HMS Winchelsea by Fred Healey

[jfhealey]

[jfhealey]

In the picture above A is 2mm and B is 13mm.

[jfhealey]

In the picture at post 29 above I transposed B and C. Sorry.

 

Thank you nzreg and JpR62 for your likes.

[Chuck]

Honestly its really hard to tell what needs adjusting.  Because you used different width planks, i cant tell if the run of your planking is wrong or if the transom fillers are too low.  But the only way to tell for sure is to measure off the plans.  Measure the distance from the top of the wales to the sheer on the plans and then compare to your model.  Once you have the sheer correct then you can adjust to transom.

[BobG]

I'm really enjoying the progress you are making, Fred. The cherry wood is gorgeous. This model is certainly on my tick list. Your outdoor photos show that you have a lovely garden to enjoy as well. Continued good luck to you on your build.

[jfhealey]

Thank you Bob; and thank you too for the kind remarks about our garden. We had a spell of gorgeous weather even you lucky Californians would have been pleased to see. Thank you for the likes - every kind word and thumbs up lifts your spirits when things don't go according to plan. Which is quite often in my case. I've planked one side! 

[jfhealey]

I can't work out how to add pictures and text in one go so this is all a bit disjointed. I don't have a Jim Byrnes or similar (is there anything similar to a Jim Byrnes?) so I bought pre cut planking and I have mixed feelings about it. There is a mixture of planks showing a fair face and planks showing an end grain face and it looks a bit disjointed and over complicated. Its OK if the finish is completely matt but any sheen brings out the problem.

[jfhealey]

There are sadly some right old howlers. This is a failure to understand the relationship between the lower counter, the incoming planking and, crucially, the substrate. I can see exactly what I did wrong. Its down to a lack of experience. I won't make the same mistake again.

[Chuck]

That is a relly tough joint to plank along the counter.  Nor worries though.  You might be able to cover most of that with the molding that goes there and of course the frieze.   Its tough to get good cherry strips unless you cut them yourself.  You would be able to pick and choose the better pieces that way.  Byrnes is the best but many folks also use the Proxxon.  It is looking good however.....I like what you are doing with the model.   

[jfhealey]

But don't get me wrong. I am loving this project. The Winchelsea is a beautiful ship. Chuck has clearly spent countless hours making the build accessible to even nincampoops like me. And I love to read of everyone else's triumphs and even to share the pain of things going wrong. I suspect my first skin of balsa wood and body filler is rather frowned upon  - but I simply don't have the confidence to plank without. I wish I marked out the tic strips and followed them with greater precision. In the photo below I think every plank probably ends in a different width from its neighbour. But it's been a sharp learning curve and I suppose that's the point. I'm seriously thinking of regarding this Winchelsea as a dry run for another to be started next winter: I love this ship that much. Oh - and perhaps buying a new camera to replace my 15 year old point and shoot. And I forgot to own up to the awful joint in the keel. I got ratty with the sandpaper when I knew I should have walked away and had a beer.

[jfhealey]

Thank you Chuck. I reckon it must be about 6:30am over there. Don't you sleep well??

[jfhealey]

[jfhealey]

This is the other side. Not far to go and then its the q galleries. Even Stuntflyer Mike says there are tough bits there so what hope for me I wonder!

 

Keep safe everyone

Fred

[jfhealey]

I've been thinking about the time in New York. I reckon, on reflection, it might be cup of tea time  rather than 6:30am. Sorry!

[BobG]

42 minutes ago, jfhealey said:

There are sadly some right old howlers. This is a failure to understand the relationship between the lower counter, the incoming planking and, crucially, the substrate. I can see exactly what I did wrong. Its down to a lack of experience. I won't make the same mistake again.

 

Can you explain a little more about what happened here and how you would do it differently the next time? I just finished the Medway Longboat and I made some errors along the way but managed to recover from them fairly well. The Winnie is on my tick list so I'm trying to read and learn from the logs here. Thanks.

[egkb]

Love what you are doing here Fred .. I too thought Winnie was 'Batting too high up the order' , you are inspiring me to at least consider it for a future build.. 

 

Keep Up The Great Work

 

All The Best And Stay Well

 

Eamonn (Just Across The Water In Rainy Ireland)

[Rustyj]

The Winnie is not the simplest hull to plank even with Chucks great guidance.

You're doing a good job and I'm sure you're improving with every plank you do. 

Keep up the good work!

[jfhealey]

Thanks Chaps.

 

Bob, Eamonn and Rusty: my sincere apologies for the tardiness of this response. Things have rather ground to a halt on the Winchelsea front with Chuck unable to ship internationally for the time being. Bob - I thought I had a clear grasp on where I went wrong with the lower counter but the more I think about it the less sure I am. I've done a couple of diagrams and I'll post them below if I can figure out how to do it.

 

First though some pictures.

[jfhealey]

I can't work out how to interpose text between pictures. You can see that (with nothing else to do!) I've lined the inside of the bulwarks. That all went surprisingly well. I had a lot of cutting away of the QG framing in order to allow for the panelling without intruding into the window opening - the blue arrow on the last but one picture above. I've also lined the inside of the lower counter and plan to cut out the rudder trunk later. I got fed up looking at the mess I made  of the lower counter inside as well as out.

 

I plan to paint the panelling - duck egg blue or something like that - but to leave the non-panelled lining in wood. I know that's probably not correct but it looks really nice unpainted.

 

Stay well everyone.

 

Now to see if I can scan in my diagrams and explain where I think I went so badly wrong with the lower counter.

 

All the best

Fred

[Chuck]

It looks really great actually.   I wouldnt worry about the lower counter.  That looks really good.   The curve of the upper counter can be adjusted visually by slightly tweaking your molding so the upper counter is consistent in width and the curve on top and bottom is the same.....or at least closer to being the same.   So dont worry about that too much.  

 

You need to buy chapter 3 of the project in Cherry?   Of that is all you need to buy at the moment I may use you as a test to see how the international mail is running.   If you want to give it a go....send me a PM so we can discuss the details..

 

Chuck 

[jfhealey]

Thanks Chuck. If there were no postal risk I'd order the carving set too but given there is a risk of things going astray  I'd be jolly grateful if you could supply the chapter 3 parts. I'm quite happy to accept the risk. Can I just place the order through Syren in the usual way? I'm not sure what a PM is!

 

Fred

[Chuck]

No as I cant open up ordering on my site for one person internationally.   I will email you.

 

Chuck

[Wacom]

Fred, seems to me you are being too hard on yourself.  The work you have done to date looks good, give it a few days and you will see its really very good.👍👌😎

[scrubbyj427]

Hi Fred,

I recently received my carvings from China with no issues. Jack is shipping international through FedEx with no issues.

JJ

[captainscott]

That is looking very nice. Love the cherry.

[jfhealey]

Good morning everyone from a (finally) sunny Cornwall.

 

First, it has been two months since Bob G asked me to explain a little more where I had gone wrong with the stern counter. Please accept my apologies, Bob, for the delay in responding.

 

This is how I see it. First, the stern counter needs to be sanded to the correct shape. Looking at the incoming planking there is quite a pronounced L shape as the sides of the how turn underneath the stern counter. Chuck's post at #337 is the one to look at. Stuntflyer Mike's post at #133 is another one to study. Of the more recent posts Guillermo Madico's stern counter looks good (post #41) though oddly he has left out the supporting block screwed to the underside of the stern frame's. Scubby J at #93 shows the roles those supporting blocks play in providing something to glue the incoming planking to.

 

I sanded to the wrong shape. I sanded to a gentle curve rather than pronounced L. That's the first thing I got wrong.

 

Secondly, those supporting blocks need to be sanded to allow the incoming planks butt up to the lower counter planking with the edges of each nicely bevelled. I didn't sand away sufficient of the supporting blocks so that my incoming planking "overthrew" the lower counter planking. When the incoming planking was sanding down it left gaps – see #43 above. Fortunately, I had access to the planking from the other side and was able to fill the area with glue and then filler so it is all perfectly sound albeit unsightly.

 

There is, as Chuck has said, fancy profile to go along the junction so I hope to be able to hide some of the error, at least.

 

Finally, the incoming planks turn quite sharply upwards in the last insurer so before they meet the lower counter planking – look at Scrubby J's #93 and you will see what I mean. That sharp upward turn really needs to be preformed with heat. Aside from turning up quite sharply the planks also need to be tapered, edge bent and twisted along the length. They are tricky. I did the tapering, edge bending and twisting first so that I had a pretty well fitting plank up to the point where it needed to be turned up quite sharply. I then tried to form the upward turn by holding the plank with pliers in the heat of a room blow heater. The cherry goes quite plastic once it reaches a certain temperature and it will take and hold bend quite well. The difficulty, as I found it, was controlling exactly where the bend formed. I think I would doing it again I put the bending fairly early stage of making the planking question and then, but only then, fettle the edge bending, tapering and bevelling.

 

So, like I suspect most of these things, there is a combination of errors in play. I hope I will do better next time?

 

On a much happier note, and after a journey of several thousand miles involving three transatlantic crossing is (New York – London / London – Miami and Miami – London) and the best part of a month my chapter 3 parts finally arrived – though not before I got clobbered for import duty. Winchelsea is only my third build (after Amati's Lady Nelson and AL's Bounty ) so I do not speak from a wealth of experience but the laser cutting quality of the chapter 3 parts (as with the earlier parts) is far, far better than anything I have seen before.

 

I have started work on the QGs. I doubt if I have the angle of the transom correct. I certainly think I have set the stern windows to low in the frame's. I doubt if my hull planking follows the plans – unfortunately, all the balsa wood and body filler I added (see above) obscured Chuck's guidelines so I just eyeballed the run. All in all I am expecting to have to make a few compromises but here are some pictures showing the present state of play. The qg frames are just rested in place as our the frames in the great cabin.

[jfhealey]

I forgot to mention – chuck supplies 14 window frames of various angles from which you can select the best 6 to suit your QG. In the photos above I have just taken the first three – just see what they look like. Here's a start on the other side.

[Chuck]

It looks very good.  Those qgalleries are tricky.  The extra windows have slightly different angles just in case.....understanding that its tough to get the angle precisely as the plans show it.  Yours look very good.  

[Matt D]

Fred, that looks beautiful.

Chuck, you take such good care of us.  You are the best!

[Rustyj]

Looking really good Fred.