Best White Wood Glue For Ship Building

[OldeManToad]

I am fairly new at ship model building. Received the Model Shipways Lowell Grand Banks Dory with tools at Christmas. It included a small bottle of yellow carpenters glue which I have used to build it, the Norwegian Sailing Pram, and I am now building the Muscongus Bay Lobster Smack. I have also used Elmers carpenter glue that I had available and some diluted Elmers white glue when needed.

 

I am getting ready to start on the Occre Albatros kit in a few weeks and it is recommended to use white glue. Is there a preferred brand? I see Titebond white wood glue. Any difference between white and yellow wood glue. I know the yellow wood glues I have used grab faster than the white all purpose glues.

 

Any help will be greatly appreciated. 

[Gregory]

The Titebond should be fine..

[Paul Le Wol]

Hi OldeManToad, welcome to MSW. I’ve been using LePage Multi Purpose White glue with good results. I like using white glue solely because it dries opaque. Even if the model is being painted I don’t like looking at yellow glue stains while it is being built. Have never tried Titebond. Good luck with your Albatros build. I should have said that it dries translucent.

Edited Tuesday at 06:12 PM by Paul Le Wol
Grammar

[palmerit]

I use original Titebond PVA glue because it was recommended here. I would not go with Tightbond II or III, which are waterproof, only because others recommended not to go with those, not because I did a comparison. I also have some Titebond Speed Set, but haven't used it very often. It does set quicker than regular Titebond.

 

I also have Super PHATIC ALIPHATIC Glue, which dries much quicker than PVA, but not as quick as CA glue. Someone had recommended it, so I tried it. 

 

When gluing pieces that are not glue (metal parts), you need CA glue of course. I use both the gel version and the thin version. The gel is easier to apply. But the thin version has a nice wicking action and you can get it into tight space that are coming apart (e.g., I just used it on a wale that had separate a bit from a hull).

 

I use Titebond PVA most often, then it's a toss between the Super Phatic and different CAs.

[druxey]

With all due respect, I would use epoxy for metal/wood or metal/metal joints (if not soldering), rather than CA.

Edited Tuesday at 06:22 PM by druxey

[Dziadeczek]

I built my first ship model more than 30 years ago - Billing Boats "Norske Love" only with Elmer's Glue All white glue and today it sits there, still intact.

My latest, scratched French 74 guns after Boudriot, I built using Titebond Original. I'll let you know after another 30 years.   😁

I think, both are good for wood, at least for our purposes.

Titebond II and III are for waterproof applications, II - for water resistant and III - for waterproof (if you are building a floating model, for RC etc.)

Edited Tuesday at 07:08 PM by Dziadeczek

[OldeManToad]

Thanks for the replies everyone. I guess I'll be going with the Titebond Original. Can you undo mistakes using alcohol with it?  I already have a Medium CA , Excelerator, and Epoxy. Need to get some thin CA and Contact Cement. Is Weldwood brand for Contact cement OK? Also changing the subject of my post, can anyone recommend a good wood filler?  I'm currently trying to use spackling putty as recommended by a book put out by Model Shipways. I'm not satisfied with that. 

 

My Occre Albatros kit arrives tomorrow but I still have lots left to do on my Lobster Smack.

 

Thanks again for the help.

[GGibson]

Maybe a bit late to the responses, but awhile back someone here recommended using diluted PH Neutral PVA glue (I put the mixture in a needle tip squeeze bottle) for gluing rigging, which works well for me, but I do use the Titebond Original for my wood-to-wood gluing.  To undo it, apply some heat using something like a soldering tip. 

 

For wood filler, I have had good recent success with DAP Plastic Wood-X.  If the container dries out fast, the DAP folks told me to add a drop or so of water to soften it up.  🤷‍♂️👍

[Dr PR]

I have been building wooden models for at least 70 years, and have used a lot of different glues.

 

Way back then I used Testor's wood glue. I don't know if it is still made, but Duco Cement is the equivalent. It is nitrocellulose dissolved in acetone. It is one of my primary wood glues because it sets in 20-30 seconds, giving time to reposition parts. It makes a good bond, leaves a shiny film, and can be loosened with acetone. I used it for most of the Albatross topsail schooner build - that hull is about 40 years old now.

 

My local hobby shop (killed by the pandemic and on-line sales) specialized in radio controlled airplanes, but also carried a selection of wooden ship model kits. The wood glue of choice there was Sig-Bond aliphatic resin used by model airplane folks. It is a very good white wood glue that leaves very little (if any) visible film. It can be loosened and washed up with water. Heat also liquifies the dried glue, and it resets when it cools (maybe not as strong as the original bond). It is what I am using on the MSI build.

 

I recently used Titebond Original for the Vanguard 18 foot cutter model. This is what Vanguard recommended, and many on this forum recommend it. It is pale yellow and leaves a slight film. It can be loosened with heat as Gregg said, but I found that it will also loosen with water. If you loosen it with heat it will reset again with a good bond when it cools.

 

I use Elmer's Glue-All white glue in places where I do not want any visible dry glue. Office Works school glue seems to be the same. They clean up with water. These are not as "strong" as the other glues mentioned above. I use these glues diluted 1:1 with water to fix rigging knots with threads like cotton and silk that soak up the glue.

 

Shellac can be used to fix knots in ropes and to shape the curves in ropes. It dries very quickly and is soluble in alcohol. It is also used as a wood finish.

 

NOTE: None of the glues listed above will adhere to polyester rope! They do not soak into the polyester thread and just form a weak coating that will come loose with a bit of pulling. Duco Cement does dry to a hard coating that is stronger than the other glues.

 

I have used Locktite CA gel (cyanoacrylate or "super glue") when I need a very quick setting glue in small spots. It usually sets in 5-10 seconds, but the latest use took 30-40 seconds. I don't like super glue - the vapors irritate my eyes. High heat will weaken or loosen CA. It leaves a white residue when it hardens.

 

None of the glues listed above are good for wood to metal or metal to metal.

 

If you want to glue wood to non-porous materials like metal or plastic the only good adhesive that I know of is two part epoxy. I am reminded of the slogan on inner tube repair kits from the 1920s and 30s. "If you don't want it on, don't put it on!" It will clean up with rubbing alcohol (isopropanol). Hardened epoxy can be filed and drilled, but is not as hard and strong as metal. You should brush/sand the metal/plastic surface to be glued to roughen it a bit so the glue can adhere properly.

 

I use liquid two part epoxy "paint" to seal the inside of planked wooden hulls. It soaks into the wood, bonding planks edge to edge, and planks to bulkheads. It makes a rock solid hull that will not develop cracks between planks as the wood swells and shrinks with changing humidity. For the topsail schooner hull I used epoxy paint flying model airplane builders use to seal wood from fuel. On the MSI build I used the clear two part resin used to form clear "plastic" layers on counter tops.

 

****

 

Although all of these glues will adhere to painted surfaces, the bond is only as strong as the paint bond to the wood/metal. Remove paint from surfaces that are to be glued.

 

None of these glues will adhere well to greasy or oily surfaces (including finger print oils). Some won't adhere to wet surfaces. Clean and dry the surfaces before gluing.

Edited Tuesday at 10:40 PM by Dr PR

[harlequin]

i use an aliphatic cabinet makers glue.......it can be sanded when dry

 

[OldeManToad]

 

Again thanks for the replies. This has been a good discussion on glues. In my younger years I used to build and fly RC airplanes. Built 3 from kits and 1 scratch built quarter scale Sukhoi SU 27 aerobatic plane.  The planes were built from balsa and plywood. Used almost exclusively CA on the balsa and 2 part epoxy on the plywood. Didn't really use much wood glue that I remember. Then I moved onto model railroading and I used carpenters glue extensively building the bench work and also for wood structures. Now I'm moving on to wooden ships and got confused about white glue because Elmers white glue is what I used for ballasting track and laying down scenery materials. That didn't seem appropriate for ship modeling. Anyways, thanks for clearing things up.

[RossR]

Titebond will let go with some alcohol.  I brush a little alcohol on the joint and it lets go in about 10 minutes.  I have used Weldwood with good results.  If you can use the thin CA without making a mess congratulations.  I really struggled with the thin CA and threw mine away.  

 

I find my self using Titebond more and more instead of CA, but it is good to have a few options in your tool box.

 

[vaddoc]

10 hours ago, Dr PR said:

Duco Cement

Phil, I presume this is a variation of contact cement/adhesive? I have not used it all for model building and there does not seem to be a good reason. It should also be gap filling so essentially looks like an epoxy substitute, without the mess.

 

Vaddoc

[Snug Harbor Johnny]

 When gluing down laser-cut aftermarket wood veneer decks to plastic model decks, PVA craft glue was recommended - and I tried it successfully on a decking project, which required some weights put on top to 'clamp' while curing (to avoid deck edges from curling up).  I suppose that contact cement could work in this application ... yeah, I'm aware of what I said about contact cement on wood-to-wood applications elsewhere - but this is wood to plastic over a relative large flat area.

[wmherbert]

As far as a filler I use this dap product which I think works very well. Sands out perfectly.

[Dr PR]

vaddoc,

 

Duco isn't what I think of as  a contact cement. The contact cements I have used are rubbery and sticky when set. You apply it to both surfaces, let it dry until it is tacky, and then press the pieces together. They bond on contact, hence the name.

 

Duco is a solution of nitrocellulose in acetone. The liquid flows into pores and cracks. When the acetone evaporates the nitrocellulose hardens to hold the parts together. In this respect it is just another glue for porous materials. Acetone is very volatile and evaporates quickly, letting the glue set up quickly.

 

However, because it leaves a film on smooth surfaces it can be used to glue wood to metal and metal to metal. However, this is not a really strong bond. The hardened nitrocellulose can be knocked loose from the smooth surface with a blow.

[ubjs]

If you react to ca-glue, you must be very careful. There is a risk of developing an allergy to approx. 
I can't be in the same room as someone who glues with ca-glue.

I also can't use fully liquid plastic glue, but what is more like a cream, 
for example from Faller with a narrow metal spout works well for me.

So be careful, once you develop an allergy, there is unfortunately no way back.

Edited 6 hours ago by ubjs