priming hull

[helge]

hello,has annyone used or have expirence with using automotive filler/primer on the hull before painting? 

 

rgds Helge,norway

[lmagna]

Many times back in my RC days. Works fine.

[helge]

Hello, Yes is wood, I know,just want to it tobe a smoot and slick surfase, 1700-1850, they used tar I belive. My friend family have and old boat from that time, ( restored) and they used tar. (boild tar)

[Bob Cleek]

49 minutes ago, helge said:

Hello, Yes is wood, I know,just want to it tobe a smoot and slick surfase, 1700-1850, they used tar I belive. My friend family have and old boat from that time, ( restored) and they used tar. (boild tar)

I would suggest that you seal the bare wood with shellac. Let the shellac soak in as much as possible on the first coat. Additional coats shouldn't be necessary if the initial coat is applied thin enough to soak into the bare wood. The dried shellac can then be sanded easily to a very smooth surface. If you sand through the initial shellac coat to bare wood, apply more shellac to the bare spots. (Or add another coat of shellac to the entire piece.)

 

If your wood has significant defects, (nicks, dings, etc.,) apply a filler coating or putty over the shellac. The filler coating used will depend on the degree of filling that's needed. For minor imperfections, a few coats of "sanding undercoat," paint formulated with chalk added which will sand easily, may be all you need. If there are imperfections that aren't filled by a coat or two of the thick undercoat, a surfacing putty will be required. (Sometimes called "glazing putty," although it should not be confused with putty used on window glass.)

 

After final sanding to a perfectly smooth surface, paint of any type (oil or water based) can be applied directly to the surface. If you are using black or very dark brown paint to represent a tarred hull, you shouldn't require any undercoat or base coat.

 

Once upon a time, "paint was paint" and the compatibility of coatings was not much of an issue. Today, while shellac is a suitable wood sealer that's compatible with most any finish coating, there are many "coating systems" which aren't compatible with coatings of other systems. (Often water-based acrylic paints won't do well applied over oil-based enamels, etc.) You should carefully check the manufacturer's recommendations before applying different brands and types of coatings on top of one another. Running a "test patch" on a piece of scrap wood replicating the entire paint job you envision and using the same paints you intend to use on the model is always advisable. If there is a problem, one need only toss the test piece in the trash and try another approach. One the paint is on the model, if there's a problem (such as a failure to "dry") removing it is often a huge task.

[BobG]

On 2/6/2020 at 2:42 PM, Bob Cleek said:

If your wood has significant defects, (nicks, dings, etc.,) apply a filler coating or putty over the shellac. The filler coating used will depend on the degree of filling that's needed. For minor imperfections, a few coats of "sanding undercoat," paint formulated with chalk added which will sand easily, may be all you need. If there are imperfections that aren't filled by a coat or two of the thick undercoat, a surfacing putty will be required. (Sometimes called "glazing putty," although it should not be confused with putty used on window glass.)

After achieving a nice, smooth finish by sanding I have been applying Satin Wipe-on-Poly to seal the bare wood which can then be left natural or painted over with acrylics. I've also been using Elmer's Wood Filler for small nicks and cracks and that seems to work pretty well also and, if the imperfections are a bit deeper, I apply the filler is small layers allowing each layer to dry before adding another. I like the Elmer's Wood Filler that changes color from lavender to yellowish-white when it has dried. It sands nicely.

 

This method has worked for me so far. My question is, is it best to apply sealer or something like Wipe-on-Poly be over the wood filler before painting or is it ok just to paint directly over the bare filler?

 

Bob

 

 

[Bob Cleek]

1 hour ago, BobG said:

My question is, is it best to apply sealer or something like Wipe-on-Poly be over the wood filler before painting or is it ok just to paint directly over the bare filler?

 

Priming filled surfaces is always recommended unless one is using a "filler stain" or sanding base coat that is specifically formulated to be used beneath a specific finish coating. (Some manufacturers will produce a compatible "system" for filling and finishing.)  I always apply sealer (shellac,) to sanded bare wood. Shellac seals the wood well from moisture and inhibits movement with humidity changes. Only then do I apply sanding under coat and/or surfacing putty, then sand and tack, and, if any fillers have been used in addition to the sanding base coat, again apply a coat of sanding base coat, sand, and tack, and only then apply my build up of finish coats. Gloss paint has little or no application in modeling. (It's not to scale.) Generally, an "eggshell," "satin," or flat finish is desired, so applying a base coat over anything like undercoat or surfacing putty (AKA "fairing compound") isn't as critical in modeling as when applying a high gloss finish to something like a yacht's topsides, but that said, the "fillers" are all basically chalk dust added to a carrier to produce varying consistencies between "cream" and "peanut butter," and that chalk will soak up the finish coats differently than the surrounding primer coating when it's all sanded, depending on the micro-textures of the differing products. That difference will often be glaringly revealed once the finish coats are applied, on a gloss finish particularly, by "dull" spots wherever there has been un-primed filler remaining after sanding fair. Painting over the filler ("priming it") with sanding undercoat and lightly sanding fair and tacking before applying the finish coats ensures the final finish, be it gloss (especially) or satin or flat (less so,) will be uniform. This is more of a problem with gloss finish coats, which can end up with dull spots wherever un-primed filler material is present. 

 

If one is finishing wood "bright" (clear,) especially with the fine grained woods usually used in modeling, there shouldn't be any need for "filling" or "fairing" the surface. A sanding of the bare wood down to around 220 or 320 grit should yield a surface which needs no grain filling or fairing before sealing with shellac. The shellacked surface can then be further sanded (lightly, without removing the shellac sealer down to bare wood again) to 400, or rubbed with fine steel wool, and the clear finish coats applied directly over that. 

 

As always with all of the synthetic coatings on the market these days, it pays to do a test on a bit of scrap wood to make sure the various coatings and fillers used are compatible. Some incompatibilities produce some pretty horrendous results that are difficult and time consuming to correct.

Edited February 8, 2020 by Bob Cleek

[BobG]

Thanks, Bob, for this great information. 

 

Will Wipe-on-Poly essentially do a similar job of sealing as the shellac you talk about? I'm not sure how they are different in what they do. Can you give me an example of the shellac and sanding sealers that you find useful?

 

Also, in regards to gloss finishes, racing sailboats would have a high gloss finish on their hulls wouldn't they? I ask because I have a Pen Duick kit that I will build at some point and I thought the hull would be a gloss finish.

 

Bob

 

 

[Bob Cleek]

10 hours ago, BobG said:

Will Wipe-on-Poly essentially do a similar job of sealing as the shellac you talk about? I'm not sure how they are different in what they do. Can you give me an example of the shellac and sanding sealers that you find useful?

I don't use sanding sealers. I use shellac as a sealer and sanding base coat for covering imperfections, although those should be rare on a model. Many people apply a sanding sealer, thinking they are sealing the wood, and then sand it off, to bare wood in places, trying to get a fair surface. Sealer should go on thin and penetrate the wood. I use sanding base coat to fill imperfections after that.

 

IMHO, wipe-on will not do as good as a sealer, but something is better than nothing. Wipe-on is wiped on and pretty much forms a film over the surface of the wood. It's just a thin surface coat of polyurethane varnish. It sells well because any idiot can wipe it on and won't make a dog's breakfast of it. Shellac is alcohol based and has the consistency of water. You brush it on generously. It soaks deep into the wood, particularly the end grain. When it dries, it's one of the best moisture barrier coatings known to man. You can sand it very smooth. Anything else sticks to it fine. It's compatible with everything. It can be easily sanded to a very fine degree of smoothness. It's easy to clean up. It washes off with alcohol. It's relatively inexpensive. 

 

I use Zinsser "Bulls Eye" clear shellac. Fifteen bucks a quart. (It doesn't skin over in the can like paint and varnish do, so you won't have to buy it too often. https://www.lowes.com/pd/Zinsser-Bulls-Eye-Clear-Shellac-Actual-Net-Contents-32-fl-oz/3449840?cm_mmc=shp-_-c-_-prd-_-pnt-_-google-_-lia-_-219-_-interiorstains-_-3449840-_-0&store_code=1901&placeholder=null&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIzqOgn6vD5wIVFq5kCh3ZawjTEAQYASABEgKoDfD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

 

On models, I don't ever really have a need to fill grain, but if I want to use a sanding base coat, I use Interlux Pre-Kote or whatever other sanding primer is on my paint locker shelf at the time. Pre-Kote runs around $35 a quart, which is way more than anybody'd ever need for a model. It's sold in chandleries and on line. Any sanding base coat (sometimes called "primer") compatible with whatever finish coat you are using should be fine. The products sold at professional auto body and paint supply outfits are quite good and more reasonably priced than the stuff "with a boat on the can." You just want one that will give you a uniform colored base and is easily sanded. It can be applied in multiple coats to fill grain and minor imperfections and then sanded smooth.  https://www.jamestowndistributors.com/userportal/show_product.do?pid=120&engine=adwords&keyword=interlux_pre_kote&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIk5uU8bTD5wIVC8JkCh1jRAm7EAAYASAAEgIYM_D_BwE

 

If I have serious nicks and dings, or for puttying generally, I use Interlux surfacing putty. It's $30 a pint, which is outrageous, in my opinion, but I guess it's all about the environmental regulations. It's thinned with acetone. It will last a long time after opening if you keep the lid edges clean and turn it upside down when you put it back on the shelf. If it starts to harden, adding a bit of acetone to the can and letting it sit over night will restore it. The stuff absorbs the acetone on its own over time. It drys very fast and sands very easily and will give a very smooth surface. https://www.jamestowndistributors.com/userportal/show_product.do?pid=4154 Any other surfacing putty or "fairing compound," as it's sometimes called, will work pretty much the same. I do not favor Bondo for any application on wood. It's for metal. Epoxy resin mixed with micro-balloons works well, too, but it's expensive and very messy to work with.

 

10 hours ago, BobG said:

Also, in regards to gloss finishes, racing sailboats would have a high gloss finish on their hulls wouldn't they? I ask because I have a Pen Duick kit that I will build at some point and I thought the hull would be a gloss finish.

 

Racing yachts do indeed have high gloss topside finishes. For a model, though, a high gloss finish would not be to scale. If you look at a high gloss finish up close, it's glossy, but at "scale viewing distance," a model would look like a shiny toy if painted with a high gloss finish. It needs to be toned down. If you look at a glossy example in real life and then back away from it until you can view the entire boat (or car) in your eye's "frame," you'll see that from thirty or fifty feet away, it doesn't appear super-glossy. A semi-gloss, "eggshell," or "satin" finish would be more appropriate. You can, of course, paint a model hull with high gloss paint and then, when the paint is well dried, hand-rub the finish with pumice and rottenstone to the degree of gloss you want. This is the best way to go about it, really. A hand-rubbed finish is "finestkind," but will take additional time and effort.  

Edited February 9, 2020 by Bob Cleek

[BobG]

Bob, thanks very much for taking the time to write this detailed and thorough reply. It's really excellent information. Much appreciated!

 

Bob

[Bob Cleek]

2 hours ago, BobG said:

Bob, thanks very much for taking the time to write this detailed and thorough reply. It's really excellent information. Much appreciated!

 

Bob

Painting and varnishing is a highly skilled craft, if it is to be done well. It takes practice and knowing how it's supposed to be done. There's no substitute for experience. Sometimes it's tricky to get a perfect finish, as is needed for models which are viewed "under a microscope," as it were. I can't stress enough the usefulness of experimenting with "test patches" before doing the final job. Not only will going through the process on a spare hunk of wood let you know if there's a problem that doesn't have to be corrected on your model, but it will give you confidence when doing it "for real." Don't forget the painter's maxim: "A good finish is 90% surface preparation."

 

While we're at it, I should mention that several thin coats are always preferred over fewer thick coats. This avoids runs, drips, and brush strokes. The thinner the coating, the less detail is lost on a model. I don't know if you are committed enough to the hobby to make the investment (which isn't all that much,) but I'd suggest you consider getting and learning to use an airbrush. Brushes can produce great finishes, but, IMHO, one can learn to get a great finish from an airbrush more easily than from a brush. There's always a need for brushes for fine details, but there's nothing like an airbrush for "wide open spaces." 

 

Good luck with your project!

Edited February 9, 2020 by Bob Cleek

[BobG]

Thanks again, Bob, for all of this truly knowledgeable and sage advice about painting. I have always loved painting of any kind. I have painted the exterior of our house twice and all the rooms and woodwork inside several times. There is just something about the transformative process of painting and seeing the beauty of a good paint job emerge that I find very satisfying. I'm quite new to ship modeling and, as you have noted, getting a "perfect finish" is tricky especially with a brush and I'm still striving to get better. Unfortunately, I find that I often learn the most through my mistakes first!

 

I've completed most of the painting on my Medway Longboat build and, as a result of what I've learned in this topic and another recent topic on painting with acrylics, it has turned out quite nice. There's certainly room for improvement when you look at it carefully and up close. I must have laid down 15-20 coats on the cap rail and the cockpit seats before I finally said "that's good enough." I used Vallejo acrylic paint that I had thinned significantly and the challenge for me was not getting lap marks which, although they aren't all that noticeable, you can see some unevenness when looking at it closely while a bright light source is hitting it at an angle. I'm pretty happy with it but there's room to get better.

 

In regards to airbrushing, my wife gave me a complete Grex airbrush kit for Christmas. I haven't tried it out yet but I'm excited to do so. I'm sure I'll have a ton of questions about airbrushing techniques and paints once I start using it. I'm grateful for the experienced modelers here that are so willing to share their knowledge.

 

Once again, thanks for sharing your expertise!

 

Bob

 

 

Edited February 9, 2020 by BobG

[Bob Cleek]

45 minutes ago, BobG said:

I used Vallejo acrylic paint that I had thinned significantly and the challenge for me was not getting lap marks which, although they aren't all that noticeable, you can see some unevenness when looking at it closely while a bright light source is hitting it at an angle. I'm pretty happy with it but there's room to get better.

Next time, try adding a bit of "retarder" to your paint. I expect Vallejo makes a proprietary one. "Retarder" is a type of paint conditioner that slows  drying time. A slower drying time will give you more time to keep a "wet edge" when brushing and will give the paint more time to "lay down" and eliminate the brush strokes and overlaps. This is one of the things to look for when you are making your tests before final painting. If it's "drying" ("curing" with acrylics, actually,) too fast, you can condition your paint to suit the immediate environmental conditions. Ambient temperature, humidity, and things like that affect how paint behaves. The components of any paint are relative to each other. Thinning may, depending on the type of paint, affect gloss, drying time, and so on. Sometimes, when paint is thinned a lot, some of the other components, "retarder" or "accelerator" ("dryers") have to be added to compensate.

Edited February 9, 2020 by Bob Cleek

[BobG]

I bought some retarder but haven't tried it yet. Great information!

 

Bob

[lmagna]

1 hour ago, BobG said:

In regards to airbrushing, my wife gave me a complete Grex airbrush kit for Christmas.

I'm jealous Bob G. I would be lucky if my wife bought me a paint brush for Christmas.  But then I doubt she would know what airbrush would work well for modeling anyway.......... On second thought I suppose that would apply to me as well. That is why I am using a $30 airbrush for the first time on my currant build, afraid to spend big money on a system that is beyond my ability to properly use. 

[BobG]

5 minutes ago, lmagna said:

I'm jealous Bob G. I would be lucky if my wife bought me a paint brush for Christmas.  But then I doubt she would know what airbrush would work well for modeling anyway.......... On second thought I suppose that would apply to me as well. That is why I am using a $30 airbrush for the first time on my currant build, afraid to spend big money on a system that is beyond my ability to properly use. 

She's a sweetheart for sure! She really likes my modeling and gives me a lot of support. There have been a couple of times when I was about to quit on a model and she told me to set it aside and look at it in the morning. That's great advice when you reach a frustration point!

[lmagna]

Sounds like you have a keeper.

 

But then it could always be like mine. After almost 40 years, and now that I'm retired and underfoot all of the time, she wants me to find something to do besides just bugging her! (Actually that is sometimes my favorite indoor sport these days. 😈)

[BobG]

16 minutes ago, lmagna said:

Sounds like you have a keeper.

 

But then it could always be like mine. After almost 40 years, and now that I'm retired and underfoot all of the time, she wants me to find something to do besides just bugging her! (Actually that is sometimes my favorite indoor sport these days. 😈)

Hahaha...that happens with us also at times. I'm an avid cyclist and so I do get away from the house quite a bit. We tend to encourage each other in our hobbies and in getting exercise. She works out regularly at the gym and we take long walks together often. I tend to get cabin fever and fidgety if I spend too much time sitting at my little modeling table and she will tell me to that I need to get out of the house and go ride my bike! She's a talented pastel artist and I try to encourage her just like she does with my ship modeling. We both tend to be our own worst critics!

 

Bob

Edited February 9, 2020 by BobG

[lmagna]

Somewhat the same here. I used to be more active and was able to get out hiking relatively often. sometimes as long as a week at a time. But last year I broke my ankle pretty badly and things changed pretty quickly.  Now almost a year later I am coming to the realization that those days may be over. You don't see to many hikers walking with a cane on the trail!

 

My wife is like yours and has had multiple crafts over the years. She has done painting, crafts of one type or another, crocheting, knitting, and for the last few years needle felting. It seems like she gets to the professional level each time, sells a few items and then has to move on to a new challenge. My modeling on the other hand could be classified as rank amateur at best. 

[BobG]

36 minutes ago, lmagna said:

Somewhat the same here. I used to be more active and was able to get out hiking relatively often. sometimes as long as a week at a time. But last year I broke my ankle pretty badly and things changed pretty quickly.  Now almost a year later I am coming to the realization that those days may be over. You don't see to many hikers walking with a cane on the trail! 

Don't give up, Lou. How about a bike? I think about Bob Coomber who is a wheelchair hiker when I start feeling too old and achy:

 

 

[lmagna]

Watching someone like him do what he is doing MAKES me feel old and achy!

 

He is lucky he does not live in Washington. Most of our trails here do not allow wheeled devices of ANY KIND. I know what the law meant. They were trying to stop off road vehicles from tearing up the trails, but the wording was done in their normally sloppy manner and anything with wheels is illegal!  There are a very few handicap trails but as far as I know they are day hike trails and none of them allow camping.

 

Biking would possibly be an option as it is not as much strain on the feet, plus it supplies a frame to carry the weight of a pack, but I have no idea where I would go. I have seen bikers on a number of our highways doing cross country biking but that always frightened me as a way to get smacked by idiots in passing cars at 60+ miles an hour!

[mtaylor]

Lou,

Consider a tandem bike.  Between you and your lady, you be able to putt right along.   It will take some work to get things to come together though.  Janet and I used to have a tandem and for her it was perfect (leg amputee).  Called ourselves the 3-pedal tandem team.  I miss those days and miss her, but such is just the way it is.

[lmagna]

It is obvious you don't know Laurie very well Mark. 1st off, IF I could get her onto a tandem, I would then have to #2 get her to peddle! I suspect she would just be an additional weight I would have to try and get up the hill.

 

I am truly sorry about how things with Janet worked out for you. Some parts of life are just harder to dismiss as gone than others and it is clear this is one for you. Hopefully with time?

Edited February 10, 2020 by lmagna

[mtaylor]

I do understand your view, Lou.  You obviously know her well.  

 

I'm doing pretty good, Lou.   She's where she needs to be and with the issues, I'm not about to go and stir those up again.   I'm finding peace. 

 

Now that we've run this topic into another dimension of space/time....    

[lmagna]

7 minutes ago, mtaylor said:

Now that we've run this topic into another dimension of space/time....    

I have that tendency. It seems like I can't be trusted with access to a keyboard on a forum! 

[Moab]

I use two coats of shellac sanding lightly between coats with 220. Works great and is fast...Moab

[Voyageur]

On 2/8/2020 at 9:24 PM, Bob Cleek said:

Shellac is alcohol based and has the consistency of water. You brush it on generously. It soaks deep into the wood, particularly the end grain. When it dries, it's one of the best moisture barrier coatings known to man. You can sand it very smooth. Anything else sticks to it fine. It's compatible with everything. It can be easily sanded to a very fine degree of smoothness. It's easy to clean up. It washes off with alcohol. It's relatively inexpensive. 

 

 

Bob, this is great information. Is it common to shellac all wood of a ship model? I can’t say that I ever recall seeing someone applying shellac to masts or spars, etc... I would think all the same reasons for shellacking the hull would also apply to the rest of the wood.

[Bob Cleek]

3 hours ago, Voyageur said:

Bob, this is great information. Is it common to shellac all wood of a ship model? I can’t say that I ever recall seeing someone applying shellac to masts or spars, etc... I would think all the same reasons for shellacking the hull would also apply to the rest of the wood.

It's up to the modeler. It's my practice to pretty much shellac all the wood on a model as I go along these days. I also use thinned shellac on cordage that requires shaping. As the shellac dries, the cordage can be bent to shape and when fully dried, the rigging line will hold that shape. This is how I avoid coils of line on pin rails and elsewhere that look like stiff lariats that belong on a cowboy's saddle instead of anything ever found on a ship. Shellac also serves well as an adhesive for paper and cardstock bits and pieces and, if thickened, can be used in more demanding adhesive applications. 

 

I generally keep a jar of shellac and a paintbrush that lives in a small jar of alcohol with a top that has a hole drilled into it to hold the brush handle and a pair of long tweezers handy on my bench. (The hole in the brush jar cap allows the brush to remain in the alcohol while the cap minimizes the alcohol's evaporation.  The alcohol in the brush jar will mix with the shellac off the brush over time and the shellac in my shellac jar will often start to thicken as the alcohol in it evaporates some. I just pour some of the alcohol from the brush jar into the shellac jar to thin it and I then add fresh alcohol to the brush jar as needed. This is an economical way to use the materials, although shellac and denatured alcohol bought in gallon cans from the hardware or paint store is dirt cheap compared to any modeling paint company's "sealer" and proprietary solvents. For small pieces, I simply hold them in the tweezers and dip them right into the shellac jar and pull them out and shake or tap off the excess shellac over the shellac jar. That avoids the difficulty of thoroughly coating a piece with a brush while it's being held. The tips of the tweezers clean right off with a dip in the brush jar and a wipe with a paper towel.  Shellac is very easy stuff to work with and it dries very quickly without brush strokes, so it doesn't require any skill to apply it. (Unless, of course, one undertakes the challenge of French polishing, which was once a separate craft in and of itself and has little or no application to modeling, save for building bases and case frames if one were so inclined to replicate an Eighteenth Century model case and stand.)

 

A single coat of thin (right out of the can) "white" (bleached clear) shellac soaks right into the wood and is practically invisible. It does four things I value:

 

One, it permits fine sanding to a perfectly smooth surface, which is especially helpful when using softer woods that tend to "fuzz" and when thus sanded smooth, it is easy to dust and tack the piece to remove all dust from the surface before applying the finish coats.

 

Two, it provides a sealer coat so that paint applied to the surface does not soak into the wood unevenly and it provides a surface for good, uniform adhesion of the paint. Sealing is also very important when using water-based finish coats which often have a tendency to "raise the grain" of softwoods.

 

Three, it tends to retard the absorption of moisture and slows wood movement due to fluctuations in ambient humidity. In practice, this is often a negligible consideration, but, in theory, at least, very slight movements of the wood components will, over time, albeit sometimes great time, loosen joints and weaken the structure.

 

Four, it is a completely safe and reversible archival material. Shellac is non-toxic. It is what is used to make M&M's and jelly beans candy shiny. It has been known in the written record going back at least 3,000 years and archaeologists have recovered shellac artifacts of that age that remained in good condition. It is perpetually reversible. Simply applying alcohol will soften and dissolve shellac even decades and centuries after it was first applied. Many have no concern about the archival quality of the materials they use in their models, which is certainly their prerogative. For myself, I like to think my models will survive me and may even be around a good long time, so using materials proven to be as long lasting as possible will help to ensure that outcome. I know that may be a much less than likely conceit, but the fantasy makes modeling a bit more fun for me on that account.

 

I believe I wouldn't be far wrong in assuming that all of the period museum models, and certainly the Admiralty Board models, were sealed with thin shellac. Until the advent of synthetics (those ersatz abominations such as "wipe on poly" ,) sealing raw wood with shellac was the standard practice for fine painted finishes and "French polishing" with shellac was the standard "clear" finish applied to fine furniture.

Edited April 4, 2020 by Bob Cleek

[Voyageur]

5 hours ago, Bob Cleek said:

Four, it is a completely safe and reversible archival material. Shellac is non-toxic. It is what is used to make M&M's and jelly beans candy shiny. It has been known in the written record going back at least 3,000 years and archaeologists have recovered shellac artifacts of that age that remained in good condition. It is perpetually reversible. Simply applying alcohol will soften and dissolve shellac even decades and centuries after it was first applied. Many have no concern about the archival quality of the materials they use in their models, which is certainly their prerogative. For myself, I like to think my models will survive me and may even be around a good long time, so using materials proven to be as long lasting as possible will help to ensure that outcome. I know that may be a much less than likely conceit, but the fantasy makes modeling a bit more fun for me on that account.

 

That is great info. I will be sure to return to this thread for reference. Do you also shellac over the paint, as a sealer or protector?

[Bob Cleek]

15 minutes ago, Voyageur said:

Do you also shellac over the paint, as a sealer or protector?

No, I don't. Varnish would't add anything to the appearance or longevity of the finish paint coats. Sometimes, I do use shellac alone (or on top of a stain) as a finish coat to represent a varnished surface. By applying multiple coats of shellac, the finish becomes shiny as the number of coats increases, so the "scale gloss" level can be controlled. (At "scale viewing distances," finished surfaces which are glossy when viewed up close on the prototype will appear less than glossy. 

[Moab]

B...thank you for the great info on shellac. I’ve long been a fan of shellac but keeping a small bottle always at the ready is excellent an idea. Thanx again...Moab