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Hello,

 

I am looking for recommendations for a single product (i.e. no mixing) red ochre paint suitable for wood bulwarks and deck fittings.

 

I understand that there isn't one "true" historical colour, so I am just interested in something shelf-stable that can be brush painted. I wasn't able to find anything suitable from Tamiya or Vallejo, and my local hobby stores don't carry much else. Would artists acrylic paints work?

 

Thanks in advance,

-starlight

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Have a look at Vallejo Red (Rojo 70.926) as a starting point.  Since main paint was power form with the liquid added time if use (linseed oil it seems) they were usually mixed using local materials.  So there's a wide variation in the reds and no one can really tell you it's the wrong shade.

Mark
"The shipwright is slow, but the wood is patient." - me

Current Build:                                                                                             
Past Builds:
 La Belle Poule 1765 - French Frigate from ANCRE plans - ON HOLD           Triton Cross-Section   

 NRG Hallf Hull Planking Kit                                                                            HMS Sphinx 1775 - Vanguard Models - 1:64               

 

Non-Ship Model:                                                                                         On hold, maybe forever:           

CH-53 Sikorsky - 1:48 - Revell - Completed                                                   Licorne - 1755 from Hahn Plans (Scratch) Version 2.0 (Abandoned)         

         

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                

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'Out of the tube' artists' acrylic or oil colors are generally too intense for a model without some modification. Paints specifically for models might be a better choice.

Be sure to sign up for an epic Nelson/Trafalgar project if you would like to see it made into a TV series  http://trafalgar.tv

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ANCRE provided a sheet with color chips for paints from before synthetic pigments were created by the German chemical industry.

 

The paint product that I found that matches is:

Winsor & Newton Winton Oil Color Paint, 37-ml Tube, Vermilion Hue

Every artist's oil company probably has Vermilion.

A 37 ml tube should last a very long time.

This is a more sophisticated way to apply color.  It is organic solvent based.  Bob Cleek  @Bob Cleek has written at least one sufficiently detailed description of how to use this system of pigments.   From what I have read, the particle size is fine enough to be easily adapted for use in an airbrush as well as brushing. 

It is a time proven system.  If that is a factor with you.  The water based acrylic plastic matrix is an on going experiment as far as how it fares over time.

NRG member 45 years

 

Current:  

HMS Centurion 1732 - 60-gun 4th rate - Navall Timber framing

HMS Beagle 1831 refiit  10-gun brig with a small mizzen - Navall (ish) Timber framing

The U.S. Ex. Ex. 1838-1842
Flying Fish 1838  pilot schooner -  framed - ready for stern timbers
Porpose II  1836  brigantine/brig - framed - ready for hawse and stern timbers
Vincennes  1825  Sloop-of-War  -  timbers assembled, need shaping
Peacock  1828  Sloop-of -War  -  timbers ready for assembly
Sea Gull  1838  pilot schooner -  timbers ready for assembly
Relief  1835  ship - timbers ready for assembly

Other

Portsmouth  1843  Sloop-of-War  -  timbers ready for assembly
Le Commerce de Marseilles  1788   118 cannons - framed

La Renommee 1744 Frigate - framed - ready for hawse and stern timbers

 

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Thanks everyone for your recommendations and advice,

 

I'd like to stick with acrylic paints for reasons of safety and simplicity. I purchased some today and tested them on various substrates.  Some comments below in case another novice like myself ever reads this:

  • Tamiya - Flat Red (XF-7)
    • Too bright of a red in my opinion.
    • Quite thin and required multiple coats. Even so, there is colour variation depending on the material being painted.
  • Vallejo - Cavalry Brown (70.982)
    • I found it to be much more brown than it looks in the photo (and on colour swatches online), at least on my monitor.
  • Vallejo - Red (70.926)
    • Probably the closest to what I was looking for. Thank you, @mtaylor!
    • Might be a little bit too intense in colour, but it dried a lot darker than I was expecting and was consistent across different woods.
  • Liquitex - Red Oxide (PR101)
    • A soft body artists' acrylic that I thought might work.
    • However, it also came out much more brown than expected.

In the end I think I will go with the Vallejo Red.

 

redochre_test.thumb.jpg.9d03d9b39d8d18758cf06dccb03b10b3.jpg

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Volume II of NRG’s Shop Notes, available from their online store, includes an excellent article complete with extensive color chips about old time paint colors. It was written by Eric Ronnberg a careful researcher. Although focused on the Nineteenth Century, the color chips include a number of preindustrial colors such as Red Lead, Red Oxide, Yellow Ochre.  This is one case where it’s better to have a hard copy as you are not looking at colors through a computer monitor.

 

In my opinion, this one article is worth the prices of the book.

 

Roger

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  • 1 month later...

Admiralty Paints Red Ochre is the best there is. Get it from Cornwall boats, excellent service whatever country your in. 

Edited by glbarlow

Regards,

Glenn

 

Current Build: HMS Winchelsea
Completed Builds: HM Flirt (paused) HM Cutter CheerfulLady NelsonAmati HMS Vanguard,  
HMS Pegasus, Fair American, HM Granado, HM Pickle, AVS, Pride of Baltimore, Bluenose

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Admiralty Paints is very good, if in the UK the Halfords rattle can red primer is very similar in colour

Caldercraft Admiralty Waterbased Paints from Cornwall Model Boats

 

Its all part of Kev's journey, bit like going to the dark side, but with the lights on
 

All the best

Kevin :omg:


SAY NO TO PIRACY. SUPPORT ORIGINAL IDEAS AND MANUFACTURERS.
KEEP IT REAL!

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

On the build table

HMS Indefatigable 1794 by Kevin - Vanguard Models - 1:64 - Feb 2023 

 

 

HMHS Britannic by Kevin 

SD 14  - Marcle Models - 1/70 - March 2022 -  Bluebell - Flower Class - Revel - 1/72   U552 German U Boat - Trumpeter - 1/48  Amerigo Vespucci     1/84 - Panart-   HMS Enterprise  -CAF -  1/48     

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St-Nectan-Mountfleet-models-steam-trawler-1/32 - Completed June 2020

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Stage Coach 1848 - Artesania Latina - 1/10 -Finished Lady Eleanor by Kevin - FINISHED - Vanguard Models - 1/64 - Fifie fishing boat

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Yes, there are a few paint colours that definitely require a colour primer.  any Red or Yellow requires a tinted primer.  There are some model paint manufacturers who do provide these for the modeller.  If painting wood, you must use a primer anyway else your paint be absorbed into the timber (regardless of the number of coats you might put on.

Completed:  

PORT JACKSON - 1803 Topsail Schooner 1/50 by Modellers Shipyard

HMB ENDEAVOUR - 1768 Bark 1/64 by Artesania Latina

Under Construction:  

HMAV BOUNTY - 1/60 by Amati

NORFOLK Colonial Sloop- 1/64 Scratchbuild

HMS EURYALUS - 1:48 Scratchbuild POF

Next Project:  

HMS THUNDRER - 1/48 CAF Models/Scratchbuild

Planned:  

HMS SUPPLY - 1/64 Scratchbuild

HMS SIRIUS

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