Hr. Ms. O 19 1938 by Piet - FINISHED - scale 1:50 - submarine of the Royal Navy Netherlands in service 1939 - 1945

[ianmajor]

Hello Paul,

 

.....Needles to say I am more comfortable with airplanes and aluminum .....

 

Piet,

 

Excellent. Now I know who to turn to when I am struggling to solder aluminium parts on a model.  

Edited September 25, 2013 by ianmajor

[popeye the sailor]

looks great Piet.......you have made some amazing progress.........nicely done!

[Piet]

Thanks Popeye, yes, she's coming along okay.  Almost done with the starboard side and then to doing what? Hmmm, probably back to the tail end, um I mean the stern end 

 

Hello Ian, soldering Al ?  Hmmmm, I used structural adhesive myself or some very good epoxy adhesive      Just watch out for stuff that attacks aluminum though.

 

Cheers,

[Piet]

Well, hurray.  Been out of the dock yard for a few days but could spend some time this morning on the build.  I had to redo the top sides of the deck torpedo compartment.  I didn't like the looks of it, the front part of the opening was larger then the aft part.  But that's all part of building a model from scratch.  It's the end result  what counts.  In the meantime as the glue sets for the new side panels I made an angle piece from brass stock for the brace and loading boom for the dingy compartment. 

I immagine it used to be a T iron that runs across the opening that houses the boat's dingy.  I also think that it functions as the loading boom for the dingy.  It's hinged forward of the opening at the bottom of the aft end of the conning tower.  From an engineering point of view It seems to make sense.  I did plan to make the dingy and show the loading boom rigged as if removing the dingy.  At least that's the plan for now.

 

I also made both the port and starboard dingy compartment cover doors. I have not permanently installed anything yet.  There is still some trimming to be done, and hatch cover rests to be made and hinges of course.  A lot of time consuming tedious work.

 

 

T bar support still needing dressing and additional brackets to mount it to the conning tower structure as a hinge point.

 

Both the port and starboard dingy hatch covers are made with the T bar support in between.

 

Here is the T bar loosely laid across the opening on the center line of the hull. I still need to make the hinge brackets that attaches it to the bottom of conning tower. also brackets at at the aft end for the pulley tackle.

 

The port side hatch cover loosely laid in on top of the T bar.

 

both the port and starboard dingy hatch covers are placed on the T bar support, closing off the dingy storage area.

 

This is a pic of the O 21 dungy storage area.  The T bar support is hinged up and temporarily secured at the top.

 

Here we see the dingy being removed from it's storage area. We see the T bar/loading boom in action.

 

This pic shows the O 19's dingy storage area with the hatch covers folded over and laying on the deck. This pic was taken when the O 19 ran onto Ladd Reef in July, 1945.  The boat had to be scuttled because all attempts failed in pulling her off the reef.

 

Cheers, 

[Jim Lad]

I'm glad to see that I'm not the only one who does re-makes, Piet.

 

A submarine with a nice little dinghy, no less!  very flash!

 

John

[ianmajor]

Piet,

 

I think the T-bar/boom modelled in the raised,rigged position lifting out the dingy would be a delightful and probably unique feature on a model submarine.

[popeye the sailor]

great information........I never knew that!   I always thought they relied on inflatables to get on and off the ship.  a great bit of detail indeed!

[Piet]

Thanks everyone for your likes.

 

@ John, remakes - - - well, I guess that's the nature of this hobby, had to do some more today and most like tomorrow and - - -    About the dingy, or jol as they call it in the Netherlands, I guess it's less prone to tears and then having to throw then away unless they were issued repair kits.  My guess is that they can seat six men, small but handy.  I have no idea about inflatables on Dutch subs.

 

@ Ian, well yes, that's the plan for now, to show what this particular boat had as standard equipment, at least as much as I can.  By the way, Coca Cola is also a great paint remover    Thought you may want to know for future reference    No nasty smell, no nasty residue and easy cleanup.

 

@ Popeye, glad yo like the info.  You know, when the O 19 ran onto Ladd Reef and the crew was rescued by the USS Cod, the Cod had no room for the dingy.  Soooohhhh, they had to set it adrift.  Our guess is that some Philippine fisherman had a great find.

 

Talking about having to redo things, well today was no different.  I was adding stiffeners to the underside of the dingy hatch covers and had to redo that three times before I was happy.  I also thought to place angle pieces at the outboard edges of the dingy storage well and spend about 3 hours making them but then realized there would not be enough room to maneuver the dingy in or out.   Looking at the pics again there were none on the original boat thus I decided to leave them off.  They must have relied on the stiffness of these covers for rigidity.  I was afraid that there may not be enough support for the hatch covers.  But, it seems to work okay on the model, so I'll leave it that way.

Now I have to figure out how to install the hinges for these covers or just make them to be lifted out. 

 

My second redo was with the deck torpedo area.  Removed the paper fake steel plating on the upper side of the opening and installed new paper pieces, much better.

 

I also made the deck torpedo doors.  Another tedious project because of the compound shape of the deck structure sides.  Still not done yet, still in the shaping and fitting mode.  Then came the frightening thought, how am I going to make the hinges on the inside.  That area is inaccessible to work on with the doors closed, which must be done to put the hinges on.  I will most likely have to remove sections of the deck above that area to gain access.  

Again not thinking ahead and making some working drawings before closing things up.  Ah yes, the pleasures and foibles of scratch building.

 

Sorry no pics, I got so engrossed in working on these items that I plumb forgot.  Most definitely tomorrow.

 

Cheers to all and thanks again fro dropping in.

 

[Piet]

Hello friends and thanks to all for your "likes."

 

My day started great, had an early breakfast outside in our screen room on the back patio watching my koi fish frolicking in the pond and listening to the birds. Weather was just fenom      A little later the Admiral showed up to feed the birds and a couple stray cats.

Then with my first cup of morning coffee I sauntered around the yard and ended up in the garage where the build docks are.

 

I had been thinking about the two things that bothered me.

One, the lack of access to the deck torpedo doors for the hinges.

Two, whether to make hinges for the dingy "hangar" hatches or not.

 

So, I decided to try and make hinges for the hatches. I proceeded with cutting shallow slots for the hinges in the  longitudinal deck frame beams. The hinges will be made from file folder stock.  I also cut holes in the hatches for hand pulls.  I'll most likely tackle the hinges tomorrow.

 

Then I moved to the front and cut a part of the deck out over the torpedo lancher area. I was kinda procrastinating but necessity forced the issue. It is now much easier to work on the doors.  They need a lot of fitting because of the compound shape.  It's getting close to finally make and glue the hinges to the doors and frame.  Keep my fingers crossed.

The deck ahead of the deck gun has hatches in the center line of the deck for access below the deck for storage, I presume.  This will work out just fine for me, I need an opening anyhow to mount the torpedo launcher assembly.  The rest will be fake with only the outlines.

 

I also started to make the engine exhaust shroud on the sides of the rear deck structure.  I had to glue two pieces of box wood together to get enough wood to carve these things.  They will be made and installed after I'm finished with the current projects.

 

Okay, here are a few pics to show what I'm talking about.

 

Here I marked the area I needed to cutout. 

 

I laid one of the torpedo doors loosely on the ballast tank for show.

 

This shows the bottoms of the dingy storage area hatch covers. I had not yet made the handholds when this pic was taken. They will eventually be painted in gray.

 

I have laid the hatch covers loosely in.  I also decided to cut them into two pieces as shown on the photos. This may complicate matters for fit.

 

Here I am in the process of cutting the deck portion. I first started to cut through with an Exacto knife  and finished with my small saw to cut through the deck beams.

 

This shows the opened up area.

 

I temporarily placed the torpedo launcher doors in place.  Still needs a lot of fiddling to make them sit right.

 

Here is the approximate outline for the engine exhaust shroud.

 

Cheers,

[Jim Lad]

Piet,

 

It seems you just get a section almost finished when you think of a way to improve it!

 

I love the way you're going about this and making it the best possible model you can.

 

John

[popeye the sailor]

you did a very neat job of cutting out that opening.........you must have been a surgeon    I like the way you did the hatch doors.....nice detail.   these must have been  'after thoughts'...due to your  'steps of assembly'.  when building in this medium,  aspect to be added in are usually antisipated and the cutting is done beforehand.   this works out well for you in this respect,  since you need to make your cuts through the inner framework.   this will add even more detail,  with the way the various beams and such,  stops at the hatch openings.   with some simple embellishments.......this can be quite pleasing to the eyes      plans for these builds may have been drawn up in the past........we get them and enjoy them a lot!   but we will never experience the build in the same way that the original scratch builder did,  when he drew them up.

 

I know your not following any plans........see what we would be missing out on.....if you had drawn some up

[texxn5]

Hi Piet, it took me until now to finish reading your extensive log. Very nice indeed. I look forward to seeing the real thing this afternoon. See you then.

[Piet]

Thanks everyone for your "like" votes, very much appreciated.

 

@ John, yes, it seems so, I keep changing my initial intend for this model and start adding things I had not planned to do.  There is something that seems to drive me in doing it, but then again, I'm retired and really feel the need to add a few extra details.

 

@ Popeye, thanks for your approval of my methods in this madness    No, not a surgeon, just an airplane doctor with very steady hands    The trick is to start scoring with an Exacto knife along a steel straightedge.  This morning I was staring at the "surgery" I did yesterday and thought I should actually continue removing more deck to the next deck frame bulkheads fore and aft.  Reason is that the center of the deck is all small hatches that rest on T beams.  This gives me the way to fasten the fixed deck pieces in the port and starboard side as well as the means for the hatches to rest on.  All I have to do is make a couple of T bars from brass.  I showed John texxn5 how I made the one for dingy "hangar."  So what are a few more hours of extra work?  

The doors are giving me a fit, hard to get them in the right shape, but they will, sooner or later.  This stubborn Dutchman doesn't give up easy.

Yes, indeed, most of this detail work was not in the original plan and now I am "struggling" with trying to add things after the fact.

Yes, Popeye, in the end it'll be a pleasure looking at the boat and showing her off 

The only official plans I have are just the lines of the boat and a few more detail drawings of the interior and the deck plan.  Remco was able to get inside the Navy Archive and sweet talked them into letting him search for the drawings and make copies.  It took him quite some time but he found the drawer with the O 19 microfiche and made the necessary copies.  They were now of course of an unknown scale but fortunately the measurements were on them in mm!  All I had to do was doing some math and I got them to my scale of 1:50 and then redraw them.  The rest was duck-soup and I could loft the frames I needed.

The rest is al from looking at photographs I have, most through Gino den Ridder and Remco.  From these pics I have to interpolate the details and guess where they are located.  I have posted pictures of the line drawing at the start of this build.  For me that was really the main thing to have.

 

Remco also bought the model building plans for the O 21 but she is not quite the same boat as the O 19, many differences, except for "close enough" details.

All in all, I am quite pleased with the way she is beginning to look.  John texxn5 also thought that the paper "steel plates" did mimic steel plates and i tried to match them to the photos as much as I can see.

Thank you Popeye for your very kind thoughts.

 

@ John texxn5, thank you for plowing through my log.  A special thanks to you and Diane for coming to visit us in Palm Coast and listening to my stories.  Gwen and I had a most delightful time and it is indeed an honor and pleasure getting to know yuns.  Hopefully Gwen and I can make a trip out your way some time soon.

 

Well, that's all for today dear friends.  Tomorrow we may find more decking removed   

 

Cheers, 

[Piet]

Again thanks to all who clicked "like," I do appreciate your visits and appreciation!

 

Well, no work was done yesterday in the shipyard.  We had a very delightful visit from John txxn5 and his lovely bride Diane.  

 

However, today I did some work and will post a few pics knowing that a certain Dutchman in Schiedam likes pictures     

The very first thing was to glue the dingy hatch hinges to the side stringers of the dingy compartment.

While the glue was drying on the hinges I moved forward again to remove the small forward and aft portions of the deck at the deck torpedo launcher.  John told me to remove them so I'll do as he told me      No, he didn't tell me, I mentioned to him that I was planning on doing it and he agreed.  

So, I did some more surgery and removed the two sections, without doing any damage to the rest 

Then I got some 2 X 4 mm planks to make stringers to glue against the deck beam studs left behind from my cuts.  This'll strengthen the sides of the deck and affords a place for the new deck plates to rest on.

Slots were chiseled in the forward and aft deck bulkheads for these stringers to rest on.

 

In the meantime the glue for dingy hatch hinges had cured enough for me to attempt to glue the hatches to the hinges. I also had to cement a small brass support shelf for the port side hatch to rest on.  I used 5 minute epoxy glue for that.  So I started with the aft starboard hatch and it went very smooth.  Next was it's mate, the forward starboard hatch, that too went off like greased lightning     I must be living right today 

 

While the glue was curing I moved forward again and glued the torpedo compartment deck side stringers in place.

 

Back again to the back and started with the port side dingy hatches. Here too, everything worked as advertise, making me a happy camper 

 

So what next?  I soaked my glued up blocks of basswood overnight and tried to twist them to fit the shape of the deck sides where the engine exhaust shrouds are to be cemented.  I clamped them in my wood vice on the workbench and with my "watchmaker's" water pump pliers and a piece of 12 gauge electrical wire I secured this Rube Goldberg setup to the electrical conduit on the wall.  I hope it'll work, we'll find out tomorrow.  If it does I'll have to do the same thing with the second one.  keep our fingers crossed.

 

Well, that was it for today, it was 17:30 and my legs were getting tired, been standing in the dockyard for a good four hours.

Okay, pics below, here you go Sjors     

 

I cut small strips of file folder paper and folded them with a sharp crease in the center.  I try not to get any glue on the crease area to keep it flexible.

 

I used the same technique as the previous operation.  It worked just fine and didn't damage anything else.  The cuts were about 1mm outside the lines so now I trimmed them to the line and filed them as straight as possible. 

 

These are the 2 X 4 mm stringers to serve as supports for the deck as well as strengthening the sides of the deck.

 

Here they are ready to be glued.

 

Side stringers are glued and clamped.  I used a piece of scrap plywood to position them so the deck plates are all at the same level.

 

I attacked the torpedo side doors - - - again.  I cut the hand holds in and added the center pull bar. To do this I had to remove the paper.  That'll be replaced tomorrow and checked for fit - - - again. If they fit correctly then I'll install the hinges on the bottom.  These will again be made from file folder stock.

 

All dingy compartment hatch hinges are now glued in place.

 

This shows the hatches in open position. There is some spring in the hinges that pull them up some. I may have to find something like a piece of equipment to place on them to keep them on the deck.

 

Here I started with making the T stringers for the deck plate supports and the center hatches.

 

Here is my Rube Goldberg rig to twist the basswood blocks for the exhaust shrouds.

 

 

Cheers,    

[Remcohe]

I really like how the hatches for the dingy compartment turned out. Nice touch to an already very nice build.

 

Remco

[Jim Lad]

Eventually, you're going to run out of further improvements to make to the hull!  

 

John

[popeye the sailor]

really nice work Piet.....more and more amazing,  with the more and more you do 

[texxn5]

Hi Piet, the hatches really seem to have worked out well. Probably with some use the hinges will soften up. Here's hoping you can get a good twist on the exhaust shrouds. It didn't seem like you need a whole lot of twist, and maybe you can undercut it with your sander to make it match up with the curves. Nice to see things come together after seeing the pieces first. Looking good my friend, and I'm sure that Sjors appreciated the pictures, I know I did.

[Sjors]

I always like the pictures !

There is nothing that i now by submarines , so i don't say something……

I'm just watching and learning……

Anja was just reading about the pictures of Vlaardingen en she just said….we have to go there and take those pictures !

But then i need a passport !!!!!!!!

 

[texxn5]

Piet, here's a picture of our humble abode, here in St. Augustine.

[popeye the sailor]

good 'ole Florida.........just as I remember it.....flat!     I used to live in central Florida back in the '70's.   my best friend {my second family} live in Kissimmee..........one of these days I have to make the trip to see them  {a promise I made}

[mtaylor]

Piet,

 

Great work.... the hatch covers came out most excellent. 

[Piet]

Thanks to all for the "like" votes, this seems like a broken record but I want to recognize all yuns who come and visit my build and like what I'm doing.

 

@ Remco, hey, thanks for dropping in    The hatches, hmmmm, yes, they look okay but this morning it struck me that I didn't allow for the teak deck strips    I may have to redo them to raise them some to allow for the added hight above the deck      Happens when you want to see something finished.  Not thinking ahead again?  But, so what, right.  All par for the course. 

 

@ John (Jim Lad), I doubt very much that I'll run out of improvements to me made, just thought of another one 

 

@ Popeye, thanks my friend for your kind words and whenever you come our way please give me a jingle then I can pipe you onboard 

 

@ Sjors, just think of submarines as airplanes without wings, unless of course you know as much about airplanes as submarines            Re Vlaardingen Ambacht, yes, a passport is required and don't forget shots (inentingen)       Not knowing anything about submarines is no excuse for you, you are never lost for words on anything my friend         

 

@ John texxn5, nice trailer John, I'm jealous but in a good sense.  I'm still savoring your visit with us.

 

@ Mark, thank you Mark, yes, I also like the way they came out but as i mentioned to Remco I may have to redo them.  Will check tomorrow and see.

 

 

I'll have very little time tomorrow for work in the shipyard.  First mow the front lawn then in the PM I have to attend our monthly meeting of the colored pencil society chapter here in palm coast.  Perhaps after the meeting.

 

Thanks again for visiting my build and your kind words.

 

Cheers 

[popeye the sailor]

I'll be sure to do that good sir..........I will definitely let you know

[Sjors]

Morning Piet, (at this part of the world )

 

I know as much from planes as for sub's….nihil !

 

I follow your build and every time there is a post I gonna check it.

But what can I say?

Wow that looks great ?

Or that's not right ?

The first time I see a submarine was at RDM in Rotterdam.

And that one was in the water.

So I only see the bridge….

I'm not the guy who is yelling  "great work  " when I don't know if it is right or wrong.

Then I can better keep my fingers still and read what there is saying.

But I admire your skills !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Piet]

Thanks again to all for clicking "like," much appreciated.

 

Hoi Sjors, well, it's evening here and I have been browsing MSW before coming to my build log.  The Admiral is preparing dinner, wild Alaska salmon I picked up at the grocery store, yum.

I appreciate you visiting my dockyard with two ships on the ways.  It seems that right now I give preference to the O 19.  No prob with not making any comments - - - I feel the vibes though and know you are looking   that's okay too.  

 

Do you great your bus passengers the same way as the tram conductors in Amsterdam used to do, when they still had those old trams?  Nah, you are too young to remember that       They were funny, I enjoyed that.

 

You have actually seen a real submarine?  Wow!  Yeah, they kinda ride low in the water, not much to see, must be something typical for subs      

The last time I saw a real sub was earlier this year, the USS Cod in Cleveland and been in it too, brought back many memories.  I did actually visit the O 19 though, way back in 1940 when my dad took me on board.  Still remember that.

 

You are always welcome in my shipyard Sjors, the popcorn machine is always full and plenty of beer in the fridge, any kind. Here's to you and Anja 

 

Cheers,

[Piet]

Hello everyone,

 

Well, my "fears" about the dingy compartment hatches were well founded.  Yes, they open nice and flat to the deck leaving no space for the wooden deck stringers.  At my scale they are 1 mm wide and about the same thick.  There will also be wooden stringers on the hatches, thus I need to redo the hinges and also the underside of the part that rests on the center T "iron" stringer/dingy loading boom. This should not pose much of a problem but I'll wait till I start installing the deck stringers.

I don't know yet how I am going to cut 1 X 1 mm plywood strips.  I do have a paper cutter but that may shatter some of the outside plies.  I'll try a small piece tomorrow.  Another way would be glue three pieces of file folder  together to make a three ply paper sheet.  This'll measure .75 mm thick and may cut better.  Next will be to stain them in mahogany.  Hmmmm, another thing to think about.

 

I'm almost satisfied with the deck torpedo compartment doors. Just a little more fiddling and they are ready to be hinged.  I may hold off on that though.  I want to coat them first in poly urethane to harden the paper so that I can clean the ragged edges with a fresh #11 blade tip. 

 

I also made two lateral stringers to help support the two T "iron" longitudinal stringers that'll support the side deck pieces and the center hatches.  These hatches will be the lift-out kind.  I don't know yet what kind of lift-out holes to give them, most likely just round.  However, the oval kind with a center "iron" grip bar would look better 

 

I also started to make the two T "iron" longitudinal deck stringers. I had to hand cut the flat parts with my 65 year old jigsaw with a jeweler's metal cutting blade.  Didn't take much time.  Cutting these narrow strips with my metal sheers would distort them too much. So, tomorrow we'll be soldering them together.

 

Okay, I tried to fit my twisted basswood blocks to the side of the deck for the engine exhaust shroud.  Wow, they came out pretty close to a fit.  I only had to sand some wood away from the center.  I already started to carve them into shape a little.  I'm happy with it. 

Now that I have seen that this crazy method works the port side is now in the vice with my Rube Goldberg twisting apparatus   

I will have to remove the paper from the area where these pieces are glued to to the sides because it'll not be strong enough to my liking.  I'll also use a few small woods crews to secure then to the deck side bulkheads for clamping and extra security.  Hmmm, in that case I may not even have to remove the paper.

 

I also started to make the side rubbing strips, aka wales.  Once that's done I think I can start with treating the hull with poly to harden the paper so I can start cleaning up the fuzzy edges here and there.

 

Below are a few pics of today's progress.  Not much to show for about 6 hours of work 

 

Port side view of the torp. compartment doors loosely fitted. Also the two lateral deck stringers to support the T "irons" for deck and hatch supports.  I made handholds in them to help pull the doors into the closed position for demo purposes.  The original boat did not have them, but then who would actually know? 

 

This is a close-up of the above pic. Yup, a lot of time consuming fiddling to clean things up but I believe that after the poly is on and hardened the paper it'll be a lot easier and neater.

 

This is the set-up to solder an angle piece to a flat piece to make a T bar. They didn't have one in the hardware store and I didn't want to go mail-order.  This works too and now at least I can say it's scratch build. 

 

The starboard engine exhaust shroud in the rough state.  The important thing is that it mates well with the deck side. Sculpting it to the correct shape is another matter

 

Cheers, 

[Adrieke]

your attention to details will make this an extraordinary model Piet . must be the good influence of the Belgian beers :P

[Remcohe]

To bad you need to redo the hatches. I know the felling when you realize you had to think ahead even more steps ahead..

 

 

 

I don't know yet how I am going to cut 1 X 1 mm plywood strips.

 

Maybe Evergreen plastic strips?

 

Remco

[Sjors]

Piet,

 

I have a secret to tell you…..

I was borne and raise in Amsterdam     

I know the Trams very well.

Just under mine bedroom window they where passing….with that BIG bell in front !

When we are coming ( don't no when but it's gonna be happening ) to the USA , I let you know !