BANYAN Posted December 21, 2017 Share #151 Posted December 21, 2017 (edited) I think you nailed the difference - according to Wiki: Rowing is the act of propelling a boat using the motion of oars in the water, displacing water, and propelling the boat forward. The difference between paddling and rowing is that rowing requires oars to have a mechanical connection with the boat, while paddles are hand-held and have no mechanical connection. Semantics anyway your skeleton is taking shape! cheers Pat Edited December 21, 2017 by BANYAN mtaylor, Canute and bensid54 3 Quote If at first you do not suceed, try, and then try again!Current build: HMCSS Victoria (Scratch) Next build: HMAS Vampire (3D printed resin, scratch 1:350) Built: Battle Station (Scratch) and HM Bark Endeavour 1768 (kit 1:64) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shipmodel Posted December 21, 2017 Share #152 Posted December 21, 2017 Hi Ben - Your build is fascinating, and so innovative. I am learning a great deal from how you are working all of the various materials together. Can't wait to see Charon in action. To answer your question - paddling is done with the arms alone, facing the bow; rowing is done using a fulcrum (oarlock, thole pin, or just a hole in the bulwark) and is usually done facing the stern. Happy Holidays to you and yours. Dan Canute, bensid54 and mtaylor 3 Quote Current build -SS Mayaguez (c.1975) scale 1/16" = 1' (1:192) by Dan Pariser Prior scratch builds - Royal yacht Henrietta, USS Monitor, USS Maine, HMS Pelican, SS America, SS Rex, SS Uruguay, Viking knarr, Gokstad ship, Thames River Skiff , USS Oneida, Swan 42 racing yacht, Queen Anne's Revenge (1710), SS Andrea Doria (1952), SS Michelangelo (1962) , Queen Anne's Revenge (2nd model) USS/SS Leviathan (1914), James B Colgate (1892), POW bone model (circa 1800) restoration Prior kit builds - AL Dallas, Mamoli Bounty. Bluejacket America, North River Diligence, Airfix Sovereign of the Seas "Take big bites. Moderation is for monks." Robert A. Heinlein Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirabell61 Posted December 21, 2017 Share #153 Posted December 21, 2017 Hi Ben, fascinating, looks like all paddeling motion will be simulated in kinematic action. Love to see that all in motion. Do you require an extra rudder for steering ? or will all be done with Charon`s (RC contolled) paddle alone ? Nils Canute, mtaylor and bensid54 3 Quote Current builds -Lightship Elbe 1 Completed - Steamship Ergenstrasse ex Laker Corsicana 1918- scale 1:87 scratchbuild - "Zeesboot" heritage wooden fishing small craft around 1870, POB clinker scratch build scale 1:24 - Pilot Schooner # 5 ELBE ex Wanderbird, scale 1:50 scratchbuild - Mississippi Sterwheelsteamer built as christmapresent for grandson modified kit build - Chebec "Eagle of Algier" 1753--scale 1:48-POB-(scratchbuild) "SS Kaiser Wilhelm der Grosse" four stacker passenger liner of 1897, blue ribbond awarded, 1:144 (scratchbuild) "HMS Pegasus" , 16 gun sloop, Swan-Class 1776-1777 scale 1:64 from Amati plan -"Pamir" 4-mast barque, P-liner, 1:96 (scratchbuild) -"Gorch Fock 2" German Navy cadet training 3-mast barque, 1:95 (scratchbuild) "Heinrich Kayser" heritage Merchant Steamship, 1:96 (scratchbuild) original was my grandfathers ship -"Bohuslän" , heritage ,live Swedish museum passenger steamer (Billings kit), 1:50 "Lorbas", river tug, steam driven for RC, fictive design (scratchbuild), scale appr. 1:32 under restoration / restoration finished "Hjejlen" steam paddlewheeler, 1861, Billings Boats rare old kit, scale 1:50 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bensid54 Posted December 21, 2017 Author Share #154 Posted December 21, 2017 Thanks Nils. The paddle will be set at an angle to offset the tendency of Charon to go in circles. The angle of the paddle will have to be determined once I get him in the water. Yes I will have a rudder at the bow in the form of a break in the keel (I think) to steer the vessel and help compensate for him wanting to paddle in circles and to direct his course. Mirabell61, mtaylor and Canute 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirabell61 Posted December 21, 2017 Share #155 Posted December 21, 2017 Thanks for the answer Ben, ca`nt wait to see that all in action... Nils Canute and bensid54 2 Quote Current builds -Lightship Elbe 1 Completed - Steamship Ergenstrasse ex Laker Corsicana 1918- scale 1:87 scratchbuild - "Zeesboot" heritage wooden fishing small craft around 1870, POB clinker scratch build scale 1:24 - Pilot Schooner # 5 ELBE ex Wanderbird, scale 1:50 scratchbuild - Mississippi Sterwheelsteamer built as christmapresent for grandson modified kit build - Chebec "Eagle of Algier" 1753--scale 1:48-POB-(scratchbuild) "SS Kaiser Wilhelm der Grosse" four stacker passenger liner of 1897, blue ribbond awarded, 1:144 (scratchbuild) "HMS Pegasus" , 16 gun sloop, Swan-Class 1776-1777 scale 1:64 from Amati plan -"Pamir" 4-mast barque, P-liner, 1:96 (scratchbuild) -"Gorch Fock 2" German Navy cadet training 3-mast barque, 1:95 (scratchbuild) "Heinrich Kayser" heritage Merchant Steamship, 1:96 (scratchbuild) original was my grandfathers ship -"Bohuslän" , heritage ,live Swedish museum passenger steamer (Billings kit), 1:50 "Lorbas", river tug, steam driven for RC, fictive design (scratchbuild), scale appr. 1:32 under restoration / restoration finished "Hjejlen" steam paddlewheeler, 1861, Billings Boats rare old kit, scale 1:50 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bensid54 Posted December 21, 2017 Author Share #156 Posted December 21, 2017 The oar as it will fit his hands and a front shot of him holding the oar. Next steps will be mounting the servos but the size of them is still up in the air. Canute, shipmodel, mtaylor and 2 others 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bensid54 Posted December 21, 2017 Author Share #157 Posted December 21, 2017 Paddling stroke oar in water. Canute, shipmodel and mtaylor 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bensid54 Posted December 21, 2017 Author Share #158 Posted December 21, 2017 Return stroke. Canute, shipmodel, RichardG and 3 others 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BANYAN Posted December 21, 2017 Share #159 Posted December 21, 2017 Very neat Ben. He looks like he is well suited to the task; that pose imparts a strong stroke. cheers Pat mtaylor, Canute and bensid54 3 Quote If at first you do not suceed, try, and then try again!Current build: HMCSS Victoria (Scratch) Next build: HMAS Vampire (3D printed resin, scratch 1:350) Built: Battle Station (Scratch) and HM Bark Endeavour 1768 (kit 1:64) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bensid54 Posted December 23, 2017 Author Share #160 Posted December 23, 2017 Roughed in servos and mount. Next will be to clean that up then build linkage and after that I'll figure out the angles so my extremely intelligent and modest friend in the UK can program the board for me. The servo with the arm hanging down won't stay that way I just have to remount it. mtaylor, Mirabell61, shipmodel and 4 others 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bensid54 Posted December 24, 2017 Author Share #161 Posted December 24, 2017 Linkage made and installed. One of the rods had to be cut down and cut to 3 mm with my little die plus I had to drill out the ball link and thread that to 3 mm. In one of the pictures you see the savage beast I had to save Charon from when she was trying to eat his wire. Next will be a video of him in action. Ainars Apalais, Jim Rogers, shipmodel and 3 others 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BANYAN Posted December 24, 2017 Share #162 Posted December 24, 2017 Looks great Ben, some very good progress made. Can't wait too see him in actions - are you still doing glowing eyes? cheers Pat Canute and mtaylor 2 Quote If at first you do not suceed, try, and then try again!Current build: HMCSS Victoria (Scratch) Next build: HMAS Vampire (3D printed resin, scratch 1:350) Built: Battle Station (Scratch) and HM Bark Endeavour 1768 (kit 1:64) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bensid54 Posted December 24, 2017 Author Share #163 Posted December 24, 2017 Not sure about the eyes yet. Thanks for the compliment I will put in the video of him in action tomorrow. Canute and mtaylor 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bensid54 Posted December 24, 2017 Author Share #164 Posted December 24, 2017 Charon's final frames first video. Any suggestions as how to improve his paddling would be greatly appreciated. Mirabell61, hexnut, Canute and 7 others 10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtaylor Posted December 24, 2017 Share #165 Posted December 24, 2017 To my eye, it looks pretty smooth and pretty spot on, Ben. My only comment is limit the speed on the rowing. The higher speed doesn't quite look right... too energetic methinks. Canute and lmagna 2 Quote Mark "The shipwright is slow, but the wood is patient." - me Current Build: Past Builds: La Belle Poule 1765 - French Frigate from ANCRE plans - ON HOLD Triton Cross-Section NRG Hallf Hull Planking Kit HMS Sphinx 1775 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 Non-Ship Model: On hold, maybe forever: CH-53 Sikorsky - 1:48 - Revell - Completed Licorne - 1755 from Hahn Plans (Scratch) Version 2.0 (Abandoned) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bensid54 Posted December 25, 2017 Author Share #166 Posted December 25, 2017 I think you are right Mark. The faster speed was after his morning coffee Canute, lmagna and mtaylor 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bensid54 Posted January 2, 2018 Author Share #167 Posted January 2, 2018 Did some more work on the weekend. I machined a sleeve to connect his head to the servo then mounted the servo to a bracket soldered to his back, the video will give you a better idea. Canute, shipmodel, BANYAN and 4 others 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bensid54 Posted January 2, 2018 Author Share #168 Posted January 2, 2018 I've done more work such as lowered his left arm so he doesn't smack himself in the teeth any more. Any suggestions as to how I can fill his body in to look more human than Terminator he looks like now. Keep in mind it has to be easy because I failed art class. mtaylor, Canute and BANYAN 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtaylor Posted January 2, 2018 Share #169 Posted January 2, 2018 Looking pretty darn good, Ben. As for clothing, how tall is he? You might look into some doll clothing... maybe modify something that exists. bensid54, Canute and lmagna 3 Quote Mark "The shipwright is slow, but the wood is patient." - me Current Build: Past Builds: La Belle Poule 1765 - French Frigate from ANCRE plans - ON HOLD Triton Cross-Section NRG Hallf Hull Planking Kit HMS Sphinx 1775 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 Non-Ship Model: On hold, maybe forever: CH-53 Sikorsky - 1:48 - Revell - Completed Licorne - 1755 from Hahn Plans (Scratch) Version 2.0 (Abandoned) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BANYAN Posted January 3, 2018 Share #170 Posted January 3, 2018 Hi Ben, looks good, even before your latest adjustment to the arm. What about something like sculpey which can be shaped/moulded then oven baked to a hard finish? cheers Pat Canute, mtaylor and bensid54 3 Quote If at first you do not suceed, try, and then try again!Current build: HMCSS Victoria (Scratch) Next build: HMAS Vampire (3D printed resin, scratch 1:350) Built: Battle Station (Scratch) and HM Bark Endeavour 1768 (kit 1:64) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bensid54 Posted January 3, 2018 Author Share #171 Posted January 3, 2018 Something that never crossed my mind Mark regarding the clothes a good idea if I make a fisherman in a row boat which I have given some thought to. The time of Charon was a time when robes were the norm so he will end up with a black cloak. Pat I was thinking about that and I'm thinking about using dowels around his arms and legs but still not sure what to do with his back. Basically I plan on only having his face and hands exposed. mtaylor and Canute 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtaylor Posted January 3, 2018 Share #172 Posted January 3, 2018 To flesh him out a bit..maybe some foam (high density?). Some of the craft shops stock it. bensid54 and Canute 2 Quote Mark "The shipwright is slow, but the wood is patient." - me Current Build: Past Builds: La Belle Poule 1765 - French Frigate from ANCRE plans - ON HOLD Triton Cross-Section NRG Hallf Hull Planking Kit HMS Sphinx 1775 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 Non-Ship Model: On hold, maybe forever: CH-53 Sikorsky - 1:48 - Revell - Completed Licorne - 1755 from Hahn Plans (Scratch) Version 2.0 (Abandoned) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shipmodel Posted January 3, 2018 Share #173 Posted January 3, 2018 Hi Ben - Those videos were excellent. They really show that you are achieving a lifelike movement. I had a strange thought while watching. To me it looks more like he is using a pole than a paddle, and I have a recollection of a woodcut illustration of Charon poling across a narrow stream between Purgatory and Hades. Do you plan to set him in a diorama, where he could use a pole, or will he go in open pools where he would have to paddle? Dan Canute, bensid54 and mtaylor 3 Quote Current build -SS Mayaguez (c.1975) scale 1/16" = 1' (1:192) by Dan Pariser Prior scratch builds - Royal yacht Henrietta, USS Monitor, USS Maine, HMS Pelican, SS America, SS Rex, SS Uruguay, Viking knarr, Gokstad ship, Thames River Skiff , USS Oneida, Swan 42 racing yacht, Queen Anne's Revenge (1710), SS Andrea Doria (1952), SS Michelangelo (1962) , Queen Anne's Revenge (2nd model) USS/SS Leviathan (1914), James B Colgate (1892), POW bone model (circa 1800) restoration Prior kit builds - AL Dallas, Mamoli Bounty. Bluejacket America, North River Diligence, Airfix Sovereign of the Seas "Take big bites. Moderation is for monks." Robert A. Heinlein Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bensid54 Posted January 3, 2018 Author Share #174 Posted January 3, 2018 Dan I plan on having him paddle around in pools and ponds on a calm day. Yes the Charon most are familiar with does use a pole to push himself across the river Styx but I don't have any shallow rivers to pole across. He will be remote control when I'm done and hopefully before the end of summer this year if not then summer next year. Here is a video of my last project. hexnut, Canute, lmagna and 3 others 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BANYAN Posted January 3, 2018 Share #175 Posted January 3, 2018 (edited) Amazing - that rowing action looks very good and even propels at a realistic pace - a well synchronised crew cheers Pat Edited January 3, 2018 by BANYAN Canute, bensid54 and mtaylor 3 Quote If at first you do not suceed, try, and then try again!Current build: HMCSS Victoria (Scratch) Next build: HMAS Vampire (3D printed resin, scratch 1:350) Built: Battle Station (Scratch) and HM Bark Endeavour 1768 (kit 1:64) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bensid54 Posted January 4, 2018 Author Share #176 Posted January 4, 2018 Thanks Pat, that boat took about two weeks worth of head scratching to figure out how I was going to do it. Getting the oars to enter and exit the water with little splashing and as human like as possible was the big challenge. This is a video of the mechanics that sit below deck. BANYAN, Mirabell61, lmagna and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louie da fly Posted July 10, 2020 Share #177 Posted July 10, 2020 Hey, Bensid - did you ever finish Charon? The log seems to have just come to a sudden halt about two and a half years ago. I lost trace of it, but I was looking forward to seeing it complete. Now that the buildlogs have been re-organised it was visible again. It would be really good to get an update - particularly if there's a video available Canute and mtaylor 2 Quote It's not really a ship model unless you've bled on it. CURRENT BUILDS Golden City - Ballarat paddlewheeler La Lomellina - Theoretical Reconstruction of a Genoese carrack sunk in 1516 FINISHED Venetian merchant Ship from Basilica of San Marco Australian couta boat RMS Titanic HMVS Cerberus 11th century Byzantine dromon Winchelsea Nef - Late 13th century Mediaeval ship Henry Grace a Dieu - Rebuild of 1:200 model I started in 1967 Mistydeefer - restoration of decor model yacht Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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