Baltic_submariner

Further update. 

Plastic railing-style profiles from Plastruct helped me to make railings on forecastle, lifeboats area and stern. Used similar stair-shaped profiles on stairs. Works pretty ok at least in my opinion.

Mounted 3D printed AA guns; 2 flakvierlings and 2 M42. As manufacturer make only single barrel M42 so I slightly modified mount to accomodate twin barrels. Case of doubt are shields on such aa mounts. It was my first try of 3D printed details and it was real hell to clean printed parts from supports without breaking everything. Partial fail as I was forced to scratchbuild some of broken details like crew seats.

On stern transom railing is modified to adjust it to depth charges chutes and is make from 0,75 and 0,5mm plastic rod profile.

Decided to start second Flower - this time definitely HMCS Snowberry. Flowers had so many interesting combat variants.

Update on ship. Based on rescaled card model I tried to make rest of superstructure, which is heavily modified from normal Flowers:

Superstructure is dry fitted and require many work to be in acceptable shape. 

Added few more depth charges on stern and added few hatches on deck. Mounted 10,5cm cannon on forecastle

Shape of armored covers for single 2cm on sides is not known. Few drawings and model which photo I found on finescale shows semi circular shape.

Photo from https://cs.finescale.com/fsm/m/online/1234077.aspx

Different drawing shows even more different placement of armament:

Which however has few very visible differences. No cut stern, no single 2cm on forecastle, no protection on sternmost twin 3,7cm, 102mm/10,5cm cannon placed on pedestal, also as far as I know Germans didn't used stern racks for depth charges like on Allied or IJN ships.

Also no drawing of German Flowers is barely similar and all of them differs strongly from others. 

Week long update.

PA-2 ex Hallebarde recived major update of works. 

Engraved plates of foredeck. Now I will sand it with very fine-grained sandpaper and repeat engreaving.

Stern deck partially equipped. British depth charge throwers were modified to look more like german one. Mooring equipment placed as same as details and depth charge chutes. Kit bombs from stern magazines cut into single one.

Stern superstructure. This is where Dark Flower loses her big part of similarity to Flowers. Three big platforms for AA mounts. Lowest with Twin M42 3,7cm, middle one with Flakvierling and highest with Single M42 3,7cm. I'm suprised about last one as highest platform definitely has space for two mounts or at least for one Twin M42 3,7cm. However famous photo definitely shows single mount. I bet it's due to center of gravity which was heavily disturbed with such mass of metal so high on ship. Also last floor of front superstructure had additional Flakvierling so overweight could be serious.

Test fit of superstructure. 

Both flying platforms were also supported by few long steel rods but most of them I mount after painting. Painting of some areas even now will be pain.

All scratch made with usage of compasses, ruler and pencil. 

30 minutes ago, yvesvidal said:

Very interesting project. I like that you felt compelled to build a surface vessel to go with your nice collection of submarines.

That is exactly what happened to me, after spending close to 2 years on the large U-552 Boot from Trumpeter. And if you feel like 1/144 is kind of small for a Flower Class, you can always look at this build log: 

 

I will be following your progress with a lot of interest.

 

Yves

Oh yes. I needed something different. Also I very enjoy non-standard variants of famous ships so PA-2 was easy choice as everybody knows Flowers but almost nobody heard about her  I'll call her Dark Flower  In case of subs in 1/144 I still have Schukas from Mikromir and Zvezda, VIIC, VIIC/41 and XXI from Revell and Gato from Trumpeter on stock with description "to build" so subs definitely return, same as wooden vessels. I have some ideas how to merge civilian KFK with wooden parts but now Flower.

Wait. 1/48 so it must be giant. Your Snowberry is beautiful but telling the truth I have no space for such leviathan. 1/144 for subs and small vessels and 1/72 in case of midget subs/fast attack crafts is maximum as I simply have little space.

Little update to Hallebarde.

I made deck plates pattern and midship deck. It was a little tricky as it required to make some supports for midship deck.

Deck plates on stern deck. Rear will be cut near deck and railing placed.

Supports for midship deck.

Superstructure of forecastle is based on HMCS Agassiz as I remember French and Canadian early Flowers were quiet same.

Oops. It looks like drop of glue made little mess. I'll repair it in no-time.

Superstructure is made from xero and plastic sheets. Forecastle deck will be fully engraved. 10,5cm cannon was mounted in different way than on allied Flowers so it will be modified accordingly.

Plates of deck fully engraved ( using ruler, blunt needle and scalpel ) Stern after first big sanding and lines will need further engraving. Now frames and bulwarks on midship part. 

Minesweeping gear will be taken most probably from ICM 1/144 KFK as for such KFK I have infinitely more peaceful idea. A fishing vessel

Hello. It's been a long time. 

Many years ago as teenager I played into rather forgotten now PC video game Enigma Rising Tide which was arcade style game about what-if WWII naval scenario. Even in such time I was suprised when I saw strange-looking escort vessel looking like highly modified Flower class corvette with anormally looking pyramid of aa guns platforms, serving in German Navy. Due to fact that most vessels in such game were purely fictious or very highly modified vessels from real world countries I was almost sure that such ship was just imagination of developers.

However I was wrong. Such ships really existed although their names were different as same as their first owner. Four French built Flower class corvettes were captured in 1940 in French yards and after long reconstruction three of them entered sevrice in Kriegsmarine. Their service was rather short but very active and all of them were destroyed in days after D-Day. They were reconstructed as AA escort ships with minesweeping capabilities, their French armament was removed and instead were armed with 1*I 105mm gun, 2*I 20mm guns 2*IV 20mm guns, 2*II ( or 1*I and 1*II ) 37mm guns. 

http://www.cbrnp.com/RNP/Flower/GALLERY/German/PA2-1.jpg

PA-2 on photo. Maybe I'm blind but setup of 37mm AA seems as 1*I and 1*II.

Flower class corvettes have such funny looking shiluettes and were rather popular subject among manufacturers with many kits availaible on market. However there is small problem. French Flowers were akin to first ships of this class what means different forecastle, much shorter than made with plastic kits. However I found card model of HMCS Agassiz by Polish publisher Modelik which depicts Flower in very early variant in scale 1:100 and has really amazing level of details. I rescaled some of pages into 1:144 and decided to merge such parts with HMCS Snowberry by Revell. I like this ships so it's most probably not only vessel from such class which I want to build. Original HMCS Snowberry or pink painted HMS Anchusa are strong candidates for second Flower.

There is little source for such unique version so many work will be probably based on solutions known from other ships in such era. Most of info comes from such site http://www.cbrnp.com/RNP/Flower/PROFILE/German_Flower.htm Years ago I made such ship in 1/350 from Mirage Hobby kit but there is little comparison due to size.

Box is BIG and it's not marketing trick. I bought also wooden deck for such ship but not sure did I use them as German Flowers most probably never wore wooden deck.

Decks are cut into parts. Midship section as same as big parts of superstructure will be taken from rescaled xero of Modelik HMCS Agassiz.  Parts of xero will be moved into polystyren sheets of various thickness. AA guns will be 3d printed AA guns from Polish manufacturer Modelhobby.

Sides are corrected to the short forecastle variant. As shape I used Agassiz parts.

Not sure about ASW and minesweeping gear but most probably I make 6 single drop chutes, 3 per side and 4 deph charge throwers, 2 per side as areformentioned photo suggest such thing. 

Last thing. My 1/144 coastal submarines collection. I definitely must make something from surface.

List of them:

1.British submarine HMS Holland 1 - first sub of Royal Navy

2. Austro-Hungarian submarine SMS U-10 from German U-boot Type UB-1 class,

3. Imperial Russian submarine Delfin, one of first Russian submarines ( torpedoes are mounted on specific mounts called Drzewiecki drop collars ( used mainly on French and Russian submarines, with few examples in other countries ),

4. Type IIB U-Boot U-23. Combat boat of famous highest scoring WWII submarine ace Otto Kretschmer. This boat in 1942 was moved in really interesting journey via land and Danube river into Romanian base and operated against VMF. Whole 30'th U-Boot Black Sea Flotilla scored some hits on soviet mostly smaller vessels. All six boats were sunk by soviet air raids or scuttled near Turkish coast after Romania and Bulgaria change of sides.

5. Type XXIII U-Boot U-2336. Last naval action of WWII in Europe when such boat sunk two allied merchants. Last one was sunk literally few minutes or hour before armistice.

First three are from small Ukrainian manufacturer Mikromir, which make plenty of submarines in various scales, often less known or prototypes. Type IIB is from ICM while Type XXIII is from Trumpeter. Collective case for "coastal" boats.

Hello, I got pinged so I'm back 😃

Your Polaris look interesting and I see that you added side planks on deck.

From perspective of time I agree that number of side guns or their arrangement was too big/tight. If I would made such ship again ( what isn't impossible ) I would stay with one gunport per side less and mount smaller cannons with big rearrangement of their positions ( model is in size and scale of Le Renard with 14 guns if I remember this corectly but now looking at such guns I feel my heresy with them ) Rest of additions were still needed for me to avoid so many empty spaces. Polaris is very nice ship for customization. 

Interesting review of very forgotten subject.

Few years ago my friend gifted to me from same publisher model of yacht-light cruiser Almaz and armored cruiser Rossiya and I was amazed by level of their details ( Almaz even had interior of some rooms ) Well, I think I'm not talented enough for them so they are staying in my library.

If anybody didn't know they make many other ship models from sailing ships into the modern navy ships. It's Ukrainian or Russian publisher so they have many subjects from their history but not only. They published probably all bigger ships from Russian side of 1904-05 war with Japan as same as many ships from Soviet Navy but had also many of even more subjects.

If someone is interested they had many architectural models - mainly from Russia, including gigantic model Kremlin fortress in separate parts.

There is also another Ukrainian/Russian publisher named Dom Bumagi ( I could mess a little transcription into english ) which also makes very detailed models of warships. Not sure did they are connected or not.

From some time I was interested in building something more exotic with rig from other part of the world. Found this pirate junk and arab dhow. Model very good and used wood was at least for me top quality. As with most of generic ships made by me I decided to modify some of parts. 

I added bigger cannon on bow platform with full rigging as I saw in one of build logs of MSW modeller @AntonyUK here which log was great inspiration to me.

Also I modified poop deck railings from wooden balustrade into more solid variant.

I decided to modify a little two sampans as I wasn't sure about painting them in wood. First I painted them black and then using CA glue I placed strips of cherry wood for hull and pear for gunwales.

Red flags as I read were used by chinese pirates so I decided to made easy and I think nice looking triangular flags on masts. Whole rigging of Junk is at least very interesting and so different in comparing to the square or lateen rig.

Ropes given by Amati seems that didn't shreds themself than ropes from previously build models which was very nice.

Telling the truth I managed to like very much such strange rigs and I would definitely want to try build a Geobukseon in same scale which I saw on ebay. Anyway now I would build Greek Galliot from Amati or Pinta from same producer. Maybe my approach is strange but I try to not repeat same types and collect different types of ships. 

After some time of work I managed to finish my galeon. As I said I exchanged some parts. On forecastle I placed scratchbuild two small cannons but after placing them I realised such guns are practicaly invisible. Canonballs are stashed so my Bucaneer is ready to sortie! 😀

I exchanged some circular deadeyes for older model of triangle deadeyes to simulate years of service and various repairs made to the ship.

I realised that I very like ships with Black Flag so decided that next kit will be from similar "owners" but from different times and from different part of the world. Chinese Pirate Junk from Amati. It's even in same scale so it could be nice to compare them.

On 8/28/2021 at 6:11 PM, Backer said:

Great work.

This model looks like a Golden Hind kit. Correct??

Thank you for appreciation!

This kit is I think is based on Golden Hind kit with few different parts beyond them. Their rigging looks the same as with name of parts on frames and sails. Also I think Buccaneer is easier due to lack of guns on lower deck and less complicated ornaments. However it's great model and kit it's very pleasurable. 

In the meantime I worked with my Buccaneer. 

Masts and dinghy mounted, balustrade has been exchanged. I decided to mount rear gallery ornaments on ship hull. I painted them all in red and then after paint dried I carefully sanded convex part to reveal "gold" of brass.

PE staircases I exchanged into made from cherry wood.

As this is pirate ship so she must have a treasure? This time locker is on board of dinghy. Maybe will be launched soon near lone island? Who knows? 😉 

I try to photograph interior scratch build by me but little is visible. I decided to mount few ammo stashes on deck. I must fill them with wood and cannon balls on top ( as I didn't want to use so many cannon balls on them )

I've managed to work more on hull and tapered masts.

Metal gunports mounted. Upper parts of forecastle and aftcastle were planked in cherry as I very like it's colour, some bottom is planked with sapelli mixed with pear wood although after sanding and varnishing it's hard to see a difference.

I've mounted chase guns. On stern I made tree pattern with alternately glued sapelli and pear. Here is a little bit better visible. I know that aftcastle rear has some errors although this will be covered in 90% by other details and ornaments.

I've decided to made some changes on prow area as fully planked deck looked a little bit bland for me.

San Juan is finished. Kit was really fun to build even if whole ship was easy and non requiring any gymnastics during assembly. 

For blackening of anchors I used AK Interactive 159 Metal burnishing liquid which gives nice a little rusty look. Liquid is very easy to use but beware as it's rather "heavy" chemistry.

I bought this ship few months ago as always wanted to have classic galleon. Again after vacational San Juan wanted something not big but impressive.

Again I wanted to custimize my ship as it's just generic galleon with Black Flag attached so I decided to made some modifications to give a bit of individuality:

- made gunports for chase guns on stern transom,

- made visible partial interior of rear superstructure room with 2 guns, gratings and ammo stashes,

- made bow pursuit guns,

- exchange full gallery balustrade into baluster based balustrade,

- change of ornamentations and I have big desire to print resized mini painting printed in color on upper stern transom. Here I probably use widely known art from book of Howard Pyle. Also ornaments printed on laser printer do not convince me in any way. In Spanish Galleons by Angus Konstam I saw few colorful examples which are inspiration. I await for his two books Buccaneers and Pirate Ships.

- change of position of few guns in rear superstructure. 

gunport is temporarly mounted 🙂

gratings placed only for photo

Hello Clare!

I saw Le Coureur from three publishers. Wooden kit from Mamoli which as I understand isn't as small as size of real ship could suggests, two card models from Shipyard ( one is laser cut as I remember while other is full paper ) and fully ribed behemoth from China or Taiwan. I would rather choose Mamoli ship and upgrade her on my own. Long ago as kid I made some paper models from local publishers. Nothing spectatular to be sure, mainly due to me. To this time survived only small CSS Virginia ironclad waterline from anonymous publisher and Admiral Ushakov from ProModel but this definitely proved me that paper models aren't for me. 

Montanes has very nice shapes, really it's beautiful ship which isn't as mainstream as certain very famous British First Rate while still having very interesting history.

Meanwhile I worked a little bit with deck dinghy. I decided to use kit supplied and slightly modify her. I added rudder and rubbing strakes from wood. I made 4 oars and fixable mast, yard and bowsprit with some obvious coils of ropes. I'm not exactly happy about paint connection between black and brown but I probably stain this place with some modellers wash.

I found on rigging scheme of xebeck/jabeque that lateen sail had more rigging as pulleys to setting sails. It could be a little tricky now but I decided to mount such pulleys and ropes because this sail is just empty. Four ropes and two blocks give a little bit more life. 

[screenshots from Occre page]

32 minutes ago, catopower said:

Paul,

I don't know why nobody else has commented since you started this build. But, it is looking very nice.

 

I agree that this is a very nice looking ship. Although you are an experienced modeler, I think it would make an ideal first model for a beginner. It has a nice easy hull shape for planking, and a square-tuck stern, which also makes for ease of planking. There are some metal parts, so they simply need to be painted, and glued into place. Again, this is easy for a beginner to do. Plus, the lateen rig is simpler than a square rig, and it's interesting.

 

You've done a nice job making your own replacement parts and showing us what an experienced ship modeler can do with this kit!

 

Thank you for an answer!

Yes, model is easy and very pleasant to build. Some time ago I decided that I must build something like such felucca because last model which I made tired me very much with rigging. You have right that it's kit for beginners although at least for me it's shame that she isn't more popular in comparison to the Polaris or some other kits. Here I suppose that lateen rig isn't as popular as schooner or square. I'm not trying to criticize kit as it's good model, only such metal parts didn't appeal to me but you have right, for most beginners it's not a problem. Also I think such tries in scratch build are good introduction to the bigger modifications and such models are nice bases for starting with imagination. 

BTW. In case of Occre models you can order plate with name of ship directly from them and they made such plate for free. I have such plates for frigate Mercedes ( completed ) and third rate Montanes ( one of my shipmodelling dreams ) Maybe this helps others too 🙂

After reading ( although it's not most proper word ) book Rigging Period Fore-and-Aft Craft by Lennarth Petersson I'm ill about making lugger as this rig looks so different from most known to me.

I'm not sure am I experienced 🙂 Still I made some very stupid mistakes and some parts are bigger or lesser problem for me. Overall it's great and nice challenge with trying how to solute some problems. 

Actualization.

I almost completed hull and rigged masts with sails. I was getting used to square rigging and some of parts were very confusing, like metal toggles ( I think it's english name of this part ) Ropes are coiled, jack is flying although it's not over. On page of one Spanish modeller I found that San Juan transported post from Spain into Cuba so I decided to arm such boat with 4-6 swivel guns. I doubt that such vessel could be unarmed but of course I can be wrong. Now also time for some cargo on board.

This was really different from rigging of deadeyes and laynards but when at start I was thinking it's easier, I was wrong. It's so different but I realised obvious fact that I fall in love in fore-and-aft rigged vessels 😉

Occre kit is supplied with many metal parts of questionable quality and I decided to replace them with my parts made from wood. Main problem was with pumps, anchor windlass and some of cleats. Instruction suggested glueing or drilling a hole inside metal parts. I didn't have machinery for such operations so I cut proper pieces of circular rod and made two holes. One all the way trough for hand operated mechanism and second to mount immitations of water mouth. I also cut from paper some very thin stripes.

Next I glued rolled strips of paper to immitate parts of pump as same as advised Sapelli part.

Last part was mounting a handle and water mouth

I think it's much better than supplied metal pumps.

Anchor windlass was similar case. I glued together two pieces of thin wood to later cut sides of windlass and from same circular rod I made main part.

I glued similar paper strips and using profiled file I made curved shape.

Next step was cutting off shape of sides of anchor windlass and many, sanding.

Last step was making from metal rod windlass handle and shaping of drum ends at ends of winch reel. I hope I didn't mixed any word as I used words from modern windlass. I certainly add some details to such windlass. You can make laugh but I was really suprised how satisfactionary is scratch building of parts.

Another parts were catheads? ( I hope I didn't made mistake ) to which anchor is mounted by ropes. As It can be potential further problems I drilled a small holes and mounted nails with removed head. All parts await for further sanding and shaping.

Another case are ship dinghies as they are also casted in metal and I'm thinking about making my own dinghies from wood.

Hello, 

I found this little cutie and decided to build her as escape from big and complicated ships. She looks like isn't popular kit and I wonder why? I realized that I very like look of lateen rigged vessels and she was smaller from Chebec which will be definitely a few months build. Here I will add to the San Juan probably 2 swivel guns as this ship wasn't big and maybe I'll paint her. I have big urge to made single plank with mathematic calculations - this seems as very big challenge and as San Juan has lenght of biggest frame about 70mm it will not require many 5mm width planks to fit.

So far I've made skeleton and planked deck. 

During previous months I made such frigate - Nuestra Senora de las Mercedes.

Hello, your Diana looks awsome and it's very clean builded. 

I'm building now her cousine Nuestra Senora de las Mercedes in similar manner ( pure wood and no paint ) and your build helped me a lot as they share a lot of parts.

16 hours ago, Havelock said:

Fantastic build. Love the upgrades! No one is going to mess with that schooner!

Thank you for appreciation! Your Polaris look great too! 

Battleships:

Ting Yuen 1/350 Bronco

Tsesarevitch 1904 1/350 Trumpeter

Orel 1/350 Zvezda

Iwami 1/350 Zvezda ( heavy modification )

Danton 1/350 Trumpeter

Lord Nelson 1/350 Trumpeter

Marat 1/350 Zvezda

Musashi 1/350 Tamiya

Cruisers:

Varyag 1/350 Zvezda

Myoko 1/350 Aoshima

Destroyers:

Yukikaze 1/350 Hasegawa

USS England 1/350 Trumpeter

Submarines:

ORP Bielik 1/350 Mikromir 

ORP Orzeł, Sęp, Dzik and Sokół 1/400 Mirage Hobby

K-3 1/350 Mikromir

S-13 1/350 Mikromir

Shch-307 1/350 Mikromir

HMS Graph 1/350 Revell ( British Type VIIC )

I-19 AFV Club 1/350

I-27 AFV Club 1/350

I-56 AFV Club 1/350 ( slightly modified early I-58 )

I-58 AFV Club 1/350

I-36 AFV club 1/350 ( modification of I-58 with conversion from B3 class into B1 )

I-37 Aoshima 1/350

I-44 Aoshima 1/350 ( modification of standard kit I-19 )

I-47 Aoshima 1/350

I-370 Aoshima 1/350

I-365 Aoshima 1/350

USS Gato 1941 AFV Club 1/350

Gato class 1942 AFV Club 1/350

USS Harder AFV Club 1/350 ( kitbash of various hulls and conning towers )

PNS Ghazi AFV Club 1/350 ( kitbash of various hulls and conning towers )

RoCN Hai Shih AFV Club 1/350

Some of them were gifted to friends or presented in local hobby shop.

Thank you all for answers and explanation! 

This makes sense. Technological progress in later half of XIX-th century and in XX-th century was very fast and uncomparable to the ealier centuries. Almost everything was changed, material used, systems of armament, range and speed. ect.

I have problem how to ask this question so I made rather long post. My aim is not start of any flamewar or something.

I read some articles and books and I come to the strange conclusion that during age of sail capitulation of ships were much more common than in example during XX century. Everybody heard about surrender of French or Spanish ships of the line during Battle of Trafalgar as same as various events from other wars. I realised that capitulation was pretty common and sometimes occured after short battle and not very big damage sustained. I can fully understand this cases most of times.

Peruvian monitor Huascar surrended to Chile. Even during siege of Weihavei Chinese commanders surrounded their warships in 1895. Well known was approach of Admiral Nicolas Nebogatov who surrounded his heavily damaged battleships during Battle of Tsushima for which he later was prosecuted in Imperial Russia. However later approach of commanders was drasticly different and cases of surrounding of bigger warships were sporadical. I leave here cases of capturing warship by enemy in port like destroyer USS Stewart or later german destroyer ZG3 Hermes and fate of some Marine Nationale ships not scuttled in Toulon in November 1942. I have on mind only cases of capitulation of warship on open sea. Then from WWI onwards we have only few such cases like Bolshevik destroyers ceded to Estonia in 1919, surrender of few submarines during WWII and egyptian destroyer Ibrahim el Awal in 1956.  No cruiser or battleship.

What causes such strong change of approach to surrender of bigger ships on sea?

I guess humanitarianism was not a case as sailors or soldiers were for very long time used as cannon fodder and it was considered as normal. Eighty Years War, Thirty Years War and Napoleonic Wars were bloody but later conflicts during XX-th century due to developing of new weapons become even deadlier.

Cost of building of steel warship was much bigger than even biggest wooden ship-ot-the line and maybe using this logic for Admiralities was more acceptable to lost their ships than give them to enemy?

I know that some of navies like IJN had very specific mentality and approach to life of their crews taken from "tradition" where human life never had bigger value but on "western culture" countries we have also cases of "suicidical battles" fought to the end like during Jutland or Pacific. Raise of nationalisms on world after French Revolution and Napoleonic Wars? 

I'm really curious but maybe I'm overthinking this and this has easier explanation?

On 4/9/2021 at 9:41 PM, Wintergreen said:

That was quick going! Did you build it in just about 4 weeks? Incredible. And a interesting alteration with guns and Jolly Roger 🙂

Well done!

Thank You!

Due to "popular diesese from Asia" I have locked in 80% my work place so I can work in home. That means after making up my teaching online work I can fully become a shipwright in my table placed shipyard  

I saw that many people makes Polaris and I'm really not suprised as kit is just wonderful but looks so empty on deck. Polaris I'm sure on 99% didn't presents any particular schooner but it's rather generic ship. Due to this I decided to add something to her. I can't do wrong with my fantasie. Guns were most obvious choice. Anchor winch was another thing which in my opinion should be added but I fully understand why it wasn't included in kit. Cannon balls made from 2mm bearing balls which are very cheap.

Now I have big desire to try some of cross sections as they look interesting and during work with plastics I've never saw such similar models.