garyshipwright

Hi Allan. You must be talking about the transom and the counter timber's David has a good article in vol 2 of his TFFM book, page 9/11. EdT also has a good article in his book of the Naiad Frigate vol two chapter 20.  When I built Montague/Alfred I followed John Franklin articles in Model Shipwright Part 2 page 29. Just a ideal on how to get the curve aft and the curve up, first make the curve up on the right size piece of wood, thickness wise and then cut out the curve aft. I added some photo's that might help you. Gary

Thank you very much for the like!
 
I provided the rear deck with all the pins..



Added Kevel blocks to the rear deck..



And the final spray, the inner railing..


Cleaned the holes in the gretings and waxed the rear deck..


 

Current Status
 

 
 

Alan just a queston good sir. Why not remove the transom you have fitted and fit the counter timber's first then install the transom to fit them. I made all of my stern timber's first and then  fitted the transom. Take the stern timbers in shape and using rubber cement or Pva which ever you choose to glue them all to each other with thin pieces of balsa wood in between the pieces and then sand all of them down at one time. Mark them out with numbers from right to left and  reinstall them in order. I found this so much easier fitting the stern timbers first then the transom.  there is a whole lot more stern timbers then transom that's for sure. Hope this help's you. 
 
 
 




 

Hi Allan. You must be talking about the transom and the counter timber's David has a good article in vol 2 of his TFFM book, page 9/11. EdT also has a good article in his book of the Naiad Frigate vol two chapter 20.  When I built Montague/Alfred I followed John Franklin articles in Model Shipwright Part 2 page 29. Just a ideal on how to get the curve aft and the curve up, first make the curve up on the right size piece of wood, thickness wise and then cut out the curve aft. I added some photo's that might help you. Gary

Hi Chuck,
no progress since my last post, but I will continue soon!
I was asked to write a little article about the Winchelsea, and especially the great cabin for the magazin „Logbuch“ of  our Arbeitskreis Historischer Schiffbau. So I was busy doing that. I hope, that is some good promotion for you as well. I put your contact information in the article.

At the moment, I am finishing an old project, wich I startet 10 years ago. It is the HMS Unicorn, a frigate from the 1740’s. Scale 1:72, fully rigged. I had to finish some rigging, now I am working on the display case.

I want to make this as a waterline-model, because the ships hull is not as well built, as I wish it would have been, and I like the idea of a waterline-scenery.

After this is done, Winchelsea will be continued. 
Matthias
 

Alan just a queston good sir. Why not remove the transom you have fitted and fit the counter timber's first then install the transom to fit them. I made all of my stern timber's first and then  fitted the transom. Take the stern timbers in shape and using rubber cement or Pva which ever you choose to glue them all to each other with thin pieces of balsa wood in between the pieces and then sand all of them down at one time. Mark them out with numbers from right to left and  reinstall them in order. I found this so much easier fitting the stern timbers first then the transom.  there is a whole lot more stern timbers then transom that's for sure. Hope this help's you. 
 
 
 




 

Folks here are a couple of photo's of the building of the hanging magazine. I didn't do to much detail on it but did enjoy building it. Gary

]Thanks every one, your kind words mean a lot. Here is another update on the Orlop deck going aft from the forward store rooms. One item you will noticed is the fore jeer capstan step that was fitted between the forward and aft sail rooms. Reason for the this was to enable the fore jeer capstan to be lowered down to the orlop deck making room for the long boat on the upper deck above. You will also noticed the hanging magazine, which was used to hold cartridges for  some of the upper deck guns. The cartridges were made up in the magazine  and then moved to the hanging magazine until needed. One of the things about this was that it was constructed to hang below the orlop deck, which I believe to keep the cartridges dry. Other items that you will noticed is the cable tier and a couple of photo's show how the grate was made to fit between the pillars, which help to keep the anchor cable contained. One will also see the shutters above the well that would some what help air flow around the timber's in a very wet area in Alfred's hold. Any question just ask away. Gary
 
 
looking fwd on the orlop deck

Hi Mark. As far as getting both sides even, the template helped with that plus lines that were marked across the top of it. Believe it or not that was one of the items that worried me the most and after carefully marking it out worked out fine.
 
Thanks Joe. Have been a little slow at posting due to life getting in the way along with the Honey dues, such as flowers and yard work. One must keep the misses happy which in turns keeps me happy. ;o)
 
Hi Juergen. Sorry about the delay sir and thanks for your kind words. Here is a couple of photo's and hope they help you on the wale at the counter. Hoping I get around to posting more in the very near future. Gary
 
 

Thanks every one. Seems I have been a little distracted with other things, such as life in general and figure I needed to add another up date. This time its with the bulkheads in the hold. There was a total of only four in Montagu hold starting with the bulkhead that separated the magazine. Going aft one runs in to the bulkhead that enclosed the front part of the spirt room, followed by the fish room and finally the bread room. Wish I had installed some barrels in the hold along with some pig iron and gravel that they would of used to steady the ship. One item that one should be able to make out is the pillars underneath each of the orlop beams. Do hope you enjoy the photos.
Gary


 
 

Hi Ruslan. Your very welcome. I would say that that sounds about right sir. Have been looking for more informatio on it but have not as of yet come up with much.
 
Hi Folks. Here is another update of Montagu hold this time showing her well, along with the pump intakes and shot lockers which was attach to the well. The well was built on the work bench and then installed in to the hold it self. You will also noticed that the floor riders are finished at this time. Another item you will noticed is the pump tubes that are resting on top of the deck beams. They were made of walnut and are still in their square state. The pillar's in the hold are also made of walnut which gives a little bit more of a color to the parts in her hold, with out over powering the other items.  Hope you enjoy the photo's. Gary

Thanks every one. As Ed stated, am just glad to have the photo's to repost the log. I would really be in tears if I lost them. Any way here is another up date on Montagu, some thing that you don't see very often unless you are building a ship of the line, Moving past the magazine to the hold we have the floor riders. Timbers that were like the frames, accept they were installed to help strength the hull. The were very interesting to build and install and are made of pear wood. There is a set that help frame in the Ships well on the front and back and will show that when we get to building and installing the well it self. Do hope you enjoy the update, even through its the second time around. If I can find any more for this part of the build will post them. Gary

Figure I would add a few more to the magazine build up. Hope know one mind

Thanks guys. Hopfully one day I have my log back even if a few of the details might be missing. Of course nothing says that we can't go back and add those later.  Figure I would add some thing deep in the hull of Montagu that really brought me a lot of enjoyment researching and building.
 
  One of the most important rooms in Montagu other then the captains room was the magazine. Spending a year researching and building this was enjoyable and at times fustrated. It does seem that once I had the magazine as finished as the research would allow me and covered it up with the orlop deck, came across more research and detail that I wish I had at the time I was building it. Does seem that that is the way it goes. Any way here is a build up of her magazine. If you have any question on the what and how please let me know and will be more then happy to answer them. Gary

Thanks Joe. Hopfully I will have it caught back up in the next two weeks, at least thats the plan. Of couse it could take me a little longer. I just purchase another great Byrnes tool. This time his disk sander. Been wanting one of those puppies every since he came out with it 5 years ago. Jim forgive me if its been longer. Just might keep me in the shop, making saw dust.           Gary

Here is a couple more showing this part of her build.



 

Thanks Mark and druxey. Here is another up date and this time we go deep in to the hull of the Montagu Once all of the sanding and fairing on the hull was done, now it was time to add some strength to the frames other then the tempory ribbands. In this set of photo's one will  see the thickstuff laid out on the joints of the frames along with the orlop and gun deck clamp. It also shows that the main mast step, keelson and the limber stakes were also added. One will  see the breast hooks which was made of pear fitted at the bow, but I really didn't like the dark color of them so they were changed out to boxwood, as you can see in the one photo. Enjoy the photo's guys.

 

 

Here is a few more of the frame build up.
 

 

 

Hi Guys. Here is another update on bringing the log along or at least a step closer to what it was. This time its about Montagu frames which was built up using some ideals from the shipwright's of old, such as the  wooden templates the used to shape and cut out the timbers that made up the frames, accept mine are paper. My frames are drawn on the wood and cut out piece by piece and glued together on top of the frame drawing's like in the photo's. If my memory can remember back that far it took about 1500 hundred pieces of wood to make all of her frames give or take a couple. Guess I should sat down and get a count of how many pieces there really was but after about 500 I stop counting. As you can see in the photo's the new water lines helped on a more accurated framing drawing and joint lay out. One item that you won't see is chock's because most frames was built up not using them. I did in fact build a few frames with them but most do not have them. One might ask, what about strength, which is why one glues frames back to back to help strengthen the joints. My frames came out very strong but when it came to the framing I didn't want to take any chances so any time I sanded on the frames, i add tempory ribbands to support the frames along with shimmens glued between the two frames  which was later removed. Any question just ask away. Gary
 
Just a addition to Montagu frames. Being that I didn't go by Montagu frames sizes on the plan,  I use a 74 gun contract that was written in 1781 to give me the sizes of the frame timbers. When others  in the future  build their own 74. Just remember this is full size measurement.
 
 
Frame. It being of the utmost Consequence to the strength of the ship,that all the timbers of the frame should as much as possible be preserved from being cut by the ports on each deck, a disposition for that purpose is made on the said draught, and as a further means to obtain it, the said timbers appointed to make the sides of the ports being continued up to the top of the side, are to be framed in bends, 1ft, 2d, 3d and 4th futtocks and top timbers together as distinguished on the draught and fastened with three bolts of 1 1/4 inches in each scarph, and that the first futtocks bebe bolted to the respective floors of every bend, with 3 bolts of 1 1/4 inches diameter, that the stations of the said frames so distinguished, are to be preserved with great exactness, and for such of them as stand afore and abrest the square, and are to be canted, these also are to keep their stations, at the breadth, and what is required to give the fashion piece and beakhead timbers a proper flight , or cant, according to the turn of the body, should be done b reducing the room and space on the side of the keel and as by this disposition of the frames in their several stations, they are respectively appointed to make the sides of every gun deck port, and one side of every upper deck ports is at once provided for by them, as one 4th futtock and one top timber proper will make the side of every gun deck port, one top timber proper, and either a 4th futtock continued up, when can be got of a length will make the said side of such upper deck port is to be made by the top timber which come under the port, being formed in a cast over the 4th futtock head, and run , taking care that the said cast be so disposed that it be not cut of as to hurt the timber by the lower cell of the port, or as shall be directed. And as all ships should be kept as light as possible in her upper works, consistent with the service required of them, so the frame should not be incumbered with a timber more than is necessary for the several offices for which they may be wanted, and two short timbers and by no means more sided as the lower end 11 inches, and at the upper deck 9 1/2 inches, stands upon the cell of every gun deck port, properly place to receive an upper deck standard, quarter deck port or such other service necessary to their stations, and there be also 2 short timbers admitted to stand on the cell of every upper deck port sided 10 inches at the lower, and 9 inches at the upper end, which, with such as are nesassary to make the gallery doors from the quarters, make the sides of the quarter deck ports, filling inbetween the formost frame and Hawse pieces, the whole ship's frame will be sufficiently full , every purpose answered, and not the least occasion for more, every frame bend to be separated with pieces of dry oak in wake of the bolts for bolting the frames together, or as shall be directed.
 
Floor timbers. Between 3 and C the were sided 1 foot 4 inches and from 3 to 15 aft and from C to N forward they were sided 1foot 2 1/2 inches, and from there aft and forward 1 foot 1 1/2 inches and in wake of the half timbers o feet 11 inches or as the space of the cant timbers will admit. To be in length 26 feet and afore and abaft as the draught directs. No chocks to be larger on any floor timbers than will admit of 1 foot 4 inches whole wood below the cutting down in the midship, and afore and abaft to increase as the shape of the timber may require for strength, and to be moulded at the heads 1 boot 1 /1/2 inches, and afore and abaft the frame, every other floor timber to be bolted through the main keel and bolts carefully clenched before the false keel is put under, by bolts of 1 1/2 inches in diameter.
 
Lower Futtocks. In the midships from timber N to 12 inclusive to sided 1 foot 2 1/2 inches, from N to the foremost floor forward and from 12 to the aftermost floor aft to be sided 1 foot 1 1/2 inches, and in wake of the half timbers according to the room and space, the cant timbers allow, that the said futtocks run down to the deadwood, and not to have less than 6 inches whole wood there, to have chocks across on the heels of them to supply the wood that my be wanting from thence, to the cutting down on inside of the floor timbers, and that they scarph on the second futtock in midships 7 feet 0 inches, and afore and abaft 5 feet 8 inches, or agreeable to what is offered on the draught, and to be in and out, or moulded at the heads 12 3/4 inches.
 
Second Futtocks. The Second Futtocks to be sided between timber N and 14 inclusive in the said draught, 1 foot 1 1/2 inches, from thence forward and aft 1 foot 1 inches, or in wake of the cant timber , according to what is required from the room and space of them, to have 7 feet 0 inches scarph in the midships to the third futtocks, and afore and abaft as expressed on the draught , and to moulded at the heads 12 1/4 inches, not to have less than 3 1/2 inches whole wood at the heels of double futtocks, and half timbers afore and abaft.
 
Third Futtocks. The third futtocks to be sided 1 foot 1 inches, to give scarph to the fourth futtocks in midship 7 feet 0 inches, and not less than 5 feet 8 inches afore and abaft, that those timbers that come under the gun deck ports run up to the cell, and to me moulded at the run of the third futtock heads 11 5/8 inches and in and out at the gun deck 11 1/2 inches.
 
Fourth Futtock. The Upper or fourth futtocks in the midships to be sided 1 foot 1 inches, to have scarph to the top timbers in midships 11 feet 6 inches and not less than 9 feet 6 inches, afore and abaft, and to be moulded, or in and out at the range of the upper deck waterways 10 1/2 inches, that all those appointed to make the sides of the gun deck and upper deck ports, be well grown young strong timber, free from sap or wain, and as the bigness of the gun deck port is 3 feet 5 inches fore and aft, and the room and space of the frames on each side of them 5feet 5 inches, there must remain full 12 inches timber from the moulding side of each fourth futtock or top timber to the side of the port, after the port is trimmed out to the bigness, and there fore great care is to be observed that such as are appointed to make the sides of ports conform in their sidings accordingly, that when the port is formed to its bigness fore and aft, not the least sap or wain to be found in the timber in wake thereof, and that all such as come in the wake of the main and fore channels, or that make the sides of the gun or upper deck ports run up to the top of the side, or at least and many of them as can be got, and that none of those that make the sides of the gun deck ports be less then 3 feet 0 inches square timber, above the upper cell of the gun deck port.
 
Top Timbers. The top timbers in Midships to run down to the lower edge of the upper strake of the gun deck clamps, to be sided at the heel and at the upper futtock heads 0 feet 13 inches , and at the top of the side 0 feet 10 1/2 inches, except such as are appointed to make the sides of the upper deck ports, which ae to be continued the same bigness as below, or according to the room there is for them, and for those top timbers that are by being frames to make the sides of gun deck ports, the same care to be observed in respect to their bigness sideways, between the mouldings of the frames and the side of the port,, as has been mentioned of the upper futtocks and that those which are to make the sides ofr the upper deck ports, instead of such fourth futtocks as cannot run up to do that office, and requires to have a cast over the fourth futtock heads to clear itself of the side of the port for that purpose, to take care that it be well grown to form the said cast, and the cast disposed of proper to the height of the port, that the timber may not be wounded thereby, and not the least sap or wain be left remaining in the top timber in the wake of the gun deck and upper deck ports, when the ports are trimmed out, and the whole to be well grown young strong timber, and moulded at the top of the side at the run of the ribband at the top timber breadth in midships 5 1/2 inches, abaft 5 5/8 inches, and at the beakhead 6 1/4 inches, and at the fiferail from the second drift to the stern timber to moulded 4 1/2 inches, and from the drift forward in wake of the timber heads 5 1/2 inches, the frame to be disposed of agreeable to a drawing that will accompany the sheer draught.

Hi guy's. Here's a update on the build but this time it is more about her building board. I add a way of being able to tilt her from side to side  which helps keep the back in tack and a lot easier getting to thing's.  I worked on a couple of hanging knee's and being tilted made it a lot better.  I can't take the Credit for it which goes to  Alan/AON and the tech info on it. Hope you enjoy the pictures and any question will be more then happy to answer them

Hi Kevin. Getting your shop complete does take awhile, believe mine took me a few years longer but I seam to have every thing I need, for my ship yard. Your set up of the foredom look's good and was wondering if you were going to add a small vise  on the top of the table. You have one heck of a work shop so can you give us a 360 degree view of you shop? Am always interested in other's work shop's and give me ideal's to add to my own shop. Are you planning adding the drill table. Just wondering and have enjoy your video's very much. Gary

Hi Steve. Outstanding job on the carving which help's bring you Victory to life. Thanks again for the info on your base. Help's me a lot. Gary

Hi Steve. I knew Victory  was floated in a drydock at Chatham because usually 1st and 2nd rates was  built in drydocks and was a little to big to be launched like a 3rd rate in a slip. I was just wonder how big was your base. Thank you for the info.  Gary