tkay11

Great progress. There are lots of really great hints on most aspects of model making at the late Hubert Sicard's site called Ship Modelling for Dummies, which you can find at http://www.shipmodeling.ca/aaplandusite.html The site has a great number of videos as well as detailed hints and tips, mostly using jigs you can make yourself at extremely low cost. It costs USD40 for a lifetime's access, but is really worth it. I thought of this site since tapering masts using a drill is one of his specialities. Tony

The DS115 saw Mark refers to is now the DS 230/E. For those in Europe, you can buy it from SAT Berlin for €99.98, or £81.70. See http://www.satberlin.de/en/PROXXON-machines/Table-top-tools/PROXXON-Scroll-saw-DS-230/E-NO-27088. Tony

As you say, it'll be painted over, so no need to worry. Just another learning experience. And don't worry too much about the rabbet as it's not so hard to line the planks up -- as you say. Lots of modellers use filler if they don't line up. Again, as it'll be painted there should be no worry. You might want to consider putting filler blocks between the bulkheads, especially at stem and stern. That would make the process of planking and fairing much easier. I used balsa, but next time I'll use something firmer such as pine or basswood/linden/lime. Tony

Wonderful to see another Rochefort started. I too have the plans but won't be starting till I've finished my cutter. I'm looking forward to following your log -- no doubt it'll save me from making a lot of mistakes! You've made a great start. Tony

I am travelling at the moment and on very dodgy connections, so cannot access my usual resources, but I remember a lengthy discussion about this on MSW1. At that time mention was made of the practice off frapping the ropes round the gun tackles, except on the occasions in the Navy when inspections were carried out. On those occasions the ropes were laid in coils on the deck. I don't think anyone has mentioned this idea on this thread so far, so thought I'd bring it up. It's what I decided to do (in a very clumsy way) on my Sherbourne model. Tony

Agreed. Very nice indeed. Sails maketh the ship. Tony

Thanks, Frankie. Sounds good. I'm at the airport now, so I'll look at this in more detail once I've arrived tomorrow and if I have a good connection. Tony

Thanks, John. That's quite reasonable, and the description was clear about terminating the sheet by frapping and hitching. I'm presume that would make adjustments to the blocks faster as well as not leaving more ends crossing the deck. Steel isn't here to argue and in the absence of reprimands about historical truth, so I think I'll go with the simple and straightforward solution with the two blocks as you suggest. Tony

Thanks, John. A lovely illustration. That's exactly how I would have done it if the description by Steel were just to the two blocks, and I agree it is the most likely and obvious solution. What threw me was the description by Steel of the to'ing and fro'ing "alternately, between the strap of the block and the seizing or dead-eye; then through the thimble at the clue" I really couldn't make head or tail of that. I also love your description -- it really gives life to the whole concept! Tony

After the tremendous help I received regarding the nature of the horse for the foresail, I find I have a further quandary. How to attach the foresail to the rail. I find the description given by Steel to be very confusing. He says: "Sheets reeve through a block made fast to the horse with a thimble, or, in some sloops, a dead-eye iron bound, and through a block at the clue, and so on, alternately, between the strap of the block and the seizing or dead-eye; then through the thimble at the clue, till the whole sheet is expended; then frapped together and hitched." I really cannot envisage this. It seems to say that the sheet is bound to the clue, then directly to a block at the horse, then to a block also attached to the clue, then to the seizing or dead-eye, then to the strap of the block at the clue then (after going back and forth 'between the strap of the block and the seizing or dead-eye') through the thimble at the clue and, when the rope is spent, frapped and hitched to the layers of rope so formed. I can't find a picture showing this, apart from a very indistinct picture from Cole's build of the Alert. I'd therefore be very grateful if someone could explain how the foresail is attached to the horse rail in this manner, especially if they could provide a drawing, illustration or picture. Just in case people reply after tomorrow afternoon, I'll be on a three-week trip starting mid-day Thursday 10th, and so may be unable to reply until I can find suitable wi-fi connections wherever I'll be staying. Thanks in advance Tony

Just to add to the advice of others, I have used PVA for the vast majority of the build. CA is really not advised in general, but there have been many times when it has come in very useful. Thus for making very quick jigs with wood, and stiffening the ends of ropes before threading it really is useful to have a bottle of CA handy. Also, and please don't tell anyone on this forum, I have, yes I have, used CA a bit when stropping blocks. But I've sworn to give up the habit -- 'onest, guv! (It's only 'cos I's a learner, after all). Finally fast-drying epoxy has been truly indispensable for a number of tricky jobs that require a fairly quick but very strong bond -- e.g. fastenings such as eyebolts into wood by brass eyebolts or other metal fastenings. So it's worth having a set of tubes of that handy. Then you'll very probably come across times when you curse the fact that you've stuck something together only to find it was a mistake or you need to go back. Isopropanol is great for PVA and you can buy 250ml off eBay for very low prices. Then for CA acetone is very handy -- especially if you have some stuck to your fingers (also very cheap on eBay). Finally, I use methylated spirit for cleaning off epoxy. Of course, when using PVA I nearly always have a damp sponge cloth or toilet roll nearby to wipe away immediate smears or to clean fingers. Considering the application of glue, I have mostly used matchsticks sharpened to a fine point to put dabs on small surfaces, and cheap paintbrushes to put diluted PVA on rigging. Some use syringes for PVA but I haven't found the need so far. Tony

Thanks, Kester. Now I'll have to make my mind up. It's like having too many goodies on the table. Tony

Nice thoughts, Frankie. Thanks! Tony

Oh dear. Shame on me. I forgot to look at Gregor's Sherbourne. He has the horse very neatly laid out at http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/2288-hmc-sherbourne-by-gregor-–-caldercraft-–-scale-164-1763/?p=186350. I had totally forgotten. He also has the same reference to Roger Cole's build of the Alert. Sorry, Gregor! And that was only two years ago. Memory clearly failing. Tony

That's perfect, Chuck. Thanks a lot! Those plans are absolutely perfect for me. I should have thought of looking at plans. I'm really glad I didn't go with the short version I had initially thought of. Interestingly, after further research, I came across the following photo on http://www.shipmodel.com/models/diligence-full-hull-nav-: Then I found Roger Cole's build of the Alert with the following picture: Both of these show rails similar to the ones in the plans you linked me to. As to my statement that I'd see the rail across bulwarks, I really can't remember where that was so I presume I remembered incorrectly. Tony

I want to place a horse rail for the sheet of the foresail on the Sherbourne (English Revenue Cutter 1763). I have seen pictures of rails that run right across the deck along the top of the bulwarks, but it seems from a look at Steel's and Marquardt's books that the horse would lie quite close to the deck just in front of the mast. Unfortunately none of the models of cutters I have seen in the museums have such a horse, even though all the sources refer to one. Goodwin's AOTS book on the Alert doesn't show one either, although there is a tantalising reference in one drawing of the rigging which shows the sheet tackle disappearing from sight on to the deck with the caption 'secured to horse'. In fact the only one I recall seeing on a model is Kester's (Stockholm Tar) build of the Sherbourne. There he placed the rail across the fore gratings but I recall he was uncertain himself at the time of how exactly he should place it. My question is how wide across the deck should the horse rail go? My initial thought was to make it the same width as the one for the mainsail at the taffrail, but when I placed it on the deck it looked a little short at just under 4 ft (45 inches) full size on a deck whose width is nearly 19 ft. The other thing, of course is the height. I've thought 15 inches would be ok, but again am more than willing to hear from the experts. Any advice or wisdom will be gratefully received as usual. Tony

That's odd. I was wondering exactly the same thing yesterday. Tony

Thanks, Peter. I had been following your log up till mid-January with great interest, as I was intrigued by the Pickle following a BBC television programme about the replica and her type of ship. The discussion about the accuracy and plans on your log is fascinating. So I was delighted by your reminder as it made me go back to see what you did with the sails. I must admit that the look of the cotton is (to my eyes) still preferable, so I'll probably try cloth next time round. I do have some fine 0.4mm thick 22gsm silk pongee cloth I bought just in case -- when I was still trying to decide. It's thinner than the Modelspan, so probably would be ideal. I just didn't have the courage to ask my wife for a tutorial on her sewing machine and was intrigued by the idea of doing it with Modelspan. You can see the congee on Amazon UK at http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B006FHMGMC/ref=pe_385721_37038051_TE_3p_dp_1. It's great stuff. I take the idea about being becalmed. Even more likely when not floating in water. I've now added my name to your list of followers to make sure I keep up to date. Onwards! Tony

Thanks, Per. That's what my wife said. In fact it was her question at the very beginning of the build ('Is it going to have sails then?') that made me think about whether I'd be able to do so. I started by thinking I'd follow George Bandurek's build with some sails furled, but I really wanted to see how a full mainsail looked in the flesh, so to speak. Tony

That's incredibly generous of you, Dirk, given the rough finish (as usual)! But I'll still bask in the pleasure of appreciation! Tony

For the rigging I followed Petersson's book of Rigging Period Fore and Aft Craft and the AOTS book on the Cutter Alert as well as Marquardt and Steel in the references given above. The boom was prepared first by fixing the tackle for the main sheet with its pulleys and cleat. The sail was then bent to the gaff using running lacing, and to the hoops on the mast. The peak halliard, throat halliard and topping lift were then rigged as shown in the photos below. The only point of interest is that some may worry about the placing of the hook for the fall of the tackle of the peak halliard since Petersson does not show where it is fixed. Steel places it on the starboard channel at the rear, so I followed his very good advice. You'll note that some of the previous rigging is now a little less taut. This is simply because with all the hauling of the peak halliard, the throat halliard and the topping lift the mast was pulled back a bit. All will be readjusted, as will the ends of the ropes round their various belaying points much later in the build. The next phase will be the cross-jack and topgallant sails, followed by the foresail and jib. Then, down the line, the anchors and the swivel guns. Tony

MAKING SAILS The first stage in this process was to study Steel’s Elements and Practice of Rigging, along with Marquardt’s book on 18th Century Rigs and Rigging so that I could understand the structure and making of the various sails. I then used the drawings in Steel to start with the mainsail. This may be the most complex sail to make for the Sherbourne because of its shape and the curved reinforcing bands that have to be fixed. However I thought it would make sense to start at the mainsail and work forwards because if I were to do it the other way I thought I’d be caught in a tangle of rigging whilst trying to attach the mainsail to the mast. I also decided that none of the sails would be furled, and that I’d be unlikely to shape them as though being filled by the wind. It will therefore be a ship that is not sailing, out of the water, and with a full set of sails waiting for a heavenly breeze to transport it to Elysium. The reason for this choice is very simple: as a novice builder I want to build my basic skill set and have a rounded understanding of the various parts of the ship and of the functions of the various bits of rigging. As a person who knows nothing about sailing, it’s all just part of the learning process. I followed Blue Ensign’s guides to sail-making in his log on this site of the Superbe build, as well as David Anscherl’s guide in Volume IV of his Fully Framed Model. This involves the use of Modelspan rather than cotton sheet. Modelspan is a paper that is very resistant to tearing even when wet, and comes in thicknesses that are very close to the scale thickness of a sail at 1:64. I decided that I would try this out first, and only if the result were unsatisfactory would I then have a bash at making the sails from cotton sheet. The first stage is to make a frame to hold the Modelspan. Blue Ensign used a cut out cardboard box, but I went Antscherl’s way and made a frame out of scrap pine. The sequence is shown in the following pictures First, the basic frame. Now the basic frame with its insert. Here, the wet modelspan is already fastened to the frame by gummed paper strips. Immediately after wetting, the insert is removed from the frame and the modelspan allowed to dry. Very quickly it shrinks to drum tightness as can be seen in the following photo (which shows the modelspan already painted with a wash made of diluted acrylic paint (a mix of unbleached titanium white, yellow oxide and burnt ochre). As advised by Antscherl, I used a drawing pen set to 0.6mm thickness to draw the seams using the same paint mix. I then cut out the reinforcing bands by using a flexible curve set on a drawing of the sail I had created in TurboCad. I traced very gently with a soft pencil around the curve onto the sail for the upper and lower edges of each band The bands were then fixed to the sail using dilute acrylic matt medium (again, following Antscherl). You can see a trial run of this method in the following photo: The next photo shows the bolt rope (0.35mm thread) fixed with the matt medium round the edges of the sail, along with the cringles made whilst fixing the rope. I then attached the reef points and drilled holes for the grommets. After this was done, I cut the sail from the frame with a scalpel. One deviation from both Blue Ensign and Antscherl is that I have placed the reinforcements on both sides of the mainsail as it proved not transparent enough. I thought nobody would ever notice since it is hard to look at both sides of the sail simultaneously. The attachment of the sail is covered in the next post. Tony

You should have with the sander a clamp with a screw. This fits into a slot on the underside of the sander and clamps it to a bench or table top. Tony

I modified my basic Proxxon drill and the basic drill press (together with an x-y table) to act as a mill. You can see how at http://modelshipworld.com/index.php?/topic/4539-how-to-modify-proxxon-mb-140-drill-stand-to-act-as-mill/?p=130660 It works quite well for me. As I have only worked with wood so far, it seems the sideways forces on the drill are not too much. The only thing is that although the height adjustment (z axis) has about 0.1mm accuracy (each division on the knob is 0.1mm), I find it better to use a template or a measuring device for really accurate height adjustment. In that posting, I said I'd make a block from Perspex, but although I did buy a block, I'm still using the wood one as it works so well. Also, although I did experiment with removing the depth stop and adding a ball race to make the action extra smooth, in fact I have left the depth stop in and it still works well with the screw from the wood block resting on top of the depth stop screw directly. By the way, the 'bamboo plug.jpg' in the posting is reference to a photo of a plug that I had put in the hole left by the depth screw. Since I no longer use that, it's redundant. The Proxxon MF 70 is probably the one to go for if you stick to wood, and it really is a very popular wood mill with modellers all over Europe who produce superb results. I'll probably get one as soon as I'm into serious milling as it is the only dedicated mill that I know of that has speeds up to 20,000 rpm. I had considered the mills that will handle metal as well, but some complain that the speeds of these machines are too low for satisfactory milling in wood (most only reach 2,000 rpm). Despite this concern with speed, there are a very large number of modellers on this forum and on others who use the standard metal mills and produce wonderful work without any apparent problem. I presume they just use slower feed rates for a decent cut. Some of the French modellers do swear by the heavier duty mill/drill system BFW 40/E which can go up to 6,000 rpm (I'm still thinking about that in preference to the MF 70), and there are some mills such as the Sherline which have accessories to increase their speeds to 10,000 rpm -- but of course all these are far more expensive and perhaps still a bit slow for the very small milling cutters that are used in small scale ship modelling (i.e. 0.6mm). One last comment about my drill stand. Although the head rotates, it is very easy to adjust it to a perfect 90 degree vertical when measured from side to side (use a set square to do so). However there is about 0.5 degrees deviation from the vertical front to back which can't be adjusted. For the depths to which I drill, that deviation is of course not noticeable, but it's worth mentioning or looking out for if you're a fanatic. Tony

Sorry, Greg, to be a curmudgeon and to divert from Chuck's wonderful build on this log, but I'd like to throw in an alternative view. I know lots of people aged 15 upwards who devote their lives to improving their skills so as to achieve as perfect a result as they can (even if it's only to pass the endless exams that will take them to the next step). I certainly would include artists, musicians, engineers, a variety of scientists, amongst the many I know and have known who are like this. In the computing world they are often known as 'nerds' or 'geeks', in the musical world endless practice is regarded as the norm. I don't know on what evidence the 'most' applies to the quoted statement except insofar as model ship building is not a mainstream hobby or profession. We have thousands of members as do the groups in other countries, and there are probably others who make ship models with various degrees of skill, attentiveness and interest; and it may well be that the majority are over 40. Of course there are people old and young who are not going to be interested in ship model making with the degree of obsession, compulsion or mania that others may have. On this forum I have seen examples of the full range, and oft a time have I seen the comment that this hobby is for pleasure, not a competition, does not have a time scale, and is to match the skills and exactly those different degrees of obsession held by each one of us as individuals. 'Instant gratification' is hard to define. I have 'instant gratification' the moment I have found a way through a problem. Others have it for their own different reasons. Making love may well be included in the list. As for 'good enough', I have seen that phrase used many times on this forum, as in not bothering to fully frame a model because it won't be seen when the planking is on, or simply because no attempt at replication will ever be successful because it is not exactly the same as the real thing. I have also heard that phrase used by some people in commenting about their love-making. A final aspect is that many young people face enormous pressures in their lives just to make ends meet -- most especially if they have young families to look after. They quite often will be working 12 or more hours a day. I was chatting to a call centre person the other day during a query about my phone account, and she told me she was at the end of a 12 hour shift at 7pm, and was going on to do her other job. To find the time to do something as demanding of concentration as ship modelling after that and before having some kind of mindless break from the pressure might well be a demand too much. Note how many people on this forum have come back to modelling after breaking it off in their teens. I presume they broke it off not because of a sudden failure of their dedication to perfection. In short, I am definitely highly respectful of the skills many on this forum have, and I learn a lot from them, but I'm wary of statements that could be taken to be elitist even though I know that intention was not there in making the statement and was made only as a kind of compliment in response to Chuck's obviously wonderful skills. Chuck, I do apologise, and if you think this comment has no place on your log, I'll be happy to delete it or ask to have it moved to another topic. Tony