Viking longship by Cathead - Dusek - 1:35 - FINISHED

[Louie da fly]

Maybe these would be more up your alley. They're pre- Viking (mid 7th century), so not really appropriate to your build - the first is the British Museum's replica of the helmet found at Sutton Hoo in the U.K., the second is one of several found at Vendel in Sweden. I like the way the eyebrows form the wings of the dragon on the sutton Hoo helmet.         

 

 

 

 

[mbp521]

Eric,

 

Nice job on the figurehead, that’s one of the skills that I have not attempted yet is carving. Not sure that if I gave it a shot that it would resemble a dragon at all, probably look more like a worm. 
 

I’m with Louie on the eye. Protruding would most likely have a better effect. 
 

-Brian

[Louie da fly]

Brian, you never know till you try. From my own experience the first attempt would probably be pretty dreadful, but you learn from the first one and apply those lessons to the next attempt, and it turns out quite a bit better. Just don't try doing the Academician's dragon head as your first project!

[Cathead]

A bit more progress. First, I played around with various ways to make a tail at the stern. Lots of sources have coiled tails, but I was unable to replicate this with my tools and skill set. So after much frustration, I decided to come up with my own tail. I wanted it to be visually distinct, at least somewhat representative if not necessarily accurate, and able to be made from the same plywood as the keel so I could slot it in easily like the dragon's head. I finally hit on using the notched edge that mirrored one of the clinkered frames; I think it came out looking reasonably nice. Evocative, if not accurate.

 

 

I then moved on to the major step of removing the frames. As you may or may not recall, these need to be removed above deck level as the real vessel had no equivalent structures. I did not glue the planks to the frames above that level in order to ease this process. It was still rather hairy, as there was no good access for any kind of saw or tool. I tried a small Dremel motor tool with a cutoff blade, but was terrified of slicing the planking. I tried a small razor saw and a knife, but the plywood is hard and they really didn't have a good angle either and doing it that way kept putting stress on the hull (I've had enough problems already with planks separating from one another). Finally I tried a pair of shears, which came closest to a flush cut and didn't risk damaging the planking. Here's what the first rough cuts looked like in progress (rejected Dremel also shown):

 

 

For anyone making this in future, note that I cut away the top of the frames first, then the "ribs", as the top parts got in the way. Once all the frames were cut away, I used a sanding drum on the Dremel to finish lowering them to at or below deck level. This worked very nicely and was easier to control in terms of not damaging the planking. Here's what the cut-off and sanded frames look like:

 

 

The kit provides a thin pre-scribed false deck, shown in part above. I think it's ugly and it doesn't quite fit my hull anyway. Here are a few more shots of it:

 

 

From the beginning, my plan has been to discard this and install individual deck planking, as I think this will look a lot nicer. So that's the next major step to undertake.

 

Finally, I want to return to my intense frustration with the shape of the hull. As noted before, this was supposed to finish at a near vertical angle, but instead the planking bowed outward and finishes at a roughly 45 degree angle that is well below its intended head amidships, as shown below. Also, if you look in the background of the photo below, you can see that the kit's final frame (which is supposed to remain in place) doesn't come close to matching the natural curve of the planking. I finally stopped trying to force the last few planks to meet this frame, which made the final planking go easier but results in a rather awful looking gap between frame and planks.

 

 

In theory I could have avoided this by gluing the planking onto all the frames, but I didn't want to do that as it would have meant very delicate removal of the frames later on, including glue stains that would have been very difficult to get rid of. I thought that soaking and clamping the planks to the frame during gluing would have been enough, but clearly this hull has a mind of its own. If I did this again I might try it to see what happened, but the instructions were so poor that I had to make a judgement call on what to do and am now living with that choice.

 

I really don't know what to do about this. I could try to add one or more new strakes, but (a) I don't have any good material for that and (b) they would have to go through a rather abrupt change in angle from the previous plank to get even close to vertical. I could leave it as-is, but it'll look ridiculous with oar ports drilled in facing the sea at a 45 degree angle and the really low freeboard will be awkward as well (the rowing benches will be near the top of the planking amidships).

 

I've been thinking about installing oarlocks atop the final plank (rather than oar ports drilled in it) to at least raise the height of the oars, like those seen here and here. This is also because I don't like the idea of drilling 60 holes in this delicate model and having no way to fix something that goes wrong.

 

My current plan is to work on the deck and let the hull decisions fester for a while. I often come up with new ideas or solutions over time, and the deck work is independent of the rest.

 

Updates will continue to be intermittent. Real life is pretty hard right now, our time is being swamped by a complex and ever-worsening situation with my in-laws that I'm not going to get into online, but which is overwhelming our mental, emotional, and physical capacity to deal with other issues. Although hobbies can be healthy distractions, this project is anything but relaxing and I'm not finding a lot of time or motivation to work on it lately. Thanks for understanding.

 

[Louie da fly]

Hi, Eric. First let me say that you've done a very good job with cutting off the tops of the frames, and particularly that you've recorded how you did it for the information of others who follow.

 

Regarding the angle of the top strakes - I can't see a sensible way out. Whether it's because of your inexperience, or bad instructions/kit  I don't know. Probably a bit of both. But I agree - the best thing is to put that problem to one side for the moment and see if anything occurs to you. 

 

In the meantime, yes, go ahead with your deck planking to replace the ready-made stuff. That should be rewarding and interesting, and put you in a better frame of mind to perhaps come up up with a solution to the strakes. In the long run, that issue might end up being a case of putting it down to experience, but you'll at least have given it your best try.

 

Sorry to hear about the personal issues. I agree - the hobby is supposed to be a relaxation away from problems, so concentrate on the parts that are relaxing and enjoyable - you don't need the extra frustration in your "time out". But I'm sure you already know that. Take your time with the model. It's not a race. I hope things get better with time.

[mbp521]

Eric,

 

Sorry to hear of your woes both with the model and life. Here’s hoping that things get better on both fronts soon. 🥃
 

I do agree with your decision to go with individually planking the deck, personally I’ve never been a big fan of pre-scribed decks anyway. I do believe the results will be much more life-like and you’ll be more satisfied with the results. 
 

Although this type of boat is way out of my wheelhouse and I’m not real sure how the original ones were built, I do like your idea of building the oar locks. If you are going for more of personal preference and not authenticity, then go with what makes you happy. I think you have said before, this is not going in a museum, so as long as you can get the satisfaction of visitors viewing your work in awe, then go build it as you like. 
 

-Brian

[Cathead]

I have had a possibly crazy idea and I'm curious for input. I keep thinking about ways to add realism in other ways, to offset the problems. If the model looks neat enough, then it'll capture the essence if not the accuracy of the vessel. So my latest idea relates to the rivets that would have held the clinker planking together. On smaller models these could be simulated using a marker, but this is too big for that to work. So I made a testing jig of two plank scraps glued together and tried two different ways of drilling holes and inserting "rivets":

 

Version 1 is thin black wire, inserted and cut off with nippers. I didn't try to make these perfectly aligned, this is a test run:

 

Version 2 uses HO-scale model railroad spikes, which have a wider head, squarer head:

 

I like the spike because their protruding ends stay black, while the wire is shiny and would need to be painted or blackened. But the wire is probably more realistic in shape. Plus spikes are limited in number and wire is infinite.

 

My biggest concern is practicality. Even at a broad 1/2" spacing (wider than scale on the real thing) I'd need to do this over 700 times for each side, and I'd have to do it consistently enough to look good, through all the curves in the hull. I'd also have to do it without breaking the glue bonds between the planks, which are already weak. Ironically, this might actually help hold them together when finished if I used a drop of glue with each rivet, but getting there could be damaging. Plus, I'd have to align the hole through the planks to the other side, which would be especially difficult. It would look especially goofy to have a ragged line of holes/rivet ends on the inside that didn't follow the planking line, but I can't see how I'd keep it consistent through all the curves of the hull.

 

My leaning is that I don't have the skills to get this right, and it could turn out disastrously since once I start I can't stop and go back.   It would also take an extraordinary amount of time for a model that isn't that great overall. But the hull would look so much better with some kind of rivet pattern rather than just being smooth at this scale. Thoughts?

[bigpetr]

It is possible not to drill and glue rivets just on the surface. I do not know if it is usable for your scale, but i punch rivets from paper of appropriate thickness (for my 1:48 scale) and glue them on the surface. They can be painted easily before gluing.

[Balclutha75]

Hi Eric,

 

Nice progress you've made, in spite of the frustrations and issues.

 

In case it slipped your mind, here is killickthere's log entry where he discusses his 2,000 rivet solution using lace pins. Yet another option.

 

I'm wondering what I'll do at this stage, presuming I get this far in my Take Two attempt on my kit.

Edited November 1, 2020 by Balclutha75

[Cathead]

That's interesting, thanks! Pin heads do provide a better appearance. Still not sure I'm up for drilling those holes, but I suppose I could clip the heads off thousands of pins? I'll think about it.

[FriedClams]

Hey Eric,

 

Another way of adding rivets is to purchase injected molded rivets.  I use them quite often and have a selection of sizes.  Tichy Train Group manufactures them and they range in rivet head diameter from .02" to .08".  They are available with round or conical heads - $3.00 for a package of 96 or 200 rivets (depending on rivet size).   https://www.tichytraingroup.com/Shop/tabid/91/c/o_nbw-rivets/Default.aspx     The largest ones shown below are the .04" size.  Just another option.

 

 

Gary  

[Cathead]

I set aside the riveting question for now as too complicated (I appreciate all the input) and worked on something else that was easier to get my head around. I initially meant to start on the deck, but realized I needed to do some other interior hull detailing first so I could paint it and be sure not to drip on the finished deck. There are various reinforcing strips run along the inside of the hull at various levels. This collection of stock photos has some pretty good interior shots of the reconstruction.

 

The kit says to make these strips out of square stock, but none was supplied. I decided it would be hard to bend square stock to match the curve of the hull, so used two layers of flat stock left over from the deck planking of my last model. These bent really easily and could be layered up to the desired thickness. In the second photo below, you can see the lap joint between the two layers to show how this worked. One level serves to support the rowing benches, the other level is meant to stiffen the top of the planking.

 

 

 

Thinking about this gave me a very good idea for "solving" the 45-degree planking tilt problem. I built up two layers of strips along the upper edge of the final strake, then sanded it smooth and horizontal. The next step will be to build up one more solid layer on top of this that will be level on top and vertical along the side; with a bit of sanding I don't think the transition will be too noticeable. This might not make sense until I finish, but here's what the sanded top looks like:

 

 

The left side has been sanded smooth, the right has not. Can you see how the plank lies smooth and flat on the left, but rests on the angled edge on the right? The lower plank simulates a rowing bench (not to scale, just checking level and position). If you look closely at the image below of the modern reconstruction, you can see how the uppermost strake is actually a thicker square feature made of multiple pieces of wood (one down the middle, two more on either side). I'm going to try to mimic that to both raise the edge of the hull and bring it vertical and square. This will be clearer when I actually start doing it but I think I can get it right enough to improve the existing version. Look at the link above for more interior images that show this even more clearly.

 

 

You might also notice that I painted the hull a darker color (undiluted walnut stain) to simulate a more accurate appearance. I'm going to use pastels to further darken this once the model is near completion. I'm also going to paint one or more upper strakes a different color.

 

Next up, I'll work on raising those hull extensions and hope it turns out ok. Thanks for reading.

 

 

[Procyon74]

Hello Cathead. I think your viking ship build is an inspiration. In spite of all the difficulties you carry on, and carry on to very beautiful results. I also hope to someday build a viking ship. As a dane brought up with lots of stories and tales of Vikings it is something close to my heart. A few years ago a was strolling along the coast in Denmark, and suddenly the replica Havhingsten (Sea Stallion) of Glendalough appeared with full sail. That was an awesome sight. 

 

Apparently, the museum where the replica of Havhingsten was build has a model kit available in the shop. Som 12 hour build instruction video is also available from the supplier. https://tallshipmodelsnorway.no/ship-models-building-instructions/havhingsten-fra-glendalough/ 

These videos are just crazy - I don't understand how this is possible.

 

I will be following your progress on your ship with keen interest. 

 

Kind Regards

Lars

 

 

[Binho]

Good problem solving their Cathead! I think that's a good solution for straightening the sides. It's strange your kit didn't come with the square stock, mine had it. They must have just forgotten to pack it in to yours.

 

I'm always for color on these older ships. These were built by powerful lords to show off, so should look the part! The Heimskringla mentions gilding on the ships of King Sweyn of and King Harald Hardrada of Norway, which are contemporaneous with this ship.

[Cathead]

I've actually had a really productive morning and have Binho to thank for it. He posted a link in another log to this amazing high-resolution interactive walkaround of the Oseborg ship, which let me look at some interesting and important details that really helped get my head around a way forward. I noticed two really useful details: 

 

First, that ship has an abrupt change in planking angle between the lower strakes and the upper two; the latter turn sharply vertical and also don't blend into the stem but just into the lower planking. I wish I'd realized this a few weeks earlier, I might have been even more aggressive in "fixing" my wacky angled planking by just attaching a few more upright strakes rather than worrying about achieving a smooth curve all the way up. I'm not trying to reproduce Skuldelev 2, just making a representative Viking craft, so this would have worked. At the very least, it further justifies my smaller additions to the top of the model's planking. Here's what this looks like:

 

 

 

Second, the oar ports on that ship are really close to the gunwale, not further down in a lower strake as they are on Skuldelev 2. They're also not drilled in evenly, there's quite a bit of random variation in their height from the gunwale, which you can sort of see above (follow the link to see it better). This suggested to me that I could get away with drilling oar ports in my altered planking after all, saving the need to make 60 tiny thole pins.

 

In other words, since my planking ends at least a full strake's width lower than on the prototype, drilling oar ports in the right location by strake would make them way too low, which was one reason I considered doing thole pins on the gunwale instead. But the Oseborg way lets me put the oars back at roughly the correct height above the deck.

 

So I mulled over the geometry for a while and decided to go for it. First, I used a thin strip of wood to transfer the oar port spacing from the plans to the model:

 

 

I then used a square to transfer a few reference marks to the other side of the hull, then lined up the strip and transferred the rest of the marks:

 

 

I wanted to drill from the inside out, as I needed to follow a narrow gap between the top of the next plank below and the reinforcing strips I added previously. But I also wanted to minimize tear-out from the drill going through the outer plank. So I clamped a moderately thick strip of wood to the outer hull, leaving gaps for the drilling locations:

 

 

I started with smaller pilot holes, using my fingers to hold the plank really firmly to avoid weakening the thin glue joint with the next plank down:

 

 

Here's what the first rough drilling looked like from the outside:

 

 

Not too bad. I then used the full-sized drill bit to ream these out to the desired diameter, then did a bunch of sanding and filing to clean up the holes and the tearout.

 

Next I decided to add the angled slots some of these ships had, cut into the sides of the oar ports, to better allow oar blades to slide through. Skuldelev 2 didn't have these, but Oseborg did, and I think they add some nice character. On the latter, they angled upward and toward the stern. My smallest rectangular file wouldn't quite fit into the oar ports, so I used a tiny triangular file to make a notch in the port, which allowed the rectangular file to get in while also making a clear indentation for me to follow. You can see this process below; from right to left, round port, initial triangular notch, finished rectangular notch.

 

 

So I did all of this 30 times on the starboard side and am pretty pleased with the outcome:

 

 

 

There's some final cleanup to do, which may wait until after painting as that always requires a bit more fine sanding once the grain is raised again. But I like the look and this gets me past a major hump. Next I'll finish the gunwale (need to run strips along both sides) and do the oar ports on the port side. Writing this, I just realized I should have done the port side first as a test, since in theory the starboard side is a better display side (the steering oar is on that side). Oh well.

 

At least now I have a clear path forward for a little while, which feels really good.

 

[Louie da fly]

Nice work, Eric, and a good research-based save. I like your oarports. Very attractive.

[Binho]

Great solution Eric! Skuldelev 2 didn’t have its gunwale preserved, so we have no idea where the oarports actually were. The contemporary Skuldelev 5 has the oarports in the gunwale, and the contemporary Bayeux tapestry also shows oarports in the gunwale- so for all we know, your solution may be more accurate

[Cathead]

I think I've finished upgrading my hull. Both sides now have drilled and sanded oar ports:

 

There was more tearout than I expected when drilling, even using a backing plank, but it's mostly cosmetic and I don't think it will be visible when painted.

 

I didn't like the abrupt way the upper strake terminated against the stem and stern, so added something to blend them together. This matches the reconstruction, though for the life of me I can't find the photo I used for reference.

 

 

 

These give the hull's lines a more pleasing flow in my opinion. I made them from very thin stock, which I held against the hull to trace an outline, then carefully cut out with a sharp knife. Took a couple tries as they broke easily, but when the end result was glued in I carved and sanded them to blend into the existing wood. If you can't tell from the photo, the added pieces stop right at the V-shaped frames within the hull.

 

So here are a few more photos showing the hull at this stage. The raw wood helps you see what I've added. Next step is to paint these to blend them into the rest of the hull.

 

 

 

 

On a more personal note, a very difficult stretch of life has just concluded. My father-in-law passed away in mid-November. I was very close to him and his loss is felt keenly by all of us. Without going into unnecessary details, the past 9 months or so have been particularly difficult as we attempted to move him and my mother-in-law closer to us to help with care as he declined, and to help both of them manage, all with the pandemic making things far more difficult and risky. I wrote a remembrance for him that I hope you'll consider reading; he was a very diverse and interesting person (including an academic background in Old English) and I believe that one way we stay with our loved ones is to be known and remembered.

 

Thanksgiving occurring not long after his passing was especially difficult, but also especially meaningful, as we were able to host my mother-in-law at our farm for the first time in several years (they were very reluctant to leave home as his health worsened). We enjoyed a sunny, warm day taking walks in the woods, working in the garden, watching birds, and making good food, all things the four of us valued and we could do while remembering him. 

 

We fired up our wood oven and baked sourdough rolls and apple-cranberry bread, then grilled beef & onion kebabs over the coals. Mashed potatoes, cabbage & carrot slaw, apple-cranberry crisp, and homemade blackberry wine rounded out the meal. All the produce and some of the fruit came from our farm, the meat and most of the rest from nearby farms of friends.

 

 

My father-in-law's interest in the Anglo-Saxon period makes the current project all the more meaningful to me now. I think I've gotten past the worst of the kit and now have a fairly clear way forward toward what should be at least a reasonably attractive final model that will always connect me with his memory.

 

Edited November 27, 2020 by Cathead

[Cathead]

I spent Saturday morning making further progress. I settled on a simple red-yellow paint scheme for the upper strakes, following others' guidance that these were common and cheap colors in this era. I painted the whole upper part yellow first, then overlaid it with red.  I then did several rounds of touching-up where my brush slipped.

 

Once that was done, I used fine sandpaper to smooth and distress the hull, as I wanted a rougher texture than pure brown. The plywood used for the planking doesn't create a very realistic surface, so I wanted to at least imply the rough grain of weathered wood by using color to stand in for physical texture. I then rubbed the whole hull with dark grey pastel, using a cloth, to further darken and blend the surfaces together. I like my models to look dirty and used, as I feel this helps them seem more realistic at a model scale where shiny colors often appear wrong even if they're right.

 

Here's the resulting hull:

 

 

 

 

 

 

Next I'll be working on planking the deck. Thanks for sticking with me on this.

[joep4567]

your hull looks very realistic to me. All your efforts in overcoming problems seems to be paying off!

[Cathead]

One more update from a productive weekend. I got started laying the decking. On the real thing, this seemed to consist of cross-wise beams separating sets of short removable slats (to reach the ballast, for example); at least, that's what the reproduction does. You can see this here (can't embed as it's a stock photo with copyright).

 

The kit includes a really crappy paper-like insert with the decking scribed onto it. I knew from the beginning that I wasn't going to use it and planned to lay my own decking piece by piece. To do this, I used my Byrnes table saw to rip an old piece of molding left over in my workshop from an earlier kitchen remodel (I think it's maple) into thin planks, as it has a distinct and attractive grain.

 

I've been hand-cutting each piece to match the curve of the hull as best I can. I don't mind if they don't fit perfectly as I'm going for the look of a rough working warship built with axes, not a pristine British man of war. The fundamental goal here is to add more texture and life to the model than a "perfect" deck. I also hand-weather each piece with gray pastel to make it look faded and used. Here's what it looks like so far:

 

 

Left side is the decking completed so far, right side is the kit's version, and middle column shows work in progress. I cut a few filler planks first, use those to set and glue in the next divider, then finish cutting and carving the rest of the filler planks. So here you see the divider glued in but the fillers still being developed. You can also see the difference between the raw and weathered wood. My interior lighting makes this too orange in tone, the real shade is paler.

 

I think it's looking really good so far, this approach adds a lot of character and draws the eye away from the blander kit planking. It's a slow process and will take a while (there will be over 30 columns of planking), but it's steady work that I now have a reliable process for doing. Hope you like it, as there's no turning back now!

[Louie da fly]

Your build has always looked good, but your most recent efforts have raised it a further notch in quality. A very enjoyable build to watch.

 

Steven

[FriedClams]

Hey Eric,

 

I’m sorry to hear of your loss.  Loosing someone so close is always such a difficult time.  I wish you and your family peace.

 

Gary

[BobG]

I read the beautifully written tribute you wrote to your father-in-law. It is apparent that he had a truly full and meaningful life and your wonderful remembrance captured that for those of us who did not know him. My sincere condolences to you and your family on the loss of this remarkable man.

[mbp521]

Eric,

 

So sorry for your loss. What a beautiful dedication to him. It sounds as though he was a great man who lived a wonderful life and will be dearly missed. 
 

Your build is progressing very nicely, glad to see that you have been able to overcome all of the obstacles the build and life have thrown your way. 

Very nice job on the decking, much better results than the kit provided “scribed” planks. Definitely adds a touch of realism to it. 
 

Do you plan on repainting the hull, or are you going to leave it as it is currently. Personally I think the way it looks right now gives it a very nice “weathered” look as though it has seen many beaching and days along the docks. 

 

-Brian

[Cathead]

Thanks very much, folks. My FIL and I were not only close, but ludicrously similar (both Northerners who ended up as freelance editors on rural Southern homesteads with large gardens, both deeply interested in the full spread of natural science and human history, both married to strong, intelligent women who love the outdoors, etc.). We even shared some of the same faults, which he certainly had but which I won't go into here (nor the differences). But it was enough for a strong affinity, especially as I lost my own father in high school.

 

Brian, right now I like the hull as it is, but may reconsider a bit more weathering when I'm done with the internal details. I might want to blend the visual style together more when I see what I've done to the interior.

[mtaylor]

Well done on the model, Eric.

 

The tribute to your FIL was both moving and fitting.  Loss of someone close is a hard thing.  Thanks for sharing it.  

[Cathead]

More decking progress. I took paired photos in sun and shade as each highlights different aspects of the texture and color. Really pleased with how this is coming out:

 

 

This is a great task to just keep plugging away at in free moments. It's a lot of manual work but pretty straightforward now that I have my system perfected. Probably another week or two and it'll be done.

[Jim Lad]

Just catching up, Eric. She's really coming along very nicely.

 

John

[bigpetr]

It is looking nice Eric, it is absolutely worth the extra work.

 

Why deckplanks were not protected with tar? It was disposable and easily replaceable so no need to protect it? Kit instructions says to do it this way, but does anymone know why? Was it common practice at times or it is just for visual richnes of the model?