Bill Hime Posted October 17, 2016 Share #1 Posted October 17, 2016 Good day everyone! After multiple searches here and on google I'm not finding any info on finishing a model to have a museum quality antique finish. looking for any info or personal experience you may have. Or direction to where it might be here at MSW. Sincere Regards, Bill mtaylor 1 Quote Passion is Patience...and I am a carpenter in any scale. Current build; Endurance - 1:70 scale, Occre Current build; H.M.S. Surprise - 1796, 1:48 A L Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulises Victoria Posted October 17, 2016 Share #2 Posted October 17, 2016 Hello Bill... Hmmm... first time I hear about a Museum Quality Antique finish. I hear about Museum Quality built ships. Could you please elaborate? What do you mean by Museum Quality Antique finish? Do you mean that the ship looks like it was built 200 years ago? Bill Hime, mtaylor and Canute 3 Quote There aren't but two options: do it FAST, or do it RIGHT. Current Project Build Log: Soleil Royal in 1/72. Kit by Artesania Latina. Last finished projects: Royal Ship Vasa 1628; French Vessel Royal Louis 1780. 1/90 Scale by Mamoli. 120 Cannons Future projects already in my stash: Panart: San Felipe 1/75; OcCre: Santísima Trinidad 1/90; Wish List: 1/64 Amati Victory, HMS Enterprise in 1/48 by CAF models. So much to build, so little time! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reklein Posted October 17, 2016 Share #3 Posted October 17, 2016 (edited) One of the Vasa builds has a great antiqe finish ,but I dont think he explains much about it. I'll give you a link if I find it. check out md1400cs Vasa build or Moonbugs Santa Maria with a good antique type finish. Bill in Idaho Edited October 17, 2016 by reklein mtaylor, Canute and Bill Hime 3 Quote Bill, in Idaho Completed Mamoli Halifax and Billings Viking ship in 2015 Next Model Shipways Syren Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Hime Posted October 17, 2016 Author Share #4 Posted October 17, 2016 (edited) Hello Bill... Hmmm... first time I hear about a Museum Quality Antique finish. I hear about Museum Quality built ships. Could you please elaborate? What do you mean by Museum Quality Antique finish? Do you mean that the ship looks like it was built 200 years ago? Yes, making it look like it was built 200 years ago. I'm sure I could figure it out but no since in recreating the wheel so to speak Thanks Bill in Idaho bill Edited October 17, 2016 by Bill Hime mtaylor and Canute 2 Quote Passion is Patience...and I am a carpenter in any scale. Current build; Endurance - 1:70 scale, Occre Current build; H.M.S. Surprise - 1796, 1:48 A L Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtaylor Posted October 17, 2016 Share #5 Posted October 17, 2016 Bill, The Russians do a lot of that using bitumen or a compound there of. I've heard of it and seen the results but haven't a clue how it's done. However, the results are incredible. Canute, Landlubber Mike and Bill Hime 3 Quote Mark "The shipwright is slow, but the wood is patient." - me Current Build: Past Builds: La Belle Poule 1765 - French Frigate from ANCRE plans - ON HOLD Triton Cross-Section NRG Hallf Hull Planking Kit HMS Sphinx 1775 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 Non-Ship Model: On hold, maybe forever: CH-53 Sikorsky - 1:48 - Revell - Completed Licorne - 1755 from Hahn Plans (Scratch) Version 2.0 (Abandoned) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulises Victoria Posted October 17, 2016 Share #6 Posted October 17, 2016 (edited) Hi Bill. There is a technique called weathering, intended to make things like cars, tanks, ships, etc. to have a weathered, abused look, which can be used to make something look very old. I have used it extensively in my plastic building days. It involves a technique called "dry brush". Not sure if this is something like what you are looking for. Please look at post #5 in this thread. http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/3962-how-to-make-plastic-look-like-wood/ Please let me know if it is and if you need further explanations. Best regards Ulises Edited October 17, 2016 by Ulises Victoria Canute, Bill Hime, CaptainSteve and 1 other 4 Quote There aren't but two options: do it FAST, or do it RIGHT. Current Project Build Log: Soleil Royal in 1/72. Kit by Artesania Latina. Last finished projects: Royal Ship Vasa 1628; French Vessel Royal Louis 1780. 1/90 Scale by Mamoli. 120 Cannons Future projects already in my stash: Panart: San Felipe 1/75; OcCre: Santísima Trinidad 1/90; Wish List: 1/64 Amati Victory, HMS Enterprise in 1/48 by CAF models. So much to build, so little time! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Hime Posted October 17, 2016 Author Share #7 Posted October 17, 2016 Bill, The Russians do a lot of that using bitumen or a compound there of. I've heard of it and seen the results but haven't a clue how it's done. However, the results are incredible. Yes Mark, The Russian models is where I have seen it. I love the richness of the wood finish on some of those models and would love to reproduce it for mine. Bill Canute and mtaylor 2 Quote Passion is Patience...and I am a carpenter in any scale. Current build; Endurance - 1:70 scale, Occre Current build; H.M.S. Surprise - 1796, 1:48 A L Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtaylor Posted October 17, 2016 Share #8 Posted October 17, 2016 There's a series of DVD's (or maybe it's CD) by Dr. Micheal, Russian Master on a lot of their techniques. I don't know if he goes into finishes though as I've not seen the videos. Canute and Bill Hime 2 Quote Mark "The shipwright is slow, but the wood is patient." - me Current Build: Past Builds: La Belle Poule 1765 - French Frigate from ANCRE plans - ON HOLD Triton Cross-Section NRG Hallf Hull Planking Kit HMS Sphinx 1775 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 Non-Ship Model: On hold, maybe forever: CH-53 Sikorsky - 1:48 - Revell - Completed Licorne - 1755 from Hahn Plans (Scratch) Version 2.0 (Abandoned) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
overdale Posted October 18, 2016 Share #9 Posted October 18, 2016 I had to 'antique' a ship model for a TV company a few years ago. After much experimenting we discovered the most effective results were with spaying the whole model with well thinned down wood stain (dark oak). The trick was not to spray regularly as if you were trying to paint it, but to use more random passes gradually building up the color to the level of age you want. It doesn't require a lot and is very effective. (on TV anyway) Dan. Canute, mtaylor, CharlieZardoz and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.Coleman Posted October 18, 2016 Share #10 Posted October 18, 2016 Chris Lindons build the Freisland has got some amazing finishes. He uses Citadel Warhammer paints. Made it look old and weathered. He also explains for us how he achieves those results. Best of luck. mtaylor, Bill Hime and Canute 3 Quote Regards, Scott Current build: 1:75 Friesland, Mamoli Completed builds: 1:64 Rattlesnake, Mamoli - 1:64 HMS Bounty, Mamoli - 1:54 Adventure, Amati - 1:80 King of the Mississippi, AL 1:64 Blue Shadow, Mamoli - 1:64 Leida Dutch pleasure boat, Corel - 1:60 HMS President Mantra, Sergal Awaiting construction: 1:89 Hermione La Fayette AL - 1:48 Perserverance, Modelers shipyard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Hime Posted October 18, 2016 Author Share #11 Posted October 18, 2016 Great information everyone! Mark, I will look for those CD's. I think the work of the Russian masters is the bar I want to set for my own builds..of course over time Ulises and Dan, Those techniques definitely have application! Scott, I'll have to take a look at Chris Lindons, Freisland. Dirk, Thank you for the link. That is what I was looking for. That link has a great discussion about the use of Bitumen which builds that feature natural wood finishes. I can't say "never" but my goal for my own work is to avoid paint and celebrate the beauty of different exotic woods. This is partly the reason I'm staying with larger scale builds, 1:48th and above. This opens up the use of species that would be otherwise too coarse grained at a smaller scale. Not to mention, can stand up to a firmer hand rubbed finish. Bill Dubz, mtaylor, Ulises Victoria and 1 other 4 Quote Passion is Patience...and I am a carpenter in any scale. Current build; Endurance - 1:70 scale, Occre Current build; H.M.S. Surprise - 1796, 1:48 A L Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
druxey Posted October 19, 2016 Share #12 Posted October 19, 2016 Of course, you could always just wait for 200 years.... Landlubber Mike, riverboat, Oliver24 and 2 others 5 Quote Be sure to sign up for an epic Nelson/Trafalgar project if you would like to see it made into a TV series http://trafalgar.tv Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matle Posted October 19, 2016 Share #13 Posted October 19, 2016 I understand the goal is to make the new model look like an old model, and not as a new model of an aged ship (aka weathering), which is something else. Since this is basicly the same as faking antique furniture, I suggest you google just that: not for ship models but for how to make fake antiques - bitumen is regularly used for that purpose so I guess that is where that particular idea came from. Probably you can find more ideas in that department, since modellers usually are better at "weathering" mtaylor 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Hime Posted October 19, 2016 Author Share #14 Posted October 19, 2016 Thank you Matle. I've been building furniture and cabinets for 30 yrs or so. Bitumen is not something I've seen readily available. My grandfather taught me to use tannins, inks and even shoe polish to create aging woods on historical restoration projects. I'm looking forward to working with it Here's the link dubz posted above; http://modelshipworl...men-experiment/ Bill mtaylor 1 Quote Passion is Patience...and I am a carpenter in any scale. Current build; Endurance - 1:70 scale, Occre Current build; H.M.S. Surprise - 1796, 1:48 A L Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
druxey Posted October 19, 2016 Share #15 Posted October 19, 2016 One needs to be careful using bituminous compounds: they never completely 'set'. The alligator-skin cracked surface one sees in old varnish is caused by bitumen: it slowly 'crawls' over time. Some old paintings have the same problem where bitumen brown was used by the artist. mtaylor and Bill Hime 2 Quote Be sure to sign up for an epic Nelson/Trafalgar project if you would like to see it made into a TV series http://trafalgar.tv Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbshan Posted October 19, 2016 Share #16 Posted October 19, 2016 I wonder if actual pine tar and turps might be of use. mtaylor and Bill Hime 2 Quote Joel Sanborn http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/9953-lexington-by-jbshan-dlumberyard-164-from-the-seaways-practicum-by-clay-feldman/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaetan Bordeleau Posted October 20, 2016 Share #17 Posted October 20, 2016 Here is what I found about the use of bitumen by old artists, the key is not to use more than what turpentine can dissolves. http://www.naturalpigments.com/art-supply-education/asphaltum-bitumen ''Although many aspersions have been cast upon the use of any asphaltum in oil painting, it is interesting to note these comments by Church. The disadvantages attending to the use of these coal-tar browns and of ordinary asphalt are two-fold. Not only are they treacherous on account of their easy fusibility, but they are liable to stain contiguous pigments by reason of their solubility in oil or varnish. When used successfully by the older artists they were always introduced sparingly, or were largely commingled with more solid paints." Basically, it is the same principle for aging wood; dissolves bitumen in turpentine and then add oil. There is a maximum of bitumen that can be dissolved in turpentine. Passed this point bitumen sinks in the bottom of the container. druxey, Bill Hime, mtaylor and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
druxey Posted October 20, 2016 Share #18 Posted October 20, 2016 Thanks for the information on bitumen, Gaetan. mtaylor 1 Quote Be sure to sign up for an epic Nelson/Trafalgar project if you would like to see it made into a TV series http://trafalgar.tv Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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