Stealers

[Sheerline]

Hello again! I have started second planking but am undecided how to proceed beyond this point.

Photos show that midships I need 10 more planks @5mm or a fraction less. At the stern post I have 70mm to fill. I'm minded to put in four stealers, probably half stealers so I don't cut into two adjacent planks.

These would be quite short not going much further than frame 13 as marked. The only alternative I can see is to narrow the planks at midships and fan them out towards the stern to gain width. I would need to get more material to do this.

I've already got one stealer above the garboard ( which I should have thickened) so I would have a total of 5 stealers at the stern. I would really like just to varnish finish otherwise wouldn't be asking. Is five stealers too many? Would it be better to buy sheet and spile them or would that make them look a bit wide compared to the rest? All opinion valued!

😀

[allanyed]

Sheer,

Your planking looks really good so far.   You can indeed use stealers, but five does indeed seem like too many.  Spiling would be the best solution for fitting the planks properly but your call on which way to go.    Are you beveling the edges of each plank enough?  There seems to be slight gap between strakes where there is a hard curve.   ( I realize photos show up EVERYTHING that do not necessarily jump out when viewing our work live.)     Sketch is attached to show what I mean about the bevel.                           Allan 

 

 

[druxey]

Do also read one of the planking tutorials on this site. It will help you get this planking business in perspective!

[mtaylor]

I was going to post what Druxey said.   It looks like at your bow end, the planks are too wide.   A tutorial will help you.

[Sheerline]

14 hours ago, allanyed said:

Sheer,

Your planking looks really good so far.   You can indeed use stealers, but five does indeed seem like too many.  Spiling would be the best solution for fitting the planks properly but your call on which way to go.    Are you beveling the edges of each plank enough?  There seems to be slight gap between strakes where there is a hard curve.   ( I realize photos show up EVERYTHING that do not necessarily jump out when viewing our work live.)     Sketch is attached to show what I mean about the bevel.                           Allan 

 

 

Thanks Allan. Think I might knock up some thin card templates and check out the spiling  route before ordering sheet. I have been bevelling as things are pretty tight elsewhere.

Think I tried to force over the planks too much at the turn and maybe it's sprung back. I know I had to fiddle these and carve out a bit here and there to ease them in. Learning as I go basically! Time to step back and reappraise . 😀 Chris. 

 

[Sheerline]

13 hours ago, druxey said:

Do also read one of the planking tutorials on this site. It will help you get this planking business in perspective!

Thanks Druxey. I've checked them out and printed hard copy.

Hopefully I can salvage things and make it look more realistic rather than representative. No experience is wasted I guess! 😀 Chris

[Sheerline]

27 minutes ago, mtaylor said:

I was going to post what Druxey said.   It looks like at your bow end, the planks are too wide.   A tutorial will help you.

Thank you for reply. Certainly at the keel/prow the two planks look a little wide.

Wale/prow downwards they're 3mm so far - approaching minimums.

I'll be reappraising the layout when I've visited the tutorials  but anticipate some carving of sheet along the way!  It would be so easy to fit stealers but I hope to improve the appearance. My first build so lots of exponential learning along the way! Thank you all again.😀👍

Chris

[allanyed]

Sheerline, the planking for your first build is really quite good.   

Study the tutorials and it will get even better!    You get to spiling planks and pretty soon you may step over to the dark side of scratch building in the not too distant future!

Allan

[Sheerline]

1 hour ago, allanyed said:

Sheerline, the planking for your first build is really quite good.   

Study the tutorials and it will get even better!    You get to spiling planks and pretty soon you may step over to the dark side of scratch building in the not too distant future!

Allan

Thank you Allan! The dark side would indeed be an adventure.

I do admire those plank on frame models with such exquisite detail.

I'm a little way off lifting and lofting yet though!  For the moment the forests are safe..😀

 

[Sheerline]

1 hour ago, SpyGlass said:

If it really is a first build its VERY good !

 Spiling I would suggest is the best route - wider strip may be quite hard to take smoothly round the curve there

 The advice on chamfering the plank edges is really a very good point - normally is best  in practice to only chamfer one side of each strip which leaves one clean edge each row.

Can I proffer a bit of heretical comment. - Its underneath the vessel - no one but you will notice which way you do it !!!

Thank you Spyglass! I'm taking a breather and looking at things afresh. I tend to gather all info and funnel it in to best practice that works for me so this site is invaluable. Time was I could fettle metal to within a few tenths but wood is my Achilles heel!

I couldn't sleep at night if I knew  what lurked under the waterline wasn't ship shape! Lol.

Please check out my build log for future developments.

My thanks to everyone for their input and support.😀

 

[druxey]

You have a great attitude! Part of the problem you have is that the hull form is a very full one with round bow. This is the most tricky shape to cover neatly, but it can be done. As you've discovered, there's lots of advice available here.

[Gregory]

On 8/19/2020 at 8:16 PM, Sheerline said:

Would it be better to buy sheet and spile them or would that make them look a bit wide compared to the rest?

Very nice work so far!

Spiling might be something to consider at this point if you feel up to it.. 

Have you looked at Chuck's bending techniques? 

For the stern just a small increase in width at the stern post for most of the planks is hardly noticeable, as seen here for Chuck's Cheerful. It would only require slightly wider strips, tapered from the stern forward to midship.

 For the bow, you might consider a drop plank.  There is only one on Cheerful.

 

Whatever you decide, it will be good experience for you.

 

 

[Sheerline]

3 hours ago, Gregory said:

Very nice work so far!

Spiling might be something to consider at this point if you feel up to it.. 

Have you looked at Chuck's bending techniques? 

For the stern just a small increase in width at the stern post for most of the planks is hardly noticeable, as seen here for Chuck's Cheerful. It would only require slightly wider strips, tapered from the stern forward to midship.

 For the bow, you might consider a drop plank.  There is only one on Cheerful.

 

Whatever you decide, it will be good experience for you.

 

 

Thanks Gregory! I'm on it, cutting out a cardboard template at this time. Think it's going to need sharp blades and fine sandpaper when it comes to wood.

Just now I had the thought of making a thin aluminium template for cutting the rest, leaving them a little wide for adjusting. I've worked out I'll need 12 X 6mm each side so it might help some. 🤔 I did use the edge bending for some of the planks at the fwd end but some feathered up and split even after a long soaking. They're only one mil thick and a bit cross grain. This kit is nearly 30 years old ! I occasionally get teased with the fact that it only took five years to build the real one!😂Thanks again..

 

[Sheerline]

3 hours ago, SpyGlass said:

Oh dear I spoke heresy to a puritan !!  I  make sooo many mistakes and my sleep is not at all troubled !

 

Haha! 😂 Think my forbears must have sailed on the Mayflower!

I'm 'cool' now having looked at the options and you've all been extremely helpful . Thank you.

[glbarlow]

I’m a ardent fan of Chuck’s plank bending approach, I try to describe it in some detail in my Finished Lady Nelson And underway Cheerful logs, linked in my signature below.

I see you have tick marks already so I’m sure you know the planks likely need to be tapered for the same number to fit at the bow as fit at the waist.

 

It being a kit it’s hard to understand why there is such a big gap at the stern for the same number of of planks as at the waist, but the bottom line is you have to fill the space. Here again the tick marks should show you the width needed. If it takes 5 it takes 5, just don’t put them all together. Did you have the same issue with the first planking?

[Chuck Seiler]

7 hours ago, Sheerline said:

I do admire those plank on frame models with such exquisite detail.

Very often, admiralty style models are not planked below th wale, except maybe the garboard strake.  'They' say it is to reveal the interior of the model.  That's their story and they are sticking to it.  I think it is because they didn't like spiling.  😄

[allanyed]

THAT is the funniest thing I have heard in a few days.  You should post it in Them Old Jokes in the Shore Leave forum here.

Allan

[Chuck Seiler]

1 hour ago, glbarlow said:

I’m a ardent fan of Chuck’s plank bending approach

I have had some success with edge bending.  One problem I see is that you appear to be using walnut as your outer planking.  I have found this to be brittle and hard to edge bend.  Too late now in the process to change, but consider another wood for exterior planking in future models.  PLenty of wood discussions on that topic.

 

Good luck. 

[glbarlow]

30 minutes ago, Chuck Seiler said:

One problem I see is that you appear to be using walnut as your outer planking. 

Are you replying to me or to Sheerline?  I'm using Alaskan Yellow Cedar on Cheerful.  I was also successful using this technique on Lady Nelson using the kit supplied walnut though I agree a kit with brittle wood of any type might find it difficult.

[Chuck Seiler]

Glenn,

 

    Good question.  I was quoting your post but was recommending to Sheerline. 

 

    I prefer boxwood, but who can afford/obtain that anymore, eh?  I have had some success with beech, but Alaskan Yellow Cedar is my new go-to.

[glbarlow]

11 minutes ago, Chuck Seiler said:

I prefer boxwood, but who can afford/obtain that anymore, eh?  I have had some success with beech, but Alaskan Yellow Cedar is my new go-to.

I'd be happy to buy boxwood, but I can not find it anywhere (except in my Shipwright version of Flirt). I really like the yellow cedar.

 

 

[Sheerline]

1 hour ago, Chuck Seiler said:

I have had some success with edge bending.  One problem I see is that you appear to be using walnut as your outer planking.  I have found this to be brittle and hard to edge bend.  Too late now in the process to change, but consider another wood for exterior planking in future models.  PLenty of wood discussions on that topic.

 

Good luck. 

Thanks Chuck. Well under way now so no turning back for me.

The wood did get a bit feathery but stuck down in the end. I hand scraped the planks with a razor and things have blended in well. I'm hoping varnish will seal it well.

Never thought of alternative woods, this stuff is only 1mm. thick and tends to give suddenly just when I think I've got the better of it.

I'll take a look at other types should I live long enough to do another build!  😂 Meanwhile I've started to make a spiling template so hopefully that will help providing I can get matching sheet wood.👍

[Sheerline]

1 hour ago, Chuck Seiler said:

Very often, admiralty style models are not planked below th wale, except maybe the garboard strake.  'They' say it is to reveal the interior of the model.  That's their story and they are sticking to it.  I think it is because they didn't like spiling.  😄

Made I laugh that did Master! 😂