Need ideas for 1/250 scale davit tackles

[ccoyle]

Okay, I have a problem. Several problems, actually, but I'll take them one at a time. I'm working on a 1/250 scale card model that has a bunch of ship's boats. The davits are laser cut, as are the blocks, but of course they're not all in one piece along with the lines. I have tried and failed several times to complete the davit assemblies (from which I'll eventually have to hang the boats, too) using wire or EZ Line. I'm out of ideas. Anybody have any new ones??

[mtaylor]

Plastic sprue that's been heated and stretched?   Or use the Ez line but starch it or spray it with lacquer (hairspray works)?  Can you reinforce the davits with some wire in them?  Maybe I don't understand the problem....

 

[BANYAN]

Hi, I have not modelled with card so please take my suggestion with a healthy dose of salt

 

Have you tried making a jig onto which you can lay out and glue all the parts  (waxed ply or the like) and using small pins and strips of wood as the form etc.  With pins in the locations for the fall blocks etc would it be possible to layout the davit tackle/falls then use Mark's idea to set them?

 

cheers

 

Pat 

Edited November 28, 2018 by BANYAN

[wefalck]

Perhaps you can post a picture of your problem ?

 

Using a jig, as Pat suggested, is a good idea. One then can stabilise the assembled tackle with clear varnish and install it as a unit.

[ccoyle]

Here's a shot of the original kit davits with a scale bar drawn for reference. The tiny dots are the blocks. The laser-cut replacement davits have the same construction, only they don't need to be cut out or laminated.

[wefalck]

Do you have a copy of Lloyd McCaffery's book 'Shipbuilding in Miniature' ? He describes, together with a picture, how he constructs such tackles from twisted wire. The rope made from wire is shaped around a rig and paper discs representing blocks are glued to the sides. The whole thing than forms a more or less rigid assembly that is installed at the desired place.

[FingerSticker]

On ‎11‎/‎27‎/‎2018 at 11:29 PM, ccoyle said:

Okay, I have a problem. Several problems, actually, but I'll take them one at a time. I'm working on a 1/250 scale card model that has a bunch of ship's boats. The davits are laser cut, as are the blocks, but of course they're not all in one piece along with the lines. I have tried and failed several times to complete the davit assemblies (from which I'll eventually have to hang the boats, too) using wire or EZ Line. I'm out of ideas. Anybody have any new ones??

Sorry if I am thick, Chris but how exactly are you failing to complete the assemblies? What is gong wrong, and even better, what is going right?

 

Adrie.

[ccoyle]

@wefalck: Thanks, I'll have to see if I can scrounge up a copy of that.

 

@Adrie: The problem is primarily one of scale. The blocks are only about 1.5 mm in diameter. Each needs to have two lines going upward to connect to a davit, and another line coming down to attach to the boat. I haven't yet found a material for the lines that is suitably thin, durable, and preferably rigid. I'm sure such a material exists -- I just haven't found it yet! In many card kits, a simplified version of the davit and block assembly is usually provided; it normally has the lines between block and davit printed. The modeler then has to decide whether to leave in the white space between the lines or (shudder!) try to cut it out. This model does not include that option, and not all of the boats have chocks, so some of them have to be hung from their davits or else omitted from the model entirely.

[wefalck]

To elaborate a bit:

- take copper or molybdenum (easy to find on ebay and stiffer than copper) wires of appropriate diameter and twist to lengths together, this is your (wire) rope; drill two holes of the distance of the blocks into a waste piece of wood and insert two pins of the diameter of your blocks; wind the wire rope you made around them to simulate the tackle - one end will begin at the lower block and the other end will run across the rollers on the davit; take the wire off the jig and stick paper roundels at the appropriate place to simulate the blocks; for double blocks you would actually need three roundels each; the top block will also need a short piece of wire or a loop attached to the davit; you can now attach the whole assembly to the davit.

[amateur]

We had a shop in electronis (radio’s), and they sold copper wire starting from .1 mm diameter.

soft, plisble and to be (soft) soldered. 

Shop has gone now, but I guess the www has some shops still around

 

Jan

[ccoyle]

Jan, I'm looking into some local cell phone repair shops. Apparently they use the molybdenum stuff.

[amateur]

“My” shop was more the oldfashioned one. Went down as no-one seems to know what a radio was.

 

Jan

[wefalck]

It is dead easy and quite cheap to find copper wire down to 0.05 mm and molybdenum wire down to 0.03 mm diameter on ebay - bought recently a whole batch from various Chines sources. They often deliver within a few days, at least here in Europe.

 

wires.co.uk also sells pre-tinned copper wire that might come handy here. Not as cheap as simple copper wire.

[ccoyle]

59 minutes ago, wefalck said:

It is dead easy and quite cheap to find copper wire down to 0.05 mm and molybdenum wire down to 0.03 mm diameter on ebay

 

I know -- I'm just looking for some I might be able to pick up on the way home instead of having to wait several days for it. Call it impatience (a sad trait in a modeler, I know).

[FingerSticker]

I tried to respond to this but I got the following failure screen! This happened on my PC at work as well on the PC at home!

 

[FingerSticker]

Test

[FingerSticker]

2 minutes ago, FingerSticker said:

Test

Hmmmmm.

 

Ok, if this works now, then:

 

Chris, I would suggest using common sewing thread and a 50/50 mixture of PVA/water. Dry it under weight for a night (clothes peg will do for weight) and the thread will become surprisingly stiff. It is best to push the thread under the liquid level and to use your fingers to remove the excess liquid and also force the sticking out fibres to line up with the thread.

 

Adrie.

Edited November 29, 2018 by FingerSticker
Added additional information

[ccoyle]

Not a bad idea, Adrie, and I do something similar for making thread railings. But I think that thread may actually be too thick for this purpose. I'll have a look at it, though.

[FingerSticker]

I have seen Shipyard sell rigging threads of 0.1 mm. Never seen them in the 'flesh' or used them, mind you. But perhaps someone here has? Oh, and not really sure what the thickness of normal sewing thread is, either.

 

Adrie.

Edited November 29, 2018 by FingerSticker
addition information

[wefalck]

I am making 'ropes' on my ropewalk from fly-tying thread. The the finest (16/0) gives a rope of about 0.04 mm diameter. This thread is available in many different colours, e.g. silvery grey for steel-wire, black, and beige.

Check out the building-log for my Zuiderzee-Botter, where I used these ropes. They can be stiffened with clear varnish - better than using glue, because the varnish can be softened with the appropriate solvent (not acrylic varnish !). The rope coils etc. on the botter-model are shaped with varnish.

Such rope would be an alternative to the twisted wire in the method described above.

[Captain Slog]

Strip the insulation off a Cat5 (patch cable) or telephony cable and unwind. Everyone has these lying around and the wires are tiny

[JerseyCity Frankie]

I’ve used this technique a few times: I tape three pieces of thin thread parallel and equidistant from each other in relatively long lengths on a piece of glass. These will wind up representing the falls of the tackle. At intervals I white glue my blocks onto all three pieces of thread. In the photo I used punched paper discs. In absence of a punch cut with xacto. When dry you can cut two of the three threads outboard of pairs of blocks, leaving three between blocks and one emerging from either end.the example in the photo used only two threads but you get the picture. 

 

Edited January 23, 2019 by JerseyCity Frankie

[ccoyle]

Great suggestion, Frankie. I got hold of a short piece of braided copper wire and will try something similar, but it will have to wait until after I finish my current project.