Dave_E Posted May 16, 2022 Author Share #301 Posted May 16, 2022 Hi All, Thought I’d be all excited about getting the shrouds back in place, but after I did… I’m scratching my head wondering how am I going to pull this off. Looking at the LN as she is, it’s like a catch 22. If I had proceeded with rigging with the shrouds and rat lines done and in place, getting to other parts of the rigging looked nay impossible. Now the rest of the rigging is done and I wondering how to do the rat lines. 😳 I see lots of logs where the standing rigging all gets done first. Is that the norm? Did I mess up completing all the rigging first? Looking at it where she lay, how bad is it? Seventynet, AJohnson, David Lester and 2 others 5 Quote Dave Current builds: Rattlesnake Completed builds: Lady Nelson On the shelf: NRG Half Hull Project, Various metal, plastic and paper models Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldsalt1950 Posted May 17, 2022 Share #302 Posted May 17, 2022 You made your job more difficult, but it can be done as is. Doing the ratlines now will take a lot of finesse, patience and time. You have weathered the storms before in this build, you can weather this one. Jim LyleK1, Dave_E and Keith Black 2 1 Quote Current Build: Fair American - Model Shipways Awaiting Parts - Rattlesnake On the Shelf - English Pinnace 18Th Century Longboat I stand firmly against piracy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Black Posted May 17, 2022 Share #303 Posted May 17, 2022 Rig a bosun's chair. LyleK1, Rick01, Dave_E and 1 other 1 3 Quote Current Builds: 1870's Sternwheeler, Lula Wood Hull Screw Frigate USS Tennessee Decorative Carrack Warship Restoration, the Amelia Completed: 1880s Floating Steam Donkey Pile Driver Early Swift 1805 Model Restoration Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick01 Posted May 17, 2022 Share #304 Posted May 17, 2022 As someone else has suggested - ground up, middle outwards and front to back. All standing rigging needs to be completed first (but after such items as booms etc), then the ratlines and finally running rigging. This is similar to actual practice, after all you re building a miniature ship. It will be a little awkward but not impossible. Rick Keith Black and Dave_E 2 Quote Completed builds:- HM Cutter Mermaid. HMS Endeavour's Longboat Topsail Schooner Enterprize Arab Dhow Sultan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave_E Posted May 17, 2022 Author Share #305 Posted May 17, 2022 Took the night off from rigging and worked on the swivel guns. These beauties were fabricated (in fact all the cannons on the ship) by Henrythestaffy who lives in Australia. There are many things wrong with this first build, but the cannons are not one of them! Thank you Paul! javajohn, Paul Le Wol, LyleK1 and 8 others 10 1 Quote Dave Current builds: Rattlesnake Completed builds: Lady Nelson On the shelf: NRG Half Hull Project, Various metal, plastic and paper models Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick01 Posted May 17, 2022 Share #306 Posted May 17, 2022 Are you going to add coils of rope where-ever you've ended any running rigging? Rick Keith Black 1 Quote Completed builds:- HM Cutter Mermaid. HMS Endeavour's Longboat Topsail Schooner Enterprize Arab Dhow Sultan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave_E Posted May 17, 2022 Author Share #307 Posted May 17, 2022 9 hours ago, Rick01 said: Are you going to add coils of rope where-ever you've ended any running rigging? Rick Hey Rick, Not sure, since It appears I didn’t do any rigging in the correct order. I might do more damage and have to rebuild than to just leave it if I were to attempt. The rat lines should be a minor nightmare. Depending on how that goes, I’ll consider it. This first build is turning out better than I hoped. I have learned where some of my natural talent works well and where I need to “learn” new technique. The 1:64 scale allows for lots of unseen techniques and errors… sometimes to our advantage. We’ll save that discussion for another day. 😁 Keith Black 1 Quote Dave Current builds: Rattlesnake Completed builds: Lady Nelson On the shelf: NRG Half Hull Project, Various metal, plastic and paper models Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregory Posted May 17, 2022 Share #308 Posted May 17, 2022 This is really a great build for a first kit.. You will have a much better feel for when to do what on your next.. Most importantly, do what works for you and don't get bogged down, worrying if you are doing it "right ".. The Gimps Chimp, LyleK1 and Keith Black 3 Quote “Indecision may or may not be my problem.” ― Jimmy Buffett Current builds: Rattlesnake On Hold: HMS Resolution ( AKA Ferrett ) In the Gallery: Yacht Mary, Gretel, French Cannon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave_E Posted May 17, 2022 Author Share #309 Posted May 17, 2022 24 minutes ago, Gregory said: This is really a great build for a first kit.. You will have a much better feel for when to do what on your next.. Most importantly, do what works for you and don't get bogged down, worrying if you are doing it "right ".. Thanks for those encouraging words Greg. There are some real artists on the site and they give everyone inspiration and levels of excellence to work toward, but you don’t get there overnight. 😊 I have a book full of the oop’s and notes to reflect on when I start the Rattlesnake later this summer. The Gimps Chimp, Gregory, Keith Black and 2 others 5 Quote Dave Current builds: Rattlesnake Completed builds: Lady Nelson On the shelf: NRG Half Hull Project, Various metal, plastic and paper models Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick01 Posted May 17, 2022 Share #310 Posted May 17, 2022 8 hours ago, Dave_E said: Depending on how that goes, I’ll consider it. At least make up a couple and give it a try. It just finishes off the rigging. It's basically a matter of making a coil of 6~8 loops round something like a thick pen, with 4~5 centimetres of line tucked under the loops. Tie it off to hold the loops together and use a little PVA glue to shape the rope into something resembling a natural fall. Once it's dried then, using the excess line hook it up onto the belaying pin, a little more PVA to position it and it's done. Fiddly I know but worth the effort. Different ship, but you get the idea. Rick Quimp Slattery, Dave_E, JGoff and 1 other 3 1 Quote Completed builds:- HM Cutter Mermaid. HMS Endeavour's Longboat Topsail Schooner Enterprize Arab Dhow Sultan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
javajohn Posted May 22, 2022 Share #311 Posted May 22, 2022 Hi Dave, I'll echo what others have said - you can add the ratlines after the running rigging is in place, even though it presents a bit more of a challenge. Ditto on adding coils after the fact. At this scale you won't see it. Think of each knot as a project. Once you get started, it will get easier as you go along and pretty soon you will wonder why you thought it would be impossible. Keith Black and Dave_E 2 Quote John Current Build: Rattlesnake (Model Shipways 1:64) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave_E Posted May 22, 2022 Author Share #312 Posted May 22, 2022 Good Sunday Morning Everyone, John, I just completed the port side ratlines last night. No photo just yet. I did everything I could right and wrong including what glue to use and used 3 different glues; CA, diluted wood PVA and polyurethane. I’ve got the knots down, but here to tell you, when you get up to the top of the shrouds and space becomes a premium, there is no way to tie the clove hitch… so I did what I could. 😊 It will take a few days and then I’ll post some photos. I am NOT using CA so don’t hammer me for it. I had used some on the port side, then found a thread about glueing ratlines and got that fired up. 😁Thanks for all your input and support guys! 👍😀 Oldsalt1950, Keith Black, Paul Le Wol and 1 other 4 Quote Dave Current builds: Rattlesnake Completed builds: Lady Nelson On the shelf: NRG Half Hull Project, Various metal, plastic and paper models Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Black Posted May 22, 2022 Share #313 Posted May 22, 2022 Dave, there are two discussions on MSW that are sure to divide the community, CA and Polyurethane. I use both in copious amounts. I use poly thread so I don't see a problem using CA to secure knots. I use Polyurethane to seal wood and painted surfaces. I'll be long dead before I regret having used either. Find what works for you and full speed ahead. The cries from the shore that you'll surly sink can only be heard if you stop sailing long enough to pay attention to them. Dave_E, bruce d and SUBaron 1 1 1 Quote Current Builds: 1870's Sternwheeler, Lula Wood Hull Screw Frigate USS Tennessee Decorative Carrack Warship Restoration, the Amelia Completed: 1880s Floating Steam Donkey Pile Driver Early Swift 1805 Model Restoration Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave_E Posted May 22, 2022 Author Share #314 Posted May 22, 2022 Good words to live by Keith. 👍😀 Keith Black 1 Quote Dave Current builds: Rattlesnake Completed builds: Lady Nelson On the shelf: NRG Half Hull Project, Various metal, plastic and paper models Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave_E Posted May 28, 2022 Author Share #315 Posted May 28, 2022 (edited) Hello Everyone, It’s Friday night and I just finished up the starboard side ratlines. First let me say… ratlines were a challenge on this first build, probably because I messed up the order of rigging. The starboard side turned out much better than the port as I learned the techniques and got better tweezers (wow what a difference they make). Lots of imperfections to be sure, but lots of learning took took place and I made notes for the Rattlesnake coming up. On to the anchors. 😀 Edited May 28, 2022 by Dave_E SUBaron, KirbysLunchBox, David Lester and 14 others 17 Quote Dave Current builds: Rattlesnake Completed builds: Lady Nelson On the shelf: NRG Half Hull Project, Various metal, plastic and paper models Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave_E Posted May 30, 2022 Author Share #316 Posted May 30, 2022 Port side anchor installed. I will be adding rope coils. Paul Le Wol, SUBaron, DanB and 5 others 8 Quote Dave Current builds: Rattlesnake Completed builds: Lady Nelson On the shelf: NRG Half Hull Project, Various metal, plastic and paper models Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldsalt1950 Posted May 31, 2022 Share #317 Posted May 31, 2022 Looking good Dave Dave_E and Keith Black 2 Quote Current Build: Fair American - Model Shipways Awaiting Parts - Rattlesnake On the Shelf - English Pinnace 18Th Century Longboat I stand firmly against piracy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregory Posted May 31, 2022 Share #318 Posted May 31, 2022 Very nice work. I envy how you have been able to progress the way you have in a relatively short period of time.. Dave_E and Keith Black 2 Quote “Indecision may or may not be my problem.” ― Jimmy Buffett Current builds: Rattlesnake On Hold: HMS Resolution ( AKA Ferrett ) In the Gallery: Yacht Mary, Gretel, French Cannon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allanyed Posted May 31, 2022 Share #319 Posted May 31, 2022 Well done Dave! One small comment, I really hope you don't mind. The hawser was secured to the ring with an inside clinch or similar knot, not seized so it was easy to remove. The sketch below is from page 129 of Lees' Masting and Rigging. This may be what you have, but it looks like it is seized in the photo. Allan Dave_E and Keith Black 2 Quote PLEASE take 30 SECONDS and sign up for the epic Nelson/Trafalgar project if you would like to see it made into a TV series. Click on http://trafalgar.tv There is no cost other than the 30 seconds of your time. THANK YOU Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave_E Posted May 31, 2022 Author Share #320 Posted May 31, 2022 Allan, I wish we would have connected 2 hours ago. I ended up with what I did after searching and looking at 4 different builds, all had something different. I have your reference on file for the Rattlesnake. 👍😀 Keith Black, Gregory and allanyed 3 Quote Dave Current builds: Rattlesnake Completed builds: Lady Nelson On the shelf: NRG Half Hull Project, Various metal, plastic and paper models Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave_E Posted May 31, 2022 Author Share #321 Posted May 31, 2022 11 minutes ago, Gregory said: Very nice work. I envy how you have been able to progress the way you have in a relatively short period of time.. Retired… it’s a holiday, lawn is wet, cloudy… good day to be in the boat yard. 😁 Quote Dave Current builds: Rattlesnake Completed builds: Lady Nelson On the shelf: NRG Half Hull Project, Various metal, plastic and paper models Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reggiemon Posted May 31, 2022 Share #322 Posted May 31, 2022 Your build is coming along very well. Sharp clean lines, tidy rope work, your getting there! 👍 Keith Black and Dave_E 2 Quote Building: 1/10 scale 1922 Alden Malabar ll R/C Finished: Rappahannock Boat Works Torpedo stern, steam launch. R/C 1/6 scale steam launch, Corel Flying Fish 1860 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DennisL Posted May 31, 2022 Share #323 Posted May 31, 2022 Nice work Dave. Excellent looking model! Dave_E and Keith Black 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BenD Posted May 31, 2022 Share #324 Posted May 31, 2022 That Anchor cable looks nice. 👍 Keith Black and Dave_E 2 Quote Ropes of Scale.com - Rope and cable for the scale modeler. Finished builds: HM Cutter Sherbourne - Caldercraft - 1:64 - 9th century longship - Falkonet - 1:72 Current builds: HMS Snake - Caldercraft - 1:64 - Tender Avos by BenD - Master Korabel - 1:72 - 19th Century Four-Oared Yawl by BenD - Falkonet - 1:24 scale Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glbarlow Posted May 31, 2022 Share #325 Posted May 31, 2022 You discovered tweezers during rigging the ratlines 😊. You can get those clove hitches at the top, but it is tight. You did a very nice job with them. Keith Black 1 Quote Regards, Glenn Current Build: Don't know yet. Completed Builds: HMS Winchelsea HM Flirt (paused) HM Cutter Cheerful, Lady Nelson, Amati HMS Vanguard, HMS Pegasus, Fair American, HM Granado, HM Pickle, AVS, Pride of Baltimore, Bluenose Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave_E Posted May 31, 2022 Author Share #326 Posted May 31, 2022 Thank you Glenn, that mean a lot to me coming from you. 😊 Keith Black and glbarlow 2 Quote Dave Current builds: Rattlesnake Completed builds: Lady Nelson On the shelf: NRG Half Hull Project, Various metal, plastic and paper models Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Black Posted May 31, 2022 Share #327 Posted May 31, 2022 Heading for home on this one, Dave. Very well done for your first build. Dave_E 1 Quote Current Builds: 1870's Sternwheeler, Lula Wood Hull Screw Frigate USS Tennessee Decorative Carrack Warship Restoration, the Amelia Completed: 1880s Floating Steam Donkey Pile Driver Early Swift 1805 Model Restoration Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave_E Posted May 31, 2022 Author Share #328 Posted May 31, 2022 Hi Keith, I’m going to try and add some rope coils, however that will be after I build a jig and practice. It’s tempting to just throw the other anchor on and the upper mast stay and the swivel guns and be done, but I know I can do some learning and some experience for the Rattlesnake and get a better finish on the Lady. Keith Black, Oldsalt1950 and The Gimps Chimp 3 Quote Dave Current builds: Rattlesnake Completed builds: Lady Nelson On the shelf: NRG Half Hull Project, Various metal, plastic and paper models Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick01 Posted May 31, 2022 Share #329 Posted May 31, 2022 1 hour ago, Dave_E said: I’m going to try and add some rope coils, however that will be after I build a jig and practice. When making my coils for the belaying pins I make up a jig from scrap MDF . Standing on edge I put a number of small nails/pins in close to the edge and after making a coil of 6~8 loops, place it over a nail/pin hanging down. To shape it so that it sits somewhat realistically I then use white PVA glue and carefully pinch the coils into the required shape. make sure you do have a small space at the top so that you can use short length of line to tie the coil to the belaying pin. See the sample I posted further up this page. Rick Dave_E and Keith Black 2 Quote Completed builds:- HM Cutter Mermaid. HMS Endeavour's Longboat Topsail Schooner Enterprize Arab Dhow Sultan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allanyed Posted May 31, 2022 Share #330 Posted May 31, 2022 (edited) Dave, You are very wise to be researching each thing before moving forward. Were the four methods on the hawser tie off based on contemporary information, or other kits. If contemporary, it would really be interesting to see how this varied. Regarding coils, I posted this video in the past, but if you did not see it, it might be helpful. Allan Edited May 31, 2022 by allanyed The Gimps Chimp, Keith Black, Quimp Slattery and 3 others 6 Quote PLEASE take 30 SECONDS and sign up for the epic Nelson/Trafalgar project if you would like to see it made into a TV series. Click on http://trafalgar.tv There is no cost other than the 30 seconds of your time. THANK YOU Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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