_SalD_

Welcome EJ_L, I just recently retired so I have some time on my hands to play around. There are some nice tutorials on YouTube explaining a lot of the 3-D commands.

Thanks Elijah, It'd be nice if I could build the real thing that quickly. Thanks druxey, you're right about the hull planking, there's not too much of it.

Hi John, welcome aboard. You're doing a great job on the Portland in spite of those terrible instructions.

For those of you who have been directed here from my Armenia build in the ‘Build Logs for SCRATCH SHIP MODEL PROJECTS’, please bear with me. For those of you not coming from that build link I will be developing a 3-D model of the Hudson River sidewheeler, Armenia. Briefly, the Armenia (1847-1886) was built by Thomas Collyer, New York. She had a wood hull with an overall length of 187 feet, a molded beam of 28 feet with an extreme beam of 50 feet with a depth of 8 feet 6 inches. She displaced 391 tons. She was powered by a Henry Dunham vertical (walking) beam engine. The paddlewheels are 29 feet 4 inches in diameter by 8 feet 3 inch wide. I will be following drawings, by F. Van Loon Ryder dated 1954, 1/8” (1:96) scale, resized to 3/16” scale. The purpose of building this model is to help me better understand how to actually physically build this model from scratch and to learn 3-D cad. I will be building this model with AutoCAD version 2013. I’ve used AutoCAD for close to 30 years now but never its 3-D functions. This will be my first attempt at a 3-D model so all you proficient users of 3-D cad, if you see me doing something really stupid please don’t hesitate to let me know. That goes for all you steamboat experts also, as this is my first steam powered boat, if you notice that I am making some major faux pas on the ship please let me know. Alright enough talk lets draw something. I started by scanning the hard copy of the drawings and making .tiff files of them. Those files were then inserted into AutoCAD and scaled to 3/16” (1:64) scale. Using the Body Line drawing I laid the keel using a polyline and sweep command. Next I used polylines to trace over the body line cross sections. From these tracings I extruded the bulkheads needed to form the hull. A little a## backwards with this next step but using the bulkheads I formed the bulkhead former. Slots were made in each bulkhead with matching ones in the bulkhead former. These pieces will be used as templates to construct the actual model. Once all the bulkheads and the bulkhead former (BF) were completed I used the ‘loff’ command between each bulkhead to create the hull. OMG, if real planking could be this easy. Hull complete.

Hello all. This is my third build log here on MSW and will be my first attempt at scratch building a ship. The ship that I will be trying to build is a Hudson River sidewheeler named the Armenia. I acquired plans for this vessel through my local model club (Connecticut Marine Model Society) and there are two main reasons I decided to build her. First I found the ‘walking beam engine’ that drives her paddlewheels to be a fascinating piece of machinery; the second and maybe the more important is that the admiral likes her too. The original plans, by F. Van Loon Ryder dated 1954, are drawn at 1/8” (1:96) scale. There are four drawings detailing the ships profile, body lines, the engine, and different deck layouts and one sheet of technical specifications. The Armenia (1847-1886) was built by Thomas Collyer, New York. She had a wood hull; length 185 feet on deck, 187 feet overall; 28 feet molded beam, 50 feet extreme beam; depth 8 feet 6 inches; 391 tons. She was powered by a Henry Dunham vertical (walking) beam engine and had an unusually long stroke of 14 feet. The paddlewheels are 29 feet 4 inches in diameter an 8 feet 3 inch wide, turning at 23 rpm. In 1852 the Armenia was lengthened to 212 feet, increasing tonnage to 421; cylinder diameter increased to 42 inches; a second boiler added with second stack aft of the original stack and the typical guard posts and hog framing added. I will be modeling her original configuration. Since this is my first scratch build I’ve been a bit hesitant in starting her mainly because I wasn’t too sure of what material to use and how much of it I needed. After hemming and yawing for a few months I decided to do what I’ve done for the past 40 years and that’s to make my own drawings of the ship so I’d have a better understanding of just how she was built. I’ve only done building (structural) drawings but I think with the set of original drawings and a little help from the CMMC members and the people on this site I should be alright. For my set of drawings I decided to redraw them at 3/16” (1:64) scale instead of the original 1/8” scale. I thought it might be a little easier to build a slightly larger ship since the eyesight just ain’t what it used to be. At 3/16” scale the model will be approximately 35” long by 9 ½” wide. I also decided that instead of just making a set of 2-dimensional drawings I would try drawing this ship in 3-dimensional cad. I’m doing this for two reasons: One, since this is my first scratch build I will get a much better understanding of how the parts go together and secondly, I have used AutoCAD pretty much since its inception but only it’s 2-D capabilities so I thought to myself, self, maybe it’s time to learn something new. So I will be making a 3-D model of the ship before I attempt to physically build it. This should also save me from wasting a lot of material since it’s a lot easier to erase and redraw than it is to remake a number of pieces. Because I am drawing this ship in cad I thought it would be more appropriate to do so in the ‘CAD and 3D Modelling/Drafting Plans with Software’ forum on this site. So until I start the physical part of this build I will be continuing at the following link: http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/14198-3-d-armenia-by-sald-–-hudson-river-sidewheeler-1847/?p=440043 I apologize for rambling on, like my daughter tells me “TLDR” (Too Long, Didn’t Read), but if anyone would like additional information about this ship please let me know, I’d be more than happy to send it or post it here. TO BE CONTINUED…..

Nicely done hervie. Even if I had a table saw I don't know if I would have ever thought of notching the planks that way. I think we all use whatever tools are most familiar to us hence the use of the drafting template to cut out my ports. As far as cutting the planks cross grain, use a very shape blade, a guide for the blade, use several small cuts to go through the plank, and have plenty of patience. Great job so far, keep it up.

This is just speculation on my part and not from any research but looking at it from a purely structural engineering point of view (since I am one) it appears that the arch is providing additional support for the exterior side of the lower deck beam. Referring to Glenn’s Heroine build log, this lower exterior beam is spanning the length of the wheel well and is supporting half the weight of the paddle wheel. By building the arch above this beam and connecting the arch and lower beam together with the vertical wall timbers it would provide a great amount of stiffness to the exterior side of the ship. The geometry (height) of the arch would then be a function of its span and design properties of the material used to build it, i.e. the higher the arch the smaller the stresses. Debris, water turbulence and aesthetics were probably also considered.

Cathead, thanks for the information, I've just started to read up on these ships and have a lot to learn. Roger, thank you for the reference. Kurt, I appreciate your help and just let me know what the fee is. John, funny you should ask, the wife and I were up there last weekend. Took lots of pictures.

I am fairly new to model ship building and have completed two wind powered sailing ships and would like to try a steam powered vessel for my next build. From my local ship building club I acquired a set of plans for the Hudson River sidewheeler ‘Armenia’ by F. Van Loon Ryder, dated 1954, 1:96 scale. What drew my attention to her was the interesting mechanism amidships that I’ve come to learn is called a ‘Walking Beam Engine’. As of now I’ve just started to do a little research on her and in the process have acquired the three books pictured below. Most of the information I’ve found by searching the web and in these books relate more towards the western (stern wheeler) style steamboat than the Hudson River (side wheeler) type steamboat. I was wondering if anyone could recommend a book or website that might give me more information on the construction of the side wheelers, specifically the hull construction. Thanks

Third base.... hervie, thinking more about your question I went back and reviewed what I did and looked at your pictures a little closer. First the top of the batten should have been aligned with the second mark down on the bulkhead. I think you have the top lined up with the third mark down which, like you said, is for the wale. You still might be able to use that though. The gun port sill is made from 1/4"x 3/16" stock, with the 3/16" side being vertical, if the distance between the two marks is 3/16" (I can't remember off hand if it is) you should be able to sit the sill right on the batten. So essentially you did mark the bottom of the sill. Now that the brain cells are firing again what I did was, I lined up the BOTTOM, not the top, of the batten with the second mark down. That way I could place the top of the sill up against the bottom of the batten, that I had left in place. I also think I turned the ship upside down when I set them so I had gravity working with me. I hope all this makes sense and sorry for the confusion, I'll just go back in my corner and watch.

Great job so far Hervie. I really enjoyed building this ship and Chuck did an excellent job of explaining all the steps. If I remember correctly I think I kept the temporary batten in place while I set the bottom sills. It helped to keep them in place.

David, While I was doing research into the same topic for my Syren I found this picture showing what the current netting looks like on the Constitution. It appears to be two pieces. I am far from being an expert on this subject so I don't know if it's 'historically' correct or not. If you use Google Map and type in 'Constitution' you can 'walk' around the ship for better details.

Jesse, I had the same problem with the guns being too high. I removed most of the lower lug, which you can't really see anyway, and added a pin to secure the cannon to the sled. http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/8410-us-brig-syren-by-sald-–-model-shipways/?p=344563 My cannons still ended up a little high in the ports. I wouldn't mess around with the ports at this stage of the build. (just my opinion)

Gary after going back and reviewing what I had done I don't think there is any reason you need to install the hammock cranes and netting at this point. I don't see a problem with waiting until after you install the deadeyes. And your gut was right they do get in the way, I bent a few of the cranes and snapped the wood rail a couple times while working around them.

Great start on your new build Brian, I'll be trailing along on both. I have to learn how to do those indexes it's a nice feature, thanks for doing it.

Great job Elijah the hull looks terrific.

Ken, thank you for sharing your technique for doing the trailboard scroll and for the template. I'm not building this ship nor am I planning to but I liked your method so I thought I would give it a try just to practice. I have one question, how is the wooden finger held in place? Thanks again.

Thanks Elijah, didn't mean to scare you and don't worry I'll build another ship. I'll also post pictures of the case once I build it.

Thanks Don and again for all the likes.

Steve, thanks so very much for the kind words I really appreciate them.

Nice work Richard, hard to tell from the picture but make sure you have enough room behind the belaying pin to get the rigging line in between the pin and the bulwarks when you tie off the line. I had a couple of questions: Did anyone finish these differently? I let them soak for a few minutes in Minwax wipe on ploy, clear satin and then made sure the holes were not blocked after they dried. Which supplied threads did you use to strop... did you serve or just tie it off? the 0.012" thread and seized it around the traveler but didn't serve the line. What type of glue did you use to attach the eye bolts, etc to the bulwark? I used medium ca with a 5-10 second drying time to give me some time position it correctly. They have thicker ca which will give you 10 -20 seconds. I also placed all the eye bolts in the holes prior to gluing them to make sure they fit, then took one out added the glue and replaced it in the hole.

Thanks Thomas, your build of the Syren was a big inspiration for me, your work is magnificent. Thanks Richard Thanks Ryland it was nice meeting and talking with you at the conference too. Thanks Jack I'll definitely check the museum out. Thanks John and it will be a pleasure to work together on the ships, talk to you at the next meeting.

Thanks Tom, maybe next time. Thanks Jesse, it is a little bittersweet, it’s nice to have finished but I will miss working on her. I do need to build a case so that should keep me busy for a while. Thanks Bob and Jack, appreciate the nice words And thanks for all the likes Al, thanks and I did have something in mind but that was before I won the award. I think now I’ll just retire from ship building, you know, go out on top. Just kidding, I had acquired a set of plans from my club a while back of a Hudson River paddleboat called the Armenia. What drew my attention to her was the interesting mechanism amidships that I’ve come to learn is called a ‘Walking Beam Engine’. As of now I’ve just started to do a little research on her and am in the process of redrawing the set of plans I have to a larger scale. So this is what I would like to do but am not sure if my skills match my desires.

Thanks wyzwyk and I do appreciate the feather. Thanks Jack and likewise it was very nice meeting you and Ryland at the conference. Thanks Jimmy, I was planning on bring it to the next meeting for the guys who didn't make the conference. Thanks Dirk, you've taught me a lot through your own build and comments

Epilog What a journey! It’s been approximately 18 months since I began this build and now that it’s over it seems like I just started. I’ve learned a lot about ship building over this time and come to know many knowledgeable people on this site. I’d like to thank you all for your encouragement and kind words and for all the 'likes'. I’d also like to thank my biggest supporter, my wife. She has been very understanding these past 18 months by letting me do something that I've wanted to for a very long time (I can’t wait to see the list). I’d also like to thank Chuck for designing a kit and writing an instruction manual that even novices like myself can follow. The kit itself for the most part is well made and the only pieces I substituted were the cannonades. I think they should provide a bit more rigging line though. Again thank you all. (need to get a better backdrop)