Bluenose by bhermann - Model Shipways 2130 - 1:64

[Rich.F]

Hi Bob, You have a great looking ship..Ill spend more time looking though to help me out on mine a bit more.

 

Rich

[bhermann]

Thanks, Rich. A lot of detail was lost in the crash, so feel free to ask about anything. It may help bring back some thoughts from before.

 

Bob

[Janfran]

Hello Bob, A Newbie from UK. came across your log following usefull links from one superb site to another, I am attempting the Pegasus as per the unbelieveably able B.E.

Just browsed over your log and admired your work very much , You have chosen the blue nose which is a beautifull boat and I love her lines! I really want to build a siilar boat myself if I ever get this one finished?

But I suffer from the usual failing of the british as I also respect the other great boats such as the underdog which very nearly beat the Blue nose,

I refer to the Gertrude which seems to have disapeared into oblivion, as you have researchd this vessel, May I ask if you have found any information on The Gertrude to which I might refer? Information on this side of the ocean is scant and I have only found a picture or two  thus far!

really enjoyed your log and thanks for adding to my meagre knowledge with the help of your log,

Best regards Frank

[bhermann]

Hi Frank.  Thanks for stopping by and for the kind words.  I too have been following B.E.s Pegasus - now there is some real craftsmanship!

 

As Bluenose is my first wood build, it didn't occur to me that research would be useful - or even possible - until I was a ways into the build and after I found MSW myself.  Since them my primary source has been the Nova Scotia Archives section on Bluenose.  The articles and especially the photographs have been very useful in sorting out some of the details as I have gotten further into it.  I haven't seen anything there on Gertrude expect some race photos showing her from a distance.

 

I assume you are referring to the "Gertrude L. Thebaud".  If you haven't been searching on the full name, that might yield better results for you.  Also check out the Story Shipyard in Essex, Massachusetts, where she was built.  I look forward to hearing about your experience in looking for her, and to your build log, should you get the chance to do that.  By the way, I understand your respect for the underdog and I share it.  I have to admit when I started this build, I didn't even know there was an underdog to the Bluenose story.  I just loved the lines!

 

Bob

[rbprescott]

Bob,

It's been a great pleasure reviewing your build log of the Bluenose by Model Shipways.  I am trying to build it myself.  I do not have your skill level but I'm trying to increase my skills  I have a problem and I wasn't sure where to post it.  I am trying to follow Bob Hunt's practicum and now I'm trying to install the Jumbo Boom Crutch and Hoisting Machinery Support.  In it he says "There are two end pieces, a large gear and a small gear and two bearings.The bearings were not attached to my assembly nor were one of the two end pieces."  In my kit both end pieces are attached along with the small gear.  If I have to cut off one of the end pieces, drill a hole to reattach it after I insert the large gear it will be too narrow to attach to the posts that have been glued to the laser cut top part.  I emailed Tom at Model-Expo and he said that tahe is the way the part comes.  I would appreciate any suggestions.

Thanks,

Ralph

[bhermann]

Hi Ralph, and welcome to MSW.  I see this is your first post.  I am sorry to hear you are having issues with the fittings on your kit.

 

I would suggest one of two things to get help on this.  First, you could start a build log of your Bluenose build.  A build log is a great way to get advice and share your work with the community.  For me it isn't about showing a perfect product, it's about sharing the process and learning as you go.  There will be other things that you come across throughout the build, and if you have a log started it's a simple matter of posting your question.

 

A second possibility is to open a new topic in the "Discussion for a Ship's Deck Furniture, Guns, boats and other Fittings" forum.  That would be a natural place for the question you are asking.  Whichever path you chose, I'd recommend posting some photos of the issue - that will make it easier to visualize what you are describing.  I will look back in my old photos and see if I have anything useful for this problem.  It was about 5 years ago when I did that part of the build, so my memory is more than a little fuzzy.

 

I look forward to seeing more of your work as you continue your Bluenose build.

 

Bob

 

 

[DBorgens]

Ralph,

As I recall, I had trouble with the cast part breaking and cannot remember how it originally was in the kit. Since it broke, I cut the gears and end pieces off and drilled out the centers. I then glued them to a piece of .030 wire. Worked out well,

 

 

Bob, sorry to jack your log. How is your Bluenose coming? Haven't heard in a while.

 

Dave B

[challenger86]

Bob,

Very nice MS Bluenose build. It's amazing how different the Model Shipways kit is versus the Amati kit, the one I'm building. Leaning towards the MS kit being a superior kit, a great amount of detail!!

 

Robert

[bhermann]

Bob,

Very nice MS Bluenose build. It's amazing how different the Model Shipways kit is versus the Amati kit, the one I'm building. Leaning towards the MS kit being a superior kit, a great amount of detail!!

 

Robert

Robert - thanks for the kind words.  I am pretty happy with the MS kit.  I think it is a bit larger scale than the Amati kit (1:64 vs 1:100?) which makes it possible to add more detail

 

Ralph,

As I recall, I had trouble with the cast part breaking and cannot remember how it originally was in the kit. Since it broke, I cut the gears and end pieces off and drilled out the centers. I then glued them to a piece of .030 wire. Worked out well,

 

 

Bob, sorry to jack your log. How is your Bluenose coming? Haven't heard in a while.

 

Dave B

Dave - no problem.  I'm glad you can recall something useful from that part of the build.  I haven't spent a lot of time on Bluenose lately.  I have finished up the rest of the sail templates and printed them, haven't cut them out yet.  I've been spending a lot of free time on other projects, one of which is an origami canoe - not something I'll be repeating soon.

 

 

 

 

Ralph - I did take  a look back at the old photos but I only have pictures of the completed assembly.  That would not be much help, I know.  If Daves response isn't what you are looking for, I recommend posting a question either in your own log (hint, hint ) or in a separate topic.

 

Bob

[PopJack]

I've been stealing admiring some of your construction techniques.  I especially like the shackles you used to connect the rings on the bow sprint to the lines.   I'm wondering on your shackles how you attach the pin that is normally threaded and screws in.  I was thinking that I should bend one end marginally, insert, trim and then superglue the pin in place.  Thoughts?

[bhermann]

I've been stealing admiring some of your construction techniques.  I especially like the shackles you used to connect the rings on the bow sprint to the lines.   I'm wondering on your shackles how you attach the pin that is normally threaded and screws in.  I was thinking that I should bend one end marginally, insert, trim and then superglue the pin in place.  Thoughts?

 

PopJack - Steal away!  That's why I post the stuff    I have "borrowed" from many others during my build, Gil Middleton's fake splices in his Victory log is one of my favorite finds.  For the shackles I soldered the loops on the ends of the "U" then super-glued a brass wire "pin" into the loops.   I trimmed after gluing so I'd have something to hang onto while gluing.  I have gotten better at getting the loops small enough to create a little friction when inserting the wire pin.  Some of my early efforts were pretty loose, but the pins have stayed in place even in those.

 

I have tried soldering the pin in place, but haven't had much success with that.  Using the glue allows the turnbuckles to rotate on the pin, when I tried solder it froze everything in place.

 

Bob

[russ]

I agree about the shackle pins. I have done it with both hard soldering and just CA. CA will usually provide enough hold in such a confined space. I just glued the pin in place and then trimmed and filed the ends.

 

Russ

[PopJack]

Thank you both for the answer.  I'm going to go online now and cancel the order for the 0.4 mm tap and die set. 

[bhermann]

Thank you both for the answer.  I'm going to go online now and cancel the order for the 0.4 mm tap and die set. 

 

LOL - if you do order the tap and die set make sure to get both RH and LH threads - so you can make those working turnbuckles!

 

I am not at a complete standstill - in fact my mind is going 200 mph, even though the build itself is crawling.  I did manage to finish making and cutting out the templates for the sail set.  Don't know if I'll use the fisherman sail, but I have it if needed.  I may add a third reef band to the mainsail - it seems too large not to have the option.

 

The sails laid out:

 

 

and where they are going to:

 

 

A closer look at the destination.  I see the mast hoops are too thick, but I have to remember I have a few extras on the mast in case of breakage.

 

 

Still working out the details of sail construction in my mind.  I am pretty clear on drawing the hem lines, not stitching them.  I am debating on whether to fold the hems over and glue them, or to get an iron-on edge and trim that to the actual sail size.  Anyway, here are a couple of shots of where I am at the moment.

 

Bob

[russ]

The sail templates look good. I sew my sails (when I have sails). It is time consuming and tedious, but with some practice, the results are worth the effort.

 

Russ

[Alfons]

 

 

I am not at a complete standstill - in fact my mind is going 200 mph, even though the build itself is crawling

 

True that Bob, I can relate..

 

Take your time, I am sure the result will be worth waiting for.

 

/Alfons

[d'brat]

Your log is definitely inspiring me to keep moving forward on the Bluenose that I started recently. If you don't mind I will be going over all of your older pages as well as the newer ones to try to keep me from going down the rabbit hole of trying to figure everything out for myself. The AL kit that I have is different in supplied pieces but I will be trying to get the details right just like you did.

[bhermann]

The sail templates look good. I sew my sails (when I have sails). It is time consuming and tedious, but with some practice, the results are worth the effort.

 

Russ

 

Thanks Russ.  The reason I am thinking about drawing in the hems is for scale purposes, not to avoid the sewing.  At 1/64, I think anything I can do on a sewing machine will just look too big to my eye.  I have read in log after log that it is best to err on the small side when adding detail.  We'll see how it turns out.  In any case, after I have drawn in the lines, if it looks like stitching is needed, I will at least have some guides to follow

 

Your log is definitely inspiring me to keep moving forward on the Bluenose that I started recently. If you don't mind I will be going over all of your older pages as well as the newer ones to try to keep me from going down the rabbit hole of trying to figure everything out for myself. The AL kit that I have is different in supplied pieces but I will be trying to get the details right just like you did.

 

Please feel free to look at any and all parts of the log.  That's one of the main reasons I have it out here.  Any questions come up, please feel free to ask.  If you see something I haven't explained (and there is a lot missing since the crash of MSW1), let me know that too.  i tried to get the main stuff in when I re-started the log, but there is a lot that isn't here anymore.  If I can still remember what I did, I'll be happy to share.

 

Alfons - I am enjoying watching your build - we work on them when we get the time, no?

 

Bob

[russ]

Bob :

On sewing sails, I have done most of mine hand sewing instead on the machine.

 

Russ

[PopJack]

Sorry to back up (perhaps there is a way to post this properly in place- but I don't know it).  I was looking at the fairleads near the spreaders.  I keep wanting to model these, perhaps with a bead or something.  May I ask what you did here?

[bhermann]

Sorry to back up (perhaps there is a way to post this properly in place- but I don't know it).  I was looking at the fairleads near the spreaders.  I keep wanting to model these, perhaps with a bead or something.  May I ask what you did here?

 

No problem - the whole log is backed up, as I have been at this for almost seven years.  I simply soldered some brass eyes (or maybe galvanized steel) out of wire, drilled holes into the spreader, glued them in and painted the whole mess white.  BTW, I just looked at what you did with the toothpicks and am impressed!  It is an elegant solution.  In any case, feel free to ask about anything at any point.  It may help someone else, and it certainly doesn't hurt me to go back over details from the past.

 

Bob

[bhermann]

No progress here - just a lot of staring at sail templates and contemplation.  I did take advantage of Chucks discount for MSW members and ordered up some rigging line.  Maybe that will help me get out of the doldrums!

 

Bob

[Dimitris71]

Hi Bob, just saw your build and i think you've done  marvellous , detailed and clean work. Congrats .Dimitris

[7 Provinces]

Hi Bob,

 

I am building the Bluenose myself, from a Billing Boats kit. I have been on and off (more off) it for almost 20 years now, but a while ago I picked up the work and started a build log.

I have also started to read the other Bluenose logs on this site which I found very inspiring. After reading your log I was a bit taken aback by the amount of detail which you have put into it and how great it looks. Billing Boats did not add much detail to the model (details which I find on original photos) and from the downloaded instruction manual (unfortunaly no drawings!) from the Model Shipways kit I see that Model Shipways does this to a somewhat greater extent. So also in your log I see more details than on my drawings. I am trying to add some more detail to my model (and correct a lot of things which the kit got wrong.

 

Right now I am adding fake stanchions to the model, a feature left undiscussed by Billing Boats. This brought me to the question of what to do around the bow. My instructions as usual do not mention this in any way but in the MS instructions I see that knightheads, hawse timbers and chafe blocks are mentioned. I would love to add this detail to my model but I am lacking information on how and where. 

If it is not too much trouble, could you maybe make a picture of your bow section showing these details?

 

Thank you very much in advance!

Jan-Willem 

[michael mott]

Hi Bob, how is the work proceeding on the sails? the templates look good, have you been sucked into the whole CAD thing?

 

Michael

[bhermann]

Jan-Willem - Thanks for the kind words.  It has been fun adding some of the detail from the MS plans and the photos from the Nova Scotia archive site.  I need to charge up the batteries on the camera and will attach some photos of the area soon.  Unfortunately, that area was one of the first areas I built on the model, so it in not well detailed on my build.  I basically used a solid block of kit wood to fill in the space where these details should be.  If I was to re-do the section I would attempt to include the details of each separate piece of timber.  BTW when I count the number of stanchions on the model (and the MS plans), there are 30 between the stern and end of the quarterdeck, and 25 from the break between the quarter- and fore-decks and the beginning of the hawse timbers.  Don't be afraid to put in a mess of them!

 

Michael - I am happy to say that I have NOT be sucked headlong into the CAD world.  However the build has pretty well ground to a halt over the past few months.  Parts of it is other priorities taking up time, part is my natural tendency to over-analyze and over-think when I move to something I have never done before on a model - and sails is a whole new thing to me.  I am in the midst of a sort of analysis paralysis mode at the moment until I get up the courage to actually transfer some of those templates to cloth.

 

Dimitris - sorry for the late acknowledgement.  Thanks for stopping by and for the kind words.

 

Bob

[7 Provinces]

Hi Bob, I am looking forward to your pictures. I am sure they will be helpful even if not as detailed as the rest of the ship. On my model there actually is nothing so it can only get better. Unfortunately I couldn't find a picture showing this area on the NSA (Nova Scotia Archives) either and I made sure I looked at all pictures (in fact, most I downloaded and printed for reference).

You actually counted the number of stanchions, that's very kind of you. However, it will not really help me I am afraid. First of all my stanchions are wider (reasons: see my build log) and I do not want to fill the waterways with stanchions only. It has to look natural is what matters most to me. Plus I cannot move the bulkhead stanchions for obvious reasons so options are limited (being the number of fake stanchions between the bulkhead stanchions). Then: even as many stanchions as you have I think is not as many as there were on the Bluenose. It's hard to tell from the original pictures but to me it looks like there were more. Last but not least I have seen on the NSA pictures that at the aft (from the steering wheel backwards) there are fewer stanchions. I recognize one but two others might be hidden behind some contraption which I cannot identify...

Anyway thanks for your help, I appreciate it! 

[bhermann]

Jan-Willem

 

Here are the photos you requested.  Hope it helps.  That solid block you see runs all the way to the stem where it wraps around the bowsprit.

 

 

I think the stanchion count is accurate.   I suspect that not every frame is continued above the deck so the number of stanchions is less than the number of frames.

 

Enjoy, and let me know if I can share anything else with you.

 

Bob

[7 Provinces]

Very nice pictures Bob, thanks a lot! So what I unterstand is that you treated the knightheads and the hawse timbers as one block and drilled the hawse hole in it. And what I understand from the instructions and from the dictionary (I am not yet very acquainted with nautical terms) is that hawse timbers are vertically placed pieces of wood between the knighthead and (in this case) bulkhead A and the first fake stanchion. The result being about the same after painting except for the fact that you chose not to add the chafe blocks. Would that be about right?

 

About the number of stanchions, you may very well be right. On my model, when I add 3 fake stanchions between every pair of bilkhead stanchions I have 20 between bulkhead A and the break between quarter and fore deck and 21 between the break and the stern. So I would get closer by placing 4 fake stanchions between each pair of stanchions but unfortunately this would not work on my model.

 

Thanks again for your help, I may have more questions in the future 

[7 Provinces]

Hi Bob, just to let you know: I did a little more digging (because you wrote that you would do this part differently next time) and oddly enough I did not find any information on how other modelers had built the knighthead / hawse timber / chafe block area. I did however find an original photo of the Bluenose which I did not have yet, where this area looks just like your model: there is, quite clearly on the photo, no distiction between the knighthead, hawse timbers and the chafe block. At least the separate parts are not visible and it is a sharp picture. This may have to do with the fact that it had been painted afterwards? Anyway, I am not going to make these different parts when they cannot be distinguished on the real ship. So I am now working on the same solution you implemented. I hope to be able to post pictures soon.

 

Thanks and regards,

Jan-Willem