Venetian Carrack or Cocha by woodrat - FINISHED - 1/64

[woodrat]

Apologies for the delay in posting. I have been overseas. after a lot of thought the mainstay (stazo) has been done in accordance with the appearances in the Zorzi manuscript which seems to show a large upper block with a number of ropes issuing presumably to a lower double block . This is much different to later practice.

 

The collar of the mainstay passes either side of the foremast and around the knee of the stem. Also seen is the gammoning of the bowsprit which also goes around the knee of the stem.

 

 

 

Dick

Edited October 25, 2016 by woodrat

[Louie da fly]

Good to see you back, Dick. I never cease to be impressed by the level of research you get into to get the details exactly right (as well as can be known at this distance in time). And the level of workmanship, as well.

 

I'm probably showing my ignorance, but what's that vertical spar next to the bowsprit?

 

By the way, I've recently come across quite a number of contemporary representations off carracks on Pinterest that I haven't seen before. Would you like me to post them or have you got as much as you need? 

 

Steven

Edited October 23, 2016 by Louie da fly

[Robin Lous]

This is fantastic! The mast reminds me of those beautiful splitcane fly fishing rods. 

 

Really cool!

 

Robin

[Robin Lous]

Good to see you back, Dick. I never cease to be impressed by the level of research you get into to get the details exactly right (as well as can be known at this distance in time). And the level of workmanship, as well.

 

I'm probably showing my ignorance, but what's that vertical spar next to the bowsprit?

 

By the way, I've recently come across quite a number of contemporary representations off carracks on Pinterest that I haven't seen before. Would you like me to post them or have you got as much as you need? 

 

Steven

My guess...it's the base for another "splitcane" mast. 

[Louie da fly]

That would be it, of course. The foremast on a carrack was usually pretty tiny, and I suppose this is a temporary stub to get the forestay correctly worked out.

[woodrat]

Yes, Steven. Its just a bit of dowel I have used to indicate where the foremast will be when I make it. Perhaps you could post the links to Pinterest.

Thanks Robin. The fore and mizzen masts would have been pole masts, not "made" like the main mast

Dick

[Louie da fly]

I didn't take the addresses, unfortunately, just recorded the pics as I stumbled across them. So I've put them up here

 

Steven

[woodrat]

On a separate note, I have been going through my books trying to find any evidence to support the presence of a spritsail in mediaeval vessels. I have found none yet although most modern reconstructions of carracks show one. The bowsprit seems to be obliquely sited adjacent to the foremast (if there is one) and functions to attach the forestay, bowlines and the grapnel anchor. At this stage I would question putting a spritsail on a mediaeval vessel.

Dick

[Louie da fly]

I'd agree. If the evidence isn't there, I don't think a spritsail would be justified, no matter what modern people may do with their reconstructions. Just because it might look obvious to us to put one on (and it may well improve the working of the ship) doesn't mean they had them in the day.

 

Stirrups seem so obvious for riding horses, but nobody used them until something like the 6th century AD. The idea just hadn't been invented yet, no matter how much of a no-brainer they seem with hindsight.

 

Steven

[druxey]

I think you are correct in omitting any spritsail as not seen in contemporary images; although it would have been useful had there been one!

[Cristiano]

Hello Dick,

You are doing a great work on this carrack.

I wonder if you already have checked a book called "navi venete" written by Cesare Augusto Levi in 1892.

He made the type of research that you are doing more or less now.

He searched for venetian ships images in every corner of Venice, including anonymous paintings, sculptures, ex-voto, frescos.

The result of his work is inside that book.

It is a book only of drawings, with specificated the source of the image.

It is more precious than that it seems, for your research.

Below a link to the book...

http://www.libreriaeditricefilippi.com/index.php/navi-venete-da-codici-marmi-e-dipinti.html

 

And below some pages of the book.

[woodrat]

thanks Cristiano. I well have a look at the book and get back to you.

Dick

[Mike40]

Very interesting build and nicely done. When I see a foc'sl built out like that I wonder how it could survive a heavy sea.

Edited November 6, 2016 by Mike40

[woodrat]

. When I see a foc'sl built out like that I wonder how it could survive a heavy sea.

 Many didn't.. I am sure that when possible they ran for a port to avoid such seas. Much of the castles could be cut away in an emergency and you will notice that the slats on both castles are removable so as to reduce windage in heavy seas

Cheers

Dick

[Louie da fly]

That's very interesting. I suppose it depends on how strongly they were built. And if the construction was too weak, they'd find out the hard way - if they survived.

 

[edit] Maybe that's why forcastles changed from rectangular to triangular in the 15th century - too much overhang?

 

Steven

Edited November 8, 2016 by Louie da fly

[woodrat]

 Maybe that's why forecastles changed from rectangular to triangular in the 15th century - too much overhang?

 

Steven

Possibly. It is also the reason why the forecastle in my model is narrower than many other models. This produces a sort of tumble-home ( also see the Mataro model which shows this tumble-home)and makes the structure less topheavy. Note the considerable bracing the the structure which I feel is necessary for strength. This is entirely guesswork as the illustrations give no hint as to framing of superstructure

Dick

Edited November 20, 2016 by woodrat

[NenadM]

[woodrat]

This to show the mainstay completed with canvas wrap to prevent chafing on the mainsail

 

the single blocks for the shrouds

Dick

Edited November 20, 2016 by woodrat

[druxey]

The forecastle looks very plausible. Nice reconstruction of it, Dick.

[Roger Pellett]

How does a crew member reach the forecastle from the main deck?

 

Roger

[woodrat]

How does a crew member reach the forecastle from the main deck?

 

Roger

It is thought that access was via the lapstrake planking of the great arch behind the forecastle. Some reconstructions show a ladder into the forecastle but I elected not to put one in because of space restrictions. I could be wrong. I am sure that there would have been a lot of variation.

Mariners of those time did not have unions or occupational health and safety officers. They took a lot of risks we would find terrifying e.g. reefing a sail without footropes.

Dick

[Roger Pellett]

Thanks.

 

Roger

[Louie da fly]

Nice work on the blocks, Dick. And the ship is looking better and better.

 

Steven

[Louie da fly]

It doesn't look like there's much sheer on the decks, even the quarter and poop decks, Dick. Is that right, or am I seeing things? In that three-quarter view looking from the bow it certainly looks that way.

 

Steven

Edited December 9, 2016 by Louie da fly

[woodrat]

 

I think maybe I could have put a bit more sheer on the poop but I think I got the forecastle pretty right. A lot of contemporary illustrations show ridiculous amounts of sheer so I tried to be guided by the Trombetta pics.

Cheers. Dick

[captainbob]

I think you got it just right.

 

Bob

[woodrat]

Thanks Steve and Bob. I like challenging feedback. It's almost like I need to do a third model to get rid of the errors in the second :'{(

But that's getting a little OCD!  

[woodrat]

 

This figure abaft the mainmast is puzzling. It was thought by some to be a person but it is now thought to be a knighthead for the halyard. What is the dot in the middle of the knight?

Dick

[CaptainSteve]

If it is a knight-head, then maybe a hole to run a line through ... ??

[Louie da fly]

Oh, it wasn't a criticism, just interested. Personally I think your interpretation is probably closer to the reality than the pictures are - representing foreshortening in a two-dimensional picture is always difficult and I think it often gets exaggerated by the artist. About how much sheer do you think you have on the quarter deck and the poop - i.e. what vertical distance compared with the horizontal distance?

 

As the knighthead is in the shape of a person's head, maybe the dot is his eye?

 

Steven

 

PS: I like that jig you have for the model - does that swivel so you can get at the model from all angles?