HMS Bellerophon 1786 by AON – scale 1:64 – 74-gun 3rd Rate Man of War - Arrogant-Class

[AON]

helm port, Helm Port, Helm Port, HELM port, HELM PORT, helm port, Helm Port, Helm Port, HELM port, HELM PORT, helm port, Helm Port, Helm Port, HELM port, HELM PORT, helm port, Helm Port, Helm Port, HELM port, HELM PORT  ( = rudder hole)

 

[garyshipwright]

Alan you forgot one, helmport. 😊😁😁😊. But it does make sense when you go looking up the term rudder hole which you can't find. Ok I go play with my toy boats now, in the bath tub 🤗

[AON]

As soon as Druxey corrected me I was brought back in my mind to grade school and the teacher assigning us homework to print the new words in our lesson book 50 times and she would check that it was in fact done the next morning.  I think I'm gonna need a bigger pencil.

[garyshipwright]

I remember those days accept we had to do it on a chalk board. Well I did get some play time in with my boats. 😊

[druxey]

Yeah, I'm picky that way!

[AON]

i SHOULD BE AS PICKY ALSO!

I will never forget helm port.

It is up there with capsize (at 12 years old while just having joined sea cadets,  one fellow answered 6-7/8" to the question : what does capsize mean)  

 

I've one last drawing for now.  The cat head and cat tail.  The contract gives some dimensions for the pieces.  Rees's plates offer some views of the items and shiver (sheave) size guide based on rope size. So does Falconer.  Steele's tables offers info on the rope size. One table suggests 5-1/2" (circumference) and another 6".  I've learned that at 1:64 scale the differences do not matter much.

 

[garyshipwright]

Thanks Alan, this may just come in handy. Gary

[SJSoane]

Alan, nice drawing! I will file that away as well.

Mark

[AON]

while I wait for the other eye to be done I decided to look at rope blocks.

 

I made an excel spreadsheet based on Steels' (and Rees') rule of thumb ratio.

It is below to download if you are interested.

 

The worksheet is "protected" meaning you can only enter the rope size (circumference) in the one yellow highlighted cell.  All others are locked.

If you want to fool around with the locked cells right pick on the labelled sheet tab (at the bottom) and a pop up menu will appear.  Pick UNPROTECT SHEET and it is ready.

 

Steel + Rees - block size calculator - rule of thumb ratio.xlsx

 

 

[AON]

Rope blocks are said to be sized for the size of the rope.

 

The size of the rope specified in Steel's / Rees's tables is the circumference and must be divided by the mathematical constant PI or π (3.1416).  So a 2-1/2" rope is actually closer to 3/4" diameter.  But, rope block sizes as listed is actually the length of the cheek (side) of the block from the head (top) to the **** (bottom).  So a 10 inch block would measure nearest 10 inches tall.

 

Steels (and Rees) provide ratio rule of thumb guide to calculating the dimensions of the various size of block shell and shiver (sheave) as determined by the size of rope (see my spreadsheet mentioned in the post above)

 

While working with my spreadsheet I'd noticed a discrepancy between the ratio rule of thumb and the rigging tables, and have been trying to understand why they differ.

The tables specify 10" and 9" blocks for 2-1/2" rope whereas the ratio suggests the length of the block should be 7-1/2" ( of rounded up to 8").  I've noted this same thing happening for other size blocks throughout the rigging tables.

 

I should also point out I am not the first to mention this, Mark, SJSloane mentioned this in his build of HMS Bellona.

 

After a day of searching and postulating I've noted the physical difference between 2-1/2" and 3" rope is quite minimal at about 0.8" and 0.9" diameter.  3-1/2" rope is 1.1" diameter..

So what might be called for via the "rule of thumb" for the carpenters to make blocks would not necessarily be what the Navy preferred.  Which is pretty well what Druxey suggested.  Then again, a rule of thumb is exactly that.

 

So, when the time comes, I will be using sizes as specified in the rigging tables, with dimensions meant to match the block size, not the rope size.

[AON]

I noted that a word in my post above was replaced with ****

the word is the actual term used to describe the bottom or tail end of the block

in my opinion it is not vulgar or inappropriate for this forum.  Much better than what a back splice was AKA, or a seaman's duffle bag was AKA.

so the word is

a

r

s

e

was that so bad?

[druxey]

I am shocked, shocked I tell you! I suppose that there is an algorithm that filters 'naughty' words indiscriminately on this site. Of course a**e is a legitimate nautical term.

[Dowmer]

Of course I knew what you meant Alan.  Silly algorithms......... 

Wonderful spreadsheet. Of course, as you make your blocks, if you can tell the difference from a 8" from a 9" block at 1/64 scale you are a better man than I. 😅

[AON]

You rare absolutely correct about the physical size difference at reduced scale.

I'm thinking there might simply be small, medium and large.

What they will be has yet to be decided.

I'm tallying up all the sizes today to see what there is.

[AON]

I've completed my spreadsheet tally of 879 blocks (standing and running rigging, less those in the boats) as at this time I believe I will include furled sails.

This includes what we normally think of a blocks, plus parrels, hearts and dead eyes.

My reference is Steels Rigging Tables for a 74 gun ship.

 

I've considered all sizes from 5" to 56" and the incremental differences at 1:64 scale. As it will likely be difficult to finish sanding a block shape to "exact scale" I believe I would group them so three consecutive sizes (5", 6" , 7") would be one size block (6") as the difference at 1:64 scale is extremely minimal.  I would aim for the middle in any one group and have made a note to remind me of this.  I just have to remember where the note is... or that there is a note!

 

This gives me 2 sizes of hearts (16" and 25") , 10 sizes of blocks (6", 9", 12", 15", 18", 21", 25", 28", 38" and 56") and 3 sizes of dead eyes (7-1/2", 11" and 17").

 

I go to get my other eye done this Friday, and three or four weeks later I will be able to go back down to my shop and get working on the square frames, and some blocks for the two yards I've made for the bowsprit and jib boom masts.

[bruce d]

Alan, good luck on Friday, looking forward to seeing all those frames and  blocks in a few weeks.

And helm ports.

 

[AON]

It is done and my vision is amazing.  Everything is so much brighter now.

I will likely need weak reading glasses and am presently using my shop safety glasses that have +1.5 magnification.

I was using the pair with +2.5 magnification the other day.

(Neither of these worked for me at all when my son gave them to me a year ago)

I am itching to get back in the shop, and the weather is not cooperating, it was sunny and warm yesterday.

It will be difficult to chose the basement over the outdoors in about 2 weeks when the doctor gives me the "all clear".

[druxey]

Glad all is well optically, Alan! Look forward to seeing further progress on your model soon.

[garyshipwright]

This is outstanding Alan and as druxey said look forward to seeing you getting back to working on her. 

[bruce d]

Good news, go get 'em!

[cog]

Glad to hear you can see again Will be waiting with anticipation on the most highly detailed process now you have an eagle's eye (actually two!)

[AON]

funny story... I was reluctant to go down to check when I had the first eye done as I was concerned I might not like what I saw.

You cannot imagine.

Once I got enough courage I walked in and braced for the worst.... I was very much surprised and relieved.

[mtaylor]

That's excellent news, Alan. Even better about what happened the first time you went into the shop.

[SJSoane]

Hi Alan,

Great news! Now you will always have that feeling when you look at one of your details blown up in high resolution photos!

 

Yes, I was also struck by the contrast between the precise rules for sizing blocks relative to rope diameters, only to see in Steel's tables that there is not a close correlation in many cases. They did seem to standardize on some basic block sizes, so as not to have to carry hundreds of different sized replacements. So why did they not say, "for circumferences from x to y, the sheave size is z". Who can I call about this.....😏

 

Mark

[AON]

My updated count of blocks is numbered at 1,323.

 

I've completed 16 models and template drawings to allow me to make them.  These are on regular "A" size or letter size paper (8-1/2" x 11").  Most are modeled in strips of 6 blocks with ample space between each to cut them from a sized strip of wood.

 

Sizing standard single, double, treble and four fold blocks was easy enough as Steels (and Rees) give the proportions.  Sizing the others meant finding the info.  With the help of this site I was directed to Steels' block making section of The Elements and Practise of Rigging and Seamanship, Vol. 1. In the section entitled the Practice of Block Making (  https://www.hnsa.org/manuals-documents/age-of-sail/the-elements-and-practice-of-rigging-and-seamanship/block-making-vol-i/  ).

 

 

The open heart size given in tables is the length or height of the wider side, the cheek.  The width of the cheek is approximately 3/4 x the height.  The breadth has a single or double groove into which the standing rigging rope or strop wraps about.  It is twice the size of the rope or three times the size of the doubled strop.  This means the outside lips or wall of the heart holding the rope or strops into the groove is half the size of the rope/strop.  I assume the thickness of the heart (outside to inside opening) is at least 1-1/2 x the rope size.  This means the cross sectional depth of wood excluding the groove would be at least equal to the rope size.  When I modelled it I sketched in five wrappings of the lanyard, checked where the outside wrapping fell and adjusted the thickness to suit.  The inside flat of the heart is said to have four or more grooves for the lanyard.  I put five in mine.

 

The closed heart size given in the table is once again the length or height of the heart.  The inside will have the same number of lanyard wrappings  as the matching  closed heart mentioned above.  The width of the heart (distance to the outside of the two legs) must locate the strop outside of whatever the open heart is spreading the strop to get around.  The two hearts for the forestay and fore preventer stay to the bowsprit are sized to allow the jib boom to pass through underneath it.  My jib boom measures 17" across the flats of the hex shape at its foot end. So the legs of my hearts are sized to drop the strops outside of 17" and the thickness is such that the top of the heart can accommodate 5 wraps of the lanyard.

 

The long tackle block is comprised of  two sheaves, one above the other. It's size is the length of the cheek.  Steels reads that it is 2/3rds longer than the proportion for a single block at one sheave to be 2/3rds less than the other, and made agreeable to the size of the rope.  So we look at the rope size and calculate the various dimensions at the larger top sheave.  The lower sheave is 2/3rds the diameter  of the upper but similar thickness as it is the same size rope reeving through it.

 

The snatch block is proportioned by the rope, leaving 2X the length for the score and lashing, tapered from the sheave to the lash end to 1/2 the breadth and thickness at the sheave. BUT... the viol or voyol block, which is a snatch block is 10X the thickness of the sheave hole which is 3/8ths more than the thickness of the sheave.  The thickness of the sheave is 1/10th more than the diameter of the viol (the rope), and the diameter of the sheave is 7X the thickness.  The breadth of the block is 8X the thickness, and the thickness to be 2/7ths of the length.  This was difficult to understand at first until I started with the two givens.  The rope size is 13.5" (= 4.3" diameter) and the block size (cheek length) is 57". Then I worked backwards:  the sheave thickness is 1/10th larger than the rope diameter (= 4-3/4"), the sheave hole thickness is 3/8" larger (= 5-1/8"); and the sheave diameter is 7X the sheave thickness (= 33"); the block thickness is 2/7X the length (= 16") and the block breadth is 8X the thickness of the sheave (= 34.4").

 

The dead eye size is the outside diameter, and they have a thickness 1" more than half their diameter.  Three holes are bored through the dead eye, sized for the lanyard,  in a triangular pattern, on a circle of 1/4 less than the diameter of the block (or 3/4X the diameter of the block).  I made my dead eyes a little thicker and adjusted my hole circle slightly so they might be easier to make.  The circumference is grooved to accept the stay rope.

Once done I realized this did not account for the gun rope blocks.  I found one article in the NRG magazine 1962 issue 12-1 (The Sizes of Gun Tackles and Breechings by Edwin Newell Rich) which gave the rope and block sizes for the various guns on the various sizes of RN warships.  I have both single and double  block sizes of 6-1/2", 8" and 10" for  2-1/2" and 2" gun, train, and gun port tackles.  My breech ropes are 6", 5" and 4" for the 32, 18 and 9 pound guns.

 

I received my "good to go" from the eye doctor, so I can get back to making my square frames now.

[druxey]

Your block shapes are great. However, the hearts should be rounded off more on the inner sides/edges.

[AON]

I suppose you are correct. 

If I ignore sketches in various books and look at Steels figure (curiously missing from Rees) or even the photos on the Syren website I see what you are describing.

I'm certain I can do better.

 

 

[garyshipwright]

Alan those are nice  and you may of been asked this before, are they hand made or CNC. Either way they are good looking.  If CNC what machine are you using, Still have it in the back of my mind about getting one. Thanks. Gary

[AON]

I am not certain how Syren make their blocks (and they do seem extremely good) in the above post, but mine in the further above post are 3D model images, made on the computer, from which I made 2D pattern drawings so I can hand make my own.

 

 

[garyshipwright]

Thanks Alan.