jbshan
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Spiling Tools and Questions
jbshan replied to daveward's topic in Modeling tools and Workshop Equipment
FWIW: You will of course, when choosing plank widths, measure the kit-supplied plank, and make that width your 'standard' width for your lining off. -
No, they probably used widely spaced frames of not so thick timbers, and only thick enough plank to keep the water out. Had they used large enough timbers, etc. to defend against 24 pdrs., the brigs would have been more deep of draft and poor sailers as well. The British had up to 24 pdr. guns and carronades on Detroit and Queen Charlotte, which were the main opponents Lawrence (where Dr. Parsons was stationed) faced. When Niagara engaged those two closely, her 32 pdr. carronades made quick work of them, presuming a similar lightness of frame and plank. 32 pdrs. would be the main armament of anything 74 guns and up.
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Dr. Parsons states that, as he was bending over tending the wounded, shot was passing over his head and out the other side of the vessel. This speaks to the height of the deck and to the strength of the hull fabric.
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Just checked my notes. Dr. Usher Parsons calls that space variously 'cockpit' and 'wardroom'. He also says the deck is at about the water level.
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If you postulate the picture Keith posted, but with the two gratings running fore 'n aft, you can blacken the center plate, remove one grating and have a ladder running next to the plate, running F&A. If you choose to show your vessel in a peaceful configuration, you could use canvas 'hoods' to help keep the rain off a 'ladderway'. I prefer that term as 'companionway' is so inclusive. On Niagara, there was a cabin aft, probably a lobby area, where one would enter from the deck, and, forward, a larger space, a saloon or common area. This is where the wounded were brought during the battle. Some of the companions/gratings used on the replica and shown on the model I suspect were not on the original, particularly those surrounding the capstan. Also, a 'skylight' would likely have been merely a grating left without its canvas covering. This was the case with Bounty, that had all those plants in the cabin. The options only expand the more you look into some of these things.
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Was watching John Wayne The Shootist the other night. He had a red cushion with gold tassels he 'stole from a cathouse'. ??? Nothing about geese, although perhaps a reference to 'Winchester Geese' is in order. When druxey finishes up with those cushions, you'll swear you can feel the fur on the velvet cover.
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In re paint colors, I finally found a color version of the painting of the four largest vessels done within days after the battle. This was done by one of the British Lieutenants and is now in the Royal Ontario Museum. It shows Detroit full length, Queen Charlotte from the starboard quarter, just the last 30 feet of Niagara also from the starboard quarter and Lawrence in full broadside view. In B&W, the port strakes of Detroit and Queen Charlotte are very similar to the port strakes of Niagara. Lawrence's side is totally in shadow and 'could' be the same as the others but the shadow makes this equivocal. In color, Detroit and Queen Charlotte clearly show a creamy color on their sides, while Niagara, while similar in grey scale, clearly is grey and not any sort of creaminess. Lawrence clearly is all one shade of grey or black. I don't remember if I put this in the article, but Ships in Scale did a series on the building of the replica vessel which appeared in about 1990. It is on the CD of that time so you can maybe find the B&W version of the painting if you have the CD covering that decade of the magazine.
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Spiling Tools and Questions
jbshan replied to daveward's topic in Modeling tools and Workshop Equipment
Try using a strip of file folder paper instead of a plank to mark on. It's stiff enough not to wobble too much between bulkheads yet can be cut with X-acto™ or scissors. Cut it a fair amount bigger but narrow enough to bend around the hull. Practice will show you the sweet spot. Then use compass points to trace against the previous plank and mark on the folder paper. When you cut to the mark and check and re-mark a couple of times it should be good to mark the plank. Tape would work to hold the paper in place while you do the compass thing. -
From the link provided by Mr. Highlander, druxey wrote: I wasted more leaf than that when I was figuring out how to gild, Janos! Did you also read up on rabbitskin glue for water gilding? Is that the method used on paper by calligraphers? It seemed simpler to me (I saw a demonstration at a calligraphers' exhibition one time) than the red size method, was nicely gold, but not too brilliant.
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The below-deck tiller and sweep has the sweep closer to the end of the tiller and small rollers on the rim of the quadrant to reduce friction on the tiller rope. This would be for larger ships, although Endeavour has headroom enough below, and if there is horizontal room for the tiller to reach it's functional limits on deck, there will be room enough in the cabin. I think some of the drawings may be for a refit, if not for the voyage and the replica got it wrong, then for afterward. That gooseneck bothers me a bit, also. It's only a foot or so long; you wouldn't gain much advantage from the extra length. Why not simply do away with it and put the ropes on the wooden part as was done on many, even fairly large, vessels, but perhaps not ocean-going. It doesn't make sense, and if it doesn't make sense, maybe there's something not right going on.
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Dashicat, that's part of the reason for the quadrant, where it is used. The tiller rope runs along the outside arc of the quadrant keeping the tension more constant as the rudder and tiller swing. There is also a tackle to take the slack out.
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Your channel should have slots in it for the chainplates. Once the chainplates are in, the outer edge of the channel is given a piece of wood to cover all the slots. You can hide a countersunk pin behind this outer strip which should give some good support.
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The photos linked above show blocks either side of the wheel, directing the tiller ropes to the bulwarks, then another block each side directing the ropes aft, then another block on the bulwarks inboard to the tiller. Three pairs of blocks.
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The drawing certainly shows a quadrant for the tiller. Perhaps this was done after the voyage, or for some reason the replica was done differently. The wheel is there in the photos, as is the tiller, but there are no tiller ropes on the wheel, though apparently there were at one time as there are grooves worn in the drum of the wheel. I also don't see any ropes on the tiller so maybe that whole system has been taken down, to reeve new ropes? If you're going by the replica that is what you go by, certainly. Underway pics show the ropes hooked up and apparently used in the normal way. Where the quadrant came from is a mystery.
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Knitting needles? I'm thinking of penochle. I think you can get the cards in a large-print format.
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That's a wooden arc hung from the quarterdeck beams. It both supports the end of the tiller and carries the tiller lines around its circumference so the fleet angle of the lines to the tiller remains efficient.
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What lays first?
jbshan replied to Telp's topic in Building, Framing, Planking and plating a ships hull and deck
The coamings and headers bear on a beam or carlin and are bolted thereto. Then, when the plank is laid next to the coaming, it can be caulked against the coaming and the joint won't open. If the plank is beneath the coaming, laid first that is to say, when you caulk, the pressure is trying to push the deck and coaming apart. Additionally, if you need to replace a plank, the coaming won't be holding it down. Here's a little sketch I did for my club newsletter:
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Also in Lever, Fig. 148, where he calls them runner pendants, 'to get in a new mast by the old one, without sheers.' And Fig. 368, for fishing the anchors.
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HMS Roebuck, 44, built in 1770 to a Thomas Slade design, had a complete row of quarter and stern lights, the stern lights of which had their lower sash level with the surface of the completely open quarterdeck, according to Harold Hahn. It made for a more imposing appearance from afar.
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Thanks for all your kind comments, Mike. In trying to resolve some questions I had I wound up going down some interesting byways. When X, Y and Z all seem to be pointing in the same direction, A & B kind of get discarded. Some of those sources I had to go to the rare books room. They didn't make me wear the white gloves, but I had to leave my jacket (it was February) outside the door. ??? I had done some investigations into color a few years earlier while I was painting, so have perhaps a leg up on some other folks in that department. The green inner bulwarks has one example from the time, the Hull model of Constitution. While that shows green was apparently used, it is only one example, and one example does not make a universal rule. I ended up making my capstan a larger diameter over the whelks as it looked kind of skinny compared to most you see on warship models and other documentation. The model is based on the replica so almost anything is fair game, once you decide to go past the slavish attention to the details of the kit. To the rest of you watching, if this doesn't make sense, read the material on the links I last posted. Cheers, Sir. Joel
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They would be dark wood and all slathered with tar from tarring the shrouds so they will appear smaller than they actually are.
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Mike, try starting with the buff and make that brighter with some white and maybe the yellow. Tiny amounts at a time, then check the results, drops and half drops, and a bit on a mixing toothpick that you have half wiped clean. What you probably should be looking for is something in the spicy brown mustard range. I don't agree with the box art on this one; I don't think they could get that bright saturated color with the pigments available. And, it's not a circus wagon. For my take on this vessel, go to http://modelshipwrights.wikispaces.com/file/view/Winter-2003_small.pdf That is issue #4, there is a historical essay in Issues #1 and #2, and also higher resolution versions of the articles. The archived issues are at http://modelshipwrights.wikispaces.com/W2W_Archives
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Ahh... Nothing like the smell of sawdust and yellow wood glue in the morning, eh? Perks ya right up.
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When you start shopping for boats, keep in mind that there isn't much difference between a 23 foot cutter and a 30 ft. cutter as far as design. If some company's 30 ft. cutter in a different scale comes out to 23 ft. in your scale, that could be the one for you. Figure out what yours need to be in inches or mm so you can compare the offerings available.
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