Hr. Ms. O 19 1938 by Piet - FINISHED - scale 1:50 - submarine of the Royal Navy Netherlands in service 1939 - 1945

[Piet]

Hello all and thanks for visiting, your comments and likes, it means a lot to me.

 

@ John (Lad): thank you John, yep, the crew was always busy when loading torps and mines but especially when in action against the enemy. 

 

@ Wacko Joe: Thanks and you make me laugh.  When I posted all them pics I thought about you and Sjors, yuns like plenty of pictures     I'm glad you enjoy my build progresses toward completion.

 

@ Amateur Jan:  Yep, I have used strands from telephone wires.  They are super fine copper wire but in using them in this application prevents me of actually demonstrating the gantries work, they'll be too stiff for that.  I should have soaked them in boiling water first.  Guess what I'll use for the boat's antenna wires, yep, one single strand.  I'll stretch them to harden them and make them stiff to prevent a sag.  wait and see.

 

@ Chief Don: Great seeing you here in my dockyard, welcome.  Thank you very much for your very kind compliment, coming from you, Kevin and a few other "old" submariners it's especially appreciated.

 

@ Pete48:  Thanks agin Pete!!!!

 

@ Carl:  Thank you Carl and now you make me blush    Well, actually I do have a few more small hand tools and a few other small shop tools but yes, most was all done with small tools and let's not forget the strong fingers   

 

Okay, the dockyard was closed today.  Had a doctor's appointment to hear the verdict on the bladder biopsies.  We are still in limbo on them because of conflicting reports from the lab.  The biopsies were send to another lab for a second or third opinion.   Wont know for another 10 days.

 

Cheers,

[Remcohe]

Piet,

 

The deck is beginning to look really busy, I like it very much. It will draw the eye across the model and put life into your model. In my eyes you already surpassed the model shown in Den Helder just because of this. It really has an atmosphere.

 

Good luck in limbo, nobody likes it there....

 

Remco

[Piet]

Thank, you, thank you, thank you for your likes and visiting my dockyard.  All yuns are in my thoughts.

 

Hoi Remco and thank you for that big compliment, I'm overwhelmed and     I just wish that all you folks could actually visit and see the real McCoy.  Most of the times photos can make errors stand glaringly out and at other times they can make a model look pretty good but I'm thrilled with the way she's taking shape.  Even Gwen, with her VERY critical eye, can't find much to critique about, other then some paint touch-ups,she just ask questions on what all those gizmos are and do.  

 

The dockyard was closed Friday and Saturday.  Yesterday I did a lot of necessary research, some on health and some on other issues.  However, I opened the dockyard this morning and felt all your presence so I had to be extra careful in doing things correctly   

 

I actually attempted to install all the forward gantry parts and complete it.  The attempt was successful, even after having to mow the front yard!       And write our daughter a happy daughter's day letter.

 

After everything was completed and tested and admired my handywork, I noticed a grave error!!               I won't tell yuns what it is but like to open it as a quiz.  The first one who can point it out winds a BIG prize 

 

Here are a few pics I took for my archive and add them to this post for your viewing pleasure.

 

This shows most of the parts in a state of assembly to the port-side forward gantry post.  The boom elevation "come-along" has a "cable" wound around its drum and that long "cable" end dangling down is the fixed cable for the "come-along" and is fastened to the fwd part where the hook is.  The small clothe pin is holding one of the thimbles that is actually in process of being whipped.  It'll hook into the swivel plate aft and on up on the gantry post.  The "come-along" is also hooked to that swivel plate.   The "cable" thats being held by the large clothe pin will be rapped around another thimble with a hook that'll be hooked to that canted part right above the swivel plate brackets.  The pics below will show the completed gantry.

 

Here we see the upper "cable" thimble being whipped.

 

A side view of the completed gantry installation.  There is a little slack in the come-along but that can be taken out by winding the cable a little bit more on the drum.

Okay, I might as well post the question here, can anyone tell what's wrong with this installation?  The torpedo is just stuck into the loading tube below deck and may guid you into finding the problem.  

I had to hang some weight on the boom tackle to keep everything taught.

The black line coming out of the deck torpedo opening is to lower and raise torpedoes.  In real life this cable goes to an electrically driven drum.

 

Another shot looking aft.  

 

Looking forward.

 

Looking straight aft.  Don't look at the mess on the build board, just too lazy to keep cleaning things up and still needing some of the stuff.  Hey Remco, busier yet!!

 

Cheers, 

[Remcohe]

Sweet Piet.

 

Is the little diagonal support arm installed on the wrong side? Now the load pulls on the arm instead of compressing it, putting a lot of tension on the bolts keeping it in place

 

Yeah, busier workbench, it puts life into your shop

 

Remco

[amateur]

The lower 'winch' is rewired in the last pic, compared to previous ones (the cable does not return to the point it started from) .

 

I still don' t quite understand how the systemn works: the upper 'wire has two fixed endpoints, and two fixed points were it connects to that thing in the middle.

IN thepic the line is straight, so the boom can't go any lower than now depicted. However, the amount of cable that can 'remocved, by tensioning the lower pulley is very limited, so the upward movement of the boom is also very, very limited. When upward and downward movembet are som limited, what' the use of this constructioj over a rigid boom?

 

Jan

[amateur]

btw also the dinghy boom is not rigged as you depicted her previously....

 

Jan

[pete48]

That Looks incredible Piet, nicely done

 

Beat Regards,

Pete

[jud]

Looks great.

jud

Edited June 16, 2014 by jud

[Piet]

Thanks everyone for visiting, your comments and likes 

 

@ Remco:  Quote - "Is the little diagonal support arm installed on the wrong side? Now the load pulls on the arm instead of compressing it, putting a lot of tension on the bolts keeping it in place."

 

Yes, it's in tension.  It's welded to the "skinny" post and bolted to the deck structure below the deck surface.  Bolts in sheer are very strong and should pose no problems.  From an engineering point of view I'd rather have it in sheer anyhow.  This is also in accordance with the drawings.  Thus your suggestion is not what I was asking.  No price for you.    

 

@ Jan:  Quote -  "The lower 'winch' is rewired in the last pic, compared to previous ones (the cable does not return to the point it started from) .

I still don' t quite understand how the systemn works: the upper 'wire has two fixed endpoints, and two fixed points were it connects to that thing in the middle.

IN thepic the line is straight, so the boom can't go any lower than now depicted. However, the amount of cable that can 'remocved, by tensioning the lower pulley is very limited, so the upward movement of the boom is also very, very limited. When upward and downward movembet are som limited, what' the use of this constructioj over a rigid boom?

 

Hmmm, rewired or wound differently, could be.  That would not alter the operation of the "come-along" ratcheting winch though.  Looking at the pics again, the feed cable coming from the "come-along" runs through the small pulley that's Bolted to the lower attach point of that triangular piece and then goes back to the aft side of the "come-along" , which is hooked into that swivel bracket on the top of the post.  This allows the boom to move up or down through the action of the "come-along."  The cable or chain that runs from the top attach point of the triangular thingy is hooked to the top of the swivel plate that's attached to the top of the post.  It's supposed to be a safety cable or most likely a chain.  The cable that runs from the triangular gizmo through the large pulley is attached to the top of the post.  As we crank the "come-along" or ratcheting crank, one way or the other it allows the boom to move up or down BUT we must first disconnect that "safety" cable or chain.  I used a cord for that but it should be a chain so its length can be changed by linking the links at their appropriate position.  Y'all know how that can be done with chains, right?

Yes, it was very difficult modeling all this to its proper scale and it's indeed impossible to make the movements exactly the same as the original.  However, it does not require much up and down movement of the boom.  My model of the ratcheting winch is way over scale and that throws everything off.  

Once the torpedoes were loaded they just unhooked everything and stowed the parts inside the con.  The boom itself was secured to a bracket on the deck.

 

The dingy boom I had to rerun the cables because I routed them in the wrong holes in the deck.  I didn't retake the pics.  Eagle eye John hit that one on the nose but that was not what I was referring to.  So, no price for Jan either   

 

@ Pete48:  Thank you but you didn't take a shot at finding my error   

 

@ Jud:  Thank you very much.

 

Okay, what I was looking at after the gantry was all completed and tried to load a torpedo I found that the gantry was too far away from the loading tube below deck.  I placed the gentry at a position as indicated on the drawings but forgot that I had to extend the access hatches further aft then the drawings show.  I installed the loading tube at a to slight of an angle.  Therefor my error.  

 

So this afternoon I managed to pry the gantry gently loose from the deck without doing any damage   

I moved it to where the drawings tell me to put it and now I can load torpedoes.  As Jan pointed out there is very little movement possible the way my model shows but, as I explained, my "come-along" ratcheting winch is way over scale making my arrangement really not workable.  That's the problem with trying to make things workable at this scale.  If I had made this ratcheting winch to scale it would have to be a static gizmo of perhaps only 2 mm but then the entire gantry assembly would be static with no movement at all.  So, this is the best I could do under the circumstances.

 

This shows the forward gantry in it's now location.  I'll have to readjust the winch a little to tighten everything up.  I might try making a sling for the torpedo so I hang it on the boom in a loading position.  There may have to be some additional rework to the rigging but that'll have to wait till later.

 

Cheers,

[Piet]

What I should have added yesterday is one more reason for me having the gantry boom hanging kinda low is that I need to run antenna wires over the top of the gantry.  Normally, when loading a torpedo the boom is pulled up to a higher angle, of course, to get a good loading angle on the torpedo.  I don't know yet if I'll change things later on to show the torp actually being in the process of sliding into the loading tube below deck.  That would really be the cat's meow but then I would also need a bunch of characters on deck handling the operation and that's not in the plans - - - so far    But one never knows - - - - - -

 

Today has been very slow in the dockyard.  I have been mulling things over to what project / model I should tackle next.  I have been procrastinating the propellers for many months now and think it's time to cut the mustard - grab the bull by the horns - and make the props.  I'm really a little apprehensive tackling this difficult project.  But then again, I have enough copper sheet so I can botch-up a lot of blades.  

 

As I was thinking and thinking I made a proto shell for the deck gun.  I wanted to see what was involved making a bunch to fight off those large and heavy guns from Sjors and Mobbsy and perhaps a few others who want to do battle             

I know, they need to be a little smaller and the grenade more pointy but the idea is there.  At least I don't have to make powder bags, water mops, stampers and steel balls 

I have not filled the shell with black powder (yet) so it's still a dummy ((like me  ))

 

One thing I see is that I really should use brass for the shell casing, copper won't do.  But it's just a prototype.

 

Thanks everyone for visiting and your likes, it's really very encouraging.

 

Here is the prototype deck gun shell standing on the deck next to the loading breech.  I still need to add the outlines of that on the gun.

 

This is a plastic boat from my Thermopile clipper kit to hang it temporarily on it's boom.  I was tired of seeing a socket wrench hanging off the hook.

 

Cheers,

[amateur]

I still don't understand why the rigging of the dinghy-boom does not match your drawing.

There seems (at least to me) more logic in the drawing than in the current state....

btw you're going into a dangerous direction: lots of work is going on on deck (shells, boats, mines, torpedo's), 

you'll need a real crew before long

 

 Jan

Edited June 18, 2014 by amateur

[popeye the sailor]

looks awesome since I last looked in..............very nicely done!

[Vivian Galad]

Wonderful Piet. More and more it astonishs me!

[Piet]

Thanks to all for looking in and the likes !!

 

@ Jan: Okay, now I see what you are saying.  Yes, I reversed the routing   .  I have been telling everybody - - - me - - - domkop    My hat's off to you for tracing the runs, you are one sharp dude and thanks for questioning, it's much appreciated     I'll reroute the ropes tomorrow and take new pics.

 

@ Popeye: Thank you very much.

 

@ Vivian: So good to see you here and thanks for your kind words, even though I am a "domkop."

 

Cheers to all, 

 

[Piet]

Well, let's see - - - what did I do today, oh yeah, drove to the eye doctor for my annual check but it was a no show and had to reschedule it for after the 4th of july.  Gwen and I will be in Coraopolis, PA visiting our daughter and grandson for two weeks - - - yippeeee.      We are leaving next week Tuesday.  Gwen suggested that I bring my big-screen iMac with me then I'll have all the pictures in my archive to show Troy, our grandson.  He's totally impressed with his great grandfather and what he's done. 

 

I had plenty of time before lunch and started with the propellers.  I first made a card dummy prop blade to use as a template.  Transferred the outline to my 0.6 mm copper plate with a steel scribe.  Then, using my jeweler's coping saw with a metal cutting blade, cut them out.  Yep, it's a slow process but using tinsnips would curl the metal too much and I want the curl to be my way, not what the tinsnips give me.

 

After I had the rough pieces in my hand then I used the tinsnips to cut away the parts outside the scribed lines.   Then I used a file to file it to the scribed line and cut a small "pins" into the bottom of the blade to assist it in cementing the blades to the hub.

 

I then bend the curved profile in the blades by hand and eyeball.  Remco send me a few drawings of the blades and their profile but by using thin copper I cannot actually carve blades to match those on the real boat.  However, I think they are shaping up quite nice.  I did some extra filing to at least give it some of the profile.

 

I carved four small diagonal grooves in the hub to receive the blades and drilled the holes for the "pins." The hubs are oak and quite hard so I used a small broken drill bit as a router in my Proxxon hand tool which worked great.  I try-fitted two blades and it seems to look okay.  

So far I only made two blades for one propeller, six more to go.  

The filing left quite a few marks on the copper so I'll have to do some serious dressing and polishing but that's all part of the process and fun.

 

I still need to reduce the length of the blades so there is still a lot of filing yet to do before they fit. 

 

Here are a few pics I put for my archive.  Enjoy.

 

Here is one of the hubs with two blades.  They are already pre-bend into their pitch, there is still some bending and twisting to be done before I'm happy.  This gives you an idea of what I am talking about above.  I still need to drill the pin holes though.

 

Here I have propped up the hub on a piece of copper tubing and pressed one of the blades in a groove.

 

Cheers.

[Jim Lad]

Sorry, Piet, but I don't see the fuse screwed into the nose of that shell for the deck gun!  

 

John

[Remcohe]

The prop blades are looking really nice, I couldn't tell they do not match the profiles I send you, they look great. Now the biggest challenge is to produce 8 identical blades. But with your metal skill this should not be any problem

 

Remco

[SawdustDave]

Hi Piet, Just discovering this amazing project for the first time. First impression...."This has got to be a kit, posted in the wrong build log category."

Absolutely amazing detail. Thanks for the pleasure of seeing your work.

Dave

[SawdustDave]

Piet, This build is blowing my mind. Just amazing sir.

Dave

[Piet]

Thanks for visiting everybody and your likes, it keeps me motivated.

 

@ John Lad:  No fuse yet, we'll have to wait for the rest of the shells.  The black powder makers are a little slow too.  I need a couple of cases before we can go on war patrol against the many big gun ships that are on the horizon 

 

@ Remco:  Hmmmm, can't see the profile eh?  Well, that's a good thing for me then    Actually they do have a little.  To make them identical we have borrowed Mobbsy's Merlin   No, really, you just stack a few on top of each other and then start filing.  It Kinda works out okay but is a slow process that's why I have only been able to get 4 semi finished.  No problem for me???  I'm no Merlin       But thanks for your confidence in me.  Let's wait and see how everything turns out before we brake out the Champagne.

 

@ Dave:  You make me blush    Thanks so very much for that compliment and no, it's not a kit although many kits going on in MSW are very challenging indeed.  Come and visit again, the coffee is always on.

As you may have read on my log, this build is in honor of my father.

 

Cheers to all,

 

[Piet]

The going is slow making the propeller blades.  I can't use a grinder because it clogs up and they get hot is a second holding with my fingers.  No, can't use clamps either, can't see the scribe marks and loose sight of the shape.  They are egg shaped and equal on each side of the centerline, the slightest deviation shows up like a sore thumb.  But that's okay, I have the time.  Nobody is standing behind me with a whip and I get paid by the hour 

 

Okay, I re-routed the dingy boom cables first thing this morning.  Thanks again Amateur Jan, good catch!! 

 

I managed 2 more blades for one of the propellers but they need more work.  I purposely made them larger then called for.  I'd rather file away metal then having to start over when they turn out too small.  You can take away but can't add on metal 

I also added ⅛ of an inch of wood to the hub to bring the blade field a little more aft.  That way I can have slightly longer blades and they won't interfere with the hull and outer dive plane supports.  Even so I had to grind away some material on the latter ones.

 

Hopefully I'll have one prop finished by the end of tomorrow.

 

Well, here are a few pics for yuns to view and don't be shy with your constructive criticism 

 

This is for Amateur Jan.  It shows the corrected rigging of the dingy boom.  Now, the load cable is still not running the same as on the drawing because I did not put a pulley below deck in the dingy compartment as it's supposed to be.  I had to run it through a hole in the deck on the starboard side of the aft con.  I could have put a 3 mm pulley down below but then I would have a problem demonstrating the works because the string would pull with a too large an angle.  Remember that this was also an afterthought.  If I had planned this from the get go I would have certainly done so.

 

This shows the four semi finished propeller blades loosely stuck in the hub. 

 

Here is another shot taken from the front and slightly above.  Here we can see just a hint of the profile.  The metal was not thick enough to machine the profile in the blades.  That would have been a devil of a task to do by hand.  For this model's purpose I think this should suffice.  

 

Here is another view but more from straight above.

 

Cheers,

[pete48]

Hi Piet, the propeller looks great, I think the propeller will suffice ,nicely done

 

Best Regards,

Pete

[popeye the sailor]

super looking prop!...........still can't get over the hardware for the crane......looks sweet!  

[cog]

Piet,

 

Great looking prop!!! Good nobody was supervising with a whip

[NenadM]

I have no idea how much "devil" work is around those metal "flower". But when think about ... my deep respect

[jud]

Prop looks great, now  how are you going to balance it so it doesn't vibrate?

jud

[Piet]

WOW, thanks to all 28 who clicked the like button, I'm overwhelmed by your generosity.

 

@ Pete48: Thank you, and yes, I guess they'll have to suffice.  Still working on them.

 

@ Popeye:  Thank you my friend for your kind words.  Yep, the hardware, lots of work and lots of scrap too - - - well actually not that much 

 

@ Carl:  Thank you too.  It was mainly me who was / am using the whip   urging, poking, admonishing myself.  I'm like Nenad, talking to the model and myself as well, mostly when I screw up something - - - then it's "domkop," and that's the good word, the others I can't write here on this forum 

 

@ Nenad:  Yeah, it was and still is a difficult job to make it come out okay.  I was really very apprehensive, more like afraid, tackling the props.  Had several ideas in how to do them but in the end I decided to make four individual blades and cement them into the hub.  You can see the end result in the next post.

 

@ Jud:  Thanks Jud and wow, you know about balancing propellers? I'm impressed!  Hmmm, do you want me to perform a static as well as a dynamic balance?  Okay - - - I'll have to make a balancing rig first though     Is this a challenge???   Yeah, I did my share of balancing aircraft props in my repair shop, only static though.

 

Cheers,  

[Piet]

I continued with the port propeller today but didn't quite finish it.  I managed fitting all the blades to the hub in relative good position as far as all being at the same distance to the hub and fitting inside the space behind the prop bearing housing.  

 

It was now time to cement the blades to the hub.  I used the slow cure two part epoxy cement giving me the time to position the blades equally spaced, and being at the same distance to the hub and all tracking the same.

 

For that I used a small steel machinist square and a piece of wood.  Hey, sorry but no fancy equipment here and one has to do what one has available that works   Of course now Jud expects me to balance them too!

 

I put a small piece of ⅛ tubing in a piece of wood so I can set the prop hub on it.  As the cement was curing I performed the final adjustments to the blades and went inside the house to have lunch.

 

After lunch I started cutting out the blades for the starboard prop and scribed the outlines on each peace of copper using the blades from the port prop as templet.  I used my tinsnips to cut the material away on the outside of the scribe lines and then sandwiched all them together and clamped them at the root end with a small pair of vicegrip pliers.   This way I could see the scribe marks and the contour of the blade ensuring that all will be the same.

The rest has to be done on an individual base.

 

It's putting the twist and camber in that's critical.   The first thing I do is bend the root into a slight curve as a start for the camber profile.  Then I work my way up bending the blade into a slight curve mimicking the camber profile.   I then put the blade into my bench vice at the root end end, between two pieces of plastic to not mar the blades, and with a pair of duckbill pliers I bend a twist into the blades.  Right now all this is just guesswork by eye.  The final shaping comes when I start fitting the blades into the hub.  

 

Now I file more of the profile into the blades on the convex side and after I have one blade pretty close to being to my satisfaction I use it as the standard, marked, and place the next blade in top to check the shape of that blade.  It may need more or less twist or more or less curve.  Adjustments are done with a piece of ¾ inch dowel and a small hammer and the duckbill pliers.

As y'all can imagine this takes a lot of time and it doesn't matter wether I have done one already that came out okay, this is a new model to shape.

When I'm happy with the twist and curve I use a few fine files to do the final shaping for the blade profile.  Polishing will come after the hub is painted and then we can cement the props to the shafts. 

 

Well, that's about how I did the port prop and expect the starboard one to work out okay as well, keep fingers crossed.

 

Okay, here are a few pics from today's efforts, hope you enjoy.

 

Here you see the propeller mounted to a small piece of ⅛ inch tubing in a block of wood.  I placed a small machinist square next to a blade and rotated the prop to see which blade needs to be adjusted.  I lucked out again and all were very close 

 

Here I used a small wood strip from the junk pile that was just the right thickness and tracked each blade for their correct tracking position.  I already determined that they were all shaped the same so checking in just one location for my purposes was sufficient.  Here too I lucked out

 

After the epoxy cement had cured enough I started to clean the blades and made a beginning of polishing the blades and painting the hub red.  After the paint had dried I had to put it on the boat - - - of course.   I am thrilled at how nice it looks, just like the real boat!  Final polishing will be done after the prop is balanced and then given a coat of lacquer to keep the copper bright.

 

This is a cloe-up, using flash.

 

Another close-up without flash.  It shows a little more detail.

 

Here is a shot looking alongside the hull aft, using flash.

 

Cheers,

[pete48]

Nicely done Piet, The prop look Amazing , Just Beautiful work

 

Best Regards,

Pete

[Remcohe]

Ahh Piet that is so sweet!

 

Remco