RRS Discovery 1901 by gak1965 - 1:72 - First Scratch Build

[gak1965]

Yikes, it's been about 3 weeks since I posted an update. Part of that time I was away, and part of it was working on the USS Kearsarge, but some real progress. First photo, all of the frames are fared, their elevations evened out, and glued in place. Large chunk of extra balsa from the Kearsarge in the background about to become part of the ship.

 

 

Second photo has the first of the filler blocks in place and (mostly) faired (final fairing needs all the fillers). It doesn't go to the top of the bulkhead at this moment because I'm trying to efficiently use the balsa block I have handy - I'll fill the rest in with leftover chunks.

 

 

I'm imaging 8 or 10 balsa fillers at the moment (between bulkheads 2-4 and  either 11 or 12 to 14. From 14 to the stern I'm going to make the filler blocks out of basswood, and for the prow to bulkhead 1, I'm going to make a basswood filler that includes the knightheads. 

 

The ship gets two sets of planking (as seen in the section below). The inner, thicker set where the planks average out to about 2mm (1/16 to 3/32") deep by 3mm about (1/8") tall at scale, although the actual thicknesses vary a bit, and an outer layer over about 2/3 of the hull that is about 1mm x 3mm at scale. The model will be pained, so, presumably I'll use basswood - it's cheap(er), it bends well, and it doesn't have to have beautiful color or grain. That said, can anyone recommend a wood source? The only sources I know of with small dimensional lumber are ModelExpo and BlueJacket. Do you all find one superior to the other? Is there someplace else people would suggest? Any input appreciated. I'm on the US East Coast if that matters.

 

 

As always, thanks for the likes and for looking in.

 

Regards,

George

 

 

 

 

 

[Roger Pellett]

Basswood strips are often stocked by craft stores like Michaels, Hobby Lobby, etc.  Basswood lumber is carried by some Big Box Home Improvement stores.

 

Roger

[gak1965]

1 hour ago, Roger Pellett said:

Basswood strips are often stocked by craft stores like Michaels, Hobby Lobby, etc.  Basswood lumber is carried by some Big Box Home Improvement stores.

 

My local hobby shop nominally carries a pretty wide selection of basswood strip (Midwest is their supplier), but their actual stock is a bit sketchier. I was there over the weekend to buy some glue, and I figured I'd get the 1/8" x 1/4" wood I'd need for the waterways, but they had none available. I generally try to buy from local sources (this place is a 3 location local chain in the DC area) to help keep them viable, or at least buy from specialist online retailers that support ship modelers for the same reason. Maybe they can order what I need for me.

[FriedClams]

Hello George,

 

Been reading through your log and you've selected an interesting subject and are off to a great start.

 

Here's a couple of on-line sources for scale basswood lumber.  They mainly serve the model RR hobby, so their offerings are in "O", "HO" and "S" scale, but they also carry limited fractional dimensional sizes as well.  Because you're working in 1:72 you'd have to do the conversion math to find what will work as a close substitution.  I planked my current hull with wood from Northeastern.  In my situation, because I'm working in 1:48, I converted their "O" scale sizes (1:43) to find a close match.  I purchased the planks for the hull in the thickness I wanted, but in a width that was wider than I needed.  I used a miniature plane to trim down each plank individually for width and taper.  I feel the Mt. Albert product may be a higher quality, but it all gets filed and sanded in the end.  

 

Mt Albert Scale Lumber

 

Mt. Albert Scale Lumber Information – Fast Tracks (handlaidtrack.com)

 

Northeastern Scale Lumber

 

O Scale Lumber - Products (northeasternscalelumber.com

 

Good luck on your first scratch build. Have fun.

 

Gary

[gak1965]

Well, @MrBlueJacket's adage that "putty and paint make it look what it ain't" seems to be starting to come true. I've put the four starboard side balsa inserts in and faired them. The aftmost is going to be made from basswood since it is going to define the stern's curve. At this point I need to go to the hobby shop and get some more balsa, that chunk didn't go quite as far as I expected. But starting to look like a ship.

 

 

Thanks for looking in!

 

Regards,

George

[Rick310]

Looking good George!!

Rick

[gak1965]

 

On 3/15/2024 at 4:21 PM, Rick310 said:

Looking good George!!

Rick

 

Thanks Rick! Moving along slowly though...

 

The ship as she appears now:

 

 

The bow filler blocks are in place, as are the stern blocks with the exception of the starboard side block after frame 14. The last two blocks that shape the stern were made from a 2"x3" piece of basswood that I bought at the local hobby shop. It is the hardest piece of bass I have ever seen. My saber saw could barely cut the blank out. I wore out three sanding drums on my Dremel getting it to shape, plus an entire sheet of 100 grit sandpaper. It was so hard, the sanding drum was sometimes burning rather than sanding. I'm frankly wondering if they were making a joke and gave me a chunk of hard maple labelled as bass. 

 

I also build out the knightheads and installed them on the bow. They were made from a couple of pieces of spare bass I had from another project and they trimmed much more easily. They are too high right now - once I have the planks that define the forecastle, I'll trim them down to size.

 

Either way, 1 more chunk, some finishing sanding, and it's time for the waterways, which, at least I have a plan for.

 

Thanks for looking in!

 

Regards,

George

 

[PvG Aussie]

George, you might even inspire me to scratch build my next one! Yours looks great. 

[KeithAug]

On 4/7/2024 at 5:14 AM, gak1965 said:

It is the hardest piece of bass I have ever seen.

That's the problem with natural products - they tend to be quite variable. It seemed to workout quite well.

[gak1965]

On 4/7/2024 at 1:59 AM, PvG Aussie said:

George, you might even inspire me to scratch build my next one! Yours looks great. 

Thanks Peter. It has a long way to go, but there is definitely something fun about designing it yourself. In my case, it probably means I'll do a lot of stupid things, but hey, we learn through our mistakes.

 

On 4/9/2024 at 2:47 PM, KeithAug said:

That's the problem with natural products - they tend to be quite variable. It seemed to workout quite well.

Isn't that the truth. The bass knightheads were way softer. The good news is that the stern is going nowhere; it will be a nice solid platform to build on.

 

On the update side, I haven't had a ton of time to work on the ship - there have been some things at work and my wife and I have been doing a major declutter associated with our 15 year anniversary at this home, and based on the fact that I'm pretty confident that we are truly, truly empty nesters (the younger child is going to be leaving her job in Boston to start graduate school in nursing in Philadelphia at the end of the summer, so I am not anticipating her moving back in anytime soon). As part of that, I'm moving my work space into a different location, so we can better use the rec room that I currently work in, etc., etc. However, the move is more or less complete, so back to making sawdust.

 

I did finally finish the filler blocks, so she is ready to start the process that will generate the hull. I've designed her more or less as the Flying Fish kit I built was designed. On the Fish, I laid the waterways on the bulkhead tops flush with the outer edges of the bulkheads, and then the planksheer (cut for the bulwark stanchions) was laid on top of that. The nibbing strake was flush with the waterways and on top of the bulkhead, and the deck laid directly on the bulkheads. This ship is designed slightly different. If you look at the below

 

you will see that the planksheer is kind of integrated into the planking itself, and in addition to the waterway (angled plank), there is a fairly significant timber that is mounted against the frames. As it happens, at 1:72 that timber, plus the extension into the frames works out to 1/4 wide and 1/8 inch tall, a nice, even size that is readily available in bass. So, my plan is as follows:

 

 

I will build the timber that abuts the waterway and the extensions to the outer edge of the frames from a piece of 1/4 x 1/8 bass, cut to allow a bulwark stanchion to fit (they are spaced about 0.7 inches at scale center to center between the stanchions). This is the blue box on the diagram and it will be aligned with the outside edge of the bulkheads. I will run it for about 22 inches, until the curve becomes too great to efficiently bend, and then will cut out the stern curve with my scroll saw from some 1/8 inch thick basswood. The two layers of planking (red and green) will be added as normal and then a 1/32 inch piece of square bass (purple) will be added on top. Finally I'll make the bulwark stanchions (yellow) out of 3/32 bass and fit them into the slices I cut out of the large 1/8 by 1/4 x 22 piece.

 

One thing that I will need to be careful about is ensuring that the bulwarks have the correct angle, because the ship 

 

I think that will work, and produce something that resembles the real thing as below:

 

Photo by Michael Garlick, retrieved from Wikimedia Commons (https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:RRS_Discovery_Dundee_Main_mast_rigging.JPG) under license CC-BY-SA-4.0)

 

One thing to note is that the Discovery in common with a lot of other ships of that era has "floating" bulwark extensions, that is, they were separate timbers that were not extensions of the frames. Since the bulwarks tended to rot faster, it was simpler to seal and maintain them if all you needed to do was pull a single timber out and not have to mess with the frames. That will not be obvious from the model, but it is the way that the ship was built.

 

Also interestingly, I had assumed that the extension that I am modeling as the 1/32 square plank was where the white stripe was painted, but looking more carefully, the stripe is actually painted just below that plank, and it points to something I need to be careful about - the angle of the bulwarks. If you look at the photo below, you will see that the ship doesn't really have channels where the chain plates are, so making sure I have adequate clearance to drill the holes for the chainplates is going to be important.

 

Photo by Magnus Hagdorn, retrieved from Wikimedia Commons (https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/55/2007_-_Trip_to_Dundee_(4000147227).jpg/1024px-2007_-_Trip_to_Dundee_(4000147227).jpg) under license CC-BY-SA-2.0 generic)

 

Anyways, as always, thanks for looking in! Please let me know if I have mangled the terminology somewhere.

 

Regards,

George

[KeithAug]

On 4/25/2024 at 5:32 AM, gak1965 said:

that era has "floating" bulwark extensions, that is, they were separate timbers that were not extensions of the frames.

Interesting - I learn something new every day. 
 

On 4/25/2024 at 5:32 AM, gak1965 said:

so I am not anticipating her moving back in anytime soon)

Ours flew the nest 22 years ago but that is when we first realised we have bred a homing pigeon.  She says her plan is to be my financial burden forever.

[gak1965]

Brief update. Followed the plan described above. I took two pieces of 1/4 by 1/8 bass, taped them together so that the two pieces would be identical, and marked off the 3/32" squares, about 0.7 inches apart, and then started cutting out the 3/32" slots.

 

 

Here are the two pieces ready to start installing.

 

 

 

I soaked them in boiling water to get them to soften for improved bending, and put them on the ship, held in the correct orientation with some clamps and nails to 'prebend' prior to installation.

 

 

Once dry, they were installed, I glued them into place. Other than some minor smoothing of some of the bulkheads. I can start planking once the lumber arrives.

 

 

Thanks for looking in!

 

Regards,

George

[Rick310]

George,  nicely done!!  How did you cut out the slots?  They look remarkably consistent.

Rick

[gak1965]

11 minutes ago, Rick310 said:

George,  nicely done!!  How did you cut out the slots?  They look remarkably consistent.

Rick

Thanks Rick! Scroll saw. But I didn't turn the wood, just made a series of cuts in the same direction, starting with the two outer edges. It's only 3/32 inch deep so it's a little easier to stay straight, and I made sure to photograph them from far enough away to hide all of the imperfections 😀

 

Regards,

George 

[Rick310]

Thanks George,

They look great!!!

Rick

[gak1965]

A brief update, as I haven't had as much time as I would like to work on the ship. However, some progress.

 

First, I needed to continue whatever that timber represented by the 1/8 by 1/4 inch bass section is (it's not the waterway, which is 1 timber in, anyone has the right name please let me know) around the stern. To do that I cut a (sorta) semicircle (arc?) out of some 1/4 inch thick bass sheet that I had from another project, and notched it for the bulwark stanchions. As depicted in the plans, the stanchions appear to be closer around the stem - not too surprising since they maintain the shape of the bulwarks there. Here is a picture:

 

 

That was then installed on the stem, and the stem evened so that the curve of the above piece and the stem matched:

 

 

And the first planks have been added to the ship:

 

 

I put a couple of pieces of 1/8 thick bass in the forecastle (hidden behind the first strake to give me a reference point to align the strake, but I'm not doing anything special inside the forecastle because it was closed off on the real ship. No sense modeling things no one will ever see.

 

Anyways, thanks for looking in!

 

Regards,

George

 

[KeithAug]

Good to see the planks going on George.  I will enjoy following the "plankers" progress. 🙂

 

[gak1965]

I'm off to the annual American Society of Clinical Oncology meeting in Chicago for the next few days, so no updates for a bit. The "plankers progress" continues. Here she is port and starboard...

 

 

 

A ways to go, and then a second planking. The second isn't for aesthetics, the ship had an extra layer of planks over the part of the hull that contacted the ice, but it will still be thinner like an aesthetic double planking.

 

You can see this on this small portion of a photo from Google Maps (source is named Open Virtual Worlds).

 

 

I find it interesting that it needs stealers, although I suppose I shouldn't be. I also note that while the primary planking aligns into the rabbet near the stern, the second layer does not, and that's good, because I didn't cut the rabbet to handle two layers of planks.

 

Anyway, thanks for looking in and hopefully an update in a week or 10 days.

 

Regards,

George 

Edited June 1 by gak1965

[gak1965]

Well, it's been a crazy couple of weeks, what with my travel, then my wife taking a trip, and for the last 10 days I've been playing nurse as my wife recovers from a procedure. She's fine, but is on crutches and as a result can't really do much around the house, so... Anyways, the inner planking is done. Here she is before putty and sanding:

 

 

 

And with the first pass of putty and sanding.

 

 

Obviously, I have more sanding to do, and some gaps to fill, but not looking too bad. Here is the ship from the bow and stern.

 

 

 

Again, needs sanding but starting to look like a ship.

 

Once the surface is in good shape, I can proceed to do the second planking. I need to order the wood for that, so probably a couple of weeks away still, and then I can build up the bulwarks and start thinking about putting some paint on. I am going to paint the whole hull. I didn't order the wood yet because I wanted to see how accurate my estimate for the main layer was. Answer was that it was a little under, so now I have a good correction factor for the second layer. 

 

In any case, thanks for looking in and the likes!

 

Regards,

George

 

[Jared]

It's progressing very nicely.  Best regards.

[Rick310]

She’s coming along!

Rick

[gak1965]

Not an update per se, but as part of a restoration, a group sponsored by Dundee Heritage (which manages the ship) had a high resolution 3D model of Discovery built. It's not particularly useful to me, as it is of the ship today (it was made by scanning the current ship), rather than as she was in 1901, and there have been a lot of changes (the masts moved, 5 yards/mast now vs. 4 in 1901, most of the deckhouses changed, etc.). Still, pretty cool, and really useful for anyone that wanted to build the Discovery of 2024. I don't know what they are doing about getting the maps, but you can see a video that they put together here: 

 

 

Regards,

George

[B-Ram]

Hello George,

 

I just found your build thread. You are doing a great job on your work. I enjoy seeing the early expedition ships. I will be following along with great interest.

 

Bill

[Kevin-the-lubber]

It'd be great if the made the mesh freely available, I'd snap that up in a heartbeat.

 

Ironically, I used to stay with friends near Dundee a lot up until 20 years back, but had no interest in ships or model-making back then. 

[KeithAug]

On 7/7/2024 at 4:18 AM, gak1965 said:

you can see a video that they put together here: 

That should inspire someone to have a go George. Thank you for posting.

[KeithAug]

1 hour ago, Kevin-the-lubber said:

near Dundee a lot up until 20 years back

Kevin - I lived near Dundee 20 years ago, but now live in West Sussex (Wisborough Green) . Are you stalking me? 🙂

[Kevin-the-lubber]

11 minutes ago, KeithAug said:

Are you stalking me? 

Wisborough Green eh.... luckily for you, beyond telescope distance 🙂. Haywards Heath here.

 

[gak1965]

On 8/14/2024 at 12:43 PM, B-Ram said:

 

I just found your build thread. You are doing a great job on your work. I enjoy seeing the early expedition ships. I will be following along with great interest.

Thanks Bill. I find them to be interesting subjects as well, and Discovery seems to have been overshadowed by Endurance.

 

On 8/14/2024 at 2:44 PM, Kevin-the-lubber said:

On 8/14/2024 at 2:29 PM, KeithAug said:

Are you stalking me? 

Wisborough Green eh.... luckily for you, beyond telescope distance 🙂. Haywards Heath

 

You gentlemen have now improved my geographical knowledge of Southern England by at least 2X, just by looking up the locations you reference!

 

On to an update +which has been a while coming). The wood arrived for the next couple of steps. As I've mentioned, the Discovery has a double hull over portions of the ship. You can see it on this photo of the plans.

 

 

The exact point where the double hull ends varies by frame (which makes these cross sections very useful), with the bow covered from sheer strake to keel (sensible since it has to break ice) but the stern only covered as far as the bottom of the prop shaft as seen here:

 

 

I'm working on where to put the exact line for the bottom of the double hull, as the drawings and this photo seem a bit in contention, but we'll resolve.

 

In the meantime I've started to put the upper strakes on:

 

 

 

And to get the part of the ship that won't be double bulled to a decent finish.

 

 

Once the double hull is in place, I will be adding a 1/16 square piece of wood to the top of the upper strakes, which will replicate the shape of the actual ship at that location.

 

Then it will be the bulwarks. As you can see from this top photo, the planksheer has holes precut to accept 1/16" stanchions. The sections will drive the ange that they are inserted, and I have some thin (1/32") wood to make the bulwarks from.

 

 

As always thanks for the encouragement and for looking in.

 

Regards,

George

 

PS: @Kevin-the-lubber and @KeithAug, I will be in your part of the world in December. The admiral and I are taking the QM2 from Southampton to New York for our 60th birthdays.

[Ian_Grant]

Speaking of overlooked polar ships, what of "Fram"?  I have fond memories of seeing her, and the viking ships, when in Oslo.

[Rick310]

She is really looking good George!  You’re doing a great!!

Rick