Thunder
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Everything posted by Thunder
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Went with the metal bands, not due to kit instructions as probably flawed but because I believe new inventions were tried on smaller classes of vessel and would like to think it was tried on this one. If went by James Lees would have been wooldings but, as with most reference material, these books deal mainly with ships of the line. Come on Ian McLaughlan, when are you going to do volume two to fill that gap??
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Sorry, got to ask, is that the fuselage of a sopworth pup in the fore ground?
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- artesania latina
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I know I have been bad in not posting updates but I now need some help. If there is the interest here I will bring it up to date. What I need help with is below. I have got to the stage of building the lower masts and can not decide on metal bands, as the kit instructions suggest, or rope wooldings. My reason for uncertainty is that the kit has cannon and so assuming is portrayed as built which would be 1796. I can find no mention of the metal hoops replacing the wooldings before 1800. Even though I have this detail I also know that most references are very deficient regarding these smaller war ships and I also know that the smaller warships were always used for testing new technology. This means any rigging details can swing either way. The construction of the caldercraft lower masts is closer to the woolding pre 1800 method but again this does not allow for the transition period that 1796 sits firmly in. would appreciate anyone's thoughts or results of their research.
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If you want to set the height of the gun port from the deck you can make up one of the cannon, sit it on the deck and mark the centre point with the cannon barell. don't cut it to full size as one you have the cannon able to protrude it will be slightly lower due to the camber of the deck. Therefore, best to remeasure once having a hole for the cannon to be pushed through. Not sure if this is what you were looking for but hope it helps.
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what are these boats worth if anything?
Thunder replied to Probate1's topic in New member Introductions
Hi, Unfortunately built models never realise their true value unless built under a commission. You never really see them sell well on ebay. Your top model is, best guess, a Mediterranean ship rigged merchant vessel similar to a Genoese or Venetian but is not an accurate build so would be only symbolic. The lower is a Chinese Junk ( Don't be offended this was what they were called). Neither are what I would call a scale replica model but more what you would find for sale in a seaside souvenir shop. Not sure how the Junk is constructed but the top one may well be plank on frame so someone may of built from kits. I might be completely wrong and someone here may have more knowledge. I do not think they are of great value but do have a charm that someone might want to put on display in their study. You see similar in many a rental holiday cottage in the UK. Hope this helps. -
Hi, The flag was straight out of the box and just needed trimming. It wasn't on a sheet like that but on its own and was very clear. It was just very stiff and took a lot of soaking and shaping. My wife brought me the kit in the first few years we were married and we have been married 27 years so may of been an earlier version. Adrian
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Hi, now you have lowered that bulkhead it may effect the run of your planking so they may need 'trueing up' again. the ones either side might need material adding.
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Hi, This was a very enjoyable kit to build even though I new the history to be incorrect. Materials are very good. I didn't use the flag at the time but managed to make it look respectable on my Speedy build ( well I think so). It was one of my early builds so I didn't do the research to much later. One major difference between a cutter and sloop is the fitting of the bowsprit. The sloop is at a greater angle and fixed. The cutter runs parallel with the deck and can be hauled in to shorten its length. I am going to look forward to your build as I have so often thought of re-vamping mine. The first thing I would do is change the stern gallery and badge mouldings. Then I would re-rig as a sloop because I managed to do a bit of a cutter / sloop hybrid.
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Arlington Court In Devon UK used to have a very good collection of ship models with a number of Prisoner of war models. It is a National Trust house and their website does not help much but when I last went, about 10 years ago it had room after room of ship models. Another reason a lot of museums have much smaller displays is that they have lost space to allow for disabled access.
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Hi, I made up one of the cannons sat on some decking strip to double check the heights and to make sure the cannon would be placed central to the port. If you think yours is too low remember that you can plank it higher at that end but you may also have to do so for the gun port.
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Plank Bender....
Thunder replied to dvlp47's topic in Building, Framing, Planking and plating a ships hull and deck
Hi, I have noticed that you live in Germany but the plank bender you have shown is 230V. Just check before you buy as I assume you are 110V in Germany. -
Plank Bender....
Thunder replied to dvlp47's topic in Building, Framing, Planking and plating a ships hull and deck
Hi, I have the model craft plank bender but find it only successful if you first soak the plank. I use it to shape the plank and dry it out at the same time. It has never worked when using un soaked planks and has the tendency to scorch it if you persist. It would be lovely to be able to spil the planks to get the right shape but unfortunately not really feasible with the timber strips provided in a kit as too narrow to start with. Buying timber in the uk, even if you only want to upgrade, is not easy and far too expensive for my budget. £564 for the diana kit and £250 more to change the second planking! I replaced the deck planking for £55 but it needs to go back as quality worse than what came in the kit. -
Plank Bender....
Thunder replied to dvlp47's topic in Building, Framing, Planking and plating a ships hull and deck
I often use the method of: taper plank as required for position to be fitted, either fore or aft. Soak plank in hot water clamp in required position till dry remove ( should retain shape) then glue and clamp in place The only down side is if the model does not have enough bulkheads the plank will look to be stepped rather than a gradual curve. This is where shaping with an iron wins. -
Chris, Due to lack of decent timber supplies in the UK would you be interested at looking at selling timber or timber replacement upgrades for other models. I only ask as I would love to replace for some of the kits I have already purchased and if you were able to purchase more it might be beneficial to you as you might get a better price from your supplier. If not can you reveal where you have obtained it from? Love this kit, wish I hadn't just finished a cutter. however, won't stop me buying in the future even though will be my third cutter! Adrian
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Hi, both may be right depending on where on the hull the profile is for. Possibly A where the planks terminate at the stem and B along the lower keel.
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Sorry didn't read correctly, I see you have spotted the issue yourself.
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That planking looks great which makes my next comment hard to say. Don't some of the midships bulkhead tabs want cutting off after the second planking is complete? At least I'm sure that was the case when I built her. I hope I'm not right.
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I think your planking started off really well. I think the main reasons you then started to struggle are more down to common faults in kit design. Firstly, especially for a single planked hull, those bulkheads are far too far apart. There is no wonder that at the more difficult part of the hull the planks have started to twist and become hard to make even. Secondly, the planks, on a real build the blanks might not only be tapered but be cut to shape from a much wider plank (think this is called 'spilling'). This means they would fit more naturally, we have to make do with the kit planks of all one parallel width. We then try to force to shape with the tendency for them to buckle. At the stem, did you cut a rabbet? when you chose to fit the stem early it would of been advisable to do this to snug the end of the planks into. I say all this but my planking has exactly the same faults. So don't knock yourself up. If it was double planked you wouldn't have the issues as you would sand it down, fill the dips and have a sound base for the second layer. Then I think you will be surprised how good you can plank.
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Hull nearly complete just some tidying up to do. I used Manns floor varnish to finish the hull and deck. I put this on another topic.
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Rudder pintles added, rudder ready to be fitted but leaving off for now. Paint will need touching up. Hull entrance steps
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Gratings in place on the deck. None are these are true to size of the plan. I cut the deck back to the apertures on the false deck. Big mistake, not only are the grating parts provided insufficient in length to cover the holes the subsequent built size are not to plan. My advice would be to plank the deck completely and apply the gratings over the top. Not correct to real manufacture which is the opposite way round. The over issue is the small gap between the gratings and between them and the companionway. The planks are too small and to easy to keep breaking away. Hole for the companionway ( still visible above) is also too large. I have this ready to put in place and have had to run a plank round the bottom edge to make it wide enough to cover the hole.
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Lou, Thank you for taking an interest, Below is another view of the deck showing the nibbling strake and planking. Gun port eyebolt positions were drilled through a simple jig made out of two layers of scrap ply. The larger layer had the jig holes drilled through, the smaller layer is the exact size of the gun port. Has a planking screw through the centre so can be passed through the port and held from the outside whilst drilling for the eyebolts from the inside. Take a note of the hawse hole positions as predetermined by the kit. They are too far from the stem post. Any anchor cable would rub on the cathead brackets when running in a direct line too their access to the cable tier. If you look to the next photos of the outside of the hull you will see they are too far out compared to the cheeks. Funny our good the kit looks to you photograph it. View of headrails etc, Not much like the kit, I managed to shape the grating / marines walk by soaking for hours and then shaping with a hot iron.
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Have you not watched 101 Dalmatians? I thought they were plain but slightly pink. Love them, don't see these types of breed much any more only mongrels with poo in the name somewhere!
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I am the reverse of this, I really struggle to hold the yard whilst dressing it so fit to the mast and then fit all blocks and finally sails.
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Hi, Your cracking on with this, have overtook my Cruiser. I tend to agree, those pump handles are too fragile to work round. I'm intrigued by the 'sills' on the bottom edge of your gunports, are these in the kits plans, I have not noticed them before?
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