US Frigate Essex by trippwj - Aeropiccola - 1:70 Scale - POB

[trippwj]

 Hey Wayne,Almost forgot how nice those older kits were without the pre-cut parts.  Half the fun of making the kit was cutting out the parts and finishing them to fit.That's when kit builders needed a scroll saw. Mine just sits on a bench now out in the garage just waiting to sink its teeth into some 5mm ply

Frank

 

Greetings, Frank - will keep you posted on how that goes!  If you want I can send you some to work on ;)

[trippwj]

Wayne your a sly old seadog, never said a word did you, and boy do you know how to make life hard for yourself.  

 

I agree with Augie mate, but be careful with that 5x5 plank, it looks as though it's going to take the Garboard Strake, the positioning is going to be critical later on.

 

Good luck with both the translation and the build mate, and if you have no objection I would like to follow your journey.  

 

Be Good

 

mobbsie

 

Key word there is "old"!!!

 

Welcome aboard, mobbsie - glad to have you along for the ride.  I think Sjors has the popcorn machine set up in the corner.

[augie]

Set up Frank's dusty scroll saw right next to the Popcorn.

[marktiedens]

My kit does seem to be a bit older than yours as you can see by the box cover.

 

 

/Mark

[trippwj]

Continuing to move slowly with the Essex.  I have installed the garboard strake supports on the port side, and getting ready to work on the starboard side.

 

 

 

As I was taking these, I noticed what appears to be a bend in the bulkhead former about midships

 

 

I had been checking for squareness on the bulkheads and for straightness of the former while installing the bulkheads, so this caught me off guard!

 

I went back and took some additional high-resolution flash photos and found that there is a bend evident in the keel between bulkheads 10 and 7 with a max gap of 1.5mm from plumb at bulkhead 9 (length between bulkheads 7 & 10 is 16.7 cm, largest gap is at 6 cm).  Will this create heartache and loss of sleep (not to mention hair) if I ignore it?  Is this something that, short of tearing everything out and starting over, I can work around in some manner?

 

 

 

[riverboat]

If there is no correct way of correcting this , I'd do like you do when you go to the gas station... "filler up"

[augie]

Darn it.  Do you have a strong keel clamp (the longer the better).  How about spraying the bent area with windex until it's good and damp and then clamping it for a day or two? 

[trippwj]

Darn it.  Do you have a strong keel clamp (the longer the better).  How about spraying the bent area with windex until it's good and damp and then clamping it for a day or two? 

 

Augie -

 

I have one of the Amati keel clamps that should be good to clamp the beastie near both ends.  Would it make sense to put something wicked stiff along the keel when I clamp it to help press it back to plumb?

[trippwj]

If there is no correct way of correcting this , I'd do like you do when you go to the gas station... "filler up"

 

Frank -

 

If clamping it doesn't work, then will probably resort to filler on one side and sanding it down on t'other to get it back to plumb!  Planning to double plank it and copper the bottom, so would hide the deformity and repairs (I hope!)

[riverboat]

Good idea of Augies, those keel holders on the Amati are movable so you  should be able to put enough pressure where needed.

[uss frolick]

That stern is an exact copy of Howard Chapelle's reconstruction, right down to the wreath thingy.

[NMBROOK]

Hi Wayne

I thought I would drop by as I have been following Bob's Essex build.I don't want to come across as 'steaming in'The deformity in the keel is caused by the dowel holes in the offending bulkheads being out of position.The only way to get it straight is to 'chase' out around the dowels with the dremel on the offending bulkheads.I have a feeling the false keel will then 'pop' straight,if it doesn't it will only need the lightest of clamping to true up. To put the strength back is just a case of cutting some ply washers cut in half and gluing either side of the dowel.I hope this sorts the problem,I felt I should speak up as I have come across this before.

 

Kind Regards Nigel

[trippwj]

Nigel - I like that idea! Thanks.

[newbuilder101]

I've just pulled up a chair. Your off to a good start...good luck with the keel fix!

[Kamil]

So will do as Sherry, taking a chair and have an eye on your build. Hope in a future I will not have such a problem, I have enough grey hairs in my age already . Good luck with fixing and hope there will be no more problems with the build!

Edited February 10, 2014 by Kamil

[wq3296]

Greetings Wayne,

What you have there is plywood being plywood. Clamping, wetting, voodoo, etc. will not work unless you remove the stress in the tension side of the plywood. The usual methods can sometimes work with solid wood because the grain is consistent all the way through. However, plywood is made up of multiple layers - each with a different grain. What I am about to describe has worked for me: First, I would cut those tie rods loose between the affected frames. You don't have to take them out, just remove an 1/8" or so from the centers so the keel can move. Next, cut vertical scores into, or through if necessary, the outer plys of the keel on both sides of the bend. Then bend the keel as appropriate to remove the bend. While bending, you may actually crack the inner keel plys somewhat, but that is the only way you will remove the bend. When she's all nice and straight, glue some fish plates over the scores to restore stiffness. You may also need to loosen some of the frames in the area to make sure the keel can be bent enough to straighten it. You can use a hacksaw blade to do this work.

 

This will work - I can't see how you could possible fill the keel enough to eliminate the bend without screwing up the geometry of the hull in the affected area. wq3296

[Sjors]

Plenty solutions Wayne.

With your skills you can fix the keel !!!!!

Sherry, can you please give me some popcorn ?

This is gonna be a long sit   

 

[popeye the sailor]

if you used white glue to cement in the dowels,  perhaps you could use water to get the glue solvent again...and then contort the frame to make the adjustment.   sandwich the keel between two stiff lengths of wood and clamp in place,  when you do it....let dry

[ScottRC]

Sorry to see that your keel warped.  Bloody ol plywood gremlins tend to do things like that when you are least expecting them.  I kinda have a dislike and dis-trust for plywood because of these issues.

 

wq3296 might be correct, need to relived the stress.  Maybe cut the dowels at the spots between the bulkheads in the ares of warp, then soak the keel so its pliable and re-clamp the bugger.  You can always re-splice the dowels with some splice plates and heat shrink or copper tubing.  I had this problem on an rc racing boat and ended up cutting small relief cuts in the keel to make it flex, then filling them with phenolic glue and clamping everything in a jig for a few days.  Got it strait as an arrow and made setting the planks much more easier not to mention I needed a strait keel for performance.

[mobbsie]

Hi Wayne,

 

You have a plethora of help and advice here my friend so you'll be pleased to know I'm not going to add to it, I know you will come to the right decision for you and I wish you luck with it. 

 

She's a lot bigger than I first imagined and will take a bit of stick so don't be afraid to bash her about a bit.

 

Be Good

 

mobbsie

[trippwj]

Hi Wayne

 

Just checking in to see if you had your keel straightened out, did you ever figure out just why that did happen, I did have a slight bend in the Cutty Sark and that is why I built a n extra heavy jig for the Victory, I think it paid off. Enjoy.

 

Regards Lawrence

 

I think I have the keel straightened out now - I shaved the holes at the offending bulkheads a bit wider so the dowel was somewhat loose then clamped the beastie with a piece of steel stock on both sides to pressure it straight.  There is just a very minor (less than .5mm) curve left now, and I think that will work out as I start planking the hull.

[popeye the sailor]

good to hear you've found a solution!   got pictures? 

[HIPEXEC]

Need pics of your fix in case we need it.

Rich

[popeye the sailor]

speaking of that......have you made any progress?   love to see where your at with this bad girl 

[Sjors]

Wayne is to busy with making snowman's       

 

[trippwj]

Well, I have certainly been remiss in updating this!  Yes, the repairs were successful.  You may recall that I had a problem with the bulkhead former being less than flat/straight.

 

 

Based on the advice provided, I widened the holes that the supporting dowels passed through, as well as slightly thinning the dowels.  It isn't particularly attractive, but will be planked over fully so not visible.  Important thing is the repair worked.

 

 

Next step was to clamp the keel thingy between two pieces of steel for about 3 days (arbitraty - had to go on a business trip so let it sit for the duration)

 

 

 

After removing the clamps and metal, the former is nearly flat.

 

 

 

While I haven't gotten a great deal done, have not been totally idle.  In the above you can see the supports for the garboard plank have been installed and shaped.  In addition, #1 son has started to work on preparing the stern and quarter galleys for painting and installation. 

 

 

 

 

While he is working on that, I have been pondering the planking of this beastie and planning the approach. 

 

It appears that the first plank will be about at the level of the deck and follow it toward the stern, with a slight rise in the bow.

 

 

First plank piece has been bent to shape, now getting ready to cross check between sides and take the plunge of putting glue to wood.

 

Until next time,

[Sjors]

Nice Wayne....

 

Good luck with the painting.

Stay away from the Jenever, you need a steady hand !

 

[trippwj]

Nice Wayne....

 

Good luck with the painting.

Stay away from the Jenever, you need a steady hand !

 

No worries there - Brett (my young starving artist son) will be handling the fine detail painting on this one!  I'll do the drinking while he paints.  May even have a piece of cake with the Jenever!

[riverboat]

Good work on the fix Wayne.... you never know it was there ( except you!)

Frank

[NMBROOK]

Glad to see you managed to bring the keel back straight Wayne  

 

Kind Regards

 

Nigel