HMS Winchelsea by mnewsholme

[mnewsholme]

Bit late to the party but I've taken plunge and ordered laser cut parts for chapters 1 and 2. Plans downloaded and ready to print. 

 

Looking at scrollsaws now as costs for laser cut bulkheads plus international shipping would virtually pay for saw (and its a good excuse for a new toy 🙂 ).

 

This is very much a long term project so don't expect fast progress. Have a vanguard models HMS Alert on the go at the moment with a Medway Longboat in early stages too. 

Cutting bulkheads for Winnie will be a filler project when I want a break from smaller scale stuff. I don't expect to seriously start building until the summer.

[Chuck]

Welcome to the group....Its not too late at all.  I expect new folks to join as this will be a long project that is here to stay.  I just packaged up your latest order of Winnie parts and the masting for the longboat.  It will ship out tomorrow morning.

 

Chuck

[mnewsholme]

Thanks Chuck

 

Superb service as usual. Now have a rest - It is Sunday after all 🙂

[Chuck]

I wish....I have about 1000 2mm double blocks to make today.   

[mnewsholme]

And so it starts. Plans back from printers + chapter one and two parts in from Syren. And a new toy in the workshop 🙂

Just got to learn how to use it now.

 

 

Matt

[Chuck]

Remember to have fun along the way!!!!

[Rustyj]

Welcome to the party Matt. It sure is a lot of fun!

[mnewsholme]

Bit off progress to report.

Side effect of lockdown is I've had more freetime so managed to get bulkheads cut on scrollsaw. 

Hopefully a dry day tomorrow so I can use disc and oscillating spindle sander outside to fine tune upto the lines. 

Has anyone got any tips for sanding slots other than files and sanding sticks. Their all going to need adjusting as Plywood varies between 6.5mm and 6.7mm thick, unfortunately 1/4" ply pretty much unobtainable in UK so went with closest metric size ( 6mm is available but its always undersize typically 5.5mm or less, weirdly 6.5mm tends to be on size or slightly oversze).

Plenty of scrap generated cutting bulkheads 🙂

 

[mnewsholme]

Slow but steady progress. Bulkheads all sanded back to lines and slots adjusted for fit. I'm now fitting Rabbit strip to keel former. Felt a bit tight bending round so I've steamed it and now allowing to dry before gluing on. I put a strengthening piece on either side of the dovetail joint in the keel former just as belt and braces.

 

Little MDF tabs are an idea I saw on Chris Wattons Speedy kit and shamelessly borrowed with a slight modification. I struggle a bit getting the rabbit strip central all the way down the keel. So I lasercut the tabs with a notch to hold the rabbit strip central to the former whilst the glue dries. Just a snug push fit and tabs are removed as soon as glue has set a bit. bulldog clip stays on to hold strip down until glue fully set.

 

Has anyone got any photos that show the stem looking vertically down from above?. I've assembled the stem and I'm struggling to visualise how its tapered. I can't see any overhead views of this detail anywhere on the plans. Is it a smooth taper from the back edge of the stem (1/4") to the front edge of the Bobstay (1/8"), or is just the front half of the assembly that's tapered?

[Chuck]

Just the front half or 60% of the stem gets tapered.   I have created a straight taper.   

[mnewsholme]

Thanks Chuck. 

[mnewsholme]

making steady progress. Stem assembled and added to keel former.

Then fitted bulkheads to keel former. Pretty happy with how level and square everything turned out. Hobbyzone slip makes it easy to check alignment as you go along.

 

Now for fairing. Ordered some extra sanding blocks. Once they arrive I'll crack on. Had a test run in meantime at ripping planking stock. Used a bit of scrap cherry and came out pretty nice and consistent in thickness. Finish left by saw is pretty much flawless. 

One question I have reading ahead a bit in chapter is when I come to add the stern framing do I add two stern planking fillers on each side of keelformer behind bulkheads 29 or is it just one each side and other two are spares?.

 

Looking even further ahead at work Chucks doing on chapter 4. Is there a ply subfloor below the planking in the two wells below the hatches?. Just wondering if it would be worth adding these subfloors now to help stiffen up skeleton before fairing, although its remarkably rigid already.

 

[Chuck]

They are just spares....I had extra room on the sheets so I figured why not add some.  It is looking very good.

[mnewsholme]

received a package from Syren today with planking blanks stock and chapter three parts. Ordered on 22nd with expectation it would take 6-8 weeks due to Cov-id, but arrived in two. So looks like shipping to UK is pretty much back to normal. Hopefully I can get some time to progress things a bit now and get chapter one finished.

 

[Chuck]

Hows this build progressing.  Any progress??

 

Chuck

[mnewsholme]

stalled at moment. Bit snowed under at work. Hopefully it's going to ease of in next couple of weeks, then can start making some progress again.

[mnewsholme]

Very slight bit of progress. got setup and started milling planking stock. Came out pretty well for first go.

 

Have to admit I'm pretty intimidated by scale of this project. Haven't got up nerve to fair the bulkheads yet. I dont think my planking skills are up to a big single planked hull yet. I'm ok on double planked where I can use filler on top of first planking to get shape correct before second planking. But I think before attempting something as big as Winnie I'd be better doing a smaller more manageable single planked hull first. For that reason Im seriously considering officially putting Winnie on hold and doing Cheerful first as its a lot less to line off and learn on.

 

[jfhealey]

Matt - I know exactly how you feel. I started the Winchelsea a long time ago (the posts are somewhere near the bottom of the pile now) and quickly realised that for a third ever build I was way in over my head in terms of the difference between the outcome I had in my mind's eye on the one hand and the achievable outcome my skill level suggested was achievable. So I started again - the posts are nearer the top as "Fred's W2". W2 is much better than my first effort but my expectations of my limited ability and experience continue to outstrip what I can achieve. So, like you, I'm thinking of taking time out from Winchelsea and having a go at Cheerful. I ordered the parts (including the laser cut frames - like you I scroll sawed the frames for both Winnies) from Chuck a couple of weeks ago and they arrived yesterday. I'm resolutely going to remember the basics - take it slow and steady and treat every part as a mini kit.  My preference would be to double plank Cheerful because I don't have enough confidence in my ability to achieve the sort of outcome I want to achieve from single planking - but the frames are not designed for double planking. I'm wondering whether  the answer is to cut the middle frames again on the scroll saw following the inside of the printed line (thus reducing the size by the required 1mm or so) and to let the fairing take care of the fore and aft frames. Or perhaps just fill the inter frame spaces with balsa and then fare the whole thing with a bit of wood filler as required.

 

Any way, whatever you decide Matt, best of luck and I shall follow your posts with interest.

 

May I ask: what table saw did you use? The Jim Byrnes seems the absolute stand out but does anyone in the UK know what it costs if Customs pick it out for imposition of duty? Or does the Proxxon do a decent job I wonder, I'm thinking of purchasing the Cheerful wood pack from Hobbymill Eu but I wonder how prices compare - milled v milling your own.

 

Best wishes

Fred   

[mnewsholme]

37 minutes ago, jfhealey said:

Matt - I know exactly how you feel. I started the Winchelsea a long time ago (the posts are somewhere near the bottom of the pile now) and quickly realised that for a third ever build I was way in over my head in terms of the difference between the outcome I had in my mind's eye on the one hand and the achievable outcome my skill level suggested was achievable. So I started again - the posts are nearer the top as "Fred's W2". W2 is much better than my first effort but my expectations of my limited ability and experience continue to outstrip what I can achieve. So, like you, I'm thinking of taking time out from Winchelsea and having a go at Cheerful. I ordered the parts (including the laser cut frames - like you I scroll sawed the frames for both Winnies) from Chuck a couple of weeks ago and they arrived yesterday. I'm resolutely going to remember the basics - take it slow and steady and treat every part as a mini kit.  My preference would be to double plank Cheerful because I don't have enough confidence in my ability to achieve the sort of outcome I want to achieve from single planking - but the frames are not designed for double planking. I'm wondering whether  the answer is to cut the middle frames again on the scroll saw following the inside of the printed line (thus reducing the size by the required 1mm or so) and to let the fairing take care of the fore and aft frames. Or perhaps just fill the inter frame spaces with balsa and then fare the whole thing with a bit of wood filler as required.

 

Any way, whatever you decide Matt, best of luck and I shall follow your posts with interest.

 

May I ask: what table saw did you use? The Jim Byrnes seems the absolute stand out but does anyone in the UK know what it costs if Customs pick it out for imposition of duty? Or does the Proxxon do a decent job I wonder, I'm thinking of purchasing the Cheerful wood pack from Hobbymill Eu but I wonder how prices compare - milled v milling your own.

 

Best wishes

Fred   

Hi Fred

 

Its a Byrnes saw. imported it in 2016 when dollar/pound wasnt too bad. From memory customs fee was around £160. this was for an onvoice of around $800 ($150 of which was the shipping). I got a lot of extras to make best use of the shipping. So impressed with quality that I went back and got both the thickness and disc sanders. The planking stock comes off the saw ready to use. No need to put it through thickness sander as its already smoother and more consistent than stock that comes in kits.

 

 

[glbarlow]

 

On 4/14/2022 at 2:05 PM, jfhealey said:

Matt - I know exactly how you feel.

Having built Cheerful and now working on Winnie, a couple of observations:

 

First, there is no way it can be double planked, it would throw off everything, like the square tuck. Cutting down the bulkheads would just make it worse. 
 

Second, while it’s true it’s a lot smaller than Winnie, it is not easier and some cases it’s harder with things like the square tuck, boom crutches, etc.  With Winnie we are fortunate to have a lot of mini-kits and lasered parts, more of Cheerful is scratch. Don’t get me wrong, it’s a really great model just no more a first kit than Winnie. 
 

My suggestion is to look at Vanguard Models (he’s in the UK but shipping to the US isn’t bad). for a true kit kit, and double planked, like Flirt or Sphinx to gain experience then come back to Cheerful and Winnie. 
 

Btw, the Byrnes line up of tools is second to none. 
 

Best of luck whatever direction you take. 

[Steve20]

On 4/14/2022 at 8:05 PM, jfhealey said:

May I ask: what table saw did you use? The Jim Byrnes seems the absolute stand out but does anyone in the UK know what it costs if Customs pick it out for imposition of duty? Or does the Proxxon do a decent job I wonder, I'm thinking of purchasing the Cheerful wood pack from Hobbymill Eu but I wonder how prices compare - milled v milling your own.

 

Best wishes

Fred   

Hi Fred,

I purchased the Byrnes Table Saw in March 2022 and with accessories the purchase price was $1,209. UPS shipping to the UK was $300 to give an invoice total of $1,509. Additionally, UPS invoiced me £221.52 for Import VAT and added a UPS Brokerage Charge of £11.50. I bought the Byrnes because I found the Proxxon FET to be limited in accuracy when milling wood and there are very few options for saw blades and accessories for the FET.

 

I also bought the Byrnes Thicknesser at the same time and with a supply of abrasives, and a 6" wedge, the purchase price was $523. UPS shipping to the UK was $245 to give an invoice total of $768. Import VAT was £111.07 and UPS Brokerage Charge was again £11.50.

 

Steve

Edited June 23, 2022 by Steve20

[jfhealey]

Steve - I've only now caught up with your message. Thank you very much for taking the time to set that out. It's really helpful. I recently purchased the Cheerful plans and bulkheads from Chuck and the Cheerful boxwood package from Hobbymill EU who were very helpful and good to deal with. The boxwood, incidentally, from them is flawlessly brilliant. The Byrnes will have to wait a while but I'm persuaded the Proxxon is probably not the way to go.

 

Glenn - many thanks for your thoughts. I'm underway and will start a Cheerful log soon. One of the joys of MSW is the "been there and done it" knowledge of the other builders. I have read and re-read your log and many others beside. I hope I shall make a much better fist of Cheerful than I might otherwise have been able to do as a result.

 

All the best

Fred

[jfhealey]

Matt - how is your Winnie coming along?

Fred

[mnewsholme]

decided to put it on hold. just finishing hull planking on duchess. Once that moves to Rigging phase I'm going to do Cheerful in parallel and really make an effort to learn best methods of lining off and single planking. Just seems a much more manageable size to learn on. Then back to Winnie. I realise Cheerful isnt necessarily easier than Winnie, but due to smaller size I think I'll make progress a bit faster on it and keep interest better.

I tend to always have two models on go at same time. One in hull phase and one in detailing/rigging, then when I get frustrated planking I do some rigging for a bit and vice versa.

Problem is I have lots of hobbies and tend to bounce between them all quite frequently so progress can be very slow 😞