hamilton

Thanks Druxey: Is it also a question of the appearance of the grain (depending on wood species) relative to the scale of the model? As well as for the workability of the wood? Not knowing much about wood, does edge grain or face grain bend better for hull planking, e.g.? Or in the case of Boxwood, would edge grain or face grain look better as planking on a 1:48 scale model? Sorry if these questions are either obtuse or simplistic! hamilton

Hi all: Are there specific parts of a model ship for which edge or face grain work/look better? hamilton

HA - the funny thing is that I picked up Historic Model Ships at a book fair on Hornby Island where we spend our summer cabin days out here in the Pacific Northwest...it was a steal at $2.00 CDN. I have been reading through but am only around page 110!! hamilton

Thanks Mark: I guess this ambiguity gives some room for interpretation - where exact historical accuracy is not achievable, probably best to fall back on what looks good or "feels" right... Thanks all for the informative responses to this thread! hamilton

Lees makes no mention of the introduction of shroud cleats - though as Mark (SJSoane) points out, he does mention some lines being belayed (on the shrouds)....Some of his belaying notes are quite vague ("the line runs down to the deck", for example). And it would take some detailed going through to see if he specifies shroud cleats or pins on racks on the shrouds. I had been assuming that lines belayed, for example, at the fore or main or mizzen tops would be tied off on shroud cleats - otherwise, where would they go? The images posted earlier show racks on the lower shrouds, but what of the topmast shrouds? I guess I'm throwing more questions out there rather than settling anything, but....another area of conjecture hamilton

Thanks Mark for the interesting history and the lovely repros and David for the link - this has definitely made up my mind with respect to this problem. Jersey City Frankie - I agree - it's hard to imagine anyone doing anything in a way that pre-dates something we later define as useful or necessary. No cave man ever longed for the distractions provided by television, but I guess they must have had other ways of keeping the stress and bother of life at bay that they thought were both delightful and amazing (at least I like to think of cave men that way, otherwise their lives seem way too depressing)....and today how often is it that younger generations think of a way of doing something or a new technique or technology that makes what their elders did seem absurd! As a teacher, I'm exposed to this kind of thing all the time - best profession if you really want to feel the ageing process..... hamilton

Thanks Mark! So during this period would pin racks have been on the shrouds - as opposed to shroud cleats? The drawings Lees provides of belaying plans indicate pin racks on the mizzen shrouds only, while in the text he mentions that they were seen on racks on the shrouds in small ships and large ships by the end of the 18th century....nowhere have I seen images of vessels in this period with belaying pins on the crosspieces of the bitts, though this is how Corel depicts them - perhaps as a convenience or perhaps (since the kit is a kind of combination of features from different periods of Bellona's career) to reflect a later practice.... hamilton

Thanks David! Much appreciated! hamilton

Hello there: I'm curious whether belaying pins would have been used on British Royal Navy ships in 1780. James Lees, in The Masting and Rigging of English Ships of War, dates their introduction to 1745, where they were used "on racks on the shrouds of small ships but not seen on large ships until the end of the eighteenth century" (p. 139) - but "seen" where? On similar racks on the shrouds, or elsewhere as well? My subject is HMS Bellona - specifically the Corel kit, which shows belaying pins on the crosspieces of the sheet and jeer bitts of the fore and main mast, as well as on the sheet bitt of the mizzen mast. For comparison, Brian Lavery's Anatomy of the Ship HMS Bellona does not show pins on the crosspieces, though in studying his book I've noticed (as with Corel's plans) that features are given that correspond to the pre-1780 Bellona, the 1780 refit, and also features of the rig that Lees suggests did not arise until the first decade of the 19th century (towards the end of Bellona's career).... As a follow up (bonus?) question, can anyone say whether shroud cleats (on lower and topmast shrouds) would have been used at this time....? Lees doesn't give a date for these, and I have no other sources that could confirm or deny their use in 1780 on British Royal Navy ships.... Any clarity on the belaying pin and shroud cleat questions (and apologies if this has been addressed elsewhere....) would be very much appreciated. hamilton

She's looking great Ferit! Amazing work as usual hamilton

Amazing work Dave - love the addition of the access door on the well and the faux pillar through the shot locker - weird design, indeed! hamilton

She's coming together very nicely - and fast! I think the trunnelling looks great - just the right accent hamilton

Nice work Harlequin! Good to see her coming together hamilton

Really nice work Dave! She's coming together really well hamilton

I've been slowing down too - too much non-modelling activities and obligations....but it's nice to see the work of others progressing! hamilton

Huh???? I have to say - that is one of those ideas that makes me wonder how it got discovered.....the perfect combination of counterintuitive thinking and random luck? Anyway, it looks great - I don't suppose you can eat the eggs afterwards, though.... hamilton

Hi Ferit! I seem to have missed your updates for the last year!! Must be the time difference between Istanbul and Vancouver.....The attention to the finer details of the ropework is truly impressive! And that shot of the model above really shows her in her majesty and beauty! Wonderful work! hamilton

Looking good Dave - your method of gluing up the frames is a great combination of simplicity and effectiveness - though I guess the joints won't be visible on the finished model will you be exclusively using butt joints for the frames, or is there any thought of experimenting with scarf joints or chocks as per ship-building practice? Also - in my modelling I would normally blacken any simulated iron parts prior to installation - but is the idea to blacken the bolts on the keel while they are in place? Curious to see how this is done. hamilton

Hi Dave: That explains it well as do your drawings - the NMM plans/Goodwin are certainly vague on this question. Looking forward to more progress (no pressure!) hamilton

Hi Dave: Looking really good - at such a large scale there will be a lot of opportunity for nice detailing. I'm wondering how you will handle the keel/rising wood...One of the ambiguities I found in Goodwin's book and the NMM plans was the rising wood, which clearly seems to curve upwards aft, but whose dimensions as given in Goodwin's tables only indicate the width. Will you just have a level rising wood, or do you have a solution for depicting the upward curve it takes towards the stern deadwood. It may be that the section you're dealing with at mid-ships doesn't have this feature....anyway, really enjoying watching your progress on this build hamilton

nice saw! and cap rails look good so far! hamilton

Amazing! I've been contemplating a Blandford cross-section myself and even bought the NMM line drawings and profile for this, but have been so swamped with work (and other modelling projects) that I've not made much progress.....just a bit of preliminary planning and drafting. There is some contradictory or vague information in the AOTS volume, and if you have some cash to spare, I would strongly recommend getting the NMM plans - can't remember the catalogue number off hand - they are the original basis of Goodwin's book. But I think overall it can be a great resource I built the Corel Greyhound kit as the Blandford several years ago - an exhausting but ultimately very satisfying project. She makes a lovely subject and I'll definitely be following your build closely - I may even be able to be of help!! Regardless, I'm sorry you beat me to this, but glad that someone is doing it here for me to copy from later on! Good luck! hamilton

Hi TUEL: I'm sorry I've only just found this log now! It seems you've gotten past the piggish first part of the build and are coming along beautifully. As you noted earlier, this kit is rife with structural imperfections - but despite this, she builds up into a very nice model. If you had asked me before I would not have recommended this as a first ship kit - but seeing how you're doing, I imagine when you get your hands on a higher quality product you will work wonders. hamilton

Well my last update to this log seems to have been in September! Then, of course, work took over and I've had precious little time for any modelling until the Christmas break....over the last couple of weeks I've finally found some time to return to both my current builds - Syren and Bluenose. Most of this work has been re-do & repair work.... Syren has seen the sweep ports repositioned (I incorrectly marked them from the templates provided with the kit and so ended up planking over them and drilling them out in the correct spots....). I also planked the counter, but noticed that I made an error in the lower planks that abut the sternpost....so I'll have to re-do these eventually....ah well. As for Bluenose, my last post documented the planking of the forward bulwarks and the cutting out of the scuppers forward. This went pretty smoothly with the help of the table saw. The quarterdeck bulwarks & scuppers were another story, though....the problem was with the fact that the quarterdeck bulwark planking did not come level with the waterways at all points. This meant that I had to file scuppers out of the bottom of the first bulwark plank at the forward end of the quarterdeck and out of the top of the upper-most hull plank aft....but because I did not do this as accurately or carefully as I could, there ended up being a small "step" in the scuppers at about the mid-point of the quartedeck bulwarks. Port and Starboard were roughly the same.... After looking at this for a couple of months, I decided I could not live with it and ripped the aft planking off. Laying a 3/32" x 1/16 planking strip along the hull , I marked the upper edge of the waterway along its length inboard and thus got a sense of where the scuppers should be positioned. Some of the scuppers can be fully filed out of the bottom of this first bulwark plank. The rest are only lightly scored and finished on the next bulwark plank up. At present I've managed to install the lower bulwark plank on the port side and it looks good - already I can see that it will be much better than my first attempt. I'm hoping to finish this work before the new semester starts (next Monday) and I get swamped with work again until the Spring....I'll post some photos once it's complete. Hope you all have a wonderful New Year and best for 2019! hamilton

Beautiful work Ron - and thanks very much for the tip on Birchwood Casey brass black - I'll see if I can't source some.... hamilton