JSGerson

Spyglass, commenting on Flyer's Pickle build log (post 260), may have solved my flag haliard problem:

I queried Peter/Flyer on his Pickle build log about the flag haliard. He replied as as follows: At this point my haliard is a loop loosely tied to the boom. I will continue my research to see if there are alternative acceptable "Navy" methods. As I previously stated, adding the flags will probably be my steps.

Thank you for the quick and detailed reply. You are right, it doesn't sound logical. You also stated there are two free ends which means now you need twice as much rope as compared to a haliard that ran as a loop plus the added hazard of possible dropping one end by accident while lowering the flag could result in the rope being pulled through the block and dropping to the deck. Very illogical indeed. Thanks Jonathan

Peter, I was referred to your build log by Martin W with regards to the flag, specifically where the halliard is tied off to. I've been building the Rattlesnake for a while now (like six years) and have finally started the rigging. This is my first rigging so I am learning as I go. Although my kit is Mamoli, I also have Model Shipway plans. As it turns out neither one of them address where the flag halliyard is suppose to be tied. Looking at my book references, they basically state that it is tied off at the most convenient spot. My logic suggests it would be better to tie off on the boom so when the gaff and boom swing, the halliyard won't need extra slack or have too much. On your model, it looks like it goes to a deck or bulwark cleat (I can't tell). Was this your choice or were you instructed? What is the reasoning for attaching it there? Anything you can tell me to shed some light on this would be helpful. Thanks Jonathan P.S. That's a beautiful model you have created!

Installing the Gaff Boom Installing the gaff was very similar to the mizzen boom however there were a few surprises. The gaff halliard goes from the tip of the gaff through a double block strapped under the mizzen cap, back to a block half way down the gaff, up through the double block again, down to a deck block and ties off to a deck cleat. That double block should have been installed during the assembly of the mizzen mast as it was a real pain to strap it on at this point. Then I discovered that I needed to add cleats to the deck on each side of the mizzen mast for the gaff halliard tie off and the gaff throat halliard tie off (the line that lifts the gaff jaws). It turns out that I had added the cleats when constructing the deck but I placed them forward of the mast instead of aft. Because the deck was constructed to show the deck below, the area where the cleats needed to be was open so partial planks had to cut to fit. I also had to use the Syren cleats because I didn’t have any more kit cleats. I left the misplaced cleats in place. Another item that had to be installed, were the jeers to hold up the mizzen cross jack yard. These should also have been installed when it was easier when the mizzen mast was being assembled; but because I was/am a newbie to rigging, I didn’t know that. I know I will have the same and similar problems on the main and fore masts. At the tip of the gaff is a small eyebolt where the flag halliard block is attached. The Mamoli plans call for a 4mm block, the equivalent of a 10” full scale block. The MS instructions state “The halliards are single lines reeved through very small blocks on the gaff.” It does not indicate a particular block size. The MS instructions seem more reasonable; you don’t need a large block for a flag. I used a Warner Woods 2mm (5”) block stropped with sewing thread. From my research, since the instructions were not very precise, the flag halliard is a continuous loop and is tied off to the most convenient point so I chose the obvious point, the boom. If the flag halliard went to a cleat on the deck there would have to be enough slack rope to accommodate the swing of the boom and gaff. If the halliard were tied off to the boom the two would move in unison and no excess slack would be needed. I suspect the flag halliards are tied off to a small cleat on the boom but near set of plans address such a cleat. I could be totally wrong. For that reason I do not plan to add the flag to the halliard at this point for two reasons. First, somehow adding the flags seems like the final act of a model build and second, I’m not sure how it supposed to be done. For now, I’ll just tie if off to the boom with no flag. Any thoughts out there?

You might want also contact Model12, he made a real nice model of the Conny with a red stripe.

With regard to the red stripe, the following came from Greg Meyer's build log on Knightdreamers.com: Using his method, you can still use regular masking tape. I hope this helps a bit. Jonathan

Let me state first I have never made any rope; I purchase mine from Syren. I did however see a demonstration a couple of years back at an NRG Conference by Chuck Passaro as to how he makes that excellent rope. Believe it or not, he uses the cheap rope walk that Model Expo sells. He made one modification however: He motorized it by removing the hand cranks and adding (If I remember right) a Philips screw for a hand drill to turn at both ends. Once the lines were strung, he would fire up the hand drill and turn the mechanism at one end. Through trial an error he knew how far that end would move while keeping tension on it as the individual lines twisted and when to stop. Then he would go the other end and do the same thing. Because he was at the opposite end, the twist was reversed and that would twist the individual lines into one. He would then remove the newly constructed rope and pull it through some bees wax and he was done. He was able to knock off a twenty foot rope in less than 5 minutes or less. Rope length is determined by how far apart the two ends of the walk are. I haven't tried it yet because I don't need any more excuses to delay my build by experimenting and practicing rope making. I've been at it for at least 6 years now and still haven't finished. Jon

Ken did a hellova job with those transfers. It's hard enough to use them on paper with a flat surface and get them lined up properly, but on a curved surface in which you need extra hands just to hold the model steady while the transfers are rubbed on; outstanding! I should know, I used these transfers all the time in pre-computer days making custom made office forms. Jon

I found these white Roman number decals on HobbyLinc. - Gothic R.R. Letters -- White -- 1/16'', 3/32", 1/8", and 5/16'' -- Model Railroad Decal -- #mg721.(all on one sheet) Since I don't know how big the real markings are, I hopefully these will work.

Getting back to the numbers on the cutwater, I did a little searching of my collection of build logs and model images of the Constitution. Of the nearly 50 different models I looked at, only about 2 or 3 of them had partial or full depth marks. The best I found was done by Ken Goetz which can be found at Midwest Model Shipwrights. Unfortunately there is no build log associated with the images. So best guess was white transfers or maybe commercially made decals were used. Jon

I've not done bow numbering before. The Rattlesnake is my first POB as well my first 3 masted ship. My best guess is either the transfer lettering (which you've had poor results so far) or homemade decals. The problem with decals in this case is they have to be white and you can't print white. Printing on paper, cutting them to size, and having them match the background exactly would be extremely difficult and I don't think they would look good. That leaves the transfers. I think you might have better luck with them here because you have more working room. You might want to check other build logs and see what they have done. Sorry I couldn't of been of more help in this case. Jon

You used the same method to attached the nameplate as I did for my Rattlesnake (post 337) except that I made a decal to be placed on wood instead of printing on paper. It was then I realized that printers cannot print white. Obviously in the Constitution case, the background on the nameplate is black and the only way to get white printing is to do it the way you did. I just never thought about it before. Very nice job Jon

Great job, I knew you could do it! There, now don't you feel better knowing you did it and didn't use the kit's cast metal part? Jonathan

Just being picky, but I assume you drilled a 0.132" hole in the twisted end and not the 1.32" as indicated...just saying. 8-) Jonathan P.S. Beautiful workmanship and documentation of it.

David - I chose the Mamoli kit because the practicum was based on it, although you can use the practicum with MS kit for the most part. I had no idea what MS kit looked like at that time. I finally purchased the MS plans on one of MS's many sales and got it cheap and downloaded their building instructions from their website. The structure of the two sets of plans are completely different. I like the Mamoli plans because it gives more detail diagrams, but I have to look at multiple diagrams to get a complete picture of what I have to do. The instructions are written on the plans and for me difficult to read - I wear strong tri-focals using an eye loupe as I am blind as a bat without these optics. Being a newbe, this has been a problem for me especially the rigging. There are numerous places where I could have done things sooner, off the model, and easier had I understood and realized it. The MS plans give a more complete picture but less detailed breakdown diagrams and no sense of order of construction with individual instructions all over the place on the plans and instruction booklet. So I use both now, but as you have surely read on my log, there are differences in the details. Then I have Harold Hahn's plans (which Bob's practicum is based on) and through another builder, the plans for the Smithsonian model. Again some differences in detail in each. If you can, get the wood supplement described in the practicum. I got mine at Hobby Mills before Jeff Hayes retired from the business. Jason Clark's Crown Timberyard has picked up the slack and provides a very nice product. If he doesn't have the list of replacement wood and sizes, I can provide that based on the invoice of what I got. DocBlake - Thanks for the like. I can understand why you put your Rattler aside, that transom can be very frustrating if something goes wrong especially if you don't know what it was that went wrong. When you get the courage to go at it again, I'll be watching. Jonathan

David, if I might Interject into your conversation, I too am a fan of Robert Hunt's practicums. They have a lot of useful stuff and I could not have built, let alone started building my Rattlesnake (my first square rigger build) without it. Just be aware that Bob is human and not perfect (he has a lot of idiosyncrasies that others might attest to) and therefore his practicums (at least the Rattlesnake's) have errors which I have pointed out in my log. Some of his dimensions were wrong as well as some of his building sequences were not fully thought out (my opinion). Double check everything and get second opinions on how to accomplish things from other build logs. He does state in the Rattlesnake practicum that there maybe better ways of doing things. I look forward to following your build log as the Conny is my planned second build and using his practicum.

Installing the Mizzen Boom The first order of business was rigging the parral. Before installation, the parral line was attached to one of the boom’s jaws with a pseudo eye splice through the pre drilled hole in the jaw, and five beads were threaded on. The boom was positioned and the line was threaded through the hole in the other jaw and tied with a simple knot and glued. Now it was just a matter of hooking everything up and adding the two blocks to the pre drilled holes on the mast cap and a block each to the pre-drilled holes on the deck on either side of the mast. Sounds simple, of course I’m describing all the failed attempts due to dropped and lost hooks, failed block stroppings, wrong length of line used, etc. You know the drill.

There is no consensus that I could find that states which is the best order to add the yards and booms so I decided to work again from the stern forward, bottom to top, one level at a time. In other words, add the mizzen booms, then the lowest yards working forward. This would be followed by the midlevel yards aft to forward and finally the top masts aft to forward. Whether this is the optimum way to do this or not, I don’t know. We’ll see. Mizzen Boom Thus the first order of business was to rig the mizzen boom. There was more stuff on this piece than I realized. It required 12 blocks; some were double blocks and others required hooks. Speaking of blocks with hooks, the Mamoli plans show that the Guy Pendant goes to a tied block on the taffrail (the railing above the transom) eyebolt. The MS drawing indicates that the block is hooked to the eyebolt. I couldn’t use Antscherl’s book as a guide because the model he was describing only had a gaff, no boom. However Petersson’s “Rigging Period Ship Models” did show that blocks attached to the hull were hooked. So, I decided to go with the hooked block because I thought that is what was probable used, plus I thought it looked better (what do I know?). Mizzen Boom Parral Another difference between the plans is the boom and gaff parrals. Mamoli just uses a loop of rope while MS shows a single rope with parrals and no ribs. Checking my sources, James Lees’ “The Masting and Rigging of English Ships of War 1625 – 1860” confirmed that no parral ribs were used for the boom and gaff but made no mention (that I could find) of using just rope. Maybe no parrals were used on smaller ships, I don’t know, so again I chose to follow MS. Lees stated that these trucks were about 3/8 the width of the boom. Since the boom and gaff were 0.10” and 0.09” at their widest point meant their trucks were 0.075 and 0.034” respectfully. I purchased a small bag of beads from a local bead shop. I got the smallest size they had. The bag was marked “size 11” which meant nothing to me. I measured them when I got home – 0.08”. These guys are tiny and I don’t think I could handle, let alone thread, anything smaller, so that’s what I used. One other thing, real trucks tend to be as wide if not wider than their diameter; these beads are a bit narrower. That raised the next question, what size is the rope used to thread the trucks? The only places where I found which described the parral rope size was Antscherl who used 2” (circumference) line (0.01” mini-rope) for his gaff, and the Smithsonian’s plans which showed 1½“ line (0.007”). Since I have both the kit’s 0.009” rope and Syren’s 0.008” rope, I had a choice, not that anyone could see the difference; I chose Syren, it looks better.

Wonderful! I glad you decided to at least making the attempt to create your own decorations. Based on your carved snake, it should look great. Believe me, you will feel a whole better about the model than if you had used the cast metal part. I look forward to following the process. Jonathan

Sorry Mundie, I know nothing about coppering so I can't help you there. And not to be adding to your coppering burdens but I've following xKen on his build of the Conny. He appears to be at the same place as you in your build and he ran into a problem that might affect you as well. He ran out of copper tape. You might want to look at his build if you haven't already, He may also have an idea on how to solve your present sticky problem since this is not his first coppering model.. Jonathan

Here are four build decorations I've found on this site and the web plus the Harold Hahn (B&W) version. Each one is different; there is no correct one. Some harder/easier than others. Give it a shot, you got nothing to lose, and if you like what you made, you'll feel better that you did. I copied Robert Hunt's who copied Harold Hahn. Mine is a far cry from the original Note: the images are from Jim McCurdy, Pasi Ahopelto, Raul Guzman, and Paul Bishop in that order

Oh, don't dread! This is fun remember? When I started my decorations, I was looking forward to it even though I've never done anything like it before. It was a fun challenge. If you were to look at what I was trying to copy (Robert Hunt's decorations) and compare those to what I made, you would see the difference between a master and a novice, but since most people won't, I look good! Try making some decorations on scrape wood (or clay if that's your plan) how bad can it be? Look at other builds, no two are alike so you can't be wrong in what you make. I would still like to see you attempt the whole arch. At worst, you use the metal one if you don't like your work. Jon

I assume you mean the two side pieces that fit in the corner of the transom below the decorative arch. They are going to be a bit tricky. In Robert Hunt's practicum, he chose to use Primo or Sculpey clay more as an example of technique rather than prime choice of method. It enabled him to form the pieces to fit the model easily. Carving was simplified because until the clay dried he could work it till he got right. Looking at his results, there was a slight change in color and texture due to the change in material I didn't like and since my model wasn't being painted, I couldn't cover that up. I decided to continue using boxwood and carve them like I did the decorative arch. What ever method you use, you are going to have to deal with a compound curve as the pieces curve in and back under the transom. It took me numerous attempts to get it right and don't forget, you have to make each one an exact mirror images of each other; and then you will have to form or carve the decorations. Good luck Note: The Mamoli kit does provide those decorative pieces. Jonathan

Be aware that the "new" copper you receive will probable not match the hue of the installed copper...at least initially. This is probable due to the difference in time it was exposed to the air. Hopefully over time, the two batches should even out. Jonathan