Ratline templates.

[serpe]

Artisan Latina 27311 Ratline Template and the Model Expo MDEM 57202 Ratliner Shroud are two templates I"m looking at. Does anyone think these would be a good choice or not.

[Knocklouder]

Those are not real popular tools. You would be better off drawing your own on paper, then clip it to the shrouds.. This is my opinion, other's may have better advice..    

Knocklouder 

[serpe]

A long time ago I built the Dikar Bluenose. I had no previous knowledge of wooden ships just a background in plastic since the early sixties. Without any inter web or books it worked well. I have built the Billings St. Roch and the Oseberg. The rigging plan for my HMB Endeavour is daunting. I'm stuck. Could you explain how a paper template would work or are there tutorials on this? Everything else is ready to go.

[Knocklouder]

I am not good with words, but shearch for "shrouds " look at the second log there  it shows what I mean hope it helps. They lots of information about shrouds and how to tie them on. And many different ways as well. Those tools lead to frustration and a waste of time and money, again this is only  my opinion.. 

Knocklouder 

https://modelshipworld.com/topic/316-hms-victory-by-edt-finished-196-pob/?do=findComment&comment=50439

This is were to look for one way.

Edited Friday at 03:58 AM by Knocklouder
More info

[Dr PR]

This is how to make a ratline template and use it.

 

1. Measure the distance between the top of the deadeyes and the bottom of the trestletrees or crosstrees.

 

2. Cut a piece of paper to be this long on one side.

 

3. Put the paper behind your shrouds, with the bottom edge resting on the deadeyes.

 

4. Use a pencil to place a mark on the paper beside each of the shrouds at the top of the deadeyes.

 

5. Mark the top of the paper beside the forward and aft shroud lines.

 

6. Draw lines on the paper for the forward and aft shrouds. You really don't need lines for the other shrouds.

 

7. Now you have to think. Ratlines were typically spaced 12 to 16 inches (305 to 406 mm) apart. Now scale this distance to whatever scale your model is. For example, I am building at 1:48 scale, so I divide the real world distance by 48 to get 0.25 to 0.33 inches (6.35 to 8.5 mm) spacing for the ratlines on my model.

 

Note: unless you are modelling a modern vessel there probably will be no record of the actual ratline spacing on the ship you are modelling, so pick a convenient spacing within the range you calculated. I will space them 5/16 inch (0.3125 inch) (7.9 mm) using a ruler marked in 1/16 inch increments..

 

8. On your paper template draw horizontal lines parallel to the tops of the deadeyes at your chosen spacing. These mark where the ratlines will go.

 

9. Trim excess paper around your ratline template, leaving a narrow space outside the lines representing the fore and aft shrouds.

 

10. Tape the top of the template to the shrouds below the trestletrees/crosstrees. Clamp the bottom of the paper to the deadeyes. You could use tape, but you probably will want to release the bottom of the paper to get it out of your way while tying all the ratline knots.

 

11. Put on some soothing music, take a deep breath and don't even think about how many knots you will have to tie for just one set of shrouds!

 

12. Now tie ratlines at every level marked by horizontal lines on the template.

 

Note: Some people clamp a small stick to the shrouds at the level of the ratline to be installed, using the template to set the position. Then they fold the template back out of the way and tie the knots above the stick.

 

IMPORTANT! After all the knots are tied check the line against the template and move the knots as necessary to get the line in the correct position. Sloppy work here will make the model look BAD!

 

It is a good idea to use a small brush to place a drop of diluted white glue (1:1 with water) on each knot as insurance to be sure the knot doesn't open or move on the ratline.

 

The ratlines are tied with clove hitches (look it up). This brings the two ends out from the knot at the same level. Leave a slight "sag" in the line between shrouds - this takes some practice. You can make this sag permanent by wetting the line with diluted white glue or shellac (dries faster).

 

On real ships the ends pf the ratline ropes had eyes spliced in them. The eyes were tied to the outer shrouds with small line. For all but the largest scale models this is unnecessary detail, and a LOT of extra work. I just use a simple overhand knot to tie the ratlines to the fore and aft shroud lines.

Edited Friday at 05:35 AM by Dr PR

[davyboy]

I've never used bits of paper as templates. There is usually a standard distance between Ratlines of 12" to 15" ",I use 12". A piece of wood 1/4" wide (I build in 1:48th) clipped across the shrouds below where the first ratline is to be rigged. Rig the ratline then clip your piece of wood directly above it and rig the next and so on. The beauty of doing it this way is you can ensure good alignment of all your ratlines with out struggling to align them with lines on a sometimes wobbly piece of paper. It works very well for me,try it.

 

I'm sure I read this tip here on the forum years ago.

 

Dave 

Edited Friday at 11:20 AM by davyboy

[petervisser]

Hi Serpe. I recently posted this on my build log of the Cutty Sark and later saw your question regarding ratline templates. So I thought you might be interested in another method of tying these lines to your shrouds.

Ratlines are pretty straightforward but I decided to make a post on a nifty way to get the spacing uniform. I cut a small piece of toothpaste box packaging to the correct width, folded it in half and then clipped it to the outermost shrouds that take the ratlines. The tiny clothespins were purchased at Michaels, a craft store chain. With the "jig" in place, the ratlines are added to the shrouds at the top edge of the paper. I'm not sure if this has been tried before, so apologies to the originator. Once the ratlines have been added to the lower mast shrouds, the sheets, tacks and clew lines will be added to the courses on all three masts.

Here is a picture of the "ratline tool" (patent pending) in place along with a pic of the tools in use for this rivetting aspect of model ship building. The foam panel behind the shrouds isn't necessary and is there simply to make the ratlines show up better in the photo. All the best with you model!

 

[serpe]

Thanks all for your advice. Into the breach I go.

[Dr PR]

The problem with using a clip-on guide without having a template for guidance is that the spacing between lines can creep, especially on the ends. After a while the lines are not parallel to the water line, running high on one end or the other.

 

I speak from experience! And that is why I always have a template that I can use for reference.

[wefalck]

Absolutely ! This is what the engineer would call cumulative errors.

 

For the outhermost shrouds, I would use a 'cow-hitch' (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cow_hitch), where the loose end returns on itself. This is the same amount of work as a clove-hitch, but looks more like 'real' thing.

Edited yesterday at 01:29 PM by wefalck

[James H]

This is how I do it.

 

[wefalck]

... it also a good idea to draw onto the template the shrouds as they should be. This shows you immediately, whether you are pulling them together by accident.

 

Leave securing the knots until you are sure that everything is adjusted to be 'ship-shape, Bristol-fashion', unless you use some organic-solvent based varnish or shellac, which can be re-dissolved, should further adjustment be needed.

[Clark]

8 minutes ago, wefalck said:

... it also a good idea to draw onto the template the shrouds as they should be. This shows you immediately, whether you are pulling them together by accident.

 

Leave securing the knots until you are sure that everything is adjusted to be 'ship-shape, Bristol-fashion', unless you use some organic-solvent based varnish or shellac, which can be re-dissolved, should further adjustment be needed.

First and last shroud is mostly sufficient.

Clark

[dvm27]

A great tip from Druxey I learned is to tie every fifth ratline first. This insures proper spacing and non-pinching of the shroud lines. Then add every third ratline. Finaly, fill in the rest. This technique has the added advantage of seeming to be faster then the Sisyphean task of filling in from the bottom up.

Edited 22 hours ago by dvm27

[serpe]

Thanks everyone this helps a lot.

[Capt. Kelso]

No matter which method you use (trial and error) I find doing ratlines is a "mind set". It's a slow tedious time-consuming process!