Planking not contacting bulkheads .

[LEGION 12]

Building the Dumas sub chaser , for some reason the planks aren't contacting the last two bulkheads at the transom . Was told I should of faired the frames but it's only the last two . Any way to fix this without removing the planks ? 

[LEGION 12]

[Gregory]

The only thing you could do besides doing it over, would be to add some shim material to the bulkheads..

[LEGION 12]

8 minutes ago, Gregory said:

The only thing you could do besides doing it over, would be to add some shim material to the bulkheads..

Thanks for the quick reply , I was thinking the same thing the first plank is glued to the stringers , if I sand the bulkheads wouldn't that throw everything off even more ?  Not really sure how this even happened .

[Cathead]

It looks like the planks aren't taking their intended curve properly, maybe helped along by the lack of frame fairing. Did you pre-bend them using water and/or heat? That's the standard approach, which rearranges the wood fibers to hold their shape when dry/cool. Most planks won't want to lie in their intended curves without doing something along those lines, it's the nature of hull geometry.

 

Gregory is right that adding some thin material to the frames can fill that space, but that's not necessarily going to fix the problem overall, as each successive plank may keep bowing outward unless you get them bent properly in the first place. I.e., it looks like those planks are bowing outward, not sitting in the proper orientation with just a thin, even gap above the frame. Kits sometimes do get bulkheads wrong, requiring such spacers, but the first step should be assuming that the plank needs work, not the bulkhead. For example, you may also need to be tapering these planks, which helps them take the intended curve (as most hulls narrow toward the stern, each run of planking has to get thinner than it is at the full width amidships). I can't tell from your photo angle if you've done this or not.

 

Rule of thumb, test-fit every plank using clamps before gluing. If it doesn't sit properly with the right bend, something needs to be addressed. Can you share with us a photo of the directions for this step and what the planks look like at the transom? Do the directions say anything about tapering planks? Is there a drawing of how the kit is meant to look at this stage? More information will help us give you better advice.

 

Other broader suggestions:

• Read through a few planking tutorials here in MSW to ensure that you understand the general principles.
• Search for other build logs for this model and consult their photos and methods (for example, here's one not on MSW that has lots of detailed photos that I found in 30 seconds of searching).
• Start your own build log that tracks everything you do on this model. Starting new topics for every question you have on this specific build (looks like this is your third) clutters up the forums by repeating questions already asked and answered elsewhere, while making it harder for people to answer your questions (as they don't know what else you've done or asked on your model).

 

We'd love to help you learn the skills of this really fun hobby, so keep at it and help us help you by providing more information and organizing your questions in a way that will be easier to answer as you progress.

 

 

[Gregory]

It's really hard to see what is going on from your pictures.

 

Are you saying the planks are laying flat on the transom, but there is a gap between the plank/s and one or more bulkheads?

 

A wider shot, with maybe a pencil pointing at the problem would give a better idea..

[Beef Wellington]

I'd definitely recommend starting a build log.  Although it would possible to add some shims to fill the gap, I think you'd run the risk of altering the shape of the hull away from its intended form as the gaps look quite significant.  I wonder if you faired the bulkheads sufficiently?  More photos might help with better advice.

[LEGION 12]

Sorry about the clutter folks I will start a build log . I'm rather new to all this , the information on this build is pretty scarce and the instructions are probably for someone with much more experience than me . 

[LEGION 12]

[Cathead]

Interesting. Those aren't the most helpful instructions I've ever seen. They say nothing about tapering, though my instinct is that it would help (though without actually handling the model I don't really know).

 

I think I'd start by pre-bending the planks and see if they sit right (as that can be undone, unlike tapering). Some people soak them and clamp them in place to let them dry, others apply dry heat with a planking iron or other source, then clamp them in place, or even both (soaking followed by heat application). Either way, again, the idea is to get the plank to hold the shape you want before glue is used. If it won't sit right on its own, it'll put too much tension on the glue joint, especially with so few frames providing support. If you're wondering how to do the clamping, there are really good photos and examples of different methods in the tutorials (my favorite is to use simply office-supply binder clips).

 

The good news here is that all you're going for is a solid surface; the planking doesn't have to "look" good as it gets an overlay, so you have a lot of leeway. Unlike, say, if this was a wooden sailing vessel hull where accurate planking runs are a core part of the appearance. Try bending a few planks and let us know how it goes!

 

Edit: Meant to say, if/when you start a build log for this, let us know here so we can follow you over. Otherwise it can be easy to miss a log being posted in all the activity on MSW.

Edited January 5, 2021 by Cathead

[JeffT]

Its hard to tell. Is it just one bulkhead or multiple? On both sides?

 

I agree you may have to shim the bulkheads.

[LEGION 12]

1 hour ago, Cathead said:

Interesting. Those aren't the most helpful instructions I've ever seen. They say nothing about tapering, though my instinct is that it would help (though without actually handling the model I don't really know).

 

I think I'd start by pre-bending the planks and see if they sit right (as that can be undone, unlike tapering). Some people soak them and clamp them in place to let them dry, others apply dry heat with a planking iron or other source, then clamp them in place, or even both (soaking followed by heat application). Either way, again, the idea is to get the plank to hold the shape you want before glue is used. If it won't sit right on its own, it'll put too much tension on the glue joint, especially with so few frames providing support. If you're wondering how to do the clamping, there are really good photos and examples of different methods in the tutorials (my favorite is to use simply office-supply binder clips).

 

The good news here is that all you're going for is a solid surface; the planking doesn't have to "look" good as it gets an overlay, so you have a lot of leeway. Unlike, say, if this was a wooden sailing vessel hull where accurate planking runs are a core part of the appearance. Try bending a few planks and let us know how it goes!

 

Edit: Meant to say, if/when you start a build log for this, let us know here so we can follow you over. Otherwise it can be easy to miss a log being posted in all the activity on MSW.

Hi I went ahead and started a build log , the planks seem to be bending fine only the 2 rear ones aren't contacting the bulkheads . 

[Cathead]

If they aren't contacting the bulkheads, they're not bent properly. Based on your photos, shimming isn't going to help because the plank is bowing away from the bulkhead and the next one's going to be much worse. I'll head over to your build log from now on (link here for others interested).

[turangi]

It looks to me that there is a rather severe curve to the bulkhead and the plank needed to  be bent to to conform to the curve. Probably too late now but a method I have used involving a length of cove molding and dowel on a soaked plank. Soak the plank well and clamp it into the molding, the curve can be adjusted somewhat by the amount of clamping pressure. The planks often have to be bent not only on their length but also on their width to meet the bulkheads fairly.

Edited January 6, 2021 by turangi

[Chuck Seiler]

Do it right.  Remove the planks.  Soak the joint{s) with isopropyl (rubbing) alcohol.  It will soften the glue (if you used wood glue).  I have done this several times before.  If you let the mistake go, it will compound down the road.

[allanyed]

Just as an FYI, a long while back I did a scratch build  of a schooner (I think it was Columbia) and found that the plans I purchased had a hiccough.  One bulkhead was incorrectly drawn and under sized and I had to redraw and make a new one the correct size.  In your case, it could be that all of their kits have the same problem because of a design error.    If you do remove the planks, be sure the bulkhead is correct or, if it is not, that you have the tools and material to make a new one from scratch that is the correct size.   

Allan

 

 

Edited January 6, 2021 by allanyed