Bismarck by rvchima - FINISHED - Amati - Scale 1:200 - WWII German Battleship

[rvchima]

5 hours ago, hof00 said:

Hi Chap,

Your Anti-Roll thingies are called "Bilge Keels."

 

Looking good!

Thank you! I've heard that term before but couldn't dredge it up.

[hof00]

Hi Rod,

Just thought that I'd mention the pre-drilled holes for Grab Rails on the Stern Port hole etch pieces, I thought that this was a great addition to the kit. (Mine is pretty old.... 🙂) I got paper templates and a  bunch of measurements of where \to place them.

 

A question for you, do your Deck veneers come in sections and is there a 1.0 - 2.0mm space between the edge of the false Deck and the Veneers or are the veneers flush with the edge of the False Deck?

 

Cheers....HOF. (Harry)

Edited December 10, 2021 by hof00

[ted99]

Concur completely with your comments on the difficulty in blending the second planking to the ply/PE combo and the poly pieces.  Just as you, I had to use some filler on the poly at the bow.  In hindsight, trial fitting at the first planking stage and adjustment of the first planking thickness at that stage might have avoided this, but at the stage You (and I reached), it was too late.  Future builders beware!  I also think that the first layer of planking at the bow under the ply pieces should have more concavity sanded in to eliminate a "step" at the lower edge of the bow PE brass.  The bottom edge of the brass intersects with the second layer of planking at an angle, rather than a smooth curve.  Again, this doesn't really show up until you prime the hull, and then it's too late.

 

Rod--I like your color-coded belt armor picture.  If I decide to scribe in dummy joints (the belt armor was designed to be removable in the shipyard to repair battle damage and was not welded so as to minimize damage to one section translating to an adjacent section), it informs where the lower horizontal break line should be.

 

I'm currently painting the hull, but it's slow going because of my need to allow curing time before putting masking tape over fresh paint, plus waiting for weather to be suitable for my balcony paint "shop".  The gesso did a good job of filling all the "wood" artifacts such that it now looks like plastic.  The irony of going to all the work of making our wood hulls look like plastic is not lost on me.  One wonders if the "better" approach is to use one of the Trump plastic kits with Pontos super detail.  My next project will be the 1/200 Missouri with Pontos to try this out.  I think in a perfect world, I'd like to try a plastic hull with wooden/PE superstructure like the Amati kit.

 

Did you bevel the top edge of the belt armor?  Can't tell from the pictures of your model.  All of the pictures I have seen of the ship has the top of the belt armor at about a 45 deg angle down.

[pietkm]

Hello Rod;

Following your build with interest as I'm also building this kit. However while looking at your picture of the starboard

stern PE part I think you made a mistake there. Looks like you interchanged the SB and port PE and put it upside down.

It will give you problem in positioning parts later (gangway, outrigger) correctly. If you compare in the manual pictures #099

and #104 Amati also made a mistake here, #099 is the correct. It will not be easy correcting this, I realize, still I wanted 

to bring it to your attention, if you did not notice it yourself already.

Piet

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[rvchima]

Primer

So far I have used three full sheets of the laser-cut ply, built the hull, and sanded it until it looked like a piece of furniture. Time for primer.

[rvchima]

Every Project Gets One BIG Mistake

While I was waiting for the primer to dry I read this post by Piet:

23 hours ago, pietkm said:

Hello Rod;

Following your build with interest as I'm also building this kit. However while looking at your picture of the starboard

stern PE part I think you made a mistake there. Looks like you interchanged the SB and port PE and put it upside down.

It will give you problem in positioning parts later (gangway, outrigger) correctly. If you compare in the manual pictures #099

and #104 Amati also made a mistake here, #099 is the correct. It will not be easy correcting this, I realize, still I wanted 

to bring it to your attention, if you did not notice it yourself already.

Piet

Thank you for catching this Piet. You are absolutely correct -- I interchanged the stern porthole cutouts on the port and starboard sides. There are slight differences in the number of portholes that no one will notice, but to make matters worse I got the starboard side upside down.

 

Explanation

The area with the portholes has three layers: a layer of planks, a plywood layer with the portholes pre-cut, and a matching PE layer. The PE pieces have tiny eyebrows etched over the portholes, but when I lined them up with the ply, the eyebrows ended up between the layers and not on the outside. I overlooked that clue. In fact I got the bow wrong too, but that won't matter much. Here's the port side showing where the ladders go.

I did not realize that all the tiny holes are for ladder rungs. On the port side all the ladders point up. It will be OK.

 

On the starboard side the ladders point down. And so,

 

Deconstruction

 

The PE didn't get too mangled, so I should be able to flip that piece and butter it back into place.

 

Edited December 15, 2021 by rvchima

[yvesvidal]

Glad that you caught this mistake in time....

 

Yves

[rvchima]

2 hours ago, yvesvidal said:

Glad that you caught this mistake in time....

 

Yves

I guess time is relative. I wish that I'd caught it a long time ago.

[hof00]

Hi Rod,

Sorry to see you had some re-work there.... 😗 (Never a good thing....)

 

Looks like nice surgery and a nice save!!

 

(In hindsight, I have been lucky with paper templates for the Port Holes and even more paper templates for drilling/positioning the Ladder, (Grab Handles), Rungs....

 

All the Best and I'll be looking forward to seeing your completed Hull recovery/save.

 

Cheers and Regards,

 

Harry.

[rvchima]

More Deconstruction

I started to sand the primer on the hull and found that it came off in gooey globs that clogged my sandpaper quickly. That was after 24 hours of drying time.

 

I have had problems with Rustoleum products in the past.

Last September I posted problems with Rustoleum primer not sticking to the hull on my Marie Felling tug.

In 2016 I had problems with Rustoleum products on my Arleigh-Burke destroyer.

Kurtvd19 did not have good things to say about their products at that time.

 

Will I never learn?  I eventually gave up and stripped the primer off the Bismarck with mineral spirits. I am discarding all my Rustoleum products and will never use them again.

[yvesvidal]

Beautiful hull and very nice planking.

 

Yves

[mtaylor]

On 12/15/2021 at 2:23 PM, rvchima said:

 

 

Will I never learn?  I eventually gave up and stripped the primer off the Bismarck with mineral spirits. I am discarding all my Rustoleum products and will never use them again.

Wise choice.  We modelers can sometimes be a stubborn bunch.

[Old Collingwood]

52 minutes ago, mtaylor said:

Wise choice.  We modelers can sometimes be a stubborn bunch.

But we learn by our  practices....

 

OC.

[mikegr]

Ι  decided to make an easy approach while building the hull on my project. I quited the first made a second and still setting me back several weeks. The easy way turned to be the hardest one. There's no model building schools so we learn from our mistakes only.

Edited December 19, 2021 by mikegr

[rvchima]

Do your Models Rattle?

After I closed up the Bismarck hull for good I flipped it around on the bench and something rattled inside. It seems like that has happened on every model I've ever made. Now I know that no one will ever shake my models (they had better not!), but It bothers me to know that there is something unintended inside. Well, after removing the upside-down back corner of the Bismarck I gave the hull a good shake and out fell a glob of wood filler that had squeezed through the cracks. I feel much better now. Ever happen to you?

[rvchima]

I Can't Stand It

I decided to build the cradle while waiting for primer to dry. Amati's cradle is made of two end pieces joined by 8 small pieces stacked together like Lincoln Logs. The notches are cut a little large so everything is quite flimsy. I suppose this is another consequence of the original model being designed to fit inside a magazine.

 

I replaced the Lincoln Logs with two pieces of basswood, and put gussets in the corners just for fun. More elegant now.

 

However, I don't plan to use the cradle for the finished model. I have noticed that it is awkward to move a finished model on a cradle, so I have mounted most of my recent models on brass pedestals screwed through a wooden base into the hull. I've already placed an order for the pedestals.

[ted99]

Rod--I read your post on the Rust-oleum paints with great interest, as I had started using them.  My experience:

1.  There are two types of Rust-oleum primer  "Automotive" grade and their "new" stuff that I'll call "2X".  I had purchased both a while before I reached the painting stage, so I'm invested in finding out what works.  I've attached a picture of the two, plus a can each of the 2X red finish coat and a can of the 2X granite.  I've used the almost-black automotive grade primer on the hull bottom and I've used the 2X grey primer on the topsides which I then covered with the 2X satin granite grey top coat.  I haven't put the top coat on the "automotive" primer, yet, because of weather.  But, it sands just as you would wish it to do.  An earlier picture in my build log of the topsides of my hull showed the 2X granite grey top coat over the 2X grey primer.  I did not need to sand the 2X primer.  It felt like it was soft and had not cured completely a day after painting, but I went ahead and put the top coat over it.  The top coat cured hard and very smooth.

 

When I look at the cans, the "automotive" primer says "fast drying and sandable".  The 2X says nothing about being sandable, simply saying that it provides a tight bond for a top coat.  That's the way it worked for me.

 

At the same time I primed the topsides with the grey 2X primer, I used it for the aircraft hangers that I've built ahead in the instructions waiting for outside painting weather.  They have been sitting around for several days and the primer has hardened off in that time to a very smooth satin finish, which needs no sanding.  It has done just what I hoped it would do when I selected it over a grey automotive primer.  It has a very fine grain and does not fill in.  The attached close-up picture of those hangers shows that there has been no build-up or filling-in of the very narrow slots that Amati provided in the hanger sides and top to place PE brass pieces.  The slots are very narrow--PE width size.  In fact, the finish is so good that I will not use a top coat over it.  It's the perfect color and does not look at all like "primer".  The fewer paint coats, the better to avoid covering up PE details.

 

In short, I needed to pick my Rust-oleum product for it's intended purpose.  If I am going to sand it as part of the process of getting a smooth surface, use the automotive grade.  If I am satisfied with the substrate finish and what I want is maximum adhesion of a top coat, I'll use the 2X for it's very fine grade and smoothness, which does not need any sanding.  Note that I have been using white gesso brush-applied and sanded with #150 grit sandpaper to arrive at my desired painting substrate.  I have not been putting on coats of primer and sanding between coats.  I can brush on gesso in the house, rather than waiting for outside weather to be suitable for spray can painting.  Based on my experience, to date, I wouldn't be using the automotive grade primer at all since I don't need to sand my primer as part of the finishing process.  I really like the colors of the 2X Rust-oleum paints and their "fineness" which doesn't hide details, so I will be using the 2X primer going forward for it's intended purpose of providing a tight bond for the 2X top coat.  Except, I don't expect to be putting a top coat over the grey 2X primer I've painted the superstructure with.  So far, it looks perfect but there is always time to use the 2X granite top coat if necessary.

 

Topsides are done and I'm in the multi-step process of painting the waterline stripe and bottom, weather permitting, and I'll cover this in detail in my build log.

[rvchima]

On 12/9/2021 at 1:39 PM, hof00 said:

A question for you, do your Deck veneers come in sections and is there a 1.0 - 2.0mm space between the edge of the false Deck and the Veneers or are the veneers flush with the edge of the False Deck?

 

Cheers....HOF. (Harry)

 

I haven't unwrapped the deck veneers until now. The answer to your question is yes and no. In some places there is a space at the edge of the veneer as intended, but elsewhere the veneer is pretty close to the deck. I may have to trim it back a little, but not enough to lose the holes for the rail stanchions.

[rvchima]

On 12/10/2021 at 3:27 PM, ted99 said:

Did you bevel the top edge of the belt armor?  Can't tell from the pictures of your model.  All of the pictures I have seen of the ship has the top of the belt armor at about a 45 deg angle down.

 

I did not bevel the top of the armor belt at first. There is a cross section in Anatomy of the Ship that that clearly shows a bevel, so as long as I was refinishing the hull I sanded it in. You probably can't tell from this photo but it's there. It's probably to keep cigarettes from landing on the flat step :^/

[rvchima]

24 minutes ago, ted99 said:

Rod--I read your post on the Rust-oleum paints with great interest, as I had started using them.  My experience:

1.  There are two types of Rust-oleum primer  "Automotive" grade and their "new" stuff that I'll call "2X". 

etc.

Ted,

Thank you for posting your experiences with the Rustoleum products. They do have a good range of colors and are working well for you, so stick with them. I have used successfully them in the past, but have had enough bad experiences that I just don't want to mess with them again. It was the 2X primer that I had trouble with on the Bismarck and the earlier tug.

 

I am using Krylon paints now. They contain a long list of hazardous solvents so you probably shouldn't use them indoors. They are dry to the touch in 20 minutes and completely dry in an hour. Krylon does not have as wide a range of colors as Rustoleum, but I will be airbrushing most parts above deck with acrylics anyway.

[hof00]

Hi Rod,

Thank you for coming back to me.

One more question: How did the the Hull surgery go?

 

Cheers....HOF.

[rvchima]

On 12/20/2021 at 3:13 AM, hof00 said:

Hi Rod,

Thank you for coming back to me.

One more question: How did the the Hull surgery go?

 

Cheers....HOF.

Harry,

 

The patient survived and is doing fine 😷. I've since attached the prop shafts, ladders, and hull gratings. I wanted to get some primer on them before posting but my spray booth, AKA garage, is blocked by my son's car here for the holidays.

Rod

 

The ladder rungs were not fun to attach. Since my port and starboard pieces got swapped I had to drill a few new holes for miscellaneous eyelets that were in the wrong places.

 

Note to RC builders -- The shaft supports are flimsy plastic and are not drilled. You would probably have to drill the long support and remake the short support from stronger material. The plastic rudder shafts are long but there is no bearing for them.

 

The gratings popped in easily.

 

Edited December 24, 2021 by rvchima

[rvchima]

My neighborhood here in Asheville, NC  puts out about 900 luminaria on the three nights leading up to Christmas. The display is quite beautiful.

Happy Holidays to you all!

[hof00]

Hi Rod,

That Hull is looking awesome!!

A very nice save indeed....

 

Ps With my build, there are RC options discussed in the instructions. The Prop Shaft Housings are very different toi the plastic offerings with the static model and I think that you had to purchase these with the RC upgrade package.

 

Cheers....HOF.

[rvchima]

Aeronaut vs. Amati

About a year and a half ago I completed a 1/200 scale model of the Prinz Eugen light cruiser  by Aeronaut. They also make a 1/200 model of the Bismarck and several other German WWII ships. Now I am working on Amati's 1/200 model of the Bismarck and I thought it might be interesting to make a quick comparison between the manufacturers.

 

The Amati hull is built up plank on bulkhead, with some photo-etched (PE) brass pieces. It took over 100 hours to get to this much done. It would be challenging to install RC.

 

The Aeronaut hull is molded plastic. It took a few hours to get this much done and would be perfect for RC. I have seen the Aeronaut Bismarck kit for sale without all the accessories relatively cheap. I wonder if the Amati model would fit on the Aeronaut hull?

 

The Aeronaut Prinz Eugen superstructure is made of thick blocks with thin decks. Some eyelet portholes get added later. There is no PE included with the kit but I bought a PE kit made by Pontos for a 1/200 plastic Bismarck kit and used a lot of doors and other details on my model.

 

I am just getting started on the Amati Bismarck superstructure. This little section has about 30 pieces in it. It will get wrapped in PE later. I feel like it is unnecessarily complicated. Thick blocks would work just fine.

 

The Amati kit costs about 1.5 times what the Aeronaut kit did, but it will make up into a much nicer model.

[hof00]

Hi Rod,

Interesting comparison....

Yup, I agree,  the Amati offering does seem overcomplicated in ways.

I'm unsure if I'd be comfortable with large blocks for the Superstructure though....

 

Cheers....HOF.

[rvchima]

Color Schemes

I've never built a model where the colors were given exactly.  The Amati instructions specify RAL colors, a German color-matching system. I made up color charts for the hull using paints that I have used. For the grays I painted some samples, scanned them, then averaged the pixels and got the RGB colors using Photoshop. For the reds I used color swatches from the Krylon and Rustoleum web sites. Here's what I found.

 

Upper hull, RAL 7000. I had 4 kinds of gray paint and thought that surely one would work. Wrong. RAL 7000 is fairly light but has a lot of blue in it.

 

Lower  hull, RAL 8012, almost a brick color. I used Rustoleum Colonial Red on my Arleigh Burke, my Prinz Eugen, and even on a couple of stationary steam engines. I used Krylon Satin Brick on my Marie Felling. Ted99 is is using Rustoleum Claret Wine on his Bismarck. It is actually pretty close to RAL 8012.

 

I ended up ordering cans of acrylic spray RAL 7000 and RAL 8012 from LVP Paints. It was fairly expensive and the postage cost more than the paints, but it arrived quickly, sprays perfectly, and looks great.

 

Partially painted with temporary pedestal base.

 

I couldn't tolerate plastic props on a $700 model so I ordered brass Raboesch props from agesofsail.com, two left and one right. The props and rudders are not attached yet.

 

 

Masking for the white dazzle camouflage. Good thing I just had all that practice wrapping Christmas presents.

 

Hull painting completed save for some minor touch up. Back in its cradle for now.

[rvchima]

Superstructure  -- 150 hours, 76 days

While waiting for paint to dry I've been building parts of the superstructure. The construction technique is all new to me - complicated plywood frame and some plastic components, all skinned with photo-etched brass. The instructions are excellent and the brass parts are numbered almost sequentially on the sheets, making them easy to find.

 

 

It helps to secure the structure in a vise to keep from breaking off the delicate details. You can only bend a PE piece 3 times before it snaps. (Don't ask how I know.)

 

 

Amazing how the shiny brass is covered with fingerprints after just a few days.

 

[hof00]

Hi Rod,

Looking really good!!

You are certainly making some excellent progress there!!

 

Just something that comes to mind regarding the Forward Superstructure are the PE parts for the AA Platforms.

Unsure if this is addressed with your version is that once these are on, you will end up with a 0.38mm "Step" between the Deck and platforms.

 

In the Build Log by a Chap in the UK, (Incomplete), he solved this issue with a 0.38mm plastic card Deck on top of the ply Deck with cut outs to accommodate the AA Platforms.

 

As mentioned, unsure if this has been addressed with your kit but information only that may or may not be useful. 🙂

(I have ordered some 0.38 Plastic Card to address this for my build. (Also some 2.0mm square strip for another issue for a Mast exhaust thingy.)

 

Cheers....HOF.

 

Edited January 3, 2022 by hof00

[ted99]

Love the sharpness of your camo stripes--mine are a mess.