Shazmira Posted April 22, 2013 Author Share #331 Posted April 22, 2013 Keith, I guess I need to find some flux before I try again. And thanks for the tip about heating the part first. I was not doing that. David, why silver? What is the difference? Quote Robbyn If you risk nothing, you risk everything! Current builds Syren (Model Shipways) version 2.0 AL San Francisco II Mordaunt (Euro Model) Completed Builds 18th Century Longboat designed by Chuck Passaro In the closet Battle Station Al Charles Morgan (1980s version) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bedford Posted April 22, 2013 Share #332 Posted April 22, 2013 OK ! Soldering. I am an electrical fitter, I have made thousands of solder joints with copper and 60/40 resin cored solder. Forget silver solder for non load bearing joints, you don't need it and it may require specialised heating implements and flux. Copper is made to be soldered with 60/40 resin cored, they go together like peas in a pod. Use a mains powered iron, 25watt should be good. MAKE DAMN SURE THE COPPER IS CLEAN!!!! I use wet and dry sanding paper to make it shiny and don't touch it where you are going to solder. Do not set it up on a wooden board unless you are well and truly used to doing it as if you take too long the wood will start to burn and the smoke will wreck the joint. DO put solder on the iron first, just a little, this increases the contact area between the iron and the job and the heat transfer is much more efficient. For small jobs you may find the initial blob of solder on the iron is sufficient, you will see it flow onto the joint when the job is hot enough. Solder flows to heat so if you need to add more to the joint then do so on the edge of the joint and it will flow in. If I was doing those joints I would use a wood base but use a household tile and after sanding the copper clean bend the "U" with tools and leave long ends on it so you can tape it down. Then bend a very short right angle into the shaft part and tape it down so the "L" is in place against the "U" The reason for the "L" is to give more contact area to the joint. Meanwhile the iron has been getting hot. Touch the solder to the iron and if it melts quickly the iron is hot enough, touch the solder carrying face of the iron to the job and hold until you see the solder flow. You can add more and if it only flows to such an extent that the blob has ceased to be a blob and started to flow but wont spread then definately touch a bit more solder onto the joint because that will add flux and help the solder flow. If you get the joint hot enough then when you remove the iron I would drag it down the shaft and this will thin the excess solder down along the shaft rather than leaving a huge blob. It is worth noting that solder has a high lead content so use it in a well ventilated area but more interestingly to modellers, it can be trimmed with a sharp knife. ROBBYN, BE VEWY, VEWY CAREFUL I made this using an electric iron as well as a larger gas heated iron, it was 50/50 from memmory, resin cored solder. Fitted to a 3.5Kg vehicle, I can lift the car by the bullbar and it is brass, not copper, copper is easier to solder. avsjerome2003 and realworkingsailor 2 Quote Ships built :- Schooner for Port Jackson Thermoplylae Bluenose II Full size Tammie Norrie dinghy 1:8 scale Miss Caroline, model of the full size boat I built Under construction :- Royal Caroline, this one is special as it is in memory of my 13 year old daughter, Caroline who passed away in 2005 Miane three masted schooner R/C, scratch build (on hold) Charles W Morgan (on hold) Scratch designed and built R/C Mahogany and Walnut speedboat (on hold) In the que :- S.T. Waratah, maybe! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lamarvalley Posted April 22, 2013 Share #333 Posted April 22, 2013 I think you just got a practicum on soldering... and yes... flux is required. Your wheels look good... aren't you glad you added them.... I mean, really, without them those poor sailors would wear themselves out dragging those cannon around (to where I have no idea but if they have wheels...? ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bedford Posted April 22, 2013 Share #334 Posted April 22, 2013 I have never added flux to a solder joint I have done at home. The resin in the solder is more than adequate. Quote Ships built :- Schooner for Port Jackson Thermoplylae Bluenose II Full size Tammie Norrie dinghy 1:8 scale Miss Caroline, model of the full size boat I built Under construction :- Royal Caroline, this one is special as it is in memory of my 13 year old daughter, Caroline who passed away in 2005 Miane three masted schooner R/C, scratch build (on hold) Charles W Morgan (on hold) Scratch designed and built R/C Mahogany and Walnut speedboat (on hold) In the que :- S.T. Waratah, maybe! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lamarvalley Posted April 22, 2013 Share #335 Posted April 22, 2013 Bedford, I bow to your soldering experience fore it far exceeds mine but I always thought flux was a necessity...my solder is called 'grade 60/40 solid... is that a resin core? Would it say it on the roll? Not quibbling, just asking... you know... learn something new everyday... use it in every way... avsjerome2003 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shazmira Posted April 22, 2013 Author Share #336 Posted April 22, 2013 Mine says it has the flux in the core on the package. When I went to buy the soldering iron, I was looking for flux, but the hardware store didn't sell it...just the flux core stuff. Thank you very much for the tutorial. I had to make a purchase of some dowels from ME, my kit was short one length of dowel for one of my masts, so while I was at it I also purchased a different soldering iron since this battery powered one seems to be a joke! Quote Robbyn If you risk nothing, you risk everything! Current builds Syren (Model Shipways) version 2.0 AL San Francisco II Mordaunt (Euro Model) Completed Builds 18th Century Longboat designed by Chuck Passaro In the closet Battle Station Al Charles Morgan (1980s version) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bedford Posted April 22, 2013 Share #337 Posted April 22, 2013 (edited) Bedford, I bow to your soldering experience fore it far exceeds mine but I always thought flux was a necessity...my solder is called 'grade 60/40 solid... is that a resin core? Would it say it on the roll? Not quibbling, just asking... you know... learn something new everyday... use it in every way... I never mind a question, hell, I have asked thousands !! If your solder says "solid" then it is not resin cored and you would need flux. Personally I would consign it to Davey Jones' Locker and buy some resin cored. Resin cored will say "resin cored" and if it is an old roll and you can't read the label then pull on the end, stretch it until it breaks. You should be able to see the resin cores. There are normally a few cores that are like veins running through the length of the solder. It is brown so easy to see. If not sure then heat up the iron and melt some solder, the resin will become apparent as a brown fluid around the solder. Edited April 22, 2013 by Bedford avsjerome2003 and lamarvalley 2 Quote Ships built :- Schooner for Port Jackson Thermoplylae Bluenose II Full size Tammie Norrie dinghy 1:8 scale Miss Caroline, model of the full size boat I built Under construction :- Royal Caroline, this one is special as it is in memory of my 13 year old daughter, Caroline who passed away in 2005 Miane three masted schooner R/C, scratch build (on hold) Charles W Morgan (on hold) Scratch designed and built R/C Mahogany and Walnut speedboat (on hold) In the que :- S.T. Waratah, maybe! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shazmira Posted April 23, 2013 Author Share #338 Posted April 23, 2013 finished the deck furnishings!!!! Cannons are complete Lifeboat is done and tied down. I plan to add some oars but have to wait for the wood I ordered to get here. Should be able to add those easy enough. Time to start the masts!!! James H and avsjerome2003 2 Quote Robbyn If you risk nothing, you risk everything! Current builds Syren (Model Shipways) version 2.0 AL San Francisco II Mordaunt (Euro Model) Completed Builds 18th Century Longboat designed by Chuck Passaro In the closet Battle Station Al Charles Morgan (1980s version) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
augie Posted April 23, 2013 Share #339 Posted April 23, 2013 Looking good Robbyn. Quote Augie Current Build: US Frigate Confederacy - MS 1:64 Previous Builds : US Brig Syren (MS) - 2013 (see Completed Ship Gallery) Greek Tug Ulises (OcCre) - 2009 (see Completed Ship Gallery) Victory Cross Section (Corel) - 1988 Essex (MS) 1/8"- 1976 Cutty Sark (Revell 1:96) - 1956 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffT Posted April 23, 2013 Share #340 Posted April 23, 2013 Very nice! Quote Jeff In progress: Medway Longboat 1742 - Syren Ship Model Company -1/2" scale USS Constitution - Model Shipways - Scale 1:76 HMS Granado - CAF Model - 1:48 HMS Sphinx - Vanguard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrieke Posted April 23, 2013 Share #341 Posted April 23, 2013 very nice indeed Quote Current builds : HMS Bounty, Constructo Pilar Next build : undecided On the Shelf : AL San Juan, Mamoli HMS Victory Builds on hold : Ochre Gorch Fock, Hachette/Amati Black Pearl Previous Builds Gallery : Virginia; King of Mississippi Previous Builds logs : AL King of Mississippi 1/80 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
themadchemist Posted April 23, 2013 Share #342 Posted April 23, 2013 So which will arrive first the wood or the Syren. If the Syren beats the wood there may be 2 ships going. May be the long boat... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjdale Posted April 23, 2013 Share #343 Posted April 23, 2013 Very nice Robbyn! Quote Grant ____________________________________________________ Current builds: African Queen - Radio Control / Live Steam Previous builds: The Shipyard at Foss' Landing (Diorama), Hannah - Ship in a Bottle, NRG Capstan Project, 1869 Allerton Steam Pumper, Medway Longboat , Alfa Romeo Spider Gran Touring (Pocher) , Da Vinci Flying Machine, 1949 Chris Craft 19' Racing Runabout - Dumas - Radio, Bomb Vessel Granado, 1742 - Cross Section - Scratchbuild, HMS Victory (Mamoli 1:90), Cutty Sark, Armed Pinnace, Bounty, Santa Maria At another place: Stephenson's Rocket (OcCre 1:24) (click the title to follow the link) In the Gallery: Lancia Armata 1803, Bomb Vessel Granada, 1742 Cross Section, 1949 Chris Craft 19' Racing Runabout Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
src Posted April 23, 2013 Share #344 Posted April 23, 2013 Robbyn, Yikes I go away for a couple of days (weeks?) and you have a half completed ship, have started soldering(!) AND your a moderator!!! Were you on the over achievers list in collage as well as the deans list?? Everything looks great. As far as soldering, it appears the more experienced here are using irons, perhaps I am missing something but I use a small butane pencil torch, my parts dont move around on me. It is an almost instantaneous joint, A little dab-0-flux, a tinier snippet of solder, light the torch touch the flame to the part and your done. Regardless which way you go, each time you solder something you will get better and better, what you have done looks good. Sam Shazmira 1 Quote Current Build Constructo Enterprise Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salty Sea Dog Posted April 23, 2013 Share #345 Posted April 23, 2013 The deck is looking great! Nice job! Maybe you can whittle some oars for the life boat when your camping at Custer State Park (beautiful place!). If you are going to double the rum rations while on vacation, maybe you should stay away from knives though... avsjerome2003 1 Quote -Buck Current build: AL Morgan's Whaleboat (1st build) Kits in the ships locker: I cannot confirm nor deny that there may be a few kits in there... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hamilton Posted April 23, 2013 Share #346 Posted April 23, 2013 Hi Robbyn: Just catching up on your build log after a long absence - wow! Great recovery from the injury and great work on the SF! Glad to see you diving into some scratch building on this build - I was much too timid to do so on my first! Also I'm glad you got that forward cannon on. My 4-year-old son made me take it off on my SF build because he was afraid someone would trip over it coming down the stairs! I've been trying to sneak it back on ever since, but he keeps catching me at it! Sheesh! hamilton Quote current builds: Corel HMS Bellona (1780); Admiralty models Echo cross-section (semi-scratch) previous builds: MS Phantom (scuttled, 2017); MS Sultana (1767); Corel Brittany Sloop (scuttled, 2022); MS Kate Cory; MS Armed Virginia Sloop (in need of a refit); Corel Flattie; Mamoli Gretel; Amati Bluenose (1921) (scuttled, 2023); AL San Francisco (destroyed by land krakens [i.e., cats]); Corel Toulonnaise (1823); MS Glad Tidings (1937) (in need of a refit); HMS Blandford (1719) from Corel HMS Greyhound; Fair Rosamund (1832) from OcCre Dos Amigos (missing in action); Amati Hannah (ship in a bottle); Mamoli America (1851); Bluenose fishing schooner (1921) (scratch); Off-Centre Sailing Skiff (scratch) under the bench: MS Emma C Barry; MS USS Constitution; MS Flying Fish; Corel Berlin; a wood supplier Colonial Schooner Hannah; Victory Models H.M.S. Fly; CAF Models HMS Granado; MS USS Confederacy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bedford Posted April 23, 2013 Share #347 Posted April 23, 2013 I just noticed the foam work cradle you have for the SF. Love that idea ! I have made an adjustable work stand which is very useful but sometimes when you are working on this side and that, turning it constantly, the stand can be a pain. I shall have to keep my eyes open for a suitable piece of foam ! The ship is looking good Robbyn, the riggin is a big job, don't think you will have it knocked over in no time. Steve Quote Ships built :- Schooner for Port Jackson Thermoplylae Bluenose II Full size Tammie Norrie dinghy 1:8 scale Miss Caroline, model of the full size boat I built Under construction :- Royal Caroline, this one is special as it is in memory of my 13 year old daughter, Caroline who passed away in 2005 Miane three masted schooner R/C, scratch build (on hold) Charles W Morgan (on hold) Scratch designed and built R/C Mahogany and Walnut speedboat (on hold) In the que :- S.T. Waratah, maybe! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lamarvalley Posted April 23, 2013 Share #348 Posted April 23, 2013 Holy cow, you're burning thru this ship. Don't you sleep? She's looking good... nice job, I'm looking forward to the masts and rigging... then she'll be getting some height.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newbuilder101 Posted April 23, 2013 Share #349 Posted April 23, 2013 I'll agree with everyone else...you are really 'sailing' through this part of the build, and it looks great! Quote Sherry Every goodbye is the birth of a memory... Current Build: San Felipe Finished Builds: Mayflower Build Log Gallery: Mayflower Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shazmira Posted April 23, 2013 Author Share #350 Posted April 23, 2013 Keith, Gee Syren was supposed be 30-45 days on back order...nope, it will arrive tomorrow I had it delivered to my work address instead of home, so I am going to have to leave it locked in my office. If I take it home I will be in really big trouble, as I will hear her whispering to me to come open her up and get started src, glad to see you back, I wondered what had happened to you lately! Crackers....ok, my stupid question is this, do I actually have to tie something to these pins? or are they for looks only? I have been thinking the same thing about them being too close to each other, but I am not sure how to fix this...I have no more of the applewood in the proper dimesnions, but I could remake them in basswood. I cut everything according to the instructions, but the pins themseves seem to be overly large. Hamilton, Dr. Hamilton that is...I hate those cannons so close to the stairs...seems very impractical to me, but I suppose that is the whole scale issue with this and other models. Buck, I don't want to wait till Custer for those oars lol. Yes, it is a beautiful place for sure! No rum for this pirate however, I like my Jack, Black lol. Steve, my foam cradle....how ironic, the surgeon gave me that to rest my hand on while sleeping so I wouldn't roll over on it during the night lol. Works very well for supporting the build though Sleep is over rated lol...I want to see her completed!!! But the ever critical eye of the other half noticed some small issues this morning, so tonight I will address a couple minor things and straighten up the "lines" of the deck. Quote Robbyn If you risk nothing, you risk everything! Current builds Syren (Model Shipways) version 2.0 AL San Francisco II Mordaunt (Euro Model) Completed Builds 18th Century Longboat designed by Chuck Passaro In the closet Battle Station Al Charles Morgan (1980s version) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
augie Posted April 23, 2013 Share #351 Posted April 23, 2013 It's good to have an impartial ship inspector in residence. Another pair of eyes. I can't tell you haw many hours I've worked around a glaring fault without seeing it. The my Base Commander comes by and notices something. It ususally starts with 'is this supposed to look like that'? Now some unsolicited advice. DO NOT, repeat, DO NOT open that Syren box. You saw what happened to Adrieke when he just took a 'peek' at his new Gorsch Fock! Shazmira 1 Quote Augie Current Build: US Frigate Confederacy - MS 1:64 Previous Builds : US Brig Syren (MS) - 2013 (see Completed Ship Gallery) Greek Tug Ulises (OcCre) - 2009 (see Completed Ship Gallery) Victory Cross Section (Corel) - 1988 Essex (MS) 1/8"- 1976 Cutty Sark (Revell 1:96) - 1956 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john46 Posted April 23, 2013 Share #352 Posted April 23, 2013 Went through your log. Very nice built, nice pictures too. Regards, John Shazmira 1 Quote <span style='font-family: courier new'>In progress: <a class='bbc_url' href='http://modelshipworld.com/index.php?/topic/177-king-of-the-mississippi-artesania-latina-scale-180/'>King of the Mississippi</a></span><br /> <br /> <span style='font-family: courier new'>Completed : <a class='bbc_url' href='http://modelshipworld.com/index.php?/topic/176-mare-nostrum-4331-artesania-latina-scale-135/'>Mare Nostrum 4331</a></span><br /> <span style='font-family: courier new'><a class='bbc_url' href='http://modelshipworld.com/index.php?/gallery/album/51-16th-century-galeass-imai-scale-1160/'>16th century Galeass</a></span><br /> <span style='font-family: courier new'><a class='bbc_url' href='http://members.upc.nl/carla.en.john/Modelbouw/Rocket.htm'>George Stephenson Rocket Locomotive</a></span><br /> <br /> <span style='font-family: courier new'>Next build : sl Louise</span> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
themadchemist Posted April 23, 2013 Share #353 Posted April 23, 2013 Keeping it a work HA HA HA HAHA AHAHAHAHAHhahahhahahhah thats funny, you surf MSW and your students wonder why your laughing out loud. I give you a week. I can just hear you "Ok class, read chapters 30 to 50 and I'll be over here, if you need something DONT BOTHER ME, Unless there's an exacto knive sticking out of my hand" sorry, you'll never live that one down. BTW you haven't mentioned recently, how is the hand doing. We do can about more then just the build. fish 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shazmira Posted April 23, 2013 Author Share #354 Posted April 23, 2013 HAhahaha Keith...shhhhh, you aren't supposed to let the others know what us teachers are really doing during class Hand is ....I am not sure how to explain it....half working I guess. The thumb, pointer, and the middle finger work fine, other two, not so much. Still can't hold anything, or grasp anything that needs to lay accross my palm at all. The incision area itself is hper-sensitive, and the scar tissue build up is pretty bad. I was not a good patient and I unwrapped it and used it before the doctor said to which caused the stitches to pull and tear through the skin leaving an open, gaping wound. This wound eventually closed and healed, but left massive scar tissue behind that has left a protruding deposit of the stuff about 3/8 of an inch high. I thought, well, looks ugly but it's scar tissue so no big deal. Ooops, this bundle of scar tissue presses down on the healing nerve bundle, causing some pretty intense pain sometimes. Whodathunkit! So dr. has me going through scar therapy...I have to keep this silicone covering on the scar tissue now, this is supposed to soften the skin, and help break down this large mass of tissue. The therapy is already showing signs of helping (started last Friday) but the side effect is that now I have basically a pressure bandage placed on an area that feels pain under any type of pressure. Now, instead of just the occasional jolt of pain, I get 24 hour pain. However, this too serves a purpose and I am becoming a bit more desensitized to it all. Long story short..it is getting there, but I won't be doing any golfing for awhile yet. Quote Robbyn If you risk nothing, you risk everything! Current builds Syren (Model Shipways) version 2.0 AL San Francisco II Mordaunt (Euro Model) Completed Builds 18th Century Longboat designed by Chuck Passaro In the closet Battle Station Al Charles Morgan (1980s version) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shazmira Posted April 23, 2013 Author Share #355 Posted April 23, 2013 So Crackers, aka Tony is right, my belaying pins are too close together...I guess I will need to make new ones tonight Quote Robbyn If you risk nothing, you risk everything! Current builds Syren (Model Shipways) version 2.0 AL San Francisco II Mordaunt (Euro Model) Completed Builds 18th Century Longboat designed by Chuck Passaro In the closet Battle Station Al Charles Morgan (1980s version) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shazmira Posted April 24, 2013 Author Share #356 Posted April 24, 2013 Okay, i have straightened out the deck furniture and made sure everything is now centered and straight on the keel line, and I made new pin racks so I could put the proper distance between the belaying pins. Unless someone sees anything else I need to fix or improve speak now please before I start on the masts and the rigging. realworkingsailor and James H 2 Quote Robbyn If you risk nothing, you risk everything! Current builds Syren (Model Shipways) version 2.0 AL San Francisco II Mordaunt (Euro Model) Completed Builds 18th Century Longboat designed by Chuck Passaro In the closet Battle Station Al Charles Morgan (1980s version) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sport29652 Posted April 24, 2013 Share #357 Posted April 24, 2013 On the old site a log had pointed out some pins in the midship rail that are not clearly pointed out in the instructions. Take a super close look at the rigging plans and you'll see what I mean. Good luck on not messing with the Syren. Quote Eric Current build(s) ; AL San Francisco II http://modelshipworld.com/index.php?/topic/862-san-francisco-2-by-eric-al-190-sport29652/ MS Rattlesnake http://modelshipworld.com/index.php?/topic/868-rattlesnake-by-eric-model-shipways-164-sport29652/page-2 Sitting on the shelf : MS Constitution, MS Sultana, Wish List : MS Essex, Confederacy, and Syren, and a Victory kit by someone ? "80% of the time it works every time." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bedford Posted April 24, 2013 Share #358 Posted April 24, 2013 As for cannon close to stairs, hell they even had them in the great cabin on a lot of ships. Look at Jeronimos Bon Homme Richard. Space is at a premium when spending months at sea with labour intensive vessels and no refirdgeration. I see no problem with the placement of the guns. Quote Ships built :- Schooner for Port Jackson Thermoplylae Bluenose II Full size Tammie Norrie dinghy 1:8 scale Miss Caroline, model of the full size boat I built Under construction :- Royal Caroline, this one is special as it is in memory of my 13 year old daughter, Caroline who passed away in 2005 Miane three masted schooner R/C, scratch build (on hold) Charles W Morgan (on hold) Scratch designed and built R/C Mahogany and Walnut speedboat (on hold) In the que :- S.T. Waratah, maybe! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
realworkingsailor Posted April 24, 2013 Share #359 Posted April 24, 2013 MMMMMMMMMMM do I have to stick a knife in my hand to get a foam cradle??? I will do a lot for the love of making a ship............................................... No near amputations required: http://www.bowser-trains.com/In%20Stock%20Pages/In%20Stock%20Foam%20Work%20Cradle.htm Andy Quote Quando Omni Flunkus, Moritati Current Build: USF Confederacy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
realworkingsailor Posted April 24, 2013 Share #360 Posted April 24, 2013 Robbyn, that's the same type of cradle I've been using under my build. It does make things a little bouncy... but it's great for protecting the copper tiles from damage after they've been installed. Just make sure to do what I did, and put two layers of paper towel between the ship and cradle. Something I've always been on the lookout for since I've been collecting brass model trains.. if metal like brass, or copper is left too long in contact with soft foam... for whatever chemical reason the foam will disintegrate and melt to the metal (maybe TMC would be able to explain the process). Model train collectors call it "red foam disease" since certain model companies used red foam in their boxes (of course I've seen green and blue and black foam as well). I'm talking of course, over a period of years for the foam to degrade, but I like to play safe nonetheless.. And trust me.. it is ugly nasty to see... there's no natural effect that this could simulate Andy Quote Quando Omni Flunkus, Moritati Current Build: USF Confederacy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.