Thunder
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I'm going to complete my rigging research for the Sovereign of the seas whilst also starting a wooden kit. Although just purchased the NMM plans of the Serapis I think it will be either the Diana, Granado or Fair American.
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Hi Wahka, Yes considering my next build. I do have other kits started, what i call my holiday kits, I.e. kits i start in the evenings when away from home. I have the Airfix kits of Great Western and Sovereign of the seas started as well as the Pyro USS Alliance and Constructo's Halifax. The two Airfix kits and the Alliance are all at the point of doing the rigging. I will be, however, starting a new wooden kit but I have many already purchased to choose from. Just deciding which one is the problem. I have: Jotika's Diana, Granado, William, Bounty, Endeavour, Mary Rose. Mamoli's Yacht Mary, Victory's Pegasus and Lady Nelson. Euromodel's Mordaunt, Aeropiccolla's Serapis, Lauck Street's Fair American. Art's Prince de Neufchatel, Rhoda Mary, Revell's Rattlesnake, SWM's Mevagissey Lugger. Which would you choose?
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I did take these photographs but did not like how turned out. Will do some more once mounted.
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I am at the final stages of my build. Just the final tidying up and mounting on a stand. Wahka, I usually write each stage of the rigging down and did so with this model, however, did not make such a good job of it as usual. Big lesson learnt. On the next model i will do the research before completing the deck furniture to make sure i have the correct belaying points. Better notes and my own drawings.
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There kit has been on hold for over ten years, film came out in 2003 and they started development shortly after. "The ship came from Patrick O'Brians imagination so know one really knows what it looked like," Not really so as was based on a real ship: https://prints.rmg.co.uk/products/plan-of-hms-surprise-1796-lines-and-profile-j5948?_pos=9&_sid=bca6752cf&_ss=r
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Hi, I did mean Ronald's but think you have the same issue. Unfortunately not at home to check plans but that angle looks very severe. Be worth checking against other builds on here. On Eugenio's i was wondering where the stern board should go with the chase gun ports. There also seems to be no run aft over the rudder. Take a look at the below (lifted from Kevin's build) Sorry Kevin, hope you do not mind.
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Hi, Can you show a photograph from the side? Hard to tell from the rear view of the stern but almost looks like the kit has given the Victory a Square tuck instead of it being round. If so i am amazed you did as well as you did.
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I like the drawing holder idea. I have been looking into getting one of the below but not located in the UK yet. You may want to check out HMS Cruiser builds as well. The hull structure is almost identical.
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There used to be a loop hole where if you got a company to post to someone in the US and they forwarded to you marking the item as a present you didn't pay the duty. I believe they have closed that now. My wife brought me the Lauck Street 'Fair American' and really got stung. To be honest, if she had known about the extra cost, it would not have got purchased. I have never brought anything direct from the US since.
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If this is the quality of your work then I think I will have a lot to learn by following this build. Inspiring.
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The best way to judge the length of the breech rope is the practical. I.e. they wouldn't want it that long that the gun could recoil down the grating.
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Looking very good, very professional. Cant wait to see one rigged.
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Hi, Had a look in Brian Lavery's 'The Arming and Fitting of English ships of war 1600-1815. He does not include a lot of text other than that below: Does not state for our period with 6 pounders for the breechings but does state circumference. If we say 5.5" circumference that gives 0.7mm for our scale. I have added the text for the tackles but this gives more confusion as it seems he has worked on sizes in Diameters for these. This does not make sense as it makes the tackles 0.79mm which is bigger than his breech rope. I would think he meant circumference for this which gives 0.25mm and blocks of 2.5mm. Unfortunately it is often the case that the more you research the more confused you get. I have an extensive library but often find these great authors contradictory or, in most cases, do not have the information you need. Perhaps they could not find it either.
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Hi, Yes very useful chart, even my books on arming and fitting do not give this detail. Works out at 1.59mm. I have just put some 1.5mm on one of my cannon and compared with photo of victory I posted and think you may be right. You will have to step up the eyebolt sizes as well in order to rig. At first I thought the chart might be giving circumference instead of diameter but this brings it out at 0.5mm which seems too small.
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Hi, 1.5mm seems huge to me, have you worked that out from a good source? I used 0.75mm, I would only go as high as 1mm. If unsure i tend to go smaller rather than larger as larger, in my opinion, tends to look clumsy. However, it will be worth getting a stock of 1mm and 1.5mm as I used these sizes for the standing rigging. 2mm and 2.5mm is also worth having mainly for anchor ropes. The Amati is what I have. I used the natural and dyed black. I have answered on my log. Sorry for delay, only just got back from holiday and had to look at model to confirm what I used.
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Hi sorry for slow reply, I have been away and could not say till I came home and had a look at the model. I used 0.75 Amati. I do prefer Amati for the larger sized threads for both colour and quality. The natural colour only. The larger standing rigging is dyed Amati Natural.
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Hi, I am away so cannot measure what size i used at the moment. I know I probably gauged by eye as finding accurate sizes is near impossible. They are smaller than most people think if taking those on HMS Victory and HMS Trincomalee as a guide. You can see on the attached that all but the breechings are a single loop so depends what detail you want to go to. Mine are all single loop. The kit sized eyelets on the etched sheet were a good size but think mine made from enamelled wire. If you have a set of miniature drill bits you can use the shaft to twist wire round and make any size you want. Another source i am just investigating are eyed fishing hooks. You can buy down to size 26 which are tiny. Cut the eyelet off and use or use complete as hooks for rigging. Buy barbless. They come in different shapes of shaft as well as sizes. Cutting the eyes off two and gluing to a third with an eye also makes a nice little grapnel.
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Many times people have made the above quote because they have failed to test the paint on some scrap material or small area. Oils in some woods stop the paint setting. Some paint is designed for plastic and this causes the above.
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It is the gun port distribution that is most concerning, never seen anything like this. Other photos show this shape of port but think the kit company has squeezed in 32 guns as they have their history in error.
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Hi thankyou for the reply and your kind comments about my completed builds. I did find some interesting photographs of the ship Alliance but did not post due to the lack of interest. NH 57136.tiff
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Hi, I used rigging line for the topmast shrouds. Should be steel around deadeyes with metal plates through to just below top and hooks for futtock shrouds. It is just two cleats to each of fore most shrouds on each mast for the topgallant yard lifts.
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As my shrouds are rigged was considering replacing one at a time. the other shrouds and ratlines should keep everything in place whilst i do it. Then all should be perfect size. Would be very fiddly though.
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Hi. yes should be closed. To be honest it has annoyed me that I didn't make new ones ever since I fitted them as should not be hard to do. Also if you solder them there is less chance of them pulling open. If going to solder will be worth doing the bottom of the loop with the deadeye in as these are a bad design and will pull open the split being at the point of most importance.
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I tend to put the three sections of mast together off the ship, i.e. main mast, topmast and t'gallant. That way they can be glued and dry with a straight line drawn under them so you can see they are all in alignment. I then install on the ship. Make sure the ship is level, fore and aft, to its waterline and from side to side. You can install a plumb line to the rear of the mast (rear so rake of mast makes it swing freely, and as long as this is in alignment with the mast you should have it set accurately. Of course if you get the rigging incorrect you will pull the mast out of position but gives you a good starting point.
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THE ORDER OF DRESSING THE MASTS AND YARDS - HMB Cruiser 1796.docx attached the order I rigged but remember I rigged the lower yard on the main mast as a cross jack, as you are depicting a later date you may want to rig as a sail carrying yard arm. The kit depicts a half way house calling it a cross jack but rigging Jeers.
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