Endeavour 1934 by Julie Mo - Amati - Scale 1:35 - America's Cup UK J-Class Challenger

[Julie Mo]

The centerboard has about 10 coats of lacquer on it.  It was easier to do that before installation and the lacquer will help prevent glue from adhering to it when planking.  But the lacquer added enough thickness to the centerboard that it required the keel slots to be widened.

 

When trying to figure how I was going to clamp the "cabin sole" in place, I decided to use the punch out pieces as wedges.  I cut away for the cabin sole sections and then wedged them in place after glue-up.  It seemed to work well enough.

[Julie Mo]

Glue-up continues...

 

I haven't yet figured out why those frame additions are necessary (under the black & red clamps).  You think they would have put them at the deck joint but that's not the case.

 

The stern fillers.  This was a tricky clamp up.  I used the friction method to join the three different sized pieces.

 

The centerboard stopper (white arrow)

 

When clamping two parts on different planes, it became a challenge to apply much pressure.

 

The right side of the clamp is barely clinging on to the bottom of the keel, while the left side of the clamp isn't even applying pressure on the other side of the piece.  Now that I'm seeing this, I realize I should have inserted wedge shims.

[KeithAug]

Hi Julie 

 

You seem to be doing very well.

 

Re frame additions - if I am looking at the right bits these are because in the Amati build method the planks are only long enough to reach about half way along the hull. They have therefore given you a double frame thickness to land the end of the planks on. I don't like this solution as it means all the plank ends finish on this central frame - giving a distinctive line of weakness. Planks which alternatively land on different frames give a more realistic and stronger solution. You may be able to see this in the attached photo.

 

Keith

[mtaylor]

Be careful of using "too much" pressure as it can create issues down the road by crushing the wood.   I've heard both good and bad about Titebond.  Gorilla is the big problem child as it foams in the joint and tries to separate the pieces. 

 

Looking good Julie.  You're getting excellent advice and counsel from Keith.  I'm just following along with a cup of coffee.... 

[UpstateNY]

Hi Julie,

 

Thanks for posting the pictures of how you interlocked the clamps...very interesting technique.

 

Enjoying your build and certainly looks like a challenging hull to put together to say the least.

 

Cheers,

 

Nigel.

[Dee_Dee]

Julie,

 

Looking forward to watching your build! 

 

Would it be possible to post more photos of the keel, bulkheads and all of the cross bracing?  The reason I ask, is I purchased this kit on eBay last winter 'for parts', actually, I purchased it for the tools that were included.  But, when I opened the box, I got more parts than expected:  Included were the two sheets of bulkheads / false keel, all of the strip wood and some of the small parts.  Missing were most of the small parts, deck furniture, instructions and prints. 

 

I don't have the room to even think about displaying the finished boat.  However, I'm thinking about building this as a 'half hull' or the hull only for a friend.   

 

Any additional photos of how the hull fits together would be greatly appreciated.

 

Thanks

 

Dee Dee

[Julie Mo]

Hi Julie 

 

You seem to be doing very well.

 

Re frame additions - if I am looking at the right bits these are because in the Amati build method the planks are only long enough to reach about half way along the hull. They have therefore given you a double frame thickness to land the end of the planks on. I don't like this solution as it means all the plank ends finish on this central frame - giving a distinctive line of weakness. Planks which alternatively land on different frames give a more realistic and stronger solution. You may be able to see this in the attached photo.

 

Keith

Keith, you may think I am nuts but here goes...

 

Today it's hard to find mahogany planks over 20-24'.  Back in 1932-3, they might have been able to get planks up to 40'.  (I know Endeavour had an aluminum hull but we'll pretend it was wood.)  So for the sake of this "realism", I was planning on cutting the planks to no more than that length, on a 1:35 scale.  I will not be using full lengths of the material provided.  That may sound like I'm making more work for myself but my love of classic sailboats will not let me do otherwise. 

 

No two planks will butt together on the same frame without at least 2-3 planks separation, but if possible more like 5-6 or more.  I will create a planking pattern that will convey realism and the aesthetic of structural integrity.  Should be fun.     

 

Be careful of using "too much" pressure as it can create issues down the road by crushing the wood.   I've heard both good and bad about Titebond.  Gorilla is the big problem child as it foams in the joint and tries to separate the pieces. 

 

Looking good Julie.  You're getting excellent advice and counsel from Keith.  I'm just following along with a cup of coffee.... 

Mark, it's 5:15 PM and you're just now sitting down with a cup of coffee?

[mtaylor]

 

Mark, it's 5:15 PM and you're just now sitting down with a cup of coffee?

 

It's the first cup of the second pot today.       I drink a lot of coffee.

[Julie Mo]

Julie,

 

Looking forward to watching your build! 

 

Would it be possible to post more photos of the keel, bulkheads and all of the cross bracing?  The reason I ask, is I purchased this kit on eBay last winter 'for parts', actually, I purchased it for the tools that were included.  But, when I opened the box, I got more parts than expected:  Included were the two sheets of bulkheads / false keel, all of the strip wood and some of the small parts.  Missing were most of the small parts, deck furniture, instructions and prints. 

 

I don't have the room to even think about displaying the finished boat.  However, I'm thinking about building this as a 'half hull' or the hull only for a friend.   

 

Any additional photos of how the hull fits together would be greatly appreciated.

 

Thanks

 

Dee Dee

Dee Dee,

 

I am posting every photo I can think I would hope to see if I was going into this blind, which I am.  I hope you find what you need.  My creative photographic skills may not be the best.  Sorry if I missed something you need.

[Julie Mo]

This has been a great experience thus far.  I'm happy I took took the plunge.

 

Now that the bones are solid, time to fair the structure for the deck. 

 

First, I want to say I tripped upon these Bessey vices that became a godsend.  I knew I had some work to do that would require some rigidity in the hull structure.  The Bessey vices were rock-solid.

 

This made the following steps so much more enjoyable.  I took the limited tools I had on hand and made the best of fairing the top deck structure.  Being conscious of the curvatures of the deck, I made sure to always have the fairing tool laying on at least two surfaces so I wouldn't lose the natural shape of the hull.

 

About 46" overall

 

Shooting down the line, it looked pretty good. The bow did have a slight dog but it was easily fixed.

 

Now the deck dilemma.  To tack or not to tack? 

 

I can see the benefit of tacking the deck when it comes to fairing the tips and gunnels.  Then there's the issue of where to begin the gunnel planks?

 

The hull is taking shape and makes my heart skip a beat!  I know how Elizabeth Meyer felt when she first saw Endeavour wallowing in the murk.

[Dee_Dee]

Jules,

What ever photos you post are great - just post as many as possible    

Also, be happy you're not in Chicago, to day we had 12" of snow in Northbrook, more snow further west and north, but only an inch or two at Montrose Harbor.........

Dee Dee 

[Julie Mo]

Dee Dee, I don't envy the snow but I do miss the city.  I'm on a silly quest to see how long I can stay in shorts and sandals but Chicago will always be my home.

[KeithAug]

Julie

 

Re 2nd planking - realistic mahogany plank lengths.

 

This is my best shot of the end butt on my 2nd planks. This is at high magnification. The end butts are hard to see on the finished model. Shortening the planks to a scale length might actually make the laying of the planks easier. On the other hand it will make it more tedious. The decision on what to do is down to you and what makes you feel good. Long or short planks are both wrong on this model because as you say the hull was metal. As you are not constrained by the accuracy of reproduction constraints my advice is to do what makes you feel good.

[Julie Mo]

Julie

 

Re 2nd planking - realistic mahogany plank lengths.

 

This is my best shot of the end butt on my 2nd planks. This is at high magnification. The end butts are hard to see on the finished model. Shortening the planks to a scale length might actually make the laying of the planks easier. On the other hand it will make it more tedious. The decision on what to do is down to you and what makes you feel good. Long or short planks are both wrong on this model because as you say the hull was metal. As you are not constrained by the accuracy of reproduction constraints my advice is to do what makes you feel good.

No matter what anyone else sees, we can spot every detail in the things we've made.  And since this will be something I will keep, I can see it driving me nuts if I didn't stagger the planking like they used to on wood-hulled ships.

 

This reminded me of a wooden 12 meter that I saw in Chicago back in the 80s - US 23, Heritage.  I remember being hypnotized by her beauty.  As I was doing the web search for Heritage, I ran across this: http://www.sailingscuttlebutt.com/2015/06/22/photos-a-new-wooden-12-meter/ Some pretty cool pictures of the build there.

[Julie Mo]

Taking another look at how I will proceed, I am seeing both good and bad regarding tacking the deck down.  The good is that it will provide the contour for helping shape the bow and stern as well as fairing the frames.  The bad is if it's tacked down well enough to remain in place while doing that work on the hull, it will probably be very difficult to remove, especially if it is left on through the planking process.  Indecision reigns.

 

If I go ahead and install balsa backer, I can see how that would stiffen everything up and eliminate the need for tacking the deck down.  I just need to figure how I will cut up the balsa for a snug fit with the limited tools I have.

 

Here's some more pictures of that new wooden 12-meter, from log to finished hull.  I think I want one. 

Edited November 22, 2015 by Julie Mo

[Julie Mo]

Hoping I can get some feedback on how to proceed...

 

I'm at the point where I have to decide to install balsa backer between the frames or proceed without it.  If I had precision tools here, I'd do the backer.  But without that, I am doubtful I can do a proper job.

 

What I am seeing I need to do is fair the frames just like they would be if the backer was installed.  This is what I have set up now:

 

 

 

The clamps keep the hull fairly rigid and straight.  But when I begin to take a rasp or file to the edges of the frames, there is some movement in areas not directly attached to the clamps.  And without the backers, there is some guesswork as to whether you are creating a proper fairing of the hull.  Yet I see most model builds do not have any kind of backer.

 

Keith, did you install the backer because of the size of the model and the space between the frames?

 

To anyone who has built a larger model, did you do so without backers?  If so, how did the hull look?  Was it properly faired after the first planking or did you need filler?

[Styrmann]

Hi Julie

If i could do the hullplanking over again, I surely would have chosen the KA way of construction, For a more stable and even upbuilding of the planks, After finishing the sanding of the hull, I have decided to paint, No mahogny, after I read the orginal ship was a metalconstuction,

At the moment I realize there is a lot of manual labour in front of me, The planks are going in all directions, Uneven thicness and the curvature of the hull are not as I hoped it would be. Cracks between the layers too.

I must admit, on the other side, it has been a straight learningcurve.

Many layers of spraypaint did not work.Probably some indoor housepaint will do the trick to fill the space between the planks.

 

PS. Intresting how many words used in  the Anglo-american language that are simular to my language, related to shipbuilding and work on the sea.

 

B

[KeithAug]

Hi Julie

 

I used the backer for a number of reasons:

 

Because of the thinness of the planks and the wide spacing of the frames I knew the planks would want to curve more at the frames and flatten between them. This would mean that the hull would not change shape smoothly. The lack of smoothness would be greater than could be taken out by sanding - inevitably leading to sanding through the planks as they passed over the frames. The backing significantly reduces / eliminates this problem.

 

Perfect edge to edge butting of successive planks would be very hard to achieve. This type of butting invariably leaves isolated areas where the planks have some misalignment. A misalignment of 1/2 the plank thickness (only .020 inch) would mean half the plank thickness would have to be sanded away to create a smooth hull. The resulting thinned hull would of course be very weak. The backing significantly reduces this problem.

 

The backing stabilises the frames meaning you can complete the planking of one side before starting the other. Without backing you need to alternate planks from side to side. This is a more difficult operation because where the planks close at the bow they want to cross.

 

Although the backing does aid fairing of the frames its main purpose is to address the planking issues identified above. 

 

Keith

Edited November 23, 2015 by KeithAug

[KeithAug]

Hi Julie

 

This photo (borrowed from another members build) gives some idea of the problems encountered without backing. If you consider the sanding needed to get this smooth you will appreciate the degree of plank thinning that is involved.

 

By way of contrast look at this on my build with backing.

 

Zooming in to both photographs shows the issue better.

 

Regards Keith

Edited November 24, 2015 by KeithAug

[Julie Mo]

Don't fight the Hyrda. 

 

I have spent a lot of time debating installing backing and I can't convince myself of anything other than install backing.  I'll have to pull out skills needed to make it happen.

 

Thanks, Keith

[mtaylor]

On the fairing, I wouldn't use a rasp, make a long flexible sanding stick and work up and down instead of back and forth.  Takes longer but you'll have more control and less flexing of the bulkheads.

 

Go with your heart and the Hydra, Julie.  You'll be happy that you did. 

[Julie Mo]

With my handy kindergarten tools, I am finding the backing slooooow going.

 

[yvesvidal]

Julie,

 

Is the backing included into the box? I did not see it on the pictures of the contents.

 

Yves

[Julie Mo]

Julie,

 

Is the backing included into the box? I did not see it on the pictures of the contents.

 

Yves

No, Yves.  I bought the backing separate.  I picked up a couple of blocks of balsa that were 2x4x12 inches.  I wish I had bought 1/2" and 3/4" thick pieces.  It would have made my life much easier.  Trying to rip cut with a Japanese saw doesn't work so well.

[dgbot]

Julie,  using the balsa for filler is a very wise move as the bulkheads are so far apart.  The filler will keep the hull from warping and provide a smooth surface four your planking.  At times it is a pain and and time consuming but down the road worth the effort.

David B

[Julie Mo]

Julie,  using the balsa for filler is a very wise move as the bulkheads are so far apart.  The filler will keep the hull from warping and provide a smooth surface four your planking.  At times it is a pain and and time consuming but down the road worth the effort.

David B

The biggest problem I am having is finding balsa "boards" in 3/4" thickness.  One place wanted to charge almost as much for shipping as the wood.  I need more so I just may have to order big blocks and keep ripping away.

[dgbot]

I bought mine as a bundle of cut offs and usable scrap.  Cheap but then the fun begins with the glue up and shaping.  Is there a hobby store near you that specializes in doll houses?  

David B

[mtaylor]

Check Michael's.  They have assorted sizes of balsa and "bags o' balsa".   My local hobby shop also carries the thick stuff in sheets and "planks" for the big RC planes.

[Julie Mo]

Like a slow boat to China, the backing plods on...

The most enjoyable part of this is using those little Lie-Nielson planes on the left.  I can see them taking the backing right down to the frames and fairing the hull quite well.

 

All the fairing has been done with the L-N planes thus far.

[KeithAug]

Hi Julie

 

It seems to be going well. In the end it will all be worthwhile. 

 

Keep checking the alignment - for bow and twist. Particularly if you are working on one side first. You may need to work from both sides to control distortion.

 

Keith

Edited November 26, 2015 by KeithAug