USS Perry by EricWilliamMarshall - BlueJacket Shipcrafters - Scale 1/96

[EricWilliamMarshall]

On 12/18/2021 at 8:53 PM, Hubac's Historian said:

you have done a fabulous job of fairing this hull.

Thank you for the compliment! While I'm not doing anything fancy by MSW standards, I'm hoping to do the basic work well. A weird side-effect of entering this hobby when I did, is Covid hit right after. I haven't had a chance to see that many models in person, so I'm working from a slightly idealized notion of how they look in the real world. Plus of the few I saw, were of the caliber of Chuck Passaro's work! Here, I tip the hat to the Ship Model Society of New Jersey for having members who are killer craftfolk.

12 hours ago, Landlubber Mike said:

Glad you’re getting additional use out of the Bug - very clever

Any tool can be a tool mis-used!! It is a nice tool and has a few features that weren't apparent at first glance. Thanks for the recommend!

[EricWilliamMarshall]

Not much to report. Still working on the coppering of the hull. I started with the keel, which is nice and flat; so works as a nice safe place to start. The annealed copper is easy to unbend (by rolling the handle of my x-acto knife over the bend piece).

 

Edited December 26, 2021 by EricWilliamMarshall

[EricWilliamMarshall]

How do folks apply glue? As for myself, I use a needle mounted in a pin vise. I put a drop or two of CA on to an old lid from take out food or similar. The drop stays liquid for roughly an hour or so. I find using this setup conserves glue, reduces the fumes and gives great control.

 

The glue will build up on the pin. This is easily popped off the pin by scraping the pin against an x-acto blade. I use the back of the blade so not to dull the blade. It is also a nice reminder of the limited strength of CA glue to bond to metal. 

[KenW]

What kind of CA do you use?

You work looks great.

Cheers

[Keith Black]

 Eric, I've never had good luck with the GG brand, I've always used the old SG brand with much better success. 

[EricWilliamMarshall]

12 minutes ago, KenW said:

What kind of CA do you use?

In this case, Gorilla Glue and earlier in this build a rebranded version from Maplewood Hobby. I haven’t noticed a great difference between brands. I have noticed is regarding viscosity. Over time any glue I have opened becomes thicker. The same is true for dab of glue sitting on the lid. Thin glue spreads easily and will run along folds, seams, etc. where as thick glue will fill gaps and can be deployed in ‘lumps’.

 

24 minutes ago, KenW said:

You work looks great.

Thank you, thank you, thank you! I’ve have noticed, if I move quickly, I can sometimes wipe away excess CA glue before it dries, that it can sit on a piece for a bit and still be good and not be afraid to ‘do over’ if I screw up.  I try to be extra careful not to have the glue squeeze out. No great insights or dark magic at work here. 
 

 

[EricWilliamMarshall]

48 minutes ago, Keith Black said:

I've always used the old SG brand

I’ll give that a shot and see how it goes. Thanks,

[Keith Black]

1 hour ago, EricWilliamMarshall said:

I can sometimes wipe away excess CA glue before it dries

 Eric, when gluing I have several Q-tips at the ready to soak up any excess CA. I go through a ton of Q-tips because the tips become hard after one use. 

[Roger Pellett]

Eric,

 

If this were my model, I would not copper plate it.  A scale copper plate would be less than .001 in thick and slightly over 1/8in wide.  

 

So, with the vessel out of the water, standing 100ft away what would you see?  You certainly would not see individual flat head tack heads, at scale perhaps .005” in diameter, and probably not individual plates.  Quite possibly you would see a mottled copper/ brown hull with touches of green along the waterline.  

 

I would rub down the copper paint to a smooth finish and overspray with a very light coat of red tinted brown. You could also dry brush some green along the waterline.   If done right, this subtle shading would produce a handsome effect on this small model.

 

Roger

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Ryland Craze]

16 hours ago, EricWilliamMarshall said:

The glue will build up on the pin. This is easily popped off the pin by scraping the pin against an x-acto blade. I use the back of the blade so not to dull the blade. It is also a nice reminder of the limited strength of CA glue to bond to metal.

I use the flame from a cheap long reach butane lighter to burn off the CA buildup on the pin.  Your Perry is looking good.

[EricWilliamMarshall]

Ryland, thanks for the kind words! I will try flames as well! Thanks for the tip!

[MrBlueJacket]

Regarding CA glue, it has a shelf life of 6-12 months at room temperature. You will notice that it starts to take longer to set. While accelerator helps, I find it better to just get a new bottle. Unopened glue will last a long time in the freezer.

 

Nic

[EricWilliamMarshall]

Someone asked via direct message for a photo of the glue I use. These are the two bottles I’ve used so far. In the past, if there is an option I buy gel or gap filling CA.

Edited January 2, 2022 by EricWilliamMarshall

[EricWilliamMarshall]

On 12/26/2021 at 7:53 PM, Roger Pellett said:

A scale copper plate would be less than .001 in thick and slightly over 1/8in wide.

A fair point. A number of items on my build aren’t to scale: my decking, my bulwarks, the exactness of my waterline, the symmetry of the hull, etc, These are all off a bit due to the materials and my abilities and my patience or lack there of. I did think about two other approaches to coppering the hull. One, airbrushing to suggest plating - a technique used in plastic models of 20th century warships for decks or to suggest plating. The other, using copper leaf applied to paper to create plates. Copper tape seems to be the path most folks follow. For those who read my previous build log may remember I tried my hand at oil gilding for a carving I made.  @sjanicki used plates on his Perry and I thought I would give it a shot. 

 

I couldn’t find any period/contemporary information regarding plate size or dimensions of the copper sheets or gore lines or number or pattern of copper nails used, etc. Most of the information I could find is from non-naval ships of half a century later! 
 

So a couple thoughts and a question:

Do you have a reference for the dimensions of the plates or colors?
I agree they would be thin but I couldn’t find any information regarding length or width other than perhaps being four feet in length. Nor consensus regarding what a coppered hull should look like “at rest”. I did find an article by Jim Roberts suggesting colors as you have and found a mention about the wear and tear of merely sailing in salt water on copper which leaves the copper fresh.

But have found countering color suggestions based on the source and manufacturing of the copper or if the ship was at rest or sailing, in the water or out (and for how long). I’ve thought about aging copper in salt water just to see for myself!

 

There is also the issue @Keith Black suggested as well. Very few models of this period or earlier are displayed weathered, worn and otherwise shown as used (or abused). While I haven’t discussed it here, when looking for details in photos of nineteenth century vessels, they are often messy; I don’t understand the clutter of a working ship enough to model it, let alone the skill to model it. (I have never seen a doll house with laundry on the floor or dirty dishes or unmade beds…)

 

So I’m following the conventions of present day modeling as a rough guide to learning the skills needed to do this work. These issues will arise for me again regarding sails and crew later, items usually skipped by modelers. 
 

I have to admit, a bit green patina and a overspray of tint on the copper would hide my sins with copper so far!

Thank you @Roger Pellett for the suggestion and nice work on the.Royal Navy Longboat! 

Edited January 2, 2022 by EricWilliamMarshall

[EricWilliamMarshall]

News flash: I’m not fast at the copper!

[sjanicki]

This is looking very good!

[EricWilliamMarshall]

On 12/27/2021 at 9:46 AM, MrBlueJacket said:

Regarding CA glue, it has a shelf life of 6-12 months at room temperature. You will notice that it starts to take longer to set. While accelerator helps, I find it better to just get a new bottle. Unopened glue will last a long time in the freezer.

Thanks for sharing - this is information is useful to nearly everyone at MSW!!

[EricWilliamMarshall]

22 hours ago, sjanicki said:

This is looking very good!

Thank you! I'm still following your handy 8-step guide:

1. Apply all the plates butting against another vs. layered.  My skill wasn't great enough to layer them without it looking horrible.
2. Form each plate to the shape of the hull before trying to glue
3. Cut the plates that need to be cut to shape before applying
4. Apply the plates to the keel starting with the base.  
5. Apply to the side of the keel a single row.
6. Apply a single row of plates along the waterline all the way around.
7. Start in the center of the ship starting at the keel and tiling your way out with an overlap.
8. The bow section and stern are the most difficult and require cutting each tile exactly to shape.

[EricWilliamMarshall]

Little by little…

[EricWilliamMarshall]

Of possible interest to ship-making folks: I just finished an experiment regarding the fading of wood. I took a number different types of wood and coated one side with a finish, shellac in this case (via French polish) and kept them in a closed box once everything was stable, dry, etc. Fast forward 25 years to the time of Covid. I pulled out the wood samples and covered one half with painters tape and put in a window for about a year to see how much the wood would fade.

[EricWilliamMarshall]

Here are the results: one side with shellac, one side without (and pictures of the names of the wood).

Edited January 9, 2022 by EricWilliamMarshall

[EricWilliamMarshall]

Most of the color change happened of the summer. It doesn’t  take years for wood to fade, It take exposure to UV light. A more clever me would have taken a photo of the wood samples when put in the box years ago. The colors didn’t change noticeably over the years in the box. And while exposure to air may be a factor, the finished side would slow those reactions as compared to the unfinished side. I should mention they were flipped over half way through the summer, so both sides would receive similar light during the summer.

[EricWilliamMarshall]

I've used up all the copper plates (to my surprise) and have spent my dollars so some more will find its way from Maine to my secret lair.

(ok, it isn't a lair nor secret...)

[EricWilliamMarshall]

In the absence of new plates, I've started on other parts of the build. I debated putting in a second rail as per the older set of plans but it would interfere with pin racks of the current model so I backed down. As for work done, I filled in the gaps in the plywood visible in the gun ports (I couldn't tell if these are covered later via a casual search in the instructions) and painted the same. I added a moulding as well (which echoes the aforementioned rail) which you can see above the gun ports in this photo.
 

[EricWilliamMarshall]

Forgive the off-topic post - I just found out this week, I got an Honorable Mention https://www.ippawards.com/2021-winners-abstract/ for this abstract photo:

Edited February 8, 2022 by EricWilliamMarshall

[Hubac's Historian]

On 1/25/2022 at 8:58 PM, EricWilliamMarshall said:

I've used up all the copper plates (to my surprise) and have spent my dollars so some more will find its way from Maine to my secret lair.

(ok, it isn't a lair nor secret...)

M’WHAAHAHAHAHA (my evil secret lair laugh).

[Hubac's Historian]

Awesome pic!  I could tell you what I think it really is, but it’s more fun to imagine that it’s my boss’s stomach.

[BobG]

Congratulations on your photo, Eric! I swear, I'm just about to give up on 35mm photography and just shoot with my iPhone. It's just so convenient, compact and darn good! Now, tell us about your photo...what is it?

[Keith Black]

 Eric, congratulations. Yes, please provide details of your photograph. 

[EricWilliamMarshall]

As for the ship model. I cleared the holes for the gun’s rigging. I couldn’t fit my pin vise inside the ship but the gun ports served nicely. The instructions state a size #75 drill bit should be used but the holes are mostly nine sizes larger. I found, then cut as directed and blacked the rings that will fill the holes. I used Blackwood Casey’s brass black. This time I  exposed the rings briefly to the blackening liquid (10 second or so).