My newest Challenge

[James Flynn]

Hello all.    I am new to this forum and kind of new to ship building I have built many different speed boats, and my latest build was a 5'' long Skipjack sailing shrimping boat. Now I'm wonting to dive headlong into a big 4'' long war ship scratch build I'm wanting to build the 1812 120-gun Montebello first rate triple decker war ship. However, I am struggling with the plans I have downloaded from French 120-gun Ship-of-the-Line Montebello – The Model Shipwright but there written in French and I can't read them, and being my first time working with line plans I'm having a bit of trouble understanding the front and the back of the ship I can see how the ribs cut out for the most part from the image on the left top front and back views but why are there two sets of front and back one with high walls and one without and how do I get the front rounded into what looks like a D shape when looking at the top view?  

 

Edited Monday at 06:12 AM by James Flynn
description

[James Flynn]

you can see a full set of the plans I'm using here French 120-gun Ship-of-the-Line Montebello – The Model Shipwright

 

[Gregory]

Can you show a marked up drawing indicating where you want a " D " shape?

Edited Monday at 05:11 PM by Gregory

[KLarsen]

The profile views on the left part of the plans only show one side because both sides have the same curve. The left part of the drawing is from midships aft, the right side from midships forward. The curved lines correspond to the vertical lines on the side view of the ship. You'll have to identify them one by one to see which corresponds to which if they are not identified.
Regarding the "D" shape I suppose you're referring to the bow? By taking the lines as I explained above you should automatically get the bow shape, though you might have to extrapolate to get the intermediate frames not shown.

 

Are you building the ships as plank-on-frame (POF) or plank-on-bulkhead (POB)? POF is quite difficult and requires you to do "lofting", getting the curve of all the frames using all the lines on the plans.

[Keith Black]

11 hours ago, James Flynn said:

I'm having a bit of trouble understanding the front and the back of the ship I can see how the ribs cut out for the most part from the image on the left top front and back views but why are there two sets of front and back one with high walls and one without and how do I get the front rounded into what looks like a D shape when looking at the top view?  

 James, first, welcome to MSW, secondly, curb your desire to jump in knee deep and start building. You need to do a ton of research on how to build a model ship before tackling building a ship of the line. Use the resources of MSW and go through build log after build log from start to finish.  Within a couple of build logs you'll understand what that D shape is at the bow and see how different builders tackle the making. The knowledge can not be spoon fed, YOU have to want to learn and the easiest way to learn is looking over the shoulders of the many fine modelers here at MSW. Use the MSW search engine to find those build logs that pertain to 19th century French warships. 

[barkeater]

The right side is the bow, and the left is the stern in the first image top left. The figure directly below is a puzzle to me as it is different. Maybe somebody else knows. Also, the lines are not the ribs but rather depict the contour of the ship. Ribs are more numerous however if you are going to do a plank on bulkhead and not a plank on frame, you can use the lines for your bulkheads. 

Richard 

This was already answered as I was formulating an answer. Did not intend to repeat.

Edited Monday at 05:47 PM by barkeater

[Jim Lad]

Hello James, and a warm welcome to the forum.

 

You might find it advantageous to have a browse through the 'Articles' database (link at the top of the home page) to find information on reading a ship's plan. As Keith said, learn about the process before you start to build - you'll find life much easier; and more satisfying.

 

John

[mgdawson]

Hi James

The diagrams on the left are called the body plan, as mentioned above the left side of the body plan show the contours of the hull from midships to the stern and the right side shows midships to the bow. If you look carefully at the left side the midships curves on the 2 body plans are slightly different, the lower one has 11 curves drawn and the upper only has 10 and if you overlaid them you may find other differences.

 

Perhaps try putting the text between the 2 body plans into google translate it may give you a clue as to what's going on.

 

As Jim mentioned check out the article on reading ship lines plans, if you don't already, you really have to have your head around those concepts.

 

Mark

 

[KLarsen]

10 hours ago, mgdawson said:

Perhaps try putting the text between the 2 body plans into google translate it may give you a clue as to what's going on.

It says:
"Horizontal and vertical sections equidistant from the hull, outside [including] the planking".

By "hull", I suppose it means the centerline.

[wefalck]

The drawings posted here and on the linked Web-site come from the 'Atlas du Genie Maritime' that was collated from the middle of the 19th century on until about the 1880s, so contains information and plans from different periods. There is also special volume on rigging details that is a fantastic source (see archjofo's building log for LA CREOLE). The exact contents of this Atlas varies depending on the different copies preserved. It was meant as a sample book and teaching resource for naval engineering students. Unfortunately, there never seems to have been a textbook with explanations for the numerous plates.

 

Not sure what scale you want to build in. At the beginning you wrote the model would be 4" long, which is probably wrong. Otherwise it would be a veritable miniature. If you envisage such miniature, have a look at the building log in 1/700 scale here: http://www.shipmodels.info/mws_forum/viewtopic.php?f=59&t=382477.

 

The two body-plans are, indeed, puzzling. As the lower one seems to show one more frame station I would venture the guess that it may refer to a possible lengthening of the ship, when in 1851 she was converted into an auxiliary steamer. However, Wikipedia on her is quite spartanic and I did not have time to dive deeper into her history. Lengething old warships to make space for machinery was a common procedure at the time.

 

Concerning the language challenges: if one dives into a project from another country, one should be prepared to learn at least the basic terminology in that other language. Today it is easy to find on-line all sorts of specialised and period dictionaries due to the libraries digitising their holdings. Take modern bilingual on-line dictionaries with a pinch of salt - they do not always get it right ... Here are some useful dictionaries that also can be found on-line:

 

PAASCH, H. (1885/1901): From Keel to Truck.- 206 + CIV p., New York/Antwerp. ... that's a classic for English, French, Dutch, and German, later also in addition for Spanisch and Italian.

 

BONNEFOUX, P.-M.-J. DE (1834 and later editions): Dictionnaire abrége de marine. Contenant la traduction des termes les plus usuels, en anglais et en espagnol.- 338 p., Paris/Havre (J.A. Dezauche/C.-B. Matenas).

BONNEFOUX, P.-M.-J. DE (1848?): Dictionnaire de Marine à Voiles et à Vapeur. Marine à Vapeur.- 771 p., X pl., Paris (Arthus Bertrand, Éditeur).