  Using gel CA is a bit risky as the CA may fog the windows fitted at the side of the model (I haven't yet glazed the windows of the Facia - will use Kristal Klear again).  Have others found epoxy suitable for this?  Suggestions?
 
I am concerned about fitting the lettering 'VANGUARD' on the stern.  I have read how Arthur did it in his log, and will probably adopt his method, but I would like to know if there is a way that is a little less fraught.  Suggestions are very welcome.  I will also put out a general query.
 
 
 
 

So I've been driving across "the" half acre (as in h€££'s half acre) today. Picked up Diana from the ship, then turned around and headed north to the cottage..... About 8 hours on the road
 
Time for some rest... And a goodly amount of beer and other adult beverages...
 
Andy

I am 958 hours into my build, the original cost has doubled due to books paints rope walks and line servers, considering i am possibly 1/3 into the build this so far works out to £1.46 per hour - $2.5  about the price of a pint of milk and a loaf of bread, -
the caldercraft always to me seamed the best option with the kits that are on the market, she will be finished and the cost will be virtually next to nothing per hour 

people please stop me being away from these build logs, i am missing so much
 
fantastic work, she look brilliant

Hi BE.
 
The stern davits are purely optional. (No holes cut into the stern, so leaving them off isn't a problem). It is important to note that if I were to design the stern as per her Trafalgar configuration, the stern would look very different to how it looks today, on the real thing. If I did design the stern as per 1803/05, too many people who don't know what it actually looked like would complain and say it's wrong.
 
Also, I don't buy the built up bulwarks for the forecastle. I have only ever seen these on Victory on paintings of her taken years after Trafalgar, where the artist has incorporated configurations contemporary to the artist, and not of 1803/05 (one famous painting even shows Victory with a later round bow with continuous front bulwarks). With a 'square' forecastle, build up bulwarks does not look right, perhaps looking a little awkward - But that's just my own personal opinion based on many drawings and paintings I have studied over the years.
 
More drawings/paintings than not show stern davits and timberheads at the forecastle, so this is what I include - but as I said, the stern davits are entirely optional.

Hi,
 
I am sorry it took so long to re-register - but I have been very busy - plus my internet has been intermittent.
 
Whilst developing and building the Victory prototype, I have made many changes 'on the fly' - sometimes for realism/previous part not quite right to adding more detail - especially the stern windows.
 
I have just completed the boat designs, anchors (100mm long!) and made four new cannon barrel masters - here are some pics:
 

 
Copper plates laid in two distinct bands:
 

 
Rudder is very easy to copper.....:
 

 
Main Channel:
 

 

 

 

 

 
Checking the cannon masters:
 

 
As for release dates for kits, I am sorry, I cannot help. I have as much idea as you, as I only design and develop the kits, and have nothing to do with release strategy....
 
 
Chris

Many happy returns