Soleil Royal by Hubac's Historian - Heller - An Extensive Modification and Partial Scratch-Build

[shipmodel]

Hi Marc - 

 

The Helping Hands and the fly tying thread will make a significant improvement.  Go with that if it works for you.

Here is another solution that works in small scales like yours.

It relies on stropping with wire and making the hook an integral part of the strop.

The photo is pretty self-explanatory.  The block is 2mm from Warner Woods West.

You can add to the realism with a quick layer of paint on the hook to minimize the look of the twisted wire.

A line can be tied to the other side of the block to start the lacing from block to block.

 

Best of success

 

Dan 

 

 

[Siggi52]

Hello Marc,

here the way I do it. This is a 3 mm block and a 0,3 mm rope

Then with a cannula I go through the rope once,

and a second time from below. Then I glue it with clear nail polish.

I wisk you good luck and nerves like wire ropes with your rigging.

 

[kirill4]

GOOD DAY Siggi!

Thanks a lot!

This is real good way! It is almost real splicing!!! Looks very natural!!!

All teh Best !!!

Kirill

[Hubac's Historian]

Very cool tip, Siggi!

[yancovitch]

i intervene, by asking anyone here if they have seen any metal sanding sheets, i think with carbide abrasive coatings , fine and coarse.....it's like they don'l exist anymore ......they put sandpaper to shame....i still have some after 40 years.....sandvik came out with them first....you can cut them to any shape....the most wonderful tool ever.....maybe it's some kind of suppression?.......thanks....

[Hubac's Historian]

I’m a little confused: carbide abrasive coated paper, or carbide abrasive coated metal?  Forgive me if that is a foolish question.

[Kevin-the-lubber]

If you mean those ubiquitous dark grey ‘wet & dry’ sanding sheets, which I believe are coated with silicone carbide, you can still get these just about everywhere relevant in the uk. But as we’re on the subject, can I make an additional recommendation, that being sanding mesh. If you are familiar with it, it’s really good on wood as it doesn’t clog and stays ‘sharp’ for much longer than normal sanding paper.

[yancovitch]

these were actually metal with a rough, i think, carbide grit on the surface...i'll send photo when i get back from walk with wife...

[yancovitch]

 

 

this to me was one of the best inventions next to velcro and crazy glue...ok ....i exaggerate....😁    i've cut pieces from this one and glued them to various shaped wooden handles

Edited October 14 by yancovitch

[Hubac's Historian]

I don’t think I have ever seen anything quite like this.  It’s like a fine rasp, but with an adhered abrasive?

[yancovitch]

strange...''they'' had course, medium, and fine.....purchased at home depot in vancouver many years ago.....i can't even see them mentioned  anywhere online.......i guess the the sandpaper manufacturers, forced termination somehow.....first sandvik, then another company took over....then.....ziltch.......they were-are just wonderful.....

[Hubac's Historian]

In response to reading through my travails of researching and learning basic rigging techniques, Dan Pariser offered to give me a first-hand tech session of the various tools, materials and techniques that he employs in his own professional work.  As is always the case, this was time well-spent.

 

Immediate takeaways:

 

- The helping hands vise with a retro-fitted hardware store spring for tension is an absolute game changer.  Intuitively, this is common-sense, but actually using the device makes it crystal-clear how medieval my previous efforts really were.  Welcome to the enlightenment!

 

- Speaking of which, a simple magnifying visor really helps to ease eye-strain - particularly for fools like me who are still stubbornly resisting the very real need for transition lenses.

 

- Buying a box of small CA gel tubes is a wise investment.

 

- Along those lines - small disposable paper cups, like the ones you would use to stock a water cooler, are the perfect elevated platform for you to place a dollop of your gel CA.  I had been using small squares of tin foil, but it’s easy to lose sight of the glue spot and/or stick the foil to your hand when you aren’t paying strict attention.

- One really should accustom themselves to using bent-nose tweezers for their rigging processes.  Self-evident, I know, but I have a tendency to make due with whatever I have laying about.  I am usually working way too hard.

 

- Common, round tooth picks are the perfect CA applicators.

 

So, Dan showed me a variety of approaches to stropping a block, either with or without hooks.  What was especially fascinating was the interplay between polished line (free of whiskers) and either embroidery thread or fly-tying line for seizings.

 

Embroidery thread, because it has a lay, will grab onto the polished line, while fly-tying line is more prone to slipping.  This can make it difficult to advance the seizing.  To counteract this, when using fly-tying line, one might begin the seizing with a Lark’s Head knot, and then reversing both leads in the counter-direction, in order to cinch the knot tight:

 

https://howdidyoumakethis.com/larks-head-knot/

 

Another important take-away was to begin the seizing at the distance away from the block that you wish the seizing’s length to be.  With each successive wrap, the seizing grows tighter as it nears the block.

 

Lastly, a perfectly serviceable and long-lived serving machine can be made for a mere hardware store pittance:

As soon as I got home, I now found it incredibly easy to make hook strops for my 2mm double blocks:

Right now, I’m in the process of painting all of the main deck guns. Their bores have been blacked-out.  I have learned from my earlier experience with the lower main deck guns to always keep the gun barrels separate from each other during the painting process.  This is especially true for the next step, which is the Citadel ver-de-gris wash.  I’ll have a bit of a tedious touch-up process for those lower deck guns, much later in the build.

The cascabels are still white, here, because I am using that end to hold the barrel while I brush on the Citadel dark bronze.  I haven’t tried to airbrush this paint, but I suspect that the metallic flake would make it a poor candidate for air-brushing.  Once painted, I’ll join the barrels to their carriages.  I’ll add cap-squares with CA and strips of black construction paper.  Then, I’ll glue the guns down and attach the breaching ropes and tackles.

 

Dan showed me quite a bit more about knotting techniques and other rigging tips, but I will discuss those things as the build necessitates them.  Thank you so much, Dan!

 

And thank you all for looking-in!

Edited October 15 by Hubac's Historian

[Baker]

12 hours ago, yancovitch said:

i intervene, by asking anyone here if they have seen any metal sanding sheets, i think with carbide abrasive coatings , fine and coarse.....it's like they don'l exist anymore ......they put sandpaper to shame....i still have some after 40 years.....sandvik came out with them first....you can cut them to any shape....the most wonderful tool ever.....maybe it's some kind of suppression?.......thanks....

Off topic, but.

As a former 3M employee (retired).
Up until 25 years ago, the resin that "glues" the "sanding grains" to the paper was made from phenol and formaldehyde.
Not environmentally and health friendly, but of great quality.
Now a different, healthier resin is used. Less unhealthy, certainly. Better...?
Search the 3M website. You might find the sandpaper you are looking for there.

[wefalck]

Yep, phenolic resins are so much better, because harder, for many applications ...

 

If you consider building a serving machine, you may also consider building yourself a rope-walk. Basically, you need the same kind of parts and materials, as for the serving machine. Ropes made from fly-tying threads or certain high-quality threads (e.g. Alterfil L 400, a German brand used now by various museums in Europe) will have a 'lay' and no fuzz.

 

[Hubac's Historian]

For this model, I will buy my rope.  The prospect of making all the rope this project will require, in all the many sizes does not interest me.

[shipmodel]

Hi Marc - 

 

Thanks for the compliments.  It's always gratifying to pass along the tips and tricks that I have worked out over the last 35 years.

I used to teach rigging seminars for the Guild, but they have been phased out.  

I keep thinking that I will write a book one day, but it has never really gotten off the ground.

 

Happy to have helped.

 

Dan

 

[Hubac's Historian]

Huge help, Dan!  The problem with rigging is precisely that there aren’t any substantive modeling technique books out there, so one finds themselves in a vast grey area of looking through better build logs along with their own experimentation.  In his books, Philip Reed details some of his rigging technique, but owing to small scales, that is often accomplished with wire.

 

As you said the other night - most of what a really good model requires isn’t complicated, but it is helpful to understand the best simplifications for the sake of whatever scale you are working in.

 

You have my vote, Dan; by all means, please write that book!

[Bill97]

Thanks Marc, and by way of Marc thanks Dan, this is some good information and techniques. It was interesting for me recently when I toured the Cutty Sark in Greenwich, England. They have a small scale rope walk set up and visitors could help in making a small section of rope as a souvenir. I have seen numerous posts here on MSW showing a builder using a rope walk to make their own rope but never gave it much attention. I just use the variety of if rope sizes available online. However I did find it interesting watching how they work. I also was amazed when the guide explained they needed football field long buildings to make the ship ropes, which actually makes since. I may have mentioned before that as my different builds come and go I have more and more looked forward to the rigging the model. This is where the model actually comes to life I think. What I also find fascinating is that if a builder builds their model straight from a high quality kit with the supplied thread, blocks, and other rigging essentials, following the instructions they can achieve a very nice model. However for the more experienced and adventurous builder taking the rigging outside the box opens up vast avenues for the hobbiest. Marc your steps outside the box encourage me to maybe put a toe out there. And of course Dan, as Marc said, write that book. Teach classes. Do what you can to spread your infinite knowledge. 
 

Bill

[wefalck]

There is a bit of a scale gap in books and other instructions on the practicalities of realistic ship models. For instance, Lloyd McCaffery provides ideas for very small scales, based on wire, in his book. There are the old-time classics, such as Underhill, but they typically are aimed at a scale of 1/48 or perhaps down to 1/64 or so. In the range of 1/72 down to 1/200 there isn't anything specifically in bookform, as far as I am aware.

 

If you are interested in a tour-de-force of absolutely detailed, down to all the splicing and serving, rigging example in 1/48 including all the historical research that goes with it, have a look at @archjofo's log on LA CREOLE (we have been pushing him to write up his work in a more permanent form, but this is a lot of work).

 

Another example, but in 1/96 scale is @dafi's HMS VICTORY. At this scale, he has to make already simplifications and describes them very well, including rope-making.

 

At smaller scales the materials are a limiting factor. About the thinnest material for rope you can get is 16/0 fly-tying thread and Alterfil L400 sewing thread. Below that you will have to resort to wire.

[Hubac's Historian]

Today, my son is home, sick, and so I stayed home with him.  This will afford me a few hours to assemble guns, while otherwise enjoying a lazy afternoon.

 

Painting of the barrels came out well.  The Citadel ver-de-gris wash is a little tricky to use.  Unless you are depicting the centuries-old guns currently on display at the Palais des Invalides, then you are going to want to dilute the wash-coat.  I like to use a medicine dropper to do this because it is easier to keep track of ratios that are repeatable.  I think I ended up at a 50/50 mix, cut with common tap water.

 

Despite thinning, the wash coat does dry almost immediately, and it is almost impossible to avoid lap lines with a brush.  I do think a bristle brush is the best applicator - as opposed to an airbrush - because you can draw color into and out of crevasses, thus modulating the effect.

 

After everything has dried, I use a Q-tip, covered with a t-shirt scrap to burnish each barrel, and minimize the lap-lines.  Particularly stubborn laps can be further softened with a well-worn SOFT toothbrush.

In the light of day, this degree of oxidation looks about right to my eye:

As for assembling, I have a small, round needle file that I use to clear paint from the trunnion blocks.  I scrape paint away from the undersurface of the trunnions, as well as the quoin and the cascabel rim, where these two surfaces meet.

 

I will add cap-squares, at least to the fully visible carriages.  If the process is not too tedious, I will do so for the rest of the main deck guns; it’s just a little extra bond-insurance to safeguard against guns breaking free of their carriages.

 

So, little by little.  Catch as catch can.  We are getting there!  Thank you for stopping by.

[HAIIAPHNK]

First of all, I wish your son a good recovery. 
I guess fall was invented specifically for illness. My childhood memories of my ailments are primarily associated with this time of year. Of course it's not pleasant to be sick. But still, being sick as a child had its advantages, you could play games, even in bed. Building caves or castles out of blankets. I was also very fond of my childhood constructor, made of metal parts, slats and wheels. You had to connect them with bolts and nuts. For some reason they don't make those anymore. It's a shame. You could build mechanisms or transportation with it. Then I found nuts or other parts in my bed for a long time. So when I was a kid, there were advantages to being sick. And now when I get sick and ask to bring something like that to my bed, my wife looks at me strangely and scolds me. It's frustrating. Being sick as an adult is boring. 

I won't say much about your work. I just don't understand much about working with plastic, and any words I say on the subject will show my low understanding in this technique. But I always watch all your releases and admire. You can be sure of that.

 

[Kevin-the-lubber]

1 hour ago, Hubac's Historian said:

In the light of day, this degree of oxidation looks about right to my eye:

Looks about right to me too. When I was working up the resin printed Victory cannons a while back, I did a weathering trial on a few, using Vallejo Model Air cockpit green (71.331) diluted even further with a bit of water. It came out okay, but no better than that. With the paint being so watery, it was very difficult to get it 'just so'; it would run and sit in the corners but run off the surfaces, and when I look at those test pieces now, I can see that the results varied from cannon to cannon. Yours looks much better and, when I come to it, I'll try that citadel paint.

[Hubac's Historian]

Kevin - would not most of Victory’s guns have been iron?

[Kevin-the-lubber]

11 hours ago, Hubac's Historian said:

would not most of Victory’s guns have been iron?

Yes, all iron as far as I know. I meant when I get to the SR!