Bit of a problem! HMS Speedy, Vanguard Models

[JohnEvans]

This morning I accidentally caught the top mast, and almost snapped it. It’s weakened at the point where the 1mm hole is and is never going to hold when  I complete the rigging process!

when

I stopped sobbing and started to think of my options, which are these I think-

splint ?

some kind of support fabric?

re- do the top mast section, which could cause more damage in the process ( and having seen Glenn-UK’s post on HMS Sphinx I realise that the smart way is not to assemble the top mast at this stage!)

 

if anyone out there has advice,I would love to hear from you.

Couple of pics. attached, please don’t judge to harshly, I know I’m in the company of experts, but I only have my dining room table!
thanks I hope 

john
 

 

[AON]

I hate to say it... but sometimes a "do over" is the best answer.

Remove the offending part and make a new one.

Seems like a kick in the sensitive parts right now, but when your done you will be much happier and will be wondering why you hesitated... but we all do so you are not alone.

[Thukydides]

I am with Alan on this one. I think you should just remake it. Also as you said it is better to not add things that stick out until you are completely ready for them. I like to only put the lower masts in, then rig them, then proceed to the topmasts, then rig them etc...

Edited Thursday at 03:18 PM by Thukydides

[Justin P.]

If I haven't made  50% of a Model at least twice then I'm not sure I've really built it.  I think the other guys are right...   remake it.

[Keith Black]

 John, at one time or another most of us have been in your shoes. When building these fragile models breakage is to be expected.

 

 Short of doing the correct thing by replacing the broken part, you might try removing the broken top part of the mast, drill holes into the two faces, insert a brass pin made from brass wire, and CA glue the two pieces back together. It's a long shot, it might work but it's always going to nag at you. 

[TBlack]

Keith, It's the main t'gallant mast where John's problem is. Mine measures 2 mm wide at that point. I suppose your idea might work if John has a drill bit small enough and a steady hand. At the same time, I guess there's nothing lost in giving it a try.

Tom

[chris watton]

I did the same with my prototype model, the one that's on the box art! But it was the fore topgallant I caught and snapped. You can see it slightly bent in all the finished pics - all I could do was apply a drop of glue and keep it in place until set. But it still has a slight tilt...

[paul ron]

i hate when that happens!

 

i kept snapping my bowsprit in the same place several times. my final fix was to dowel it. i drilled both part's center ever so slightly oversized hole to fit the shaft of a fishing hook. fishing hook wire is pretty tough metal. check how the broken parts fit exactly as they broke. i used epoxy in both parts holes. because the hole is slightly larger, its not critical to get the wire to align exactly centered due to the oversized hole. 

 

so far my fix hasnt broken at that fragile point even though ive hit it a few times since. i did put a red flag on it so i can see it and stay clear of it next time. 

 

btw we have a thread here on just this subject with a few good fixes. 

 

 

Edited Thursday at 06:43 PM by paul ron

[JohnEvans]

Thanks for all your help guys- re-make it is then!

[JohnEvans]

And I’ll check the thread Paul!

[hollowneck]

Good decision, John. Sometimes a do-over is the best option.

Console yourself with the thought that you haven't added the standing rigging.

Attached is a photo of my current commission to restore a vintage model with several broken masts and spars that need dramatic repairs (prior to sorting-out the rigging mess); a family cat jumped on my client's glass case, collapsing the top panel onto the ship.

 

I show you my challenge to perk you up, accentuate the positive! It could be worse.

Ron

 

 

 

[Keith Black]

 Ron, the ship looks salvageable but can the cat be saved? 

[Dr PR]

John,

 

Replacing the broken piece won't be much of a problem. You don't have rigging in place yet.

 

However, the suggestions to splice the break are not too far fetched. All of the rigging exerts a downward force, and that will hold the pieces together. And the different stays and lines balance each other if you get them rigged right, so the mast shouldn't try to bend.

 

When installing the rigging do not pull the lines tighter than the minimum force necessary to get them to stand straight without sagging. You really shouldn't be putting much strain on the masts and spars.

[paul ron]

15 hours ago, hollowneck said:

Good decision, John. Sometimes a do-over is the best option.

Console yourself with the thought that you haven't added the standing rigging.

Attached is a photo of my current commission to restore a vintage model with several broken masts and spars that need dramatic repairs (prior to sorting-out the rigging mess); a family cat jumped on my client's glass case, collapsing the top panel onto the ship.

 

I show you my challenge to perk you up, accentuate the positive! It could be worse.

Ron

 

 

 

why not put some pirates climbing aboard and fighting on deck with the crew as if she were overtaken in battle? 

 

you have alot of work ahead.

 

[hollowneck]

18 hours ago, Keith Black said:

 Ron, the ship looks salvageable but can the cat be saved? 

When I picked the model up from my client I saw no evidence of any household pets. Plausible deniability!

 

 

[hollowneck]

6 hours ago, paul ron said:

why not put some pirates climbing aboard and fighting on deck with the crew as if she were overtaken in battle? 

 

you have alot of work ahead.

 

One mast. One spar. One rigging line at a time. I'm Keeping Calm. Carrying On.

I've added an overhead "gantry" to my workshop's ceiling to suspend the model's rigging mess while I repair the broken masts and spars. Three clamps on the glued maintop that is in four broken pieces. Intense lighting also helps.

Edited Friday at 08:08 PM by hollowneck
grammar

[Keith Black]

 Ron, would you please start a build/restoration log for this model as I'd love to keep abreast of your progress. 

[TBlack]

Looks to me as though Ron has gotten most of the masking back in place.

[paul ron]

16 hours ago, hollowneck said:

When I picked the model up from my client I saw no evidence of any household pets. Plausible deniability!

 

 

mancoon? thats one big **** cat! 

[JohnEvans]

Talk about using up all your 9 lives in one go!

Thanks Ron, definitely feel encouraged, fascinated to see how you get on.

I'm still mulling it over, but will probably do the “do over”, it’s just a matter of summoning up the motivation!

And the dog Ruby can’t get on the table😀😀

[JohnEvans]

This forum is a wonderful thing!

I’ve just found a post which replicates pretty much exactly what I did, thanks paul Ron for the tip!

[hollowneck]

19 hours ago, TBlack said:

Looks to me as though Ron has gotten most of the masking back in place.

The topgallants are going to be the most challenging to repair. I'm planning on employing an internal "splint" (thin brass wire with a daub of clear Gorilla glue) to connect the thin, broken dowel surfaces to one another. Re-tensioning the existing backstays, shrouds and braces will help stabilize these delicate dowel pieces. One of the principal issues on a restoration commission is to return the model to its original configuration as best one can. This restriction means I can't use certain materials like modern rope for rigging repairs.

Edited 7 hours ago by hollowneck

[Keith Black]

2 minutes ago, hollowneck said:

This means I can't use certain materials like modern rope for rigging repairs.

 Catgut? 

[hollowneck]

29 minutes ago, Keith Black said:

 Catgut? 

No. The model was rigged entirely with a single diameter of 3 stranded cotton thread that is no longer available. The original builder paid a lot of attention to reeving the stays properly, however he applied what seems to be a variable coating of shellac to most rigging lines (standing as well as running) including where lines terminate: cleats, belaying points, but more problematical, where lines reeve through blocks! Once fully-rigged, the builder apparently wanted to insure the rigging wouldn't go anywhere nor absorb moisture (? a guess). The builder loved doing rigging (one of the better aspects of this particular "old school" kit model) and I believe he wanted it to survive for centuries!

Unfortunately, the rigging's shellacing didn't prevent the family cat's other plans...

 

Looking closely at the model's crushed mainmast top, the shrouds and stays are nicely reeved. The same light colored rigging line used for running lines was darkened somehow for the standing rigging.... and then, coated with shellac where it terminated (to keep it in-place is another guess).

 

I'll close this out now, since I'm getting (WAY!) off-topic from @JohnEvans original query.

 

 

Edited 6 hours ago by hollowneck

[vossiewulf]

25 minutes ago, hollowneck said:

I'll close this out now, since I'm getting (WAY!) off-topic

Um I understand closing it out here, but I'll echo others who requested you do a build log of sorts for the repair, I would be very interested in following how you handle that mess

 

[Keith Black]

1 hour ago, hollowneck said:

No. The model was rigged entirely with a single diameter of 3 stranded cotton thread that is no longer available.

 You missed my stab at humor. 

[Nirvana]

I would use the model and create a battle diorama; the damage is there already.....🙃