US Brig SYREN 1803 by Justin P. - Model Shipways - Scale 1:64

[Chuck]

Just sand it flush inboard instead.  Thats the way to go.

[glbarlow]

1 hour ago, Justin P. said:

I see in your build log that your rail runs flush with the inner bulwarks, perhaps I can sand it back beyond and add a thin piece in the same way the outer molding is installed..

Yes, the design of Cheerful is as you note. The cap rail is finished flush with the bulwarks. I wasn’t sure when I first read this in the monograph, but it looks good and Chuck notes it’s also accurate, at least for Cheerful. And yes the moulding strip was added only to the outer edge. It’s a much more scaled look I think. 
 

It worked for me, I hope it does for you too should you go this route. If it doesn’t I was never here🤣

[Justin P.]

Ok, so sanding out the inner bulwarks was the way to go.   I don't know quite what I was thinking with ripping everything out, though I was a bit saddened as the result till now was pretty good...   

 

 

I spent a couple hours this afternoon working on it, and I think with a few more hours finishing everything again and cleaning up it will be ok.   Very happy with that outcome, thanks again to @Chuck and @glbarlow for saving the day with their very practical fix.  

 

For anyone in a similar predicament, here is how I tackled it:

 

Set my compass to just under 1/4" and take a line off the outer edge of the molding and began sanding with a low grit paper mounted to a sleigh shaped block:

I was able to remove quite a bit of material very quickly this way while the shape of my block slide over the gunport with relative ease.

 

You can see the progress here:

Now Im playing with the idea of recovering my overhang with a very thin strip brought through a half-dome scraper.    The width now is 1/32" over 1/4" and that includes the outer molding...

 

 

 

Edited November 30, 2020 by Justin P.

[WalrusGuy]

Great fix!! Looks much better.. Glad you didn't have to rip out the planking. Also this made me question my cap rail and saw its around 0.25". Btw mine doesnt overhang inboard except for a bit at the bow. 

Edited November 30, 2020 by WalrusGuy

[glbarlow]

Looks good, glad you sorted it out.  Chuck had a good point, do the scale conversion and see if the scale width your contemplating seems reasonable at full size.

Edited December 1, 2020 by glbarlow

[BobG]

Nice fix, Justin. It looks so much better now. Every build I've done required some fixes along the way. It was frustrating for me at first and now I know it just part of the process for me. I'm sure I'll never complete a build without some fixes and redos along the way.

[Overworked724]

Looks stellar, Justin!

[Justin P.]

Phew, almost month since my last update.   Apologies to those friends whose own build logs Ive not caught up on but who take the time to check in on my own.  Ive been keeping my head down lately just trying to recover from this last debacle, trying to manage family during a COVID Christmas and making time for some paid work as well.  I hope to catch up on everyone's builds soon!

 

Correcting the error in my bulwarks has taken a lot more time than I initially thought.   Sanding the thickness down inboard resulted in some very think inboard planking as was expected, what I didn't anticipate was that as I started to repaint the moisture would cause some expansion of those thinned planks.  The result was a very cockled look and not at all acceptable.   What transpired since first starting this correction has been a long sequence of filling, sanding, repairing, painting, etc, etc, etc...    it has taken a long time to get where I I could progress forward again.    After all was said and done, I came out a good 1/8" or more narrower at the caprail.

After the endless cleanup, touching-up and checking and rechecking I finally decided it was ok to lay in the decking which I completed with the supplied basswood strip stained with a diluted Golden Oak to give it a distinctly lighter tone than the outer hull planking.   I made a mini mistake in the shift pattern, but I don't think anyone will catch it unless they are looking for it.   

After installing the waterways I then moved on to exterior hull details.   The first thing I tackled were the sweep ports which went well.   I used the supplied brass bits, blackened in the usual way and later added the wire hinges (not pictured).  

Im currently thinking about copper plates and the badge as I wait for some items in the mail that may make some or all of that process a bit easier.   Until then Ive been working on the side badges.  Ill be *trying* the layered cake approach used by others to reconstruct these.

 

The first thing I did was laminate some quarter inch basswood to meet the required dimensions for making two sides of the middle or window portion.  Seen below is a relative comparison, I cut two pieces per side to account for error.  

Once roughly laid out I could set the gauge on the Byrnes to roughly 75 degrees and cut my 1/4" high window section.  

This gives me the appropriate sweep to carve by.   

Im not sure how the rest of this will go, but I feel good about progress so far and will update as I move ahead.   

 

 

Edited December 28, 2020 by Justin P.

[WalrusGuy]

Awesome progress! I'm so glad you were able to fix the thickness issue. Also your decking looks superb! And nice start to the quarter badges. They require a lot of work but is very well worth the effort! 

[Overworked724]

Great work!  Deck looks marvelous. Interested to see how you attack the badges. I’ve been fussing with that idea as well. (Told you you would pass me!!! 🤣)

[Overworked724]

I’m just amazed at how beautiful your paint job is...I’m simply awful at painting and it’s something I approach with sincere dread. But your finish (clean and polished without being glossy) is truly crisp. 
 

May I ask what paints you were using as well as your technique?

 

 

Edited December 28, 2020 by Overworked724

[Justin P.]

19 minutes ago, Overworked724 said:

May I ask what paints you were using as well as your technique?

Hey I appreciate the compliment, but must admit that I use a combination of suggestions and methods I've gathered from correspondence with @Gahm, and through reading tutorials and build logs of @Chuck.  One thing I have experimented with this time around has been the use of sanding sealer.   After sanding thoroughly smooth, I apply the sanding sealer and sand back to smooth (it will raise the grain of the wood).   This has the benefit of sealing the wood so it wont expand or absorb the moisture from the paint.  Without it I was always battling the wood grain raising and fibers popping up.   With the sealer the finish or "smoothness" of the fine finish sanding is preserved.   

 

For paint I use the Model Shipways, heavily diluted with water and apply many, many layers.   After each layer dries I sand it with 1000+ sand paper.   Essentially, I paint and then sand about half of it off and then paint again so on and so forth...   eventually the color becomes saturated without being bulky or looking plastic (i.e glossy).   

[abelson]

Nice, clean work on the deck and bulwarks. Looking good!

[Gahm]

In can only agree, beautiful job all around!

 

Thomas

[Justin P.]

Badges Part II:

 

Still plucking away, not sure exactly how these will turn out.  It feels mostly like an experiment at this point.   I don't love the results, but I don't hate them either...   

 

 

[Overworked724]

3 hours ago, Justin P. said:

I don't love the results, but I don't hate them either...   

 

...I feel the same way about my recent paint job!  But your badges are looking pretty darned good.  How do you make the small white frames?

[BobG]

Absolutely beautiful, Justin!

[Justin P.]

Ive abandoned by quarter badge project for the time being as Im able to return to the next steps per kit instructions.   I really was not happy with the color, look or process of creating copper plates per the supplied materials and so opted to outsource.  I went with Amati 1:64 scale copper plates which have the same nailing pattern and come pre-made, they also have a matte finish which appeals to me more than the bright polish of the kit provided option.   I picked up two packages from Age of Sail, which come with a sheet of plates for port and starboard each.  They do not have the self-stick backing, but are nice quality and I don't mind individually adhering them despite the time it takes.   They are only slightly different dimensions overall.  Normally I would prefer to find a DIY solution, but I think there will always be a few components I don't mind shelling out for: blocks/ropes/cannon among them.  

Ive spend a solid 8 hours working on the coppering and have gotten about 1/3-1/2 way on the port side only.  Its slow going, but nice to see it come together.  Im happy with the choice. 

 

 

 

 

 

[WalrusGuy]

The copper plating looks great!! Which adhesive did you use to stick the plates and how were they aligned? It looks perfect 🙂

[Overworked724]

Agreed - those plates look awesome.  Same question - how are you adhering these to the ship?

[Justin P.]

Thanks fellas.   I wish I could take credit for them, ha!    I agree they look pretty good and am happy I made the investment. 

 

7 hours ago, WalrusGuy said:

how were they aligned?

Aligned?   Im not sure what you mean -  Im aligning them using the overlapping method described in the instructions and mostly by eye.   Following the pattern suggested in the diagrams provided.    I'll likely need to make some accommodation for the curvature of the hull, but Im not there yet.  

 

37 minutes ago, Overworked724 said:

how are you adhering these to the ship?

Medium CA applied with a micro applicator.    Holds very well.   

[BobG]

Looks awesome, Justin! She's going to be a real showpiece.

[Justin P.]

4 hours ago, BobG said:

She's going to be a real showpiece.

Ha!   Thanks for the kind words Bob, at this point I just hope she comes out able to be shown at all!

[abelson]

Looking good!

[Justin P.]

Coppering is 98% done.   

 

I still have the rudder to deal with and another few wipe-downs with ethanol but Im happy with it.   I learned a lot in the process, and will definitely tackle it differently next time.  Not pictured is the finishes and stained false keel and drilled post holes for mounting.

 

Edited January 12, 2021 by Justin P.

[Gahm]

Your coppering is really beautiful! Well done!

 

Thomas

[georgeband]

Justin,

 

Your copper plates are very impressive and add to the model. I am sure that they transform the impression she gives.

 

I have a set of the Amati plates to use on a Ballahoo schooner (modified Caldercraft kit) and do not have any drawings for how they flow and align with each other. My concern is about how I should handle the stealers: near the bow I will probably taper some of the plates and at the stern I will probably fit in a few triangular pieces. The alternative is to change their angles a little, equivalent to bending a plank across its width. How did you deal with these issues? I would love to see a few close up photos of the bow and stern.

 

Regards,

George

[Axo938]

I wonder if anyone would know how close to scale those copper plates would be for a model shipways constitution. I really like the look of those over the copper tape.

 

[glbarlow]

After Vanguard I really learned to hate coppering and vowed never to do it again. However you’ve done a really nice job of it. 
 

I’m very impressed with your painting, it’s something I pride myself on doing. Sadly I don’t have your patience to paint so many coats though I do thin mine a lot. The sanding sealer, or I should say your use of it, really turned out a great result. 

[Justin P.]

23 hours ago, georgeband said:

I have a set of the Amati plates to use on a Ballahoo schooner (modified Caldercraft kit) and do not have any drawings for how they flow and align with each other. My concern is about how I should handle the stealers: near the bow I will probably taper some of the plates and at the stern I will probably fit in a few triangular pieces. The alternative is to change their angles a little, equivalent to bending a plank across its width. How did you deal with these issues? I would love to see a few close up photos of the bow and stern.

George - Thanks. 

 

I think much depends on the curves of your hull.   For SYREN, I haven't needed any stealers or to cut any of the plates to triangles.   The overlapping of the plates allows one to make gradual adjustments so that they sweep up towards the bow naturally.   At the stern, the curvature of the hull is relatively straight and thus the plates simply run aft without much deviation.   If you decide to butt plates edge to edge, which I believe would be an inaccurate representation (I am no expert), then you would need to be more calculated with your pattern and would require the use of stealers to make the curves (much like with planking).  

 

22 hours ago, Axo938 said:

I wonder if anyone would know how close to scale those copper plates would be for a model shipways constitution. I really like the look of those over the copper tape.

Axo,   I think you just have to compare what your kit is calling for against what Amati has available.   You could even cut them down a bit if needed.  I think they offer 1:72, and 1:64 scale plate options.     I went with these because they were the only ones with scale nailing patterns and the same pattern stipulated by the plans.  

Edited January 16, 2021 by Justin P.