Silver Soldering Tools

[bundybear1981]

Hey all,

I've been reading up on silver soldering and am trying to figure out where to buy the tools needed from here in Australia.

 

Firstly, I'm not sure what to look for in the torches. Are there brands that should be avoided, or those that are better and would be recommended.  I'd rather spend a bit extra now and get decent tools then cheaper ones that I'll need to replace in 2 or 3 years time

 

Secondly, can someone please direct me where to buy the consumables (solder, fluxes ect) and tools from as well (preferable online stores/sellers)

 

thanks in advance to all

Jason

[hopeful]

Hey Jason,

 

Don't know where you buy Silver soldering stuff in your part of the world but here is a photo of what I use to silver solder.

 

 

The tube contains both flux and silver solder. Purchased everything you see in the photo for under $100.00USD. Black block is made of charcoal.

 

BFK

Hopeful aka David

Edited April 24, 2013 by hopeful

[HSM]

I found silver solder and flux in one package at a local railroad model store. I usually use a regular soldering iron, but have used a torch similar to the one in David's photo for larger pieces.

[bundybear1981]

thanks for the replies guys   I did a quick search and I can get the Bernzomatic stuff from Bunnings here.  I saw they also produce solder as well.  Would this be suitable for our needs?

 

Metal Work Solder - http://www.bernzomatic.com/item.html?id=68

Electrical Solder - http://www.bernzomatic.com/item.html?id=69

 

thanks for all the assistance here

Jason

[dgbot]

The solders you are showing are for use with a soldering iron.  Silver Solder melts at over 1250 degrees F. I believe there is a tutorial on this sight that can better explain what it is.  You can buy silver solder from any jewery supply store.

David B

Edited April 24, 2013 by dgbot

[gjdale]

Jason,

 

As you noted, you can buy the torch and butane from Bunnings. I would recommend the type with a self-ignition system - constantly re-lighting will be a pain otherwise.

 

What you really need to go with it is some silver flux paste (the stuff that comes in a syringe). You can get this in varying "temperatures" - ie different melting points, which can be useful if multiple joins need to be done in close proximity. I think I ordered mine from Model Expo and had no problem with importing. You can also order this through on-line jewellery making suppliers.

 

Hope this helps.

[Boccherini]

Jason,

this is the torch I have been using for several years, it is works well for me. The flame is quite tight, so you have good control over what you are heating. They are also cheap, and readily available online. You just need a propane/butane refill can from Bunnies. It doesn't have auto ignition. Smith Little Torch is probably the best set up, but pricey. I cant justify the expense for the amount of use it would get. Silver solder paste is available from online jewllery suppliers, there are several in Oz. I 2nd Janos opinion of Mytool store, I'm another satisfied customer.

 

Regards,

Grant.

 

[Chuck Seiler]

Dave B./dgbot,

    I dunno.  That looks like the stuff I use.  I will have to check the actual tube when I get home.  It is silver solder paste with the flux mixed in.  You can get it in three different temp settings, but 1250 is about right.  I have 2 temperatures if I need to make two solders close together.  The first can be the higher of the two temps so the second one does not melt the first.

 

Jason,

    Another source for a soldering working surface is to get a ceramic tile from the local home improvement store.. 

[bundybear1981]

Thanks for all the replies and ideas.  I found an online jewellery supply store that has a range of silver flux pastes (Hilderbrand), charcoal work surfaces and locking tweezers and placed an order today.  Once they arrive the fun can begin   I've done a lot of soft soldering and a small amount  of oxy-welding (copper refrigeration pipes) before so hopefully it will come to me quickly   I've read the tutorial on silver soldering found on here, but does anyone have any tips, tricks or techniques they have found in their experiences?

[bhermann]

Jason - one of the things i have found most useful is that the silver solder tends to flow toward the heat source.  I learned this from someone on the old MSW.  It was counter-intuitive to me, but it made getting good bonds much easier than it was when I first started, when I assumed the flame would push the solder away from it.

 

Bob

[Garward]

Good results are yielded by the solder containing 40% of silver.

[Chuck Seiler]

Ensure the work surface is thoroughly clean.  Also, ensure the two surfaces to be soldered MUST be touching.  Unlike low temp soldering, silver solder does not bridge the gap. 

[dgbot]

It takes practice but well worth the effort. 

David B

[Boccherini]

Cleanliness, and importantly, (you may already know this having done some copper pipe work), the metal parts to be joined should be hot enough to melt the solder and make it flow. Melting the solder with the flame will not give a strong joint. You'll be ok with a bit of practice.

 

Regards,

Grant.

[Dida]

I know, there is needed a practice to make good joint. I have huge problem to obtain correct temperature when soldering. Each my joint is burned and useless.

[ReD_BuLL]

Hello everyone, I am new here. I am also a jeweler, about 15 years now. Soldering silver and gold jewelry is something i have been doing long time. With silver for example you can't really do a pinpoint soldering. I mean you have to heat up surrounding areas of the spot you are trying to solder together. So I use a larger torch, slightly more oxidized versus gold soldering, where you can do pinpoint soldering. There are different types of solder out there. I stock easy, medium, and hard. For example I use medium and hard for soldering rings, and easy is used for soldering chains and smaller thinner objects that should not be heated too much. I never used the solder/flux mixter or paste. I use liquid flux. First make sure you clean the item you will solder in an ultrasonic machine if you have one, if not, then the least should be done is some concetrated cleaning solution and use an old toothbrush. Then dry and flush the item and a piece of solder. Place the solder belof the item and heat from the top or vice versa. Whichever way you like to do it.

 

But I have read the posts from others and I see everyone does it different. Its all up to you to find the best way that works for you when it comes to soldering. I am still learing things when it comes to that.

 

Its easy, with silver you pretty much have to heat the whole item or at least the majority of the surrounding areas. With gold just the spot you need to solder together.

 

Sorry if i overdid on this

[ReD_BuLL]

I know, there is needed a practice to make good joint. I have huge problem to obtain correct temperature when soldering. Each my joint is burned and useless.

I know how it is. It takes time to figure all that out. Trial and error.

[ReD_BuLL]

Hey all,

I've been reading up on silver soldering and am trying to figure out where to buy the tools needed from here in Australia.

 

Firstly, I'm not sure what to look for in the torches. Are there brands that should be avoided, or those that are better and would be recommended.  I'd rather spend a bit extra now and get decent tools then cheaper ones that I'll need to replace in 2 or 3 years time

 

Secondly, can someone please direct me where to buy the consumables (solder, fluxes ect) and tools from as well (preferable online stores/sellers)

 

thanks in advance to all

Jason

 

Hey all,

I've been reading up on silver soldering and am trying to figure out where to buy the tools needed from here in Australia.

 

Firstly, I'm not sure what to look for in the torches. Are there brands that should be avoided, or those that are better and would be recommended.  I'd rather spend a bit extra now and get decent tools then cheaper ones that I'll need to replace in 2 or 3 years time

 

Secondly, can someone please direct me where to buy the consumables (solder, fluxes ect) and tools from as well (preferable online stores/sellers)

 

thanks in advance to all

Jason

Usually I use a torch system. One line from propane tank and the second to oxygen tank. And you can regulate the flame. More oxygen or less for different temperatures and soldering techniques. And of course each metal reacts differently. Silver come in different ways, its content. So it can react differently to certain temperatures.

[dgbot]

I use a Smith's Little torch and am glad for the investment.  As a result I can do small joints as well as large ones.  The secret is using the right size of flame for the job. This will be learned through trial and error.

David B

Edited April 28, 2013 by dgbot

[Dida]

Hello everyone, I am new here. I am also a jeweler, about 15 years now. Soldering silver and gold jewelry is something i have been doing long time. With silver for example you can't really do a pinpoint soldering. I mean you have to heat up surrounding areas of the spot you are trying to solder together. So I use a larger torch, slightly more oxidized versus gold soldering, where you can do pinpoint soldering. There are different types of solder out there. I stock easy, medium, and hard. For example I use medium and hard for soldering rings, and easy is used for soldering chains and smaller thinner objects that should not be heated too much. I never used the solder/flux mixter or paste. I use liquid flux. First make sure you clean the item you will solder in an ultrasonic machine if you have one, if not, then the least should be done is some concetrated cleaning solution and use an old toothbrush. Then dry and flush the item and a piece of solder. Place the solder belof the item and heat from the top or vice versa. Whichever way you like to do it.

 

But I have read the posts from others and I see everyone does it different. Its all up to you to find the best way that works for you when it comes to soldering. I am still learing things when it comes to that.

 

Its easy, with silver you pretty much have to heat the whole item or at least the majority of the surrounding areas. With gold just the spot you need to solder together.

 

Sorry if i overdid on this

Thank you for the advices. If you can mention some of your welding tips it would be appreciated.

[Garward]

When it is necessary to solder two details, one of which much more another (on weight), sometimes it is necessary to warm up separately in addition this detail that more fine detail thus didn't overheat.

[ReD_BuLL]

When it is necessary to solder two details, one of which much more another (on weight), sometimes it is necessary to warm up separately in addition this detail that more fine detail thus didn't overheat.

Are the spots near each other in close proximity or are they farther apart? Of course if the thickness is different then increase the flave. For example if the other spor is thicker than the other then increse almost twice as much. Of course gold ans silver react different. So it is trial and error technique. You cn get it from the first try if you are an expert. But even experts that I know (i might be one, but still learning, after 15 years) still dont always get it from the first try.

 

Kstati, bil ya u vas v Kieve, krasivii gorod Zhal chto tolko odin den. V sledushii raz priedu na paru nedel A ya sam iz Moskvi

[Garward]

Hi, ReD BuLL,  welcome to Kiev! Certainly, the big detail should be heated previously separately from small if to heat them together, the small detail can will melt earlier, than big will heat up to soldering temperature.   

[WackoWolf]

What Garward said is very true. It is like welding you hold to the thicker piece move the the thinner piece. Anyone that has welded before know what we are saying.

[iaincwil]

bundybear there is a blowpipe that you may be able to find on one of the jewelry web sites which you use in conjunction with a spirit  (meths) lamp,

I used it for very fine work as a blowtorch can blow everything all over the place,

it is good for soldering very small parts that do not require the higer temp.

[Sailor1234567890]

Always was curious about this silver solder thing…. Something I'll have to look into if I'm going to scratch build something.

[Modeler12]

Here are a couple pictures showing how I silver braze or solder very thin wire. The brass is 0.016 inch in diameter. I have made a few loops to be used for chain plates with deadeyes.

 

I use a small handheld torch shown. It does not have a self igniter (too small), so I use a candle when I have to light the torch repetitively. The solder comes premixed in the 'solder it' dispenser. It has the flux incorporated and a tiny bit goes a long way. I apply it with the tip of a round toothpick. Then I hold the flame of the torch very close to the joint and watch the silver flow. It takes a second or two.

 

My torch has an adjustable flame. Shown are medium and small flames. I use medium for most work on small items.

 

Here is a tip. When I have to break the joint (I may have forgotten to link pieces together as shown above), I can re-solder the joint using some old paste flux and the silver that was still in the old joint. Using the 'solder-it' again adds too much silver.

 

 

Earlier I showed a video about silver soldering, but that was before someone suggested using the premixed flux/solder.

Edited January 16, 2015 by Modeler12

[Modeler12]

Here is one more tip.

If you should add too much solder to a joint, you can redo it or cut away some of the extra solder, apply some plain flux and reheat the joint as shown below. You could even cut the joint, remove the extra silver and remake the joint with plain flux.
  
In the following picture I have cut away the extra solder with some snips and small file, then I
applied some plain flux (a bit too much again, I am afraid).
It caused some discoloration on the opposite side as shown in the last picture.
 

Edited January 16, 2015 by Modeler12

[Modeler12]

Tip number three:

 

Don't hold the flame too long or you get the following:

Indeed, practice a bit, but it is not difficult.

[JSGerson]

Jay, You need to look at the link you provided for more details about silver soldering. A number of images are missing.