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dziadek4444

VASA by dziadek4444 - DeAgostini - 1:65

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Well, at least pictures don't need to be translated! ;)   Excellent planking job!!

 

 

BTW  Mates in case you did not know---- or into any other language for that matter for which Google has available

 

 

Cheers,

 

IMG_8836.thumb.jpg.74800d453d1bf7795cbb913c52ec949a.jpg

 

 

 

 

Edited by md1400cs

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Hello Dziadek4444,

 

You are building a very good D'Agostini model of the Vasa.  All of the work is truly excellent - particularly the first planking, in preparation of the second planking and your crisp cutting to the outer borders of the ship, above the waterline.  Surface prep, for preliminary finish/sealer looks great!  All of this looks like it will shape up to a tremendously successful model - because you have clear talent and precision in your execution.

 

Forgive me, in advance, because I will take exception with one aspect of your build that I frequently see in kit builds, and it just bothers me.  Often, the builder is extremely meticulous in their execution, and the work done is beyond reproach.  However, in an effort to make plywood keels and stems look more harmonious, builders sometimes choose to continue the plank seams from the hull, into the stem.  I love what you are doing with this model, but this particular aspect of it is completely wrong - and more importantly - it detracts from all of the other excellent work you have done, so far.

 

Think of it this way; a keel is, literally, the backbone of a wooden ship; it must be strong, in order to withstand the tremendous wracking forces at work, upon it, all of the time.  That strength is a result, at least in part, of dimensional girth, and mechanical joinery; a keel is always scarfed at appropriate intervals and lengths, according the the length and breadth of the vessel.

 

The cut-water, or stem, is no different.  The stem requires compass-cut timber, at appropriate scantlings, that are joined with bolstering scarfs, at the right locations, in order to solidify the entire bow structure, which receives the full brunt of whatever seaways through which it passes.

 

Even if one doesn't wish to build a completely authentic model of whatever the subject may be, there usually exist a plethora of documented examples, of similar types, that show exactly what the stem-head of the ship was constructed of.  The Vasa is a prime example, of course, because the ship survives, intact.

 

You are making an excellent model of this great ship.  Please go the extra mile and correct this.

Edited by Hubac's Historian

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Witaj Hubaca Historyk
Masz rację, oczywiście, i wiem, jak zbudować kil. W tym przypadku jednak jestem trochę bezradny, ponieważ zobowiązałem się do zbudowania modelu ściśle według instrukcji DeAgostiniego. Dlatego waloryzacja historyczna lub estetyczna nie jest możliwa.
Dziękuję za uznanie za moją pracę i dobrą radę. Muszę jednak budować zgodnie z przyjętym zobowiązaniem.

pozdrowienia

Edited by dziadek4444

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Sorry guys, let me jump in with Polish here.

@Hubac's Historian i checked the instructions, and indeed they tell you to do the planking on the whole keel, stem and sternpost

 

Witaj @dziadek4444,

 

Przede wszystkim powiem, że wspaniała robota to plankowanie, naprawde kunszt :)

 

W instrukcjach DeAgostini, zeszyt numer 4. elementy numer 81-84, od strony 240 i potem dalej zeszyt 6 od strony 280 punkt 4 do 9.

Jest to ewidentny błąd w instrukcjach, jeśli by ci się udało w jakiś sposób usunąć to plankowanie i spróbować nakleić przynajmniej na dziobie i rufie pojedynczy płat drewna, to byłoby to chyba wykonalne ?

 

Ewentualnie w Marketach budowlanych są dostępne pasty do zaklejania dziur w drewnie (trociny drobne lub miał drewniany wymieszane z klejem lub żywicą) to możnaby tym zamalować i potem przeszlifować żeby sprawiało wrażenie jednolitego kawałka drewna.

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1 hour ago, Jasseji said:

Sorry guys, let me jump in with Polish here.

@Hubac's Historian i checked the instructions, and indeed they tell you to do the planking on the whole keel, stem and sternpost

Then the instructions are totally wrong about this point.

Hubac's Historian is right. It is indeed advisable to correct this error.

 

Ps 

Otherwise very nicely done.

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42 minutes ago, Backer said:

Then the instructions are totally wrong about this point.

Hubac's Historian is right. It is indeed advisable to correct this error.

 

Ps 

Otherwise very nicely done.

yes, indeed they are, you can check the Plans Online:

https://www.model-space.com/gb/build-the-vasa.html

 

Part 6, Page 280

 

 

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Macie Koledzy obydwaj rację !!!

 

Robię model dla polskiego wydania kolekcji De Agostini. Zobowiązałem się go zrobić dokładnie według instrukcji zawartej w zeszytach. W moim wypadku sprawa polega na dowodzie, że ten model da się zbudować w oparciu o zeszyty De Agostini. 

 

Na tej samej zasadzie powinienem wykonać schodnię wbrew sztuce: https://www.model-space.com/gb/build-the-vasa.html#build

Część 9, str. 419

 

Buduję według instrukcji natomiast na polskim blogu podpowiadam modelarzom jak poprawnie elementy te powinny faktycznie być zwaloryzowane.

 

Pozdrawiam

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8 minutes ago, dziadek4444 said:

Tłumaczenia językowe są okropne!!!

Tak, faktycznie, to stanowi problem (chodzi o budowę według instrukcji oraz o tłumaczenia - jakby co to służę pomocą przynajmniej w tłumaczeniach)

 

Back to English:

dziadek4444 is building it for the Polish deAgostini Catalogue and has to follow the instructions as stated

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this is a detail that is prevalent on most,  if not all sailing vessels.   it's too bad that DeAgostini got this wrong.  it will take some doing to remove the offending planking......wetting it down with alcohol or water may help.  looking in other logs here on the site,  I'm sure you can see where the seams for the keel parts are,  and can be indented and drawn on with pencil.  it's not a hard repair,  but it can get tricky.  one shouldn't feel to badly about this.......positively sure your not the forst who has been duped by incorrect plans  ;)    she's a beautiful hull.......you've done well thus far :) 

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Hello Dziadek,

 

I meant no dis-respect, and I can understand your faithfully following through with what you have commited to.

 

Thank you for that link to the Modelbeau website, Jasseji.  I was unable to open the instruction guide on my phone because I’m in an area with poor reception.  Nevertheless, I believe what you are both saying about the kit instructions is true. It is just puzzling as to why, considering the lengths D’Agostini went to to produce an, otherwise, authentic model.

 

The only possibility I can think of that makes any kind of sense to me  is that, after planking over the stem, one could then veneer over that with an assembly of stem timbers, so that the hull planking appears to neatly tuck into the stem rabbet.  This possibility, however, would not provide a similarly neat resolution of where the hull planking meets the stern post; the veneered-over stern post would step down to the planking in this area.  Anyway, it is a strange feature of the kit.

 

I was able to watch the videos, though, and I am impressed by the amount of internal structure that they designed into the model.  The laser-cut parts appear to tuck neatly into place without a lot of fiddling - so long as you have squared your construction, along the way.

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39 minutes ago, dziadek4444 said:

Tłumaczenia językowe są okropne!!!

Tłumaczenia językowe są okropne!!!   = Language translations are terrible !!!

Yep, Google translate is useful. But indeed, it sometimes makes strange misspellings

 

You Colleagues are both right !!!  Thanks (dziękuję)

 

I'm doing a model for the Polish edition of the De Agostini collection. I undertook to do it exactly according to the instructions contained in the notebooks. In my case, the case is based on the proof that this model can be built based on De Agostini notebooks.

Bad research from De Agostini :default_wallbash:

 

I build according to instructions, but on the Polish blog I suggest modelers how correctly these elements should actually be valorized.

Great work !!

 

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I had also noticed your keel planking. Your response is indeed interesting. 

 

In April 018 I visited the Vaset Museum. I also was lucky enough to spend a very informative hour with Dr. Fred Hocker (he also builds models). He also prefers to be called Fred. Super nice person. He showed me parts of the museum’s research area, we then sat and spoke about several subjects.

 

One of which was the DeAgostini Vasa, a project that he is very involved with. He noted that, for example, the upper and lower hull gun ports are slightly miss-located. This was a cost savings compromise for a mass produced kit. Some of the inner vertical frame locations resulted in some ports having openings that are not aligned as the 1:1. This (miss-alignment) has been discussed by other builders as well.

 

The keel planking was not discussed however. So it is indeed surprising that something (simple) such as this would not be. at least, drawn correctly on the instructions, and that it would be possibly missed by Fred. It is a part of any kit’s build that can so easily be correctly overlaid from most kit supplied single ply-board pieces.

 

That said, you might later indeed regret not re-doing the keel planks IMO. This kit is otherwise arguably the best Vasa available. And your build is certainly excellent indeed.

 

Regards,

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This is how I made the rudder. I guess the original is more elaborate, but it's better than what DeAgostini wants you to do.

IMG_1473ed.thumb.jpg.d4afe691be6fd93ca243eb43e0375a9d.jpg

 

The deck. On the original almost no planks have the same width due to different nationalities working with different measurements. I did four butt shift

IMG_1343ed.jpg.da6cc52d410da90a657d3e1e40190d5b.jpg

No where near the original but better than DeAgostini...

IMG_1471ed.jpg.3914ab5d54d11c6bf63b3f4c82abc774.jpg

And here is the big problem. Theres almost no space to work on trying to do a good keel planking. This is my third attempt under way before she went in the closet waiting until all shipments have arrived.

IMG_1472ed.thumb.jpg.57cef7859bfeefd8137e002f091b3484.jpg

I found the thin strips easy to peel off and easy to sand off, so when  you have taken the pictures for your blog you could always replank the keel and rudder... ;)

 

You are doing a great job, and I wish I could do the painting you do.. I am way behind on that. Being colorblind takes away the fun in painting hundreds of figures... :D

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