Bounty by Baker - FINISHED - Revell - scale 1/110 - PLASTIC - semi scratch and extra detail

[lmagna]

Wishing you the best of luck in your recovery Patrick. Hope you stay healthy enough that you can stay home and even do some more work on your fantastic Bounty. Please keep us up to date on how you are doing with the CORONA. 

[Veszett Roka]

18 hours ago, Backer said:

And received 2 things today.
a good
A few weeks ago I asked through the Revell website if I couldn't buy extra rope from them. For the extra finishing of the Bounty
A reply came pretty quickly that they were going to send this.
And today, a package (And without a bill attached)

 

a bad
I received a positive result about my corona test 😷

Fortunately, the symptoms are mild  and hopefully soon forgotten. 

 

So a lot of free time for rigging.
But I am tired quickly

 

Hi Patrick,

 

Get well soon!

 

I'm following your build quietly, because i have the same kit (maybe newer mould) still in the box, waiting for other projects to complete.

 

-miki

[Edwardkenway]

Patrick, I hope you're feeling better quickly and you get the better of the awful virus!

[Baker]

Thank you everyone for the good wishes, this is much appreciated.
Tired quickly but otherwise only slight symptoms. My wife got it too (from me) she has the same symptoms with a few days delay
The strange thing is that food no longer tastes like it used to, everything tastes pale (also with extra pepper added 🥵 🤧)

In the meantime, the rigging continues. Lots of free time now.

The extra wire supplied by Revell is thicker and used on the lower (heavier) yards. evanals de blocks (from the SR van Heller).
The thinner original thread is for the lighter yards and I will probably have to make smaller blocks for them.

Some rigging done, a lot of rigging to be done.

 

There are several Bounty models and buildlogs on this site. Kits and scratchmodels (and there are sometimes differences in these models).
To have a general idea of the rigging I usually look at this site. Easy to view for me. all photos are on 1 page

 

https://www.modelships.de/Bounty/Photos-HMS-Bounty_details.htm

 

Thanks for following, comments and likes

 

 

[Baker]

Rigging continues slowly. Lots of free time now, so I do an update faster than usual
Made a sketch to have an idea of which wire should go where.

And now and then a corona break, with wife and cat on the couch.

The cat doesn't mind 

 

Thanks for following

[wefalck]

I am curious, how you will tackle the blocks (intended pun). When I started the BOUNTY in the early 1972s the blocks, among other things, stalled the project and it was never completed. In my teens I just didn't have the means and the knowledge (even though I tried all sorts of things and visited the National Maritime Museum in Greenwich) to produce the small blocks needed. I think somewhere I still have the same kind of sketches you made

 

In the late 1980s McNarry's book on Miniature Shipmodels came out and he proposes a method using punched-out ovals of paper or card for the blocks, but uses twisted wire for rigging and pre-assembles the tackles etc.

 

As I am writing, I am experimenting with laser-cut card-board parts for blocks about a millimeter long. With moderate success so far :(

 

 

 

[Baker]

For the blocks
I am happy that I have never thrown away the old blocks from Heller's SR. They are actually too big for the Revell Bounty, but for my application they are quite ok.
I have already thought about how to make small blocks, without success for the time being.
When I see how you can make such detailed parts on such a small scale. then making small blocks should be no problem for you .

 

As stated in post 1.
the whole box ended almost immediately in the waste bin 😳

 

First, i wanted to throw everything away. But it had some trouble with this idea.

Main goals are : making of a good model and have fun.

[G.L.]

21 hours ago, Backer said:

And now and then a corona break, with wife and cat on the couch.

The cat doesn't mind 

 

 

The cat seems to be your loyal friend. She doesn't care about covid contamination at all.

[Veszett Roka]

For the blocks, i have used to cut the moulding frames to tiny pieces and drilled 2 holes in at right angles. The below pic is from my 1:150 Vasa, one block is actually 2mm long and the holes are 0.7 mm. Sorry for the quality, there is no better macro fotomachine at hand now.

 

 

[Baker]

On 11/2/2020 at 8:36 AM, G.L. said:

The cat seems to be your loyal friend. She doesn't care about covid contamination at all.

Actually, our good friend has experienced the pros and cons of Covid.
Good, he can now sit inside the house every day.
Not good, he had symptoms for one day but is now healthy again.

[Baker]

21 hours ago, Veszett Roka said:

For the blocks, i have used to cut the moulding frames to tiny pieces and drilled 2 holes in at right angles. The below pic is from my 1:150 Vasa, one block is actually 2mm long and the holes are 0.7 mm. Sorry for the quality, there is no better macro fotomachine at hand now.

 

 

 Nice blocks, thanks.
I had about the same idea ( also with holes 0.7 diameter). But it's not yet what I really want.

 

[Baker]

a few questions

 

The yard of the mizzen sail.
Should it stay on top (for some dark reason the photo is always upside down)

May this go lower at the bottom of the mast

2. fore mast, lower sail.

white lines
On many kit models (and the Beagle replica) these ropes go to the cathead. Weird, I thought the cathead was just for the anchors.

 

red, yellow lines
Could this be a better solution. red is a wooden "stick, yard, mast?" and yellow are the ropes

Rigging continues

Discovered that treating the ropes with diluted matte black gives a positive result. 
And there are too few belaying pins in all the right places, and too much in the wrong places 

Thanks for following

[wefalck]

Many model blocks fail on one account in particular: they have just a hole drilled through them, which means that the rope comes out of them with a sharp bend. In reality, they should come out of the block sort of tangential, going around the sheave. In larger blocks one can file the edge round, but for the sizes required at 1/110 scale this is likely to be difficult or impossible.

 

Blocks at that time would have been fastened with a strop around them, not in a second hole. Another mistake frequently made.

 

One could take styrene strips and sand/scrape them oval in profile, after having drilled them in the upper quarter. This strip then can be cut into individual blocks. This doesn't solve the problem with the sharp bend, but at least gives the blocks the right outside shape after some sanding of the faces. Make a slight notch in the bottom to prevent the strop from slipping off.

 

The strop should be also made with a fake splice, rather than a knot. Fake splices are easy to make: just take the short end in a needle and go twice through the long end, secure with a drop of varnish, cut off the loose end and then roll it between your fingers to smooth it.

[shipman]

A few deft strokes with a pointed needle file or a scalpel tip would help 'fair' the hole in the block; much as should be done to advantage with deadeye holes.

[wefalck]

Not so easy on blocks just 1 mm long. Holding them is the issue. I haven‘t tried this yet, but one could make tiny half-round chisels for the purpose from injection needles ground to a suitable angle, held in a pin-vise or set into a dowel.

[shipman]

Mmm, drilling and shaping 1mm long blocks? I'm sure it can be done only by you.

You'll be doing the same with poppy seeds next.

Wait...I was joking.

[Veszett Roka]

I think the poppy seed phrase is very accurate here anyway. The key is the dimension, also the scale. At a certain point there is impossible to display the desired accuracy, we have to model something similar than the original. Rounding the holes are (or could be?) right at 1:64 but below 1:100 it is more than a microscopic radius and besides it requires precision work, no one will notice it: simply it is visible through magnifier lens only. My blocks are 2mm in 1:150, which means 30 cm in reality which is a quite large one but was hard enough to drill the holes into them to emulate the function of a real thing. I think this is a good accuracy to simulate a block where a block has been on the original ship. Well, higher accuracy would be better, but this is beyond my limits.

 

Just popped up in my mind: drill a hole in the plastic body of the block, and pull a nylon thread with force through it many times. It should smooth the edges of the hole, maybe add a roller effect. What you think fellow builders?

Edited November 4, 2020 by Veszett Roka

[Veszett Roka]

22 hours ago, Backer said:

a few questions

 

The yard of the mizzen sail.
Should it stay on top (for some dark reason the photo is always upside down)

May this go lower at the bottom of the mast

 

It should stay on top, the furled sail must be tied to the gaff yard and to the mast itself.

 

 

 

 

Quote

 

2. fore mast, lower sail.

white lines
On many kit models (and the Beagle replica) these ropes go to the cathead. Weird, I thought the cathead was just for the anchors.

 

red, yellow lines
Could this be a better solution. red is a wooden "stick, yard, mast?" and yellow are the ropes

 

 

For me, the second version (red-yellow) is the good one. Looking for Victory's bow, it clearly shows that solution:

 

 

 

 

 

Edited November 4, 2020 by Veszett Roka

[wefalck]

For rigging questions, I would consult the books by Lees and/or Marquardt. Looking at modern replicas or even modern ships might be misleading, particularly, when they are operating vessels, as they then have to comply with current safety at sea standards.

 

As several people have shown on this forum, it is perfectly possible to make working blocks of 2 mm lenght, given the availability of the right tools, of course.

 

Pulling a thread through the hole in order to round off the edges in order to simulate the sheave actually may be a good idea. In the cut stone industry diamond-studded wire are used to cut e.g. marble blocks in the quarries, but also microscopic variants are available for jewellers to be used in piercing saws. I checked the Internet and in an industrial context they are offered down to a thickness of 0.09 mm, but on ebay the smallest diameter is 0.25 mm. The cost is quite moderate with less than 9€ for a 10 m spool including shipping from China. This is more than a lifetime supply. One should give it a try. One could also use a 'normal' thread with pumice as cutting agent.

[Baker]

Thanks to all for the rigging info.

 

I tried to make a "block". The shape could be a bit better with some more practice, but this was a first prototype.
Length 1.5mm
width 1mm
thickness 0.5mm
Making these blocks should work for me, but rigging them ... On the first try, the little block decided it was scared of rope and jumped somewhere far away on the kitchen floor 🤣 😳

This is far too small for my ability and not relaxing. 

I'm going to clean up and use the blocks provided in the kit (work in progress)

[Veszett Roka]

On 11/3/2020 at 10:15 AM, Backer said:

a few questions

2. fore mast, lower sail.

white lines
On many kit models (and the Beagle replica) these ropes go to the cathead. Weird, I thought the cathead was just for the anchors.

 

red, yellow lines
Could this be a better solution. red is a wooden "stick, yard, mast?" and yellow are the ropes

 

 

 

I did checked some Bounty models and also a couple of pictures of the sailing replica of Bounty. The wooden sticks which exists on Victory doesnt found on Bounty, despite the fact that they are from the same era. Seemingly the solution vary for each ship.

[wefalck]

As I said, don't check models, which are the interpretation of another modeller, check the literature that draws on the sources. HMS VICTORY is a hugely different ship (in the true sense of the word) from HMS BOUNTY.

[Baker]

16 hours ago, Veszett Roka said:

 

I did checked some Bounty models and also a couple of pictures of the sailing replica of Bounty. The wooden sticks which exists on Victory doesnt found on Bounty, despite the fact that they are from the same era. Seemingly the solution vary for each ship.

I found another model with this application (Some of us will recognize the photo). A very beautiful model !!

Whether this is the correct way or not, this is the most elegant and logical solution.

 

The bamboo plant stick, thinned down to size.

and in  place on the model (with the smaller Revell blocks)

 

[Veszett Roka]

16 hours ago, wefalck said:

As I said, don't check models, which are the interpretation of another modeller, check the literature that draws on the sources. HMS VICTORY is a hugely different ship (in the true sense of the word) from HMS BOUNTY.

 

I disagree. Although she is a different ship both in size and duty, the solutions are the same (just think their rudder and helm: Victory's larger, and the steering ropes aren't visible due they are under the deck, but the solution is the same). I think checking models is a good source, other modelers might have better resources than you, and they are trying to interpret their models with their best.

Additionally the ships can change both in colors and rigging, so which version is the only good one? For a fine example, Lusitania. She had 3 wing propellers at first, then changed the outer two to 4 wing and different shape, then changed all four to 4 wing but smaller size and again different shape from the previous. Which is the good when modeling the ship? Original plans issued with 3 winged screws. Another example: the Wasa (Vasa is the correct form anyways). All books written from her says her colors was blue. Until the new studies unveiled her true color was red instead. We don't know how exactly Mary Rose looked before she sank, we have paintings from her. Which, in fact inaccurate - theyre just giving a general snapshot even for me and for the archeologists of how the carracks looked in the 16th century. All the others are good speculation - and we still have a half hull in Portsmouth. Does this means that we cannot made a model of Mary Rose, because it will be inaccurate?

I know you can depict the subject in a certain timeframe (Bounty reaching Pitcairn), but how can you ensure that how the actual ship looked at time, plus whether it matches to the book which written maybe centuries after? And 2 question: from where the authors got their sources? Are those sources reliable ones? I'm pretty sure they read books, checked some models and paintings in the museums, read plans, then they interpret the ship, shipwright with their best - like the modelers.

 

So cut the long story short: i accept other modelers work as a source, also other different ships from the same era. Also the modern sailing replicas, even the 1960 Bounty replica sunk, and 1978 replica built on steel frames. The only restriction is to say: my model is probably not 100% accurate because my sources could be inaccurate - but truly depict the era and mariner life in the period.

[Baker]

 

Where can you find the right information (my idea)

Books: I never trust them blindly
Replicas: are usually "full of errors"
Internet: anyone can post anything here

 

The remains of the one and only original example of the Bounty is located somewhere near an island far away from here.
Considering no one bothered to take detailed photos then. We do not have a "walk around" book available.

This build is relaxation for me, if a certain color is not right or a rope is knotted incorrectly
so be it.

 

 

[wefalck]

It is always wise to compare different (secondary) sources and to dig up, if possible, the primary sources mentioned (if at all) in those secondary sources. While certain books are more trustworthy than others, there is always an element of interpretation and real evidence may be scarce. There were also many common features and practices that were so common that no one at the time thought it worth mentioning or documenting them.

 

Ships were 'living' beings and only partially subject to rules and regulations (in the navies) or hardly at all (in the merchant navy). There was a considerable amount of discreetion on the side of the masters, particularly, when it comes to rigging. However, the responsibility for the performance of any deviation from the common practice at the time rests with the master, so that there is a certain element of conservatism involved, just to be on the safe side.

[shipman]

Backer is making a damn good job with his Bounty and doing his best to make it convincing.

I agree with your historical comments on rigging practices, wefalk.

With all due respect to Backer, he's got limited resources available and it seems to me he's happy with the overall 'impression' he's getting. And why not? He's doing fine and building his confidence.

Sometimes the right thing can get in the way.

Tomorrow is always a new day; to be welcomed, so we can go forward with what we learned yesterday.

[Ryland Craze]

Your Bounty is coming along nicely.  The extra details you are putting on this model are paying off.

8 hours ago, Backer said:

This build is relaxation for me, if a certain color is not right or a rope is knotted incorrectly
so be it.

I like your attitude.  Your build of the Bounty will be a model you will be proud of.

[Baker]

On 11/5/2020 at 8:55 PM, shipman said:

Tomorrow is always a new day; to be welcomed, so we can go forward with what we learned yesterday.

Well said.

On 11/6/2020 at 1:32 AM, Ryland Craze said:

I like your attitude.  Your build of the Bounty will be a model you will be proud of.

Thanks,

 

Build update 

The mizzen sail is adjusted (thanks Roka)  and all running rigging should be in place to operate yards and sails. 

 

Probably not every line is tied to the correct belaying pin but it is much better than the kit instructions.

Next to do things :
Make swivel guns, those of the kit are too thick, make the anchors, etc ..
And apply extra ropework (picture)

The Heller SR, roughly the same scale (built long ago) and the Bounty

 

 

Corona update
The healing is going well for me and my wife
Still tired easily. Shipyard time is a little reduced because we take a short walk once or twice a day to get more oxygen into the lungs.

 

The Flemish fields

Recently I read a good description of what the lungs feel like when you breathe with corona.
"It's like an elephant is sitting on your chest and you can barely breathe".  (Believe me it feels like that sometimes)

 

Thanks for following,comments and likes

[rkwz]

Patrick, great to hear you are recovering well. The fresh air will do you good

 

Wow, your Bounty becomes more impressive with each update, keep em coming!