vaddoc

Just looked Okto up. $400,000/week + expenses?

 Nice one though!

Thank you all for your likes and comments.

 

Carl, this simple jig worked amazingly well. No failures and all hoops came out identical, very quick process too.

Druxey, never though of it. However terrible though, walnut finishes superbly. I think once sanded and with a coat of Tung oil on, the hoops will look good and they will be very sturdy as well.

 

Mark, I am a seasoned landsman so I am really struggling with the rigging. My source of info are actually logs like yours, a few sketches from various versions of Debens, a you tube video of a vessel built at Whisstock yard, a couple of books and of course the all-knowing internet. I have no rigging plan or deck plan. I actually had to measure the various lengths of spars on the screen and scale up!

 

It seems though that Whistock yard liked the backstays to end up lower on the mast. Have a look at these photos:

 

Deben 5 sketch

 

Snapshot of top mast from the you tube boat

Now you can understand my decision to go for dramatic rather than accurate. 😁 Although I think in the end I wont be far off.

 

It does look however that the Deben carries quite a lot of sail for its size. But then again, all gaff boats seem to have powerful sails eitherway

 

Vaddoc

A month has passed and time for another post.

 

Many thanks Patrick, I am actually quite excited with the ability to make metal objects. This post will actually be silver solder heavy!

 

I had very little free time and a large part of it was occupied making nursery projects with my 4 year old daughter. I made Goldilocks, a bear, space rockets out of plaster, paper owls etc. All pretty over-engineered of course, the teachers at the nursery could never have guessed how many tools and what variety of materials was actually used...Great fun!

 

Back to the boat, I did a lot of thinking and web research and read a bit more of my gaff rigging books. I now have a less vague idea of the rigging. I also cleared the topsail issue, which will be rigged in an unusual way. The boat naturally will be very over-rigged, the more ropes the better!

 

I varnished the tabernacle and used enamel varnish. I had forgotten how good enamels are. Very hard, excellent coverage, maybe I should switch back. I then spent all of my time making the brass fittings for the mast. I first started making the gooseneck:

 

Later on however I scrapped these and made them again. I then made the first mast band

 

 

 

This however had to be scrapped as well as I had not understood the rigging well. following this I made a detailed plan of the rigging and re-measured everything. I then made the band that goes at the top of the mast, it will accept the top shrouds, forestay, (?flying) jib and topsail halyard.

 

 

I have also perfected my technique for making shackles and every now and again, just for variety, I make one in various sizes. These need to be polished.

 

Some of the metal work appears in this photo, many more will need to be made.

 

I also did some work on the bowsprit

With the above under way, I though I would start making the mast hoops. Unfortunately, the only thin strips I have are walnut, which is a horrible wood to use for modelling. I really don't want to buy more wood though so I I gave it a try.

 

The mast is 16 mm diameter so the hoops should be 20mm. I made a disc from some plywood and cut a notch.

 

 

Then I soaked the walnut strip in water and used my mother's old hair thingy.

Walnut wood is an unpleasant wood for this purpose, it breaks, has a wavy interlocked grain, terrible. I wish I had some beech. In any case, I wrapped the strip around the plywood disc and used PVA to laminate it.  A screw holds everything in place and will be filled later on with a tree nail.

Tons more work to be done but I feel a little bit more confident now

 

Regards

Vaddoc

 

Just found time to check things out Patrick. Lovely work, I particularly liked the fleet photo, a few years of hard work and dedication within a square foot or so.

But...where is the gold paint? 

 

Cheers

Vaddoc

Welcome Alan!

I visited San Diego a few years back, absolutely loved it. Do start a log, good fun as well!

 

Regards

Vaddoc

Dear all

 

Since the last post I did a bit of work on the boat, although it was 2 steps forward and one backwards!

 

First of all, I did not like the tabernacle. I used soft solder and did not wash the acid flux off so the brass started to corrode giving a green/blue tint. Also, I used some old leftover paint from the deck which was probably spoiled in some way. So I stripped the paint off and de-soldered it. I then tried to silver solder it and managed to melt the whole thing!

 

Then I made the tabernacle again which is quite fiddly and not really easy. I had to make the axle once again as the old one did not fit. I proceeded to silver solder it and managed to melt it again!

 

I made it for the third time and of course none of the previous two axles fitted so I had to do that as well. It came out reasonable but not as good as the first time. 

 

 

 

Then the side pieces were soldered, the corners ground and the mast base shortened and re-drilled. Everything was primed and then painted with fresh paint. Only thing left is some varnish, probably enamel.

 

 

Next was the bowsprit. I took the dimesions from the drawings in the plans but it looked a bit short to me. I would like a more dramatic bowsprit even though it might be unnecessary and not really accurate. Also, I wanted the base to be square.

 

So, I laminated some beach with PVA glue. I ended up with a thick solid piece of timber.

 

 

 

Next was turning it into a dowel. Somehow I managed to set up my horrible cheap plane correctly and the job was pretty easy.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Of course I forgot to leave the base square, I remembered only when it was shaped as octagon. Oh well, I think actually there are boats with octagon bowsprits out there...

The new bowsprit is much larger and certainly much more dramatic!

 

 

Next was the gammon iron. Here there is a massive problem. The top of the stem must be left square to allow for the iron to be bolted. I missed this part and sanded it off. I had to think of a way to arrange things, not accurate but close enough. Also, I had to provide a point to attach the foe bits of rigging. I soldered a few bits together and will nail these down with black iron nails. Hopefully it will blend in when all else goes on the boat

 

 

 

 

 

 

Next I made the templates for the cleats and cut one, finished with Tung oil

 

 

I also made the fixes for the bob and whisker stays. These will be secured with either brass or shiny black iron nails

 

 

 

 

Lots more left to do and quite a lot of head scratching coming up

 

Regards

Vaddoc

 

I found a solution with these forceps

 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B01AYLIH1S/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o03_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

They are stainless steel, very robust and do not transmit heat. Very cheap also. There is a base that goes with it but you can also use whatever else. Highly recommended.

I prefer silver soldering as it is much more controlled. 

 

Vaddoc

https://www.amazon.com/RHINOCEROS-MODELING-DESIGNERS-VERSION-670526003986/dp/B00AFB9ORO

 

! 

The way the metal bends to your will Michael is truly inspirational. Indeed a treat for those of us that when picking a fight with metals we usually lose.

Pleasure!

 

I made a cleat with this template, in the last two photos the cleat had a bit of tidying up sanding and a coat of Tung oil

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Actually, it is nearing the time I will need cleats so I sat down today and did a bit of CAD. Maybe this template will help others. The printer settings can be used to scale up or down. The vertical lines are for through bolts/tree nails.

cleats.pdf

I am not sure if this project is "little" but I have been patiently waiting for when it would make it near the top of your busy priority list Michael. Looking forward for the rest of this journey.

 

Vaddoc

You are right in both Welfack. It is of course much easier to make U shaped ones and indeed I ll need some later on but horse-shoe is a much more interesting shape!

You are also correct about the rings and for the 1.2 mm wire, a 2.7 mm tube would be nearer real life dimensions but I do not have this odd size and the 3 mm looks a bit wrong. There is plenty of thickness to widen the hole to accept same size bolt but there is no real need as the bolt will be invisible on the boat.

 

I intend though to make some smaller ones using 1mm or 0.8 mm wire and same 2 mm tube, this will be closer to real life dimensions.

 

This is a good way of making shackles of any shape and size, quickly and consistently at a fraction of the price for bought ones. 

I ve standardised the the method and now it takes less than 10 min for each shackle. I ll post a few more pics:

 

Clean the 2 mm tube and sand a flat and secure for soldering.

 

 

 

Cut a piece of 1.2 mm wire, bend with fingers round the pliers

 

 

 

Use second round pliers to bend into final shape in one step, using something appropriate to maintain gap

 

 

 

Trim the excess and sand flat the ends by touching on the disc

 

 

Secure for soldering, use a tiny amount of paste

 

 

 

Cool, then use the disc to cut free and shape the shackle

 

 

 

 

 

The shackles come out very consistent in shape and size. These have not been polished yet

 

 

After a bath in acid and polishing, I think they look great. This is how they compare with the bought ones (expensive)

 

 

Smaller sizes can easily be made and much smaller brass tubes are available as welding supplies.

 

 

Welcome Mark! Indeed consider starting a log, very rewarding.

Hand brushing is a good alternative, quite satisfying as well!

I have only basic painting skills and do not want to use an airbrush. I have had excellent results with hand brushing using Valejo colours following these rules:

1. Use very good brushes, with appropriate width for the job

2. Thin the paint (should be runny but not like water), avoid heavy coats.

3. For Valejo, use the hand brushing thinner, different and better than the air brush thinner. It congeals if left so must have resin in it (this is what valejo claims so not easily reproduced at home). Get the 60 ml bottle, it is not expensive.

4. Use a bit of retarder.

5. Start from dry and end on wet. Take your time, you can go over the area 2-3 times. Avoid puddles at the edges.

6. Trust the paint! Do not go over again to "correct" or smooth out brush marks. They will disappear. You ll probably need a dozen or more coats either way.

7. Best to seal the wood, I use a water based wood sealer sanded to 400 grit

8. I use plastic pots with caps that seal pretty well and are cheap. The paint stays wet for months.

9. Use only frog tape or Tamiya tape or equivalent. The paint will bleed under ordinary masking tape or electricians tape.

10. Acrylic paint is not tough so needs to be protected with varnish or some topcoat

 

Hopefully these will be of help to some. May not work for all but I was able to paint my 80 cm hull with almost no brush marks.

 

Vaddoc

It's a type of ceramic, google honeycomb soldering block, it is very cheap and works well.

Ok, I think I concluded on a quick and easy way to make shackles, at least in large sale. Very similar to the one Tony used. Here it goes:

 

Get some 2 mm brass pipe (has a hole around 0.8 mm) and also some needle pliers. Take a length of 1.2 mm brass wire, about 2 cm. No need to straighten or anneal.

 

 

Hold it at an appropriate position and bend it to shape. A second pair of flat pliers is very useful

 

 

 

Trim the ends and touch to the disc sander to make sure they are flat

 

 

Now silver solder on to the pipe. It helps if the surface of the pipe is sanded a bit flat. A tiny amount of paste is needed

 

 

 

The result in two consecutive shackles

 

 

 

 

Now, using the brown dremel wheel cut the pipe to form the shackle, trim the ends as needed. Use a wire brush to polish the brass. A short piece of 0.8 mm wire with crushed ends finishes the shackle.

 

 

 

The bottom shackles in the next photo are made with this method, I think they are the best and most consistent.

 

 

This is a quick, cheap and easy method, it needs quite a few tools but nothing too exotic.

 

Regards

Vaddoc

Indeed, this is how I straighten brass wire. I first anneal the wire and then roll it between two thick pieces of very flat MDF. Works perfectly every time but only if the wire is annealed first.

So in the first video, the central planks are quarter saw, and the rest just flat saw cut in the middle?

Use a hard dense wood, cut a pattern, define the lines with files, finish with sandpaper up to 400 grit, apply tung oil. I made all the cleats I needed in my previous boat quite easily. Link to that page

 

https://modelshipworld.com/index.php?/topic/9355-24-exploration-gaff-rigged-ketch-by-vaddoc-scale-112-a-tad-roberts-design/&page=8

 

 

Dear all

 

I experimented a bit more but this is a difficult nut to crack. I think however I can suggest another method that seems to work, at least for the 1:10 scale I work at. The shackle made this way is on the left, the one made the previous way on the right.

 

 

I used 1.2 mm brass wire, annealed, straightened and cut to 1.8 cm segments. I then used 3 mm brass rod to cut disks around 2 mm in thickness. This was actually very quick and easy to do with the jeweller's saw. The only issue is that when they cut away they tend to fly off. The rod was polished with 600 grit sand paper in advance.

 

 

I then soldered the discs to the ends of the rods with soldering paste, one at a time or both in one go. Easy to do but the usual preparation is essential, maybe will help to sand a small flt on the disc.

 

 

 

The end result is this

 

 

The second time it came out even better

 

 

Then I drilled the ends with 1.3 mm drill. This is difficult to do with the drill press as the tungsten drill broke bending the rod, I think some kind of jig is needed. With the dremel it is even harder and gets very hot.

 

 

Then, I bent the ends 20 degrees, just at the joints. If the soldering is not good, at this stage it will fail.

 

 

Then, without any jig but only using pliers, I formed the loop alternating ends so that the loop is uniform. No annealing is needed, the wire will happily bend without braking. A short segment of the same 1.2 mm wire, crushed in one end is used as a pin. Because the holes are not perfectly aligned, there is just enough tension to keep the pin in place, no glue needed. If the holes happen to be aligned, a small twist in any direction should fix the pin in place.

 

 

 

The new shackles look much better.

 

This is I think a reasonably easy and quick way to make shackles and it seems to have reproducible results. Certainly cheaper than buying shackles. I ll experiment with 0.8 mm wire and 2 mm rod to see if it still works.

 

 

Many videos on you tube with robots and huge machines forging shackles. This however is closer to what we need, watch how he bends the ears 25 degrees and then only heats the middle to bend into shape. Maybe we need to bend the metal while red hot so have a candle always burning instead of butane torch. But brass will not behave like steel.

 

 

Thanks Mark. I will try to lighten it a bit and take some metal off.

You could also use adhesive film for the portholes, sand blasted glass effect. You can get levels of transparency or not at all transparent. This is used for windows/large glass doors.