USS Independence by Philthy - Artesania Latina

[Philthy]

Hello and greetings! I am excited to start my second build log on this forum for the US Independence made by Artesania Latina. This is my third ship model that I have been steadily building up to in both complexity and size. I wanted to start this build log a little bit different by taking a few pictures of my work station. I remember building models on mom's kitchen table when I was a kid and constantly battling for space. Some of the tools I use have been in my possession for 15+ years and have been steadily expanded upon with a little here and a little there.

 

Some things I'm looking forward to about this build is constructing my first gun carriages, multiple masts, and more complex rigging. This ship is literally twice a big as my last build so that should work in my favor in the constant battle between big hands and tiny pieces. Well more to come shortly. If you want, take a picture of your work station and share it on this build log

 

oh I will be sure to add a link to my second build shortly.   

Edited October 14, 2015 by Philthy

[GuntherMT]

Good luck on Number 3!

 

There is already a thread where a good number of work areas are shown here: http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/3869-so-where-do-you-do-yours-then-model-making-that-is/

 

Mines somewhere on page 21.

[Philthy]

Well we are up and running sports fans. I was pretty surprised by the amount of materials that is with this kit. My two prior builds were significantly smaller than the Independence. I went ahead and numbered each of the laser cut part sheets and everything looks good. I should probably measure and organize the other material bundles (strips and dowels) as well.

 

I treated myself to a new tool for this build. I picked up the fare a frame jig from Model Shipways. So far this tool looks like it will make life a lot easier in terms of securing the keel and installing the bulkheads however, some assembly is required. I only got a little bit of the jug construction finished before it was time for bed. Ahh watching the Walking Dead with a glass of wine and a new model build. Does it get any better than this?

Edited October 14, 2015 by Philthy

[Philthy]

Its pretty frustrating having to go to work when all you want to do is build ships Still working on the bulkhead jig. Hopefully another few hours will become available tonight and I can finish up the jig and get to actual construction of the ship.

 

Some questions have been rattling around the brain about this build. The instructions call for installing the decking prior planking so I have been doing some thinking about treenails and "staggered" decking for a more accurate look versus individual long strips. This however is a few weeks away. I still need to install the bulkheads and should not get ahead of myself.  

[Philthy]

First of I hope that Gunther does not mind that I use a photo from his AVS log to illustrator this point. If there is an issue I will promptly remove it.

 

Progress on the jig has come to a screeching stop. This kits false keel is a bit different than most kits. The bottom of the bulkheads reach almost to the base of the false keel with only a few millimeter remaining for the jig to secure to. This kit has you apply both layers of planking before adding the keel extension pieces and stem piece. Long story short this jig would work fine for most models however, I have serious doubts it will work for the Independence by AL.

 

With that being said I plan on ordering the metal plates use for squaring up bulkheads as shown in the photo. This is a good excuse to pick up some new tools that will come in handy down the line. Model Expo is having a killer ale right now so I should be able to pick up these guys for under $15.

 

While I wait for these blocks to ship I am going to prep my bulkheads, test fit to the keel and shape the bullhead edges in preparation on planking. I'm kinda bummed out the jig didn't work out but you live and you learn. I will just have to use the jig on a future build with a full keel from the get go.

[Keith_W]

Good luck with your build! Love the beard, can I touch it?  

[Philthy]

KeithW, touch the beard at your own risk. I will not be responsible for its actions once provoked lol!

[DocBlake]

I picked up four 3" X 3" angle plates on EBay for $7 apiece.  Check it out.

[Philthy]

So I noticed something interesting about this kit or maybe the manufacture itself. Slots cut on the false keel for bulkhead installation are not 90 degrees as seen on other models. So ensuring that the bulkheads are properly aligned is going to be tricky. I'm not going to worry about it too much though. If for some reason the bulkheads are set crooked I can use spacer blocks to fix the alignment.

As you can see I went ahead with a initial sanding of the bulkheads to remove the burnt edges. I have read in he past that glue has a hard time adhering to these burnt spots so hopefully this helps. I also labeled each bulkhead numbers and their corresponding slats to help ensure the right part goes into the right spot. "Maybe I have screwed this up before lol"

I'm really considering adding filler blocks to the bow and stern sections. I have had a hard time planking these areas in the past since there is not a lot of materiel to glue to.

Edited October 17, 2015 by Philthy

[Philthy]

Some progress and head scratching on the Independence. The bulkheads have been secured and appear to line up ok depth wise and additional decking supports are in. Some troubles that are on the mind is since the bulkheads are not a nice 90 degrees and are not evenly spaced down the length of the keel, I am having a hard time keeping the keel nice and straight.

 

To fix this I am using some scrap wood to make supporting braces between the bulkheads however, this is a little tricky. This sometimes creates a bend in the keel rather than fixing it. I am trying to cut the braces the exact same length but this is proving to be a case of add a little here or sand a little there. So far I have added braces to the first 2 and last 2 bulkheads on the stern and bow with only about a millimeter difference in distance between the bulkheads. To the eye it looks manageable. I understand that this is pretty important since it can mess up the shape of the hull when its time to plank as well as mess up the proper alignment of the deck. So the next task in the build is to add additional bulkhead bracing to add strength as well as ensure the keel is straight as possible.

 

I will add some pictures later to show what I am talking about. If this doesn't make sense or if you have a better idea please let me know

 

p.s. oh I am studying up on staggered decking and lengths. The instructions call for long single pieces of decking which I think is inaccurate after seeing other builds on the forum. So I need to figure out how to convert the scale of the model in to corresponding lengths of decking. Yay math...

[Philthy]

On a bit of a side note I have been doing some online research about the schooners and sloops of the Continental Navy around the 1760's / 1770's and it is some very interesting stuff. I am finding out that digging up information on my specific ship is difficult to come by. The instruction booklet said this ships claim to fame is she carried dispatches to and from France during the early stages of the American Revolutionary War and she was the first ship to receive a salute from a foreign nation. Unfortunately, I have came across conflicting information saying another ship was the first to receive this honor. At this point I am very skeptical as to the accuracy offered by the kits manufacture.

 

Another point I find interesting is the lack of information from the Continental Navy on her such as plans, actions participated in ect. As a schooner I figured she was not meant for direct combat due to simply being out classed by larger more suitable ships. I read some information about Boston built schooners called Marbleheads that were purchased by the British prior to war for coastal patrol. These ships were said to be used for fishing and other economic based trades before being modified for naval service. I also noticed that a lot of these ships are very similar to each other in appearance for example the Hannah, Sultana, and the Independence. Maybe this is just the basic schooner profile I am seeing.

 

Another good read was an article about Maine's Colonial Navy and the ships built for its own coastal defense. I was familiar with colonial army militias but had no clue militia based naval forces were employed. Again specific information beyond ship names has been tricky to come by. I was hoping to find ship drawings or paintings to supplement my reference material in building this kit. Also information regarding color schemes used during that time period. I noticed ships of this size are painted very similar to one another both British and American. The white / yellow hull with black trim seems very common for this style of ship. Provided instructions did not offer any information in regards to painting so it looks like I will have to figure something out   

[john_wilmer]

Philthy,

 

This kit was my first build, I wish you much enjoyment.  Completing it infected me with the shipbuilding bug.  Although you may take the following as discouragement, I mean it to be instead liberating.  There is no historical accuracy to this this kit, whatsoever.  Forget researching the Independence.  It has nothing to do with this kit. 

 

Instead, enjoy the model.  The instructions call for long strips for the decking, never mention blackening the edges, or deck plank patterns.  Go with whatever you feel adds to the look, don't get bogged down too much in historical accuracy (or the directions).  Use it to improve your skills, spend your time building.  I do recommend adding blocks at the bow and stern, the planking will go easier.  There is no paint scheme to this kit, it has an all natural wood look, but again, forget the instructions and paint it if you like!!  Research the general paint schemes, then follow your own judgment. 

 

I built mine with zero knowledge of wooden ships, before I knew about MSW, following only the instructions, and was totally naïve to how inaccurate this kit actually was.  And I loved building it!! 

 

-John

[jbshan]

Check the angles of your bulkheads against the plans.  This type of vessel might have a slope to the keel with the bow higher than the stern, and they have set the bulkheads square to that slope rather than the keel.  As John intimates, there may be no relation to reality.

[Philthy]

Hello forum! 

 

Well first off super pumped after the OSU vrs. Penn State game. Go Buckeyes! Now I can get back to the build but first I need to clean up the work station. I was getting a bit aggravated at the build but then had a chance to sit back and take a look. I really need to clean up the work station and focus on one thing at a time. I need to remind myself not to worry 3 steps ahead when I need to focus on the task at hand.

 

It seems like this build log is gaining some traction as far as visitors and comments! Thanks a bunch guys.

 

John, Thanks a bunch for your comment and heads up about the build. I sort of had my doubts as far as the accuracy of this kit but you are absolutely right. Im going to continue to approach this build as a learning experience. This is only going to make me a better shipwright in the end and hey... its still wicked fun. My plan going forward is to take this build one step at a time and improving upon the kit when and where I can while loosely following the instructions. I plan on referring to the forum for other schooner type builds and apply what I see to this kit. With that being said I have been refereeing to Gunther's build log for his amazing Armed Virginia Sloop. Granted its different type of ship and different manufacture but his build sequence and detail is a great asset for a newbie like myself. 

 

Joel- 

I referred to the plans and the bulkheads are indeed not on a 90 degree angle just like the actual kit itself. No worries though, since AL decided to make up and package this ship out of their own imagination

 

p.s. John, do you happen to have a build log or completed photos of your Independence? If so please let me know as I am always on the hunt for info

 

Well with a full glass o' wine its time to clean up / organize some and go about installing these bracings. 

[Philthy]

well the clean up was quick and we are back into strengthening / spacing out the bulkheads. For this I can thank my girlfriend for picking up some 1/4 stock wood from the hobby store when she was looking for material foe her viking halloween costume (score).

 

I am measuring equal distances from both sides of the bulkheads and cutting the stock wood to secure between the two. I adopted a method of securing the bracing from Gunther's build log by cutting a cross into the ends of the cut stock wood. This should improve the amount of tight bond glue that is being use to secure the bracing. I also measured about 1 in from the keel on either side of the bulkheads as well as 1 in down to mark the location for my bracing. This might be a little over kill but hey I need to keep things organized (or at least appear so). 

 

I have been having a hell of a time making 90 deg cuts with my stock wood on other builds when using a miters box. So far the binder clips have really improved the accuracy of my cuts. A little red neck engineering seems to be the norm for my builds

 

Im not too worried about having visible bracing in the cargo hold areas of the sub decks. I plan to black these out as they should be barely visible from topside once the decking is installed. 

Edited October 18, 2015 by Philthy

[Philthy]

Tonight I managed to get 3 bulkheads braced up as well as adding some supports to the keel section. I can really feel the weight that is being added on but more importantly the keel and bulkheads are straight and it takes quite a bit of pressure to bend them. This should pay off when it comes time to file down the bulkheads in preparation of planking. From an initial test with some scrap planking I can see I am going to need some shims to even things out and prevent noticeable dips in the hull but that is a task for later on down the road. I should get some time this weekend and hopefully finish up the bracing step. Good vibes so far

Edited October 22, 2015 by Philthy

[riksgewijs]

You made an nice start. But isn't it better to set the keel fixet while gluing the bulkheads on?

[Philthy]

Hi Riksgewijs, 

I agree with you about having something to hold her steady during this step. Earlier in the log I was trying to use the fare a frame jig but sadly there is not enough material below the bulkheads for a solid hold in the jig. (I didn't want to add the keel trim pieces yet) So I had to improvise a little bit with the clamp and square. I understand this is not a perfect solution but it appears to be keeping the keel on a 90 deg angle for taking measurements and ensuring the bulkheads are evenly spaced on the port and starboard sides. 

Edited October 20, 2015 by Philthy

[Philthy]

Bracing has been completed and I am happy with the results. There is still about a 1 mm difference in some of the bulkhead distances that I was unable to fix with shims and sanding but this should be manageable during filing down the outside edges of the bulkheads in preparation of the first layer of planking. The keel was also reenforced and straightened out however, with still about a 1mm bend in a few locations. I figured I would only cause more damage if I went back and started tearing out bulkheads and braces to fix this. I might just be overly critical with these discrepancies but all should be ok moving forward. It seems pretty silly and cheap to construct the false keel out of plywood and a thin piece at that. 

 

Looks like I am going to have to run to the hobby store for some wood to use as filler blocks at the bow and stern. I should also pick up some strip wood for when it comes time to shim / fair the bulkheads to accept planking. 

 

Not bad for a weeks worth of work

Edited October 20, 2015 by Philthy

[Philthy]

Welcome back sports fans!

 

Today has seen some head scratching and the realization that I am not much of a wood carver artisan lol. I had a hard time finding wood blocks that would be suitable for filling in the bow and I didn't want to drive all over town in search of this item. So being a boy scout, a Marine, and mad genius I figured I would make my own wood filler blocks out of the 1/4 in strip wood all ready at hand. 

 

I started off by cutting and labeling the pieces to roughly match the bow with plenty of material to shave down later on. I then glued each of the strip wood together to roughly give me the shape needed of the filler block. I then took a pencil and traced out the profile lines from the first bulkhead, front most point on the false keel and from the top portion of the deck. Now I am slowly making progress carving the wood filler piece to match the hull profile desired. I have to say in a total of 3 wood ship models built this is the part that I dislike the most. Filing down the bulkheads and now the bow piece flat out sucks sometimes! 

So tomorrow I plan on making some more saw dust as I press on cutting, shaping, and sanding. For this I will be using the good ole exacto knife, 60 grit sand paper on a block, and a Dremel tool if I feeling brave enough around power tools. 

Edited October 20, 2015 by Philthy

[mtaylor]

I like that... and it embodies a certain philosophy very well... Semper Fi.

 

 

 

[GuntherMT]

Not a bad way to make filler blocks at all actually.  

[Philthy]

If you guys have any experience or tips when it comes to shaping filler blocks I am all ears at this point. I started out by more or less gnawing at the wood but if there is an actual "method" please share the secret To keep the profile straight in my mind I have to rotate the sides I am working on or I am worried about taking to much material off one side. Tomorrow should be fun and hopefully not laced with profanity lol

[lionfish]

If you guys have any experience or tips when it comes to shaping filler blocks I am all ears at this point. I started out by more or less gnawing at the wood but if there is an actual "method" please share the secret To keep the profile straight in my mind I have to rotate the sides I am working on or I am worried about taking to much material off one side. Tomorrow should be fun and hopefully not laced with profanity lol

a dremel works wonders for me. i used it to reshape the hull of my bounty, just gotta go slow and take your time. also take some thin strips of wood and get the profile at as many point as possible, use the same technique you would for faring the bulkheads for planking. 

 

dremel i have;  http://www.homedepot.com/p/Dremel-3000-Series-Variable-Speed-Rotary-Tool-Kit-3000-1-25H/203040434

 

i suggest spending the extra dough to get one from another store due to the homedepot stuff being made cheaper than standard production. on that note the tool is great, variable speed and great attachments. only thing is its high speed low torque, home drills and tools like that are low speed high torque. so just dont push the tool too fast and it will work great. 

 

here is an article on here that deals with filler blocks; http://modelshipworldforum.com/resources/Framing_and_Planking/BowandSternFillerBlocks.pdf

 

not sure if you have seen it yet, but it cant hurt. 

[Philthy]

Great link Lionfish! This is exactly what I was looking for. I am a little committed at this point with the bow filler blocks but I plan to apply this guide at the stern section. I failed to measure the actual curve profile for the bow section but should be able to wing it if I go slowly and take the material off a little at a time. Thanks a bunch! 

[Philthy]

Well the port filler block is glued on and I want to say about 90% shaped. I have been using some test planking (and ended up breaking it DOH!) and I think it's about the right shape. So now I'm chewing at the starboard side filler block and trying to match the shape. This should help me out since the bow looks to be an abrupt round curve.

 

I am pretty certain I am going to need to shim the 3rd bulkhead since it looks like there is a noticeable dip and bend but one thing at a time.

 

I will post some pictures shortly and get the expert opinion if the blocks look right since I hardly have a clue lol.

 

I realized too that the dremel is good for the rough stuff but as far as fine tune shaping I feel more comfortable with the good ole flat file. Time to make some more saw dust fly.

[mtaylor]

Here's one I've used for roughing in hawse timbers and fillers.  It's basically a dremel felt disk with some sandpaper on it. I use it like a rotary sander.  Just go slow and light as it really chews off the wood.  I also use it for the first sanding of decks.

 

[Philthy]

Well I think I am pretty set on shaping the bow filler and let me tell you it was not very fun lol. I think I matched up the shape somewhat close on both sides. Sadly I am going to have to wait until planking to find out for sure. I really fear the bow is going to look really messed up but fingers crossed.

[Philthy]

More happy fun times to be had. I hate to seem like I'm whining here but this kit seems to be a piece of junk made with the crappiest materials around. This piece of laser cut plywood has a pretty significant bend at the bow section so I soaked it in some hot water for about 5 minutes to help out with the bend. The part literally went to pieces after a few minutes. So my options are to probably snap it in half at the bow dry or soak it and have it still fall apart. Really wondering if its worth wasting my time on this POS kit. Seriously considering putting her in a box and forgetting about it for a few years lol. I have another kit  on standby so we will see. 

[lionfish]

More happy fun times to be had. I hate to seem like I'm whining here but this kit seems to be a piece of junk made with the crappiest materials around. This piece of laser cut plywood has a pretty significant bend at the bow section so I soaked it in some hot water for about 5 minutes to help out with the bend. The part literally went to pieces after a few minutes. So my options are to probably snap it in half at the bow dry or soak it and have it still fall apart. Really wondering if its worth wasting my time on this POS kit. Seriously considering putting her in a box and forgetting about it for a few years lol. I have another kit  on standby so we will see. 

is that the side? if it is, you might be able to use different wood for it.