Herzogin Cecilie 1902 by Jim Lad - Four Masted Barque

[jerome]

I was wondering how much work you’d get accomplished being in the museum working on this model.

You have become an entity and can answer questions for visitors.

Visitors like this kind of thing.

best of luck on this renovation/ build.

 

[Jim Lad]

Work achieved varies enormously, Jerome. On quiet days it can be almost like working at home, but in school holidays you spend the entire day talking to people. I make up for it by doing some of the work at home so that this model can continue to progress.

 

John

[KeithAug]

John - If you don't manage to get it finished can I suggest one of your colleagues be commissioned incorporate in a diorama of you building it. Preserved for posterity in a glass cabinet in your favourite museum, what more could you desire - and you wouldn't even have to speak to the punters.  🙂

[Jim Lad]

4 hours ago, KeithAug said:

you don't manage to get it finished

That's a cheery thought first thing in the morning, Keith! I think I've got a bit of time let yet.

 

[BANYAN]

Hi John, sorry had missed this log.  Looks like an interesting project on a model of a very interesting vessel.  Good luck with it, will enjoy watching your progress.

 

cheers

 

Pat

[BANYAN]

On 5/20/2024 at 9:29 AM, Roger Pellett said:

A while ago, I bought  a set of broaches on Amazon, Made and shipped from England.  They are triangular files without teeth.

Hi Roger.  I have some broaches (not just triangular as some have five sides) but they are all tapered.  Does your set have a constant size so that they can also act a reamers to achieve a very accurate size?

 

cheers

 

Pat

[Jim Lad]

We continue to progress. The spanker mast now has shrouds and a forestay, and you will see that there in now bagged cargo in number 5 hatchway. I've also now completey removed the top rail around the long poop deck in preparation for the future installation of a polished wood railing.

 

John

 

[KeithAug]

8 hours ago, Jim Lad said:

I've got a bit of time let yet.

Yes I was hoping you had plenty of time to complete your various projects, pass on your knowledge and generally enjoy life. Great progress she is coming along well, how is meteor doing?

[Bedford]

I just found this and will be following along keenly.

When I saw the first pics I thought "I don't remember that model at the museum" now I understand why.

I think I'd much rather build from scratch than alter and complete someone elses project but it must be done and you'll do it beautifully.

[Rick310]

Very nice model!

Rick

[Jim Lad]

Thanks, Keith. The 'Meteor' is unfortunately languishing beside my bench at the moment as I'm using what time I have at home to work on repairs to the 'Duchess'.

 

Bedford, it is certainly difficult to bypass parts of the model that I think could be done differently, but if they are correct and presentable I'm leaving them where they are. There are some items that need to be re-built or corrected as they are just wrong for the ship at the period of the model build, but I'm keeping them to a minimum. On the other hand, I'm really enjoying working on the 'Duchess' and would never have started a model of her myself, so it's a good project.

 

Thanks for the comments, Rick!

 

John

[Jim Lad]

The standing rigging creeps agonizingly ahead in between talking to museum visitors. 🙂

 

I've also now got the forward boats stowed on the repaired skids and sitting in their position over the well deck. The actual timing of their final fixing will depend on the for rigging progress as the skids are on the bulwarks in amongst all the rigging. I'll be doing constant checking of the fit and deciding the last moment I can leave the skids off.

 

John

 

[Keith Black]

 

 

 

47 minutes ago, Jim Lad said:

The actual timing of their final fixing will depend on the for rigging progress as the skids are on the bulwarks in amongst all the rigging.

The constant nagging question, If I do THIS will I be able to get my hand in THERE?

 

John, the restoration is coming along nicely.

[Kuparu]

Greetings Jimlad,

I apologise for being a little late in picking up a problem on the forecastle.  On your museum model, apparently as it was originally built, the forecastle rails extend aft outboard of the sidelight screens until they arrive outboard of the lighthouse itself.  In reality, such an arrangement would have partially obscured the lights and also caused problems with reflections.   In fact, and as evidenced in the photos of the ship, the permanent rails come aft on both sides of the forecastle, then trend inboard to parallel the centreline to meet the lighthouse dead centre and also to provide the support structure for the screens.  By doing so they ensure that the lights and screens provide the correct sector coverage without obstruction.  I know it appears to be nitpicking but your efforts to ensure a very accurate model, correct for its time, would be marred by this error.  Kuparu.

   

[KeithAug]

5 hours ago, Jim Lad said:

I've also now got the forward boats stowed on the repaired skids and sitting in their position over the well deck.

That is looking good. You seem to be making quite good progress despite distractions.  I assume you are going for the cut down rig rather than reproduction of the full rig? Now that would be a challenge!

[Jim Lad]

Keith Black - It may be a little simpler with the boat skids as I'll leave them on for display when I'm not working on the model. that means that every day I'm working the skids will get a test fit to see how access is going! 🙂

 

Kuparu - Thanks for your comments re the side lights. You're quite correct re the rails, but whether or not they'll be altered is still up for debate.

 

Keith Aug - Don't know quite what you mean by 'cut down rig'. I plan to add as much detail as feasible, including sails 'hanging in the gear' ready for setting.

 

John

[Rick310]

This is a beautiful model and you’re doing a fantastic job!!

Rick

[Ian_Grant]

She is looking great!  I set up the standing rigging on my Preussen from aft forward for the same reason.

 

By the way, to add to your story about her foundering under Capt Sven, I read somewhere in my books that Mr Erikson was furious and poor Sven ended up leaving the sea to farm sheep in South Africa. Or maybe it's an apocryphal story......

[Jim Lad]

No, Ian, that's exactly what happened. Gustaf was never really happy with Sven being master of his favourite ship, but he was a distant relative and social pressure in the small, closed community of the Aland Islands finally prevailed. Sven and his wife went back to the family farm on the islands, but I don't think it was very comfortable for them there and they moved to South Africa. I believe that after Sven's death Pamela returned with her children to the Aland Islands.

 

Part of the problem was that Sven didn't communicate with Gustaf following the grounding - it was his wife who wrote all the letters. Some of the letters back to the ship from Gustaf open with comments like, "I am still waiting to hear from my Captain."

 

Thanks for the king comments, by the way!

 

John

[KeithAug]

20 hours ago, Jim Lad said:

Don't know quite what you mean by 'cut down rig'.

John - sorry should have been clearer. I was wondering whether you were moddeling only the lower mast or whether you intended reproducing the full rig with topmast and topgallant mast?

[Jim Lad]

Yes Keith, the whole rig. The upper mast will be there eventually. 

 

John

[Jim Lad]

Back at the museum after holidays, and the 'Duchess' continues to creep slowly ahead. More photos of progress next week, but in the meantime can anyone suggest a use for this fitting just above the mast cap. it's only on one topmast (masts are interchangeable on this ship) and I'm pretty sure it was a brain fade on the part of the original builder, but I don't want to remove it until I'm absolutely certain.

 

Sorry for the ratty quality of the image, but my phone doesn't do close-up photography very well.

 

John

 

[Ian_Grant]

Seems to me like a representation of the sliding truss for the upper topsail yard in its lowered position, with a wire to glue into a hole in the yard. But it's awfully close to the mast cap, where the lower topsail yard's pivoting truss would be located. At any rate, perhaps the builder only got around to adding the first such truss.

[Keith Black]

4 minutes ago, Ian_Grant said:

Seems to me like a representation of the sliding truss for the upper topsail yard in its lowered position, with a wire to glue into a hole in the yard.

 My thoughts exactly. 

[Jim Lad]

Yes, that's certainly a possibility, but the original builder's other metal work is so precise that that hadn't occurred to me.

 

John

[FriedClams]

A very interesting restoration project, John.  I'll be following your progress which so far looks great!

 

Gary

[Jim Lad]

The lower standing rigging creeps slowly forward. I've now removed the boat skits and the well deck gangway again (you can see them sitting on the base) and they will now stay off (apart from test fitting to make sure I can get the skids back on again) until the model nears completion. They had to come off (of course0 to give me access to the base of the foremast where the lower main stays are attached.

 

My current plan is to complete the standing rigging on the foremast and then completely rig the bowsprit before working aft along the deck to complete all the deck structures and detail that can go on prior to rigging and then to work from forward to aft completing the rigging.

 

A couple of photos of the model as she is now are attached. I', still looking for a good spot near where I'm building her to take photos as all the backgrounds are really cluttered and the carpet is very dark. I'm sure I'll think of something by the end of the build.

 

John

 

[Ian_Grant]

Love it!  For some reason well deck gangways really enhance the looks of a ship, to me.

 

Access to mast bases was an issue on my Preussen too, especially the jigger mast which is completely surrounded by the aft well deck gangway, the aftmost boat skid, and the hen coop aft of it. With the insane number of backstays blocking side access I ended up belaying all the running rigging at bitts and belaying rails and will rig all of it in reverse. Preussen has been on pause for two years; back to it this winter.

[Zooropa]

Dear Jim, Superb model, but there´s three things I really to point out+ first, Herzogin Cecilie was fitted with 2 throtman anchors and one spare patent anchor. (the anchor with swivelling flukes) Second, on your model I see a hand railing at break of poop (on the main deck), Herzogin never had those railings. and third, the stanchions of the railings are really out of scale... Stanchions itself is 40mm diameter , the spheres are 70 mm diameter and the horizontal round bars were only 22 mm diameter.

On the second photo you can also see the scale of the spheres of the stanchions 

 

I hope that I can help you making your modell better.

 

Karel

[KeithAug]

Great progress John - everything looking very smart.