H.M.S. Triton Cross Section by Paddy - Scale 1:48

[Paddy]

Hi Don,

 

Nice to hear from you. Yes, the clamps are very useful. An idea I got from someone else. Hope your enjoying your Onedia project.

[AntonyUK]

Hi Paddy.

Thanks for all the info on the scrapers..usefull

 

Regards Antony.

[Paddy]

You’re very welcome Antony.

 

I have now arrived at the time to move forward to the next step. My framing is far from perfect but I think I’ve reach the point of diminishing returns. There are a few low spots on a couple of the interior frames on the inside but I do believe those will be taken care of when planking and ceilings are installed. Fingers crossed....... we’ll see.

 

I have installed the keelson and will now decide what process to start next. I do have a few logs I can study that should get me on my way here.

 

[rafine]

Paddy, you may think that your framing is far from perfect, but from here it looks really good. You'll still be able to make small adjustments while you're doing the planking, if you should find them necessary.

 

Bob

[Pete38]

That is a FIRST RATE JOB..as Bob said from here frames are looking good

 

Nice Job  

[Paddy]

Bob and Pete,

Thanks very much gents. Your encouragement is really appreciated.

 

Just reading my "Sailing Man of War 1650 ~ 1850" book, under the Keelson Assembly section, and see that there were copper bolts through the keelson into the keel at ever other timber floor before the 1800s. So, I’ll do that next, just have to decide what size. Seems they ran from 2” down to 1” except for the Victory which had 2 ½” bolts.

 

Thanks again for taking a look and your input.

Edited August 14, 2013 by Paddy

[Paddy]

Attempted my first detail bit today? Installed the simulated copper bolts that tie the keelson to the keel. I decided to leave them just a little proud of the keelson but if anyone knows that they should be flush with the top of the keelson please let me know. It’s not too late to file them down at this point.

 

 

 

[mtaylor]

Paddy,

What Bob said about the planking... if one is too low, add a shim before planking and fair it in. 

 

Bolts... good question on whether proud or flush. I think most folks, if they do these, file them flush. I would think that having them proud could cause a problem with whatever was stored there.

[AntonyUK]

Hi Paddy.

Nice work in the Keelson.

The copper bolts look OK to me.

I can remember reading an article on this..

The holes were drilled and the bolts forced through(not hammered) then cut off above the Keelson and bellow the Keel.

Then they were peaned over with a concave headed hammer.

Basic riveting.

Info came from page 10 in Anatony of the ship " Victory"

So mabe they would be proud. On an English ship...

But copper would expand in the hole with hammering and the amount of area above the Keelson would be very little.

 

That's the way I read it.

Regards Antony.

 

Edited. Found more info..

On page 71 in Anatomy of Nelsons ships there is a photo and discription of the bolts

Will post it when I get to PC.

Edited August 16, 2013 by AntonyUK

[Paddy]

Thanks for that Mark and Antony. Looks like I may have a 50-50 chance either way I decide.

 

 

Hi Paddy.

 

Snip .......

 

Edited. Found more info..

On page 71 in Anatomy of Nelsons ships there is a photo and discription of the bolts

Will post it when I get to PC.

Thanks Antony, great on the photo and I look forward to your post.

Edited August 16, 2013 by Paddy

[AntonyUK]

Hi Paddy.

As requested a photo.

The photo is not good and the scan makes no better

But HaHo.

 

Regards Antony.

[Paddy]

Antony, thanks for taking the time to post that for us.

 

On further searching of ” Sailing Man of War” for ‘Bolt’ information, I quote……..

 

“It was consider good practice to bore out the timber on either side, to a depth and diameter of the head and rove. Once the bolt was fastened the remaining space was filled with some form of caulking, and faired off with the faces of the timber.” (See page 61 in Bolts section.) 

 

So, thanks to Peter Goodwin too I do believe he has given us a supporting answer. I need to learn to expect more for his book and at least look at the index. Egg on my face and a mess in my nest again!  Going to start taking the book to the shop with me.

 

I can sure fair off the bolt with the face of the timber but may have to skip the caulking bit.

Edited August 17, 2013 by Paddy

[Paddy]

Installing the limber strakes now. While the glue is curing on the last limber strake I’ve started fitting a limber board. The fitting is a bit tedious. Have already thrown one in the trash bin.     

 

 

[Rustyj]

 

Have already thrown one in the trash bin.

 

 

Only one? Seriously you are doing a great job and well done on fairing the frames. They look great.

[Boccherini]

Paddy,

nice job on the fairing from where I'm sitting.The raw colour of the timber frames looks good. As Rusty said "Only one?", you are doing a great job.

 

Regards,

Grant.

[Paddy]

Thanks Rusty and Grant. Yes, only one so far but then I'm just starting.

Edited August 18, 2013 by Paddy

[AntonyUK]

Hi Paddy.

Still looking good.

Every time you trash something you make... Is learning another way on how NOT to make it.

Until success.

And then you know how to make it.

It's called learning by doing

I know I spent a lot of my life perfecting things.

The pictures are looking great. You know how to take a good photo

 

Regards Antony.

[Paddy]

Thanks for all of that Antony. You are spot on about the learning process. Was sitting in the bunker until a few minutes ago doing a study

on the limber strakes, and plans when the penny dropped on another way to attack the limber boards. Now, I must put on my lubber's cap and 

mow the lawn  ....... but getting back to the shop will speed the mowing so I can try the new approach.

[Long9Ron]

Paddy

I think you're doing a great job. The framing looks very nice.

I think that I will have to start getting some more books on ship building. I didn't know about the copper spikes at all. I will have to start doing more research on the building of wooden ships before the 1800's. I'm learning so much from all the builders on MSW, it's great.

[Paddy]

Thank you very much Ron.

 

I agree with you whole heartedly. What a great bunch of talented folks to have the privilege to learn from and from such a great collection of countries too.

 

I appreciate very much being a member of MSW.

[Paddy]

Hope I’m not smothering all of you with my minutia but here is what I arrived at to cut the bevel into the limber board. My second idea this morning didn’t work out so out came the trusty scraper blades. After marking some limit lines on the rectangular beam I cut to fit in the limber board trough I clamped it down and began to plane away. Taking even pressure light cuts along the length of the beam and checking the limit lines often the bevel was soon formed and consistent from end to end. I was indeed pleased with the way it went.

 

Yes, the keelson is curved but the limber board is not.

 

[Rustyj]

That's a very nice fit. Very good Paddy.

[Paddy]

Thanks for taking a look Rusty.

[Paddy]

The limber boards are installed but not permanently should I decide to change them. I did make two applications of Danish Oil natural so I could see how the plank end seams would look. Any comments or suggestions are more than welcome.

 

I’ll start trying now how to form the garboard strake into the concave section next to the keel. Is this a case requiring the soaking of the cherry in boiling water and clamping to a form?

 

 

 

[russ]

The limber boards look okay. I do not think the end grain will be an issue.

 

As for the garboard strake, why would you need to bend it?

 

Russ

[Paddy]

When I lay the 3/8 of an inch plank across that area there is a gap between the bottom of the frame and plank.

[russ]

Why that wide? That is 18 inches at scale. I would think maybe something closer to 1/4" would be good. I would fair off that area of the frame where the plank goes into the rabbet if there is any small gap. There should not be, but try a 1/4" wide plank and see if it needs a little more trimming.

 

Russ

Edited August 20, 2013 by russ

[Paddy]

Using the Midship Deck Beams Camber plan page that strake next to the keel measures 3/8” wide. If that’s wrong then the measurements I used for the cross section of the limber strake and limber board must be wrong too. I’ll be happy to reduce the width of the garboard strake as you say as it will make the task easy to fit the curl for the concave part of the frame at the keel. Maybe I worded my previous post wrong and should have mentioned the curl in the plank.

Edited August 20, 2013 by Paddy

[russ]

Paddy:

I am not sure where that 18 inch measuement came from. Obviously, someone went over the plans and changed some things, I am not sure who.

 

Best thing then is to go with the plans if that will help your comfort level. In that event, I would plane off that area of the frames next to the keel to get a straight area to lay your plank. I have never seen a plank bent or cupped that way. However, it is your model and you need to do what you think is best. Good luck with it.

 

Russ

[Paddy]

Thanks very much for your help Russ.

Edited August 23, 2013 by Paddy