Phantom by Elijah - FINISHED - Model Shipways - 1:96 - New York Pilot Boat

[Elijah]

What if I coppered and painted the practice side, and left the display side wood? Or would I still paint the display side, but not copper it? If I didn't paint the wood side, what would I do with the outside hull fittings? Thanks for responses and help!

[cobra1951]

If the planking is of an even colour, personally i would just give it few coats of wood dye, or stain. I don't like the water based ones for this as they are more like paint and hide the grain.

But it is your choice to make at the end of the day, i'm sure whichever you choose you will make a good job of it

Edited June 21, 2016 by Cobr@

[GuntherMT]

Make several small sample sections of planking, and try the various finishes on it so you can see what the end result after finishing and drying.  Then decide what you think looks the best based on seeing what it actually looks like.

 

I'm a big fan of sample testing for finishes, especially the farther along you are on the model.  I made about 12 different 'deck' samples to test different tree-nail methods and finishes prior to actually doing anything to the real deck.

[mikiek]

I agree with Brian. It's a lot of trial & error. Hopefully it doesn't take too many attempts. If you like the color of your planking Minwax Natural Stain might be an option. No real color it just gives the wood a 'wet' look. That's what I've been using on the boxwood. If you take a damp rag and wipe the planks, you will get an idea what it looks like.

 

BTW - according to the plans what color was the hull (the uncoppered part) supposed to be?

[mikiek]

Of course on the flip side, the coppering would probably be a good experience.

[Elijah]

The uncoppered part was black. I was thinking to copper and paint one side and leave the other side natural. That way, I would still have the experience of painting and coppering. What do you think?

[cobra1951]

Sounds good, then you can turn it around when you want a different look

[dgbot]

I would make up several test pieces and compare them. As for paint depending on how you do it you can hide the planking or a thin layer and accentuate it.

  Will you use enamels or acrylics?  

David B

[EJ_L]

I think it wold look good with a half and half display. Worse case if you are unhappy with the planking turnout due to either color or the planks themselves you can always copper over them.

Edited June 22, 2016 by EJ_L

[donrobinson]

Give it a whirl, as E.J. says it can always be changed

[mikiek]

That will certainly give you 2 different looks - kind of a cool idea. I have never coppered so I don't know what is involved. The only thing I can think of is when looking at the stained side would you see the edges of the copper plates at the bow & stern?

[alde]

Sounds pretty cool. It would make for a nice display and would teach you different techniques.

[Elijah]

I'm thinking the copper will cover half the keel. I'm not sure as to the differences between enamels and acrylics. I will make some sets of test planking to figure out what I like. What I am most wondering about is what I will do with the metal fittings on the hull on the natural side. Should I leave them metal, blacken them, or do something else?

[cobra1951]

Where possible i always blacken everything except the ships bell, as i think it looks more natural   

[EJ_L]

Most metal fittings should be blackened. The decorative pieces such as the ship's bell and ornamentation would be a polished brass or gold plate so those should be shiny.

[mikiek]

I used to blacken but got tired of getting the black all over everything - it rubs off. Tamiya makes an acrylic paint called Dark Iron and I have started using that.

 

 

If you do blacken, one thing I found that helps is after blackening put a coat or two of flat/matte lacquer on it. It seals up the black pretty well. If you remember the carronade pix in my log, that is what was done for the barrels.

 

 

I can hold those in my hand and nothing rubs off.

[Elijah]

Is the garboard plank twice the width of the others, or is it 1 1/2 the width? Am I getting this wrong? Any advice would be appreciated. At midship, at twice the width, the garboard would be 2' wide.

[EJ_L]

The garboard is wider than the other planks though I do not believe it was 2' wide as that would be a hard piece of lumber to find. I believe about 1' give or take a couple inches would be more accurate. It's width can change also as it goes from bow to stern. It will be narrower at the bow, widest in the middle and narrow again at the stern. This is to create a straight edge to run the rest of the planking off of. Make sure the garboard does not curve up at the bow.

[douglaspbrown]

Hi Elijah.

 

Your Pantom is looking very good.

 

I'd like to point out something in Chuck's Practicum. On pg. 16 he talks about the cockpit. Chuck points out that the floor of the cockpit should be 1 foot below the adjacent deck. I've seen some Phantom's where the cockpit floor was lowered and they look alot better than those that didn't lower the cockpit floor. Look at Chuck's cockpit on pg. 17. The ship's wheel is up against the grating. By lowering the cockpit floor there will be a gap between the ship's wheel and grating.

 

Regards.

[Elijah]

Thanks! The lowered cockpits do look better, but if you look at the plans, the cockpit looks to be at the same level as the deck. The wheel is also just above the grating. It looks to me like the cockpit walls are more seats than actual walls. Below is a picture from the plans.

[cobra1951]

Certainly looks like a strange set up whichever way you go. Bit of a dilemma. But as usual, your kit do it your way :)

Edited June 27, 2016 by Cobr@

[EJ_L]

That is a tough call. I agree that the drawings do look like the decks are at the same level. I also agree though that I think it would look better and was probably lower down in side the cockpit. With a solid hull that might make for some carving out of the deck to make it work.

 

I would do some research on other build logs or even google images and see if you can find what others have done. Ultimately like Bob said, it's your ship and decision. Which ever way makes you happy.

[dgbot]

I was able to read Chucks practicum and he said that the cockpit was originally a fot below the dexk.  The reason he does not do it is beausr of the dificulty of getting it done nice and neat.

David B

[mikiek]

Would look kinda cool but then reality sets in. That rail around the cockpit area would be annoying enough to have to step over to get to the wheel. If you had to step over and down? At nite?

[EJ_L]

MIke I thought the same thing about having to step over that rail and then it being a foot deeper on one side. I could see a lot of awkwardness, tripping and banged shins and knees on either height. Maybe not the best design...

[Elijah]

Hello all! I got three strakes done in the last two days, including the garboard on the starboard side. I took a lot of pictures, so I will let them explain themselves. I did surgery to remove a bad plank that had CA on it, and replaced it. The garboard points up at the same rate as the planks above do, so I think it works, but I would like to hear feedback on it. If I manage to get the next two strakes above the garboard, I will move on to the garboard on the port side. Really, after I get some planks on the lower part of the hull, on both sides, it will only be a matter of closing the gap. Onward !

I will update again at the halfway point! Thanks for any comments and help! Until next time.

[Seventynet]

Well done Elijah.

[mikiek]

First off, that is some gorgeous wood!

 

It's hard to say because pix don't show the 3D view very well. Not your fault, it's just the way it is.  If anything, I would say the garboard may be extending into the bow a little too much. But you can judge that. The key is you don't want the garboard turning up at all at the bow. In your next to last pic it kinda looks like it might be turning up some - maybe just the camera angle. I can say from experience, if it goes too far into the bow (even if the GB looks level) the next strakes will start to turn up.

 

One view you didn't show was your transom. How is that working out?

[Jparsley]

Looking good Elijah

[EJ_L]

Looking good! I will echo what Mike said about the garboard turning up at the bow. Even if it is only a slight bend, once you start adding strakes that bend will become more and more noticable. One way to check this is to keep measuring your space inbetween the garboard and those upper planks. Do your planks still fit in that space with the correct number and widths? If they do then you are ok. If not then you need to reset.

 

What happens is that the spacing at the bow will close out faster that the rest of the hull as it is a smaller space to begin with. If your planks are turning up there thrn that will accelerate that gap closure and you will not have the space to run the same number of strakes at the bow as you have on the rest of the ship.

 

You may be fine but double check you spacing now. It is easier to replace one plank then have to remove a lot of planks or be unhappy with your results.