Postiljon c.1666-1678 by Ab Hoving - FINISHED - a Dutch frigate

[Ab Hoving]

In spite of my shaking hands and fading eyesight I just could not resist the building of this light frigate.
The Postiljon only measured 100 x 24,5 x 10,25 feet and was armed with 20 guns. Het crew existed of 75 men. She was part of the group that executed the Raid on Chatham, an occasion at which many British warships were burned and the flagship Royal Charles was captured and brought to the Netherlands. Postiljon only played a modest roll in the event, but she was on the Medway, so she wrote history.
I pictured het counter-braced to come to a halt. We will probably come with images showing her in her natural surroundings.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

For whoever is interested, here are the plans in 1/77 scale. The model measures 52 cm over all, bowsprit and lanterns included.

I hope you like it.
Ab

 

 

Postiljon_rev_1_77b.pdf

[Alvb]

Dear Ab Hoving,

I admire your models, they are extremely lively precisely because they are not aimed at extreme precision or accuracy.

 

my respect,

Alvb

[Jsk]

Ab,

 

When I first dabbled in card modeling around 2016/17 I came across your models over at papermodelers.com. I recall using some of your son's first compositions of your ship models as computer desktop images for many months to keep me inspired. Your models still inspire me.

 

Thanks for sharing them!

[Ab Hoving]

Thanks to all the people who liked my model. Inspiring!

Special thanks to Alvb and Jsk for their kind remarks and to Alvb: No, neatness and accuracy are not my main purposes. I must confess the lack of them in my models are partly a result of the physical problems I encounter, but I never felt much attraction in polished, neat, shiny ship models, although I admire the skills of those who produce them.

In the end we are all here to inspire others and when it sometimes succeeds, it is a reason to be contend.

 

Oh, by the way, I built another model this summer for a friend who is building full size vessels from wasted plastic. Here is his web site. https://www.clean2a.nl/onze-schepen/  It is worth to keep an eye on him, because next summer, after he finished his pleasure vessel after Witsen, he will start a full size 100 feet long fluit. For inspiration I built him this model:

 

 

 

 

 

 

Just a paper finger exercise.

 

Best,

Ab

 

 

[druxey]

Makes a nice, plump model, though, Ab! Very nicely done.

[Alvb]

Dear Ab Hoving,

 

As you know, taking perfection to the extreme, despite all admiration for the craftsmanship, often leads to rigidity and lifelessness. Filling an object with life is artistic virtuosity! I would never want to call that a lack.

 

I am excited to see how the plastic Speel-jaagt behaves under sail.

 

Best wishes

Alvb

[TheDuckDetective]

Hello Ab, 

Both models are lovely. I agree with Alvb and Jeff. Your models carry a lifelike feeling which inspires me as well. It's like they jumped right out of one of the paintings in the Rijksmuseum.

 

I've been following the build of the speeljaght, and I am definitely looking forward to the Fluyt build develop. I hope to visit their shipyard someday.

 

Best regards,

 

Rutger

[flying_dutchman2]

Every Fluit you have built is always beautifully executed. I always learn something looking at your Fluits. I use this knowledge on my own fluit to make sure the Zeehaen is correct.

 

Marcus

[Baker]

Congratulations 

Very beautiful models 

[Michael Mash]

On 9/4/2024 at 9:41 AM, TheDuckDetective said:

Hello Ab, 

Your models carry a lifelike feeling which inspires me as well. It's like they jumped right out of one of the paintings in the Rijksmuseum.

Best regards,   Rutger

 

Well said.  I have been looking for those words to describe Ab's work.  Thank You.

 

 

[firdajan]

Deep respect, Ab. Awesome models

 

Jan

[scrubbyj427]

On 9/1/2024 at 10:25 AM, Ab Hoving said:

In spite of my shaking hands and fading eyesight I just could not resist the building of this light frigate.
The Postiljon only measured 100 x 24,5 x 10,25 feet and was armed with 20 guns. Het crew existed of 75 men. She was part of the group that executed the Raid on Chatham, an occasion at which many British warships were burned and the flagship Royal Charles was captured and brought to the Netherlands. Postiljon only played a modest roll in the event, but she was on the Medway, so she wrote history.
I pictured het counter-braced to come to a halt. We will probably come with images showing her in her natural surroundings.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

For whoever is interested, here are the plans in 1/77 scale. The model measures 52 cm over all, bowsprit and lanterns included.

I hope you like it.
Ab

 

 

Postiljon_rev_1_77b.pdf 1.27 MB · 44 downloads

Hi Ab, 

Is there more information available on this ship? Like deck drawings/layouts profile, carvings, gallery’s… everything to build as you have? Your model is incredible! I would love to build this.

 

JJ

[Ab Hoving]

Thank you gentlemen, for all for your undeserved praise,

@druxey: The shapes of fluits have been a subject of mockery from the beginning of its development. Still it was a most functional vessel for those days.

@Alvb:  At the moment Ter Velde is laying the fore deck:

@TheDuckDetective: Next summer the full size plastic fluit will be built on the premises of the old Willemsoord Navy yard in Den Helder.

@flying_dutchman2: You are making nice progress with your fluit.

@Baker: Thanks Patrick, I cannot stand in your shadow with your 'noblest ship'

@Michael Mash: Thanks Mike. Still, as a paper modeler yourself you know the tricks.

@firdajan: Wonderfull work on your SoS, Jan. 

@scrubbyj427: I have a confession to make JJ. Usually I never picture a specific ship, because it suggests that I know all the details. I don't. I prefer building a ship type, on which I put an invented name in the stage when the taffrail has to be added. But it is all fake. There are almost no 17th century ships of which we can be sure above a certain level. All I had as a source was this Van de Velde picture, which shows some peculiarities,  like a two-rails beak head instead of a three rails one, the locations of the gunports, the ship's ladder, the absence of the forecastle deck, and some more details which I tried to model Furthermore what James Bender tells us in his book Dutch Warships.

All the rest is general knowledge of how the decks were detailed, dimensions of the rigging, etc.

To make a long story short:  what I make is little more than a mixture of general knowledge, logical thinking and the impression the images Van de Velde left us, translated in paper and paint.

You can get any support for your build you want from me, but don't expect your model to be a true replica of the original. At least mine is not.

 

[scrubbyj427]

Hi Ab, thank you for the info. I think I’ll take a stab at this one on my computer first. This or one of the ships in your book. I love the shape of these 17th century Dutch ships.

 

JJ 

[Ab Hoving]

As I promised earlier hereby the (temporary) 'natural surrounding' of the frigate Postiljon. It is the situation during the Raid on the Medway on June 22 1667. Earlier the fortress Sheerness at the mouth of the river was conquered, the chain that closed the river was broken and here Upnor castle is under attack by the Dutch frigates. Three of the king's ships laid up near the castle were set to fire and little later the flagship Royal Charles was taken and brought to Holland as a trofee. The action speeded up the negotiations for a profitable peace and is still in the Dutch history books as a showpiece for the abilities of admiral Michiel de Ruyter (although he himself only arrived at the end of the action). I'm sure English history books have another view of the event if mentioned at all.

Emiel tried to keep as close to the facts as possible.

 

[Chapman]

I love it!
I know at least one book about this daring action. The Dutch in the Medway by P.G. Rogers

 

Edited November 28 by Chapman

[druxey]

Lovely work, both actual and virtual! Reliable English texts on the Medway raid are balanced in their account. They do not varnish the truth of the 'black eye' delivered by the Dutch on that occasion! 

[Ab Hoving]

 

28 minutes ago, druxey said:

Reliable English texts on the Medway raid are balanced in their account.

I really hope so David.

Years ago when I did a contribution about the stern carvings of the captured Royal Charles for Model Shipwright, a beautiful English magazine, a desk editor, who had no business at all with the content of the article, changed my somewhat ironic text into something much more acceptable (for himself). John Bowden, the editor was furious about what had happened, but it was too late. It shows that the matter might touch an open nerf for some people, even knowing that the British did defeat the Dutch fleet several times most convincingly... 

[firdajan]

Perfect picture, Ab👍

 

And you´re right about the Dutch, here is the proof... I think everyone knows it.

British can say whatever they want ( sorry British )

 

Jan

 

 

 

 

[Louie da fly]

From my own reading, the general British attitude has been that it was a disastrous and very embarrassing loss for Britain.

 

Steven

Edited November 29 by Louie da fly

[Dziadeczek]

On 11/28/2024 at 2:41 AM, Ab Hoving said:

As I promised earlier hereby the (temporary) 'natural surrounding' of the frigate Postiljon. It is the situation during the Raid on the Medway on June 22 1667. Earlier the fortress Sheerness at the mouth of the river was conquered, the chain that closed the river was broken and here Upnor castle is under attack by the Dutch frigates. Three of the king's ships laid up near the castle were set to fire and little later the flagship Royal Charles was taken and brought to Holland as a trofee. The action speeded up the negotiations for a profitable peace and is still in the Dutch history books as a showpiece for the abilities of admiral Michiel de Ruyter (although he himself only arrived at the end of the action). I'm sure English history books have another view of the event if mentioned at all.

Emiel tried to keep as close to the facts as possible.

 

Excelllent!   😲

Could I trouble you to repost this pic again, in a bigger resolution, say 300dpi, please? 
I use your pics for my desktop background and, even though I enlarged this pic, it now shows some grain, unfortunately. If you show it in larger resolution (original?), the quality should be noticeably better, I hope.

Thanks again!

Thomas

Edited November 30 by Dziadeczek

[Ab Hoving]

10 hours ago, firdajan said:

And you´re right about the Dutch, here is the proof... I think everyone knows it.

British can say whatever they want ( sorry British )

Thank you Jan. I don't think there are UK people who want to deny the event, just that it hurts to be confronted with another nation having invaded their country.

 

6 hours ago, Louie da fly said:

From my own reading, the general British attitude has been that it was a disastrous and very embarrassing loss for Britain.

 

 

Yes Steven, it is, but from my own experience there are people who have problems accepting it. That's all I wanted to mention. As I said, the Dutch were beaten by the English several times and maybe it depends on what your vision on history is how you cope with it.

My 'corrector' obviously had a different vision than I had.

 

4 hours ago, Dziadeczek said:

Could I trouble you to repost this pic again, in a bigger resolution, say 300dpi, please? 

 

I suppose this forum has a max for uploading pictures. Therefore I will send you the high res picture in a PM. Thanks for your appreciation.

Ab

[mtaylor]

16 hours ago, Ab Hoving said:

Thank you Jan. I don't think there are UK people who want to deny the event, just that it hurts to be confronted with another nation having invaded their country.

 

 

Yes Steven, it is, but from my own experience there are people who have problems accepting it. That's all I wanted to mention. As I said, the Dutch were beaten by the English several times and maybe it depends on what your vision on history is how you cope with it.

My 'corrector' obviously had a different vision than I had.

 

Denial sometimes seems normal in this regard.   I've seen here in the States with some folks usually in hte south referring to the "Civil War" as "the recent unpleasantness" (it took place in the 1860's) and also as "the war of northern aggression" along with other denials.  I guess pride and reality don't often mix.